The Big Winners In Stimulus Compromise: The Upper-Middle Class

[earth mom]

The middle class, working class and poor have been screwed over once again.

Forget about "hope and change" it's Politics as usual. :argh:

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The Big Winners In Stimulus Compromise: The Upper-Middle Class


When President Obama outlined on January 8 the rationale for the economic stimulus bill, "The American Recovery and Reinvestment Act," he clearly identified the men and women most in trouble:
"Nearly two million jobs have now been lost, and on Friday we are likely to learn that we lost more jobs last year than at any time since World War II. Just in the past year, another 2.8 million Americans who want and need full-time work have had to settle for part-time jobs."

The House-Senate compromise, however, cuts funds for extended health care coverage for the unemployed; cuts $30 billion in aid to state governments to prevent reductions in social services to the poor and out-of-work; and also cuts a special "Making Work Pay" tax holiday from $500 to $400 for an individual, and from $1,000 to $800 for a couple, for low-to-middle-income workers still hanging on to their jobs

Amid all the cutting, however, one group emerged unscathed: the upper-middle class, the not-quite-super-rich, but certainly not on the ropes. Most of these folks, in terms of income and employment, are what could be called the un-needy, a group clearly distinct from those Obama identified as the core target of the legislation. The "compromise" legislation includes $70 billion, or just under 10 percent of the whole package, to be used expressly to take care of these affluent people.

<snip>

Why then has Congress added the $70 billion AMT patch to the bill, while cutting other expenditures right and left?
The most obvious answers are 1) the people who make $80,000 to $250,000 are influential and vocal in pressing their complaints to Congress; 2) an AMT-induced tax hike would produce an outcry; 3) and people in this class have become the most contested "swing" voters in elections -- running the gamut from presidential to state legislative elections.



http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/02/11/the-big-winners-in-stimul_n_166192.html

[Taverner]

1. AMT is a killer

If you've never paid it you understand what I mean

I'm GLAD they did the AMT patch

[Baby Snooks]

7. No offense but...

No offense but the majority of Americans would actually love to have to pay it. Of course human nature being what it is, as soon as they did, they would hate to have to pay it. Be grateful just the same that you have the income to have to pay it.

[Taverner]

13. Ahhh but what about us Californians who barely scrape by on a 60K a year job

They would have to pay AMT

Even though, by California standards, 60K a year is NOTHING

When homes still cost 500K for 2k Sq Ft, AMT can be a killer

[madamesilverspurs]

15. Try scraping by

on $750 a month. That's just real special no matter where you live.

[Taverner]

17. Well no doubt that sucks - but AMT is not the answer

Unless you want a Prop 13-like tax revolt

Seriously - if anything we should be cutting military. We don't have any enemies. There's no Soviet Union any more, and China is not going to invade.

I can think of a million better ways to levy taxes than taking the upper middle class (or lower middle class in CA) and soaking them so they drop a notch. Well, unless your goal is schadenfreude, in which case go join the GOP. That's their game, not ours.

[madamesilverspurs]

24. The POINT is

that "scraping by" at $60thousand is going to be a wee bit more comfortable than scraping by on $750. When people at $60thousand regularly run out of food by the end of the third week of the month, then they can use the phrase. And it isn't schadenfreude to recognize that having to shop at Macy's instead of Nieman Marcus isn't quite the same as having to buy your underwear at the Salvation Army store.

As for Prop 13 - California spit Doug Bruce out and he landed here in Colorado. Be nice or we'll spit him backatcha...

[Taverner]

26. Yes but not after Jarvis/Gann and co destroyed our school system

Sure, if you live on $750 a month that sucks. The stimulus package has some things that may help, including the extension of Unemployment Benefits (As dog as my witness, I never thought that would pass)

But being angry simply because the Upper Middle class isn't being soaked is childish

You know very well there are better ways to levy taxes

[madamesilverspurs]

44. Not angry at all.

Just suggesting a better choice of words. No biggie.

[amborin]

62. the real culprit and target for anger is not the middle class, but the mega rich

[Spider Jerusalem]

63. Can't afford to live in California? Move.

And stop whingeing about having to pay taxes. If you can't afford to live where you are, and expect that you should get some sort of tax break despite everyone else with an income in the same bracket in the country paying the same in tax, then obviously the problem is yours and you need to learn to suck it up.

[wryter2000]

77. I live in CA

My mortgage is at about $287,000. The value of my house is at about $266,000. I doubt I'll be moving any time soon.

[PVnRT]

72. Since when does $60K qualify for AMT?

I've made more than that, single. You're doing your taxes wrong.

[karynnj]

57. This is silly - they do the ATM fix every year - usually in Nov/Dec

at least for the last 4 years. Not doing it would be a huge tax increase for a large number of people, that the tax was not designed to hit, who have a combination of high state taxes and high mortgage interest costs. A large proportion live in states like NJ, MA, CT, NY etc which pay the most into the government as compared to what they get out.

As they ALWAYS do this, consider this contrarian view of why it is good to be in this package - it adds to the amount said to be tax cuts that the Republicans like (both Grassley and Menendez wanted it - but the media just says Grassley) without really being an additional tax cut - because it was going to happen anyway. The negative side - that it means that the stimulus package is really that much smaller.

[hay rick]

65. Agreed

The ATM fix is a slam dunk as a separate bill and it's silly to count it as "stimulus." It does give the Republicans a face-saver (increased % of tax cuts in final bill) and also helps to get a portion of the electorate on board. The "centrist" spending cuts are the real pound of flesh that was taken.

[Runcible Spoon]

2. no big surprise there.

sigh. And they still get to call it "middle class relief" I'm sure.

[anonymous171]

3. Those are the lackeys of the rich. They should be the last in line.

[MercutioATC]

12. 20% of taxpayers are "lackeys of the rich"???

That's the percentage of U.S. taxpayers who will have to pay the AMT by 2010.

[Taverner]

31. I guess I'm a lackey for the rich then

:eyes:

Just let me know when and where we're supposed to report for re-education...

[MercutioATC]

34. The rich have a LOT of lackeys....29 MILLION of us, it seems.

No wonder everybody wants to be rich...

[Taverner]

61. Yes - and I think if you eat at Olive Garden, you qualify as rich

[Warren Stupidity]

73. Oh good job. They now have us fighting each other over who

is more deserving of the crumbs they swept off the table. And we are oh so willing to play that game.

[leftstreet]

4. "The Un-Needy"

He's right that these voters were once reliably Republican. While the Dems have finally won them over, it frees the Repubs to go populist should they choose...

[Greyhound]

76. The "win" is temporary, once we clean up their mess they'll happily put the

other thieves back in power to do it all over again.

[ryanmuegge]

5. Left-wing academics and professionals have proven P.T. Barnum right

with their blind love affair with Obama. So many intelligent, free-thinking (or, at least they would like to think so), high-status people were just so in love with the idea of the first black president and Obama's prowess as an orator that they forgot to look at his POLICIES. Oops. Oh well. They'll be fine. The rest of us are stuck feeling the effects of the fifth consecutive (defacto) Republican administration

[earth mom]

6. Yep and Edwards warned us all and few listened. nt

[SidneyCarton]

47. Ah, yes, John (I'm cheating on my wife while she's dying of cancer) Edwards.

His social views may have been indeed genuine, but seriously, if the Enquirer knew about his pecadillos, you don't suppose that the RNC did as well? How does President McCain and Vice President Palin sound to you? Sound good, sound enjoyable? How does President Palin in 2012 sound.

Oh, never mind you love an image just as false as the one that Obama supporters were accused of "worshiping"

[anonymous171]

8. YEAH KUCINICH AND/OR EDWARDS WOULD HAVE TOTALLY WON!

[Taverner]

19. Yep - if they were the nominee, right now we'd be talking about President Palin

And the mandatory bible study we Americans have to do nightly in order to keep our citizenship

[Thrill]

14. Oh knock it off. Blame Congress. Not the President. His plan didn't have any AMT patch

when he sent it up there. And his plan had the tax cuts he promised. Learn how the Legislative process works. Blame the Blue Dogs in Congress who have done this.

And this plan comes with middle class tax cuts and Americans who don't pay income tax get a reduction in medicare and SS tax that they pay.

Not to mention the boatloads of money for Healthcare, Education, Infrastructure, and Green Tech. You're out of your damn mind if you think a Republican President would of done this.

[earth mom]

16. So don't hold Obama accountable at all? That's bullshit and you know it. nt

[Thrill]

22. You can hold him accountable. But whats bullshit is the

assumption that this is some kind of Republican administration. Thats Bullshit. The fact is legislation gets changed when it goes to Congress. But having said that, this bill is still a liberal's dream. With the middle class tax cuts Billions for health, green, infrastructure, and education. Would I like even more money for it? YES. But the reality is Obama is not a King, and he has to work with congress to get things done.

Still a huge victory for the Democratic Platform

[blindpig]

80. Quite right.

The Democratic Party Platform is damn near as reactionary as the Republican, just more euphemisms.

With or without vaseline?

[jmg257]

32. I "blame" Obama - and good for him - it was a BIG part of his campaign! nt

[amborin]

60. sorry, but left wing academics and professionals always knew

and warned!

but were unheeded

[jmg257]

9. Helps Obama keep his promise not to raise taxes on those making under $250K, and

they pass this every year lately to make up for the lack of income/inflation recognition in the original law - they just added it in now is all.

[Thrill]

10. Obama cut taxes on 95% of Americans. PROMISE KEPT

[MercutioATC]

11. What we need is an AMT fix, not a yearly patch.

It was enacted in 1969 to catch 155 high-income households that found enough loopholes and shelters that they paid little or no taxes.

...but they never indexed it to inflation.


By 2010, nearly 20% of all taxpayers will fall under the AMT if nothing is changed.

[aikoaiko]

18. The AMT is the debil.

[scheming daemons]

20. Because ONE piece of the package helps upper-middle does NOT mean

that the lower and middle got "screwed".

Obama promised to not raise taxes on anyone making less than $250,000.


By getting rid of the AMT, he has kept that promise.

[Taverner]

21. Exactly

Its as if the Upper Middle Class isn't scared shitless right now...

[earth mom]

23. 70 BILLION is not chump change. But the 20 bucks a payday that Obama & Congress gave

the middle class is.


Anyone who defends this crap is obviously benefiting from it.

[scheming daemons]

28. I'm not of high enough income to benefit from it...

...but I *DO* see the benefits of it.

Less than 10% of the package is for AMT relief.

90%+ of the package will directly benefit the middle and lower classes.... foodstamps, unemployment extension, jobs via infrastructure and other projects.


The AMT is bad. It needs to be indexed for inflation. Until it is, it is a good thing to just throw it out for a year.


It is irresponsible and hyperbolic to say that, because 1/11th of a package is going to upper-middle class, that means the middle and lower classes got "screwed".

[Taverner]

37. I think the OP just wants a Bastille Day

Wipe out the Upper Middle Class Lackeys!!! Stop the running dog Capitalists and bring revolution at the barrel of a gun!

To which I say, sorry I don't give head to strangers

[Generic Other]

70. 2 school teachers' salaries = upper middle class lackey running dog capitalists?

the hackles rise on my neck...

[jmg257]

29. I hope to benefit from it-gladly! And I would defend it, because it will help the economy too.

Stimulating the economy isn't ALL about helping the poor & unemployed.

[Taverner]

39. Finally, a breath of reason here

I was beginning to look into steel collared shirts for a moment

[jmg257]

40. Hmmm...maybe I will use all my "not raised taxes" money to buy some.

[Taverner]

36. You are so full of caca I don't even know where to begin

How about Unemployment Benefits DOUBLED!!!!!!!!!

Or is that nothing, is it too bourgeoisie for you?

Look, it benefits us ALL, because if the economy crumbles, at least we'll have something. More food stamps (adjusted to current economic levels) - shit

Anyone who fights this crap is either a Disrupting Freeper or someone who took Trotsky way to seriously

[Generator]

66. Unemployment benefits doubled????

Yeah. Because if my husband loses his job and we stop being lackeys of the rick (whose he) RICH we will need it.

[Taverner]

67. 23 weeks to 46, 53 in high unemployment states (CA)

That looks like double to me

And yes, we may ALL be facing unemployment soon

I want that safety net if I do

[SidneyCarton]

49. Then perhaps you propose a purge of the party?

How very "Democratic" of you. We win our first real victories in years, but because they are not to the raving ideologue's liking, it must be time to rip the party apart, and send us all back to the wilderness where we can engage in our fruitless fantasies of ideological purity, instead of actually trying to do something.

[Ilsa]

25. And engineer Daddy making $95,000 a year could be making $0 in December,

depending on what kind of business he's in. The family could be making $45,000 on Mom the Teacher's income and hit the AMT for 2008. The stimulus for them is needed as their income went from $140,000 to $45,000. It isn't just the lowly-paid employees losing their jobs. Removing the AMT was a promise Obama kept, and I am okay with it.

[Jack_DeLeon]

27. While most of the rest of us will be enjoying our $13 dollars extra a paycheck...

Yeah we get to buy an extra beer and a meal. :eyes:

They want to keep us dumb, fat, and complacent. Fuck that shit.

I'll probably just save it for Christmas. So atleast that way my family wont suffer so much then.

[scheming daemons]

30. You really think that is your ONLY benefit in this package?

There's a lot more than just the tax credit there.


Extensions to unemployment, increases in food stamps, loads of construction jobs, mortgage relief.... LOTS of stuff.

[Taverner]

33. Extensions to unemployment - that is a BIG one

You have no idea how big this is...we've been trying to get this for YEARS

Clinton didn't even budge on it

And lo and behold, there it is

No, this was not a shaft to the lower class. Food stamps are finally adjusted to the current economy. Lots of shit getting built.

Do you want the economy back on track, or do you want Bastille Day? I'll take a healthy economy, personally.

[Greyhound]

35. K&R, excellent post.

Whining aside, this points out just how sick we've become.
:kick: & R

[Taverner]

38. So extending Unemployment benefits to 46-53 weeks is nothing???

Wow - what the fuck did you expect? Lobster bisque in every home?

[earth mom]

41. For all the hype of "hope and change" I expected a LOT more. A whole helluva lot more.

And what about those taxes on those who make more than 250K that Obama "promised" he'd raise in order to give the middle class some relief but then blew off like it was nothing?

That promise was one strong reason people voted for him.

But I suppose broken promises are cool with you too.

The truth of the matter is that Obama & Congress don't really care about the middle class.

They have proven time and time again that they are out of touch with what the middle class-WHO ARE THE BACKBONE OF THIS COUNTRY-really need; town meetings be damned.

[Taverner]

53. Excuse me? How the fuck long has it been? A month?

And Obama isn't shoveling snow off your driveway

1 year worth of Unemployment Benefits sounds pretty fucking cool to me

But what do I know, I'm "rich"

[SidneyCarton]

54. Really, what did you expect?

That in one fell swoop we would turn into Canada? And how exactly was that supposed to be accomplished? Did you suppose that the Republicans would just vanish? That they would melt away into nothingness when President Obama took the oath, or that Limbaugh would devour himself in rage. That somehow those millions of American's in the Red States who backed McCain (as will as many more in the blue states too) would magically become good neo-socialists?

Come on, how do you think change is accomplished? How do you think a nation changes course? Rome was neither built nor burnt in a day, and our transformation into a more just society will require more than a single bill or a single month in office. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, If you wanted a liberal version of President Bush, Obama was not your man. And frankly, neither Edwards or Kucinich were either. Edwards, because even if he got elected, he would have compromised, and Kucinich, because if he got elected would have dug in his feet whenever he didn't get exactly what he wanted and we would have implosion on a national scale.

This is change earth mom, anyone who told you differently was selling you something.

[Taverner]

58. Earth mom won't be happy until we're singing The Internationale all day

Every hour.... :eyes:

[Greyhound]

64. Amerika, love it or leave, eh?

Perhaps, "Amerika, Fuck Yeah!" is more appropriate?
:eyes:

[Greyhound]

42. I'd ask you to point out where I said that, but of course you can't.

This may in fact be better than nothing in the short term, but was originally too little by half and is now even less.

You can keep up with your whining, but those of us that have been on both sides of the social equation in America know the reality.

You profess to have a clue and so should know the reality of what is still coming and will begin to arrive before most of this package even begins to take effect. This is exactly what Krugman warned about months ago, a placebo to mollify the ignorant that will once again be stunned by the severity and rapidity of decline that is well on it's way.

[earth mom]

43. Excellent post!

:thumbsup:

[Greyhound]

46. Why, thank you.

:kick:

...waiting for his reply...

[jmg257]

52. Well - you got it!

:popcorn:

[Name removed]

51. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Greyhound]

56. Once again, you attempt to assign motives and statement never made.

Nice try, but it's not that easy. You are apparently suffering from a sense of entitlement because you had to work hard for your money and have been lucky enough to keep it.

Well, how about remembering where and what you come from and using your intellect and resources to work for those you left behind instead of identifying with those that would abandon you in a heartbeat if it served their purposes? Lackeys come in all but the very highest income brackets, work for the betterment of all instead of arguing to maintain an exclusionary system that ensures most will fail.

[Name removed]

50. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Greyhound]

69. Again, I've never made any pretense about knowing you or your life.

I've been forthcoming with my background, tag you're it.

[Greyhound]

75. So now you have nothing to say? You wade into this battle armed only with your narrow view,

make unfounded accusations and curse people when we call you on it, and now you simply slink away...

Seems like there is another group in this country that operates that way, but they generally don't hang out here.

[Lilith Velkor]

79. Oh yeah they do.

Check any of the gazillion octuplet threads, you'll find scads of 'em.

[onenote]

45. so a provision giving less than 9% of the stimulus package benefits to 20 percent of taxpayers

means that 20 percent is the big winner?

Some poor math going on here.

First, the $70 million represented by the AMT patch is not "just under" 10 percent of the total value of the stimuulus bill -- its just under 9 percent. And the 25 million taxpayers that will benefit from the AMT patch represent 20 percent of all taxpayers.

[Greyhound]

71. Speaking of poor math skills, you're assuming a linear progression that is patently inappropriate

in this case. The upper 20% owns well over 90% of the wealth and is in the least need.

[Blue_Tires]

48. somehow they ALWAYS seem to be the big winners

whenever financial matters move through congress

[sendero]

55. The AMT is an abortion..

... of a piece of legislation and it's long overdue for being remedied.

And, as far as I know, I've never paid it.

[KoKo]

59. That was thrown out early today on Politico and other RW leaning Web Sites...be careful what

you read these days... The Truth (as we who've been here for years, should know) is not what RW or what call themselves MAINSTREAM MEDIA ever tells us.

It's a lie...and although the Bill was compromised by the Big Banking Bucks recipients in the SENATE...it's still a START and a good OMNIBUS BILL given what is going on out there. Wait until the Lefty websits PARSE IT...before you sling arrows from the RIGHT WING...who brought us into this situation.

[BlooInBloo]

68. Doesn't matter. People simply WANT to bitch about Obama.

[Still Sensible]

74. Wrong. I agree the AMT has no business in this bill

BECAUSE THE CONGRESS WOULD HAVE PASSED IT ANYWAY as they have for a number of years. The headline is terribly deceiving, IMO, because the real "winners" were REPUBLICANS because they got to basically take $70 billion out of the package. The "upper middle class" would have received the benefit of the fix whether or not it was in this specific bill.

So the purpose of Edsall's article must have been to pit factions of the "middle class," which clearly support stimulus spending, against each other, no? It was not the "upper middle class" that was hammering the democrats to include this in the Recovery Act... It was the fucking republicans in the Senate and House. Period.

[jmg257]

83. Uhh - it was a Democrat who added the patch to the senate version.

[Still Sensible]

84. What a waste, there's 70 billion that could have

been put back in.

[earth mom]

78. Kick!

:kick:

[FatDave]

81. Sigh....

At least it's a step in the right direction. At least it's not only good for the mega-wealthy this time. It's good for the kinda rich. The kinda rich at least buy things.

[jmg257]

82. Yep - 'cause a couple making a combined $70K are rolling in extra cash.

:eyes: