Regarding the governor of Louisiana's first name ...

[ColbertWatcher]

... below is a link to a news story and photograph of a person in a similar situation.

Here is the news story: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/19/AR2009021901780.html

and here is the photograph:


The poll question: what is the name of the person featured in the photograph?

[Kahuna]

1. It's Ryan, isn't it? Or maybe both. One when he's in drag, the other

when he isn't. :shrug:

[ColbertWatcher]

3. Good distinction.

I guess the next question is: Is the person in the photograph in drag?

[tanngrisnir3]

2. Rudy. Rudy Giuliani.

[bunnies]

4. Reann. nt

[endarkenment]

5. According to the article "Ryan".

Ryan is also not confused about this. He has an act where he goes by the name Reanne. But I am confused, are you saying that Piyush is a woman's name?

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

6. The article doesn't make it very clear.

So I'm guessing it's "Ryan" and they typed it specifically "Reanne" to reflect how it was announced, but honestly, I'm not sure. It doesn't say how Ms. Mason 2009 refers to himself.

[ColbertWatcher]

15. "It doesn't say how Ms. Mason 2009 refers to himself." "Himself?"

I think you need to read the article again.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

Unless he's had a sex change, he's still a "he"

And although he has an alter-ego of "Reanne", it's not clear this is how he wants to be known generally, on a full-time basis. So no, I still don't think it's entirely clear, but I'd probably go with Ryan.

[ColbertWatcher]

27. The poll question does not refer to "a full-time basis," rather ...

... it refers to the moment the photograph was taken.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

30. It does NOT say at "the moment the photograph was taken" (nt)

[ColbertWatcher]

33. You're right, but I didn't say that it did. n/t

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

37. You said the poll refers specifically to the moment of the photo, which it does not. (nt)

[ColbertWatcher]

38. I think you're playing semantics.

There's a photograph and the question asks about the person featured in the photograph.

I think it's safe to assume that the question refers to the specific moment when the photograph was taken.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

39. I'm not the one who played semantics.

I gave my answer based on the question, and you then said the question was different from how it is phrased. If you want people to answer a specific way, you need to be specific about your question.

And no, it is not safe to assume what was meant at all. There's nothing in the question that indicates whether you mean what this person wants to be called generally versus what they are in that exact moment, which is obviously a rather large detail according to your desires, considering the whole "alter-ego" portion of the circumstance.

[ColbertWatcher]

40. I will admit that I'm not the best when it comes to heading off misinterpretations of my posts ..

... but, I did post a picture and an article, in which the first sentence in the last paragraph gives the answer.

"There's nothing in the question that indicates whether you mean what this person wants to be called generally versus what they are in that exact moment ..."

Actually it does, nonetheless, on which side would you err (error?)?

The first poster guessed and offered an explanation and even a question indicating their doubt.

Few others in this thread doubted their certainty at all.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

43. I specifically used the phrases "I'm not sure" and "I'm guessing"

I didn't exactly offer a definitive answer.

Seriously though, no, it wasn't clear. And not even the sentence you indicate tells me what YOU were looking for - only that he's Reanne in drag. What that doesn't tell me is: 1) That you were looking for his name specifically when he was in drag and not generally -or- 2) Whether or not he prefers to be called Reanne or Ryan generally - only that this is what he calls himself when in drag. Just because the answer you're looking for is available, that doesn't mean it was clear for anyone to find it. It's like cracking an encrypted message without a key phrase - just because you theoretically COULD figure it out, that doesn't exactly make it possible.

[ColbertWatcher]

44. You did qualify your answers, I'm sorry if I implied that you hadn't.

But, the picture did show someone wearing a sash that said "Ms. Mason 2009," I'd say that is pretty clear!

Perhaps the Washington Post article wasn't the best one to use, since it wasn't very fair to the winner either.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

45. It doesn't look like I was the only one confused.

And not to brag, but I'd like to consider myself at very least not a total friggin moron.

[ColbertWatcher]

46. Welcome to the club.

We "Not Total Friggin Morons" should have our own forum on DU.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

47. If it exists, it sure as hell ain't GD:P or the gungeon! (nt)

[MADem]

7. Similar situation? Are you suggesting Bobby Jindal is a drag queen?

This is a pathetic stretch, IMO. If you're trying to make a point, it's falling woefully flat.

It's as wrong to make fun of Jindal's name, or use it as a taunt, as it is to make fun of Obama's name, or taunt him with his middle name.

It's .... unprogressive. Rather like this thread.

[ColbertWatcher]

13. Both have chosen a name they prefer to be called.

Can you respect the person enough to figure out what name that is?

[MADem]

21. Is it that clear?

Not all drag queens use their stage name when they're taking a book out of the library, or shopping at the grocery store, or while they work at their day jobs. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_drag_queens

Bobby Jindal expects to be addressed as Bobby everywhere he goes. He even referenced his father calling him "Bobby" in that mess of a speech he gave, so he expects to hear it even from the parent who gave him the "Piyush" name.

[ColbertWatcher]

29. True. However ...

... the person in the photograph is not

"... taking a book out of the library, or shopping at the grocery store, or while they work at their day jobs."

The person in the photograph is waving to a crowd in some large arena-type place.

I would think her name is obvious!

[MADem]

31. You never know, though, and you cannot assume. At least I don't, until I'm told.

I saw Eddie Izzard do a comedy routine in a dress with full make up. He even had on false eyelashes. And bosoms!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xl0PZDGOgoM

He didn't ask anyone to call him Edwina. He just likes to wear women's clothes.

[ColbertWatcher]

32. Does Izzard even have a drag persona?

Has he ever asked to be called something other than "Eddie?"

[MADem]

35. You put up a picture and expected us to know that person.

Then you demanded that we decide what to call said person, when we don't know the person.

If the person asks me to call them Queen Elizabeth or George the Fifth, I'll oblige them.

Your "example" is absurd, though and it doesn't apply to Governor Jindal's situation, at all.

Everyone who isn't in a coma knows that the Governor of Louisiana goes by the name of Bobby Jindal. Why people are flinging his given name around, and snarking about it, and then having the brass gonads to pretend that they aren't snarking, is beyond me.

It's also pretty disgraceful. I can't believe I'm seeing this on this forum. There is a stench of racism throughout many of these threads, and it's sad to see.

There's plenty wrong with Bobby Jindal, but his choice of nickname/common name shouldn't even be an issue.

[ColbertWatcher]

36. I posted a picture WITH a link to a news article.

The example is trying to figure out what someone's name is, not if anyone knows her.

You don't have to know a person to know what name would be appropriate and what name isn't.

I am assuming you know who Bobby Jindal is, but you probably don't know him personally. Yet you were able to figure out what name he prefers to be called.

That is the only thing these two people have in common: they chose what name they wish to be called.

The poll asked if anyone on DU could do that.

I am in complete agreement with you as far as the DU/Jindal's name fake controversy goes.

[MADem]

41. Yeah, and the link said a guy named Ryan Allen is a drag queen whose "alter ego" stage name is Reann

and who won the Ms. Mason contest at his school. He found the entire event AMUSING. I'm guessing he'd rather NOT be called late for supper, but beyond that, I'm betting he'd simply correct someone if they were calling him something other than what he wanted to be called, and not demand that they "guess."

He apparently identified himself to the reporter as Ryan Allen. I would assume that's what he wants to be called, if it's good enough for the reporter. If I ever meet him, I'll ask.

If Bobby Jindal entered the Miss Louisiana Drag Qeen contest with a stage name of Bobbina, and won, you'd still call him Bobby Jindal, unless you were introducing him in his drag outfit, or interacting with him onstage.

But Bobby Jindal does not have an "alter ego" persona. He isn't a drag queen with a stage name. He is the governor of Louisiana and he wants to be called Bobby Jindal. He's Bobby Jindal on the crapper, he's Bobby Jindal in the office, he's Bobby Jindal when he puts his head on the pillow to go to sleep. He even made note of his FATHER, who gave him his given name, calling him "Bobby" in his speech. He wants to be called Bobby. The unwillingness here to oblige him is very curious.

The comparison you're trying to offer is just not apt. Sorry, it's not.

Should we insist on calling John Wayne "Marion Morrison," because that was his given name? Or should we call him "Rooster Cogburn" because he played that part on the silver screen? Was he somehow "inauthentic" for wanting to be known as John Wayne? Would we have offended him if we didn't call him "Rooster" on the True Grit set?

You're going way too far afield. It's just a poor effort at analogy on your part.

[ColbertWatcher]

48. To beat this dead horse one last time ...

... Jindal wants to be called a certain name, so does Ryan/Reann.

Some people get it right, others don't. For those who don't get it right, some may be out of ignorance, other it may be out of a desire to be an asshole.

Thank you for noticing that the person in the picture was on a "stage" of sorts.

(BTW, other posts have used the Cassius Clay/Muhammad Ali example too, which isn't a perfect analogy either, but I can see where they're going with it.)

[MADem]

51. No, that's not true. Ryan didn't tell the reporter to refer to him as Reann.

In the opening paragraph, the reporter tells us the man's name. In the article, we learn that Ryan told the reporter that his stage name/alter ego is Reann. He didn't tell the reporter to refer to him as ANYTHING in that article.


Like I said, Marion Morrison changed his name to John Wayne. His "alter ego/stage name" in TRUE GRIT was "Rooster Cogburn." Do we ever refer to the person everyone save the film geeks refers to as John Wayne as "Marion" when we discuss his work? No. Do we call him Rooster Cogburn outside of discussing his True Grit role? No. His name was John Wayne. It's the name he chose for himself, and people respect him, respect his wishes, and call him the name that he wanted to be known by. And he was a conservative Republican, too.

Your point falls flat.

Bobby Jindal is not a crossdressing gay beauty queen with an "alter ego" or a stage name. He's a governor with a nickname that he's had since he was four years old, that he chooses to go by, and that anyone who has basic respect and who isn't looking to dig, insult, snark or bait uses when addressing him.

The lengths people are going to in order to justify insulting this man by snarking about his first name are beyond the pale. There's just no justification. It's fine to go after the guy for his record, his views, and the policies he's incorporated as governor, if he misbehaves in his personal life, fine to comment on that too, but this not-so-subtle xenophobia in these discussions about his name is just horrific.

[ColbertWatcher]

34. Maybe I should have posted the link to the video in the OP.

http://dcist.com/2009/02/drag_queen_named_ms_mason.php

I really didn't think it would have been this hard to figure out her name.

Not on DU anyway.

[Numba6]

8. Pat?

[Earth_First]

9. ?

:shrug:

[FreeState]

10. His name is Ryan - he is a drag queen, his characters name is Reann its not even close to the same

as the Governor. One is acting and playing a part as part of his cultural heritage and the other was given an ethnic name at birth and chooses to use a different name (which should be respected IMO).

[ColbertWatcher]

12. What is similar is that both have chosen the name they prefer to be called. n/t

[FreeState]

53. Exactly - one needs to respect both IMO n/t

[Marrah_G]

11. More information is needed.

Does the person in the photo refer to himself as Ryan or as Reann?

THAT is the important part that is left out.

Do they live as Reann or as Ryan?

[ColbertWatcher]

17. I don't think more information is needed.

It's all there in the article.

Maybe this link to a video helps: http://dcist.com/2009/02/drag_queen_named_ms_mason.php

[Marrah_G]

18. I'll have to watch the video at home- at work right now.

[ColbertWatcher]

20. Ugh. I hate work-place blocks! n/t

[Marrah_G]

24. It's not blocked...I just have people coming in and out of my office all the time.

I try to be careful with any audio.

[baldguy]

14. Ryan, as stated in the article.

"Reann" is "His drag alter ego," again as stated in the article.

He's not trying to fool anybody.

[ColbertWatcher]

22. I don't think anyone is saying there is a deception going on.

However, the question is: what is the name of the person in the photograph?

[baldguy]

26. "Regarding the governor of Louisiana's first name ..."

I think "Bobby" Jindal is very defiantly trying to deceive people.

[ColbertWatcher]

28. I don't agree with the deception part, but he does perfer to be called "Bobby." n/t

[gcomeau]

16. Wrong question.

The question is "What is it appropriate to call them?" And the answer to that question is not automatically "whatever was put on their birth certificate".

[ColbertWatcher]

19. Not completely wrong, but I take your point. n/t

[Uzybone]

23. Bad analogy

If Gov Jindal had an act where he wanted to be called Bobby instead of Piyush then this would apply.

Unless your saying his entire life is an act. I might agree with that.

[ColbertWatcher]

25. "Unless your saying his entire life is an act." LOL!

I'm saying that he picked the name he wants to be called.

[Occam Bandage]

42. Reann is a stage name, not what he chooses as his actual name.

It's like the difference between the Joker and Heath Ledger. One plays the other.

[ColbertWatcher]

49. But, it is a name she chooses to be called. n/t

[Occam Bandage]

50. When he is on-stage and performing, yes. nt

[Geek_Girl]

52. So Bobby Jindal is Piyush's Stage name?

I don't think these situations are remotely close. Rean is Ryan's stage persona when he performs according to this article.