Trouble on the Assembly Line

[DainBramaged]

For months Washington has focused on saving Detroit's automakers. But now the auto industry says it could face a bottom-up collapse if the suppliers supporting these automakers don't receive federal aid starting next week.

"We're on the cusp of what could be cataclysmic," said Aaron Bragman, an auto analyst with IHS Global Insight.

What now looks like a house of cards was built with a complicated trade credit system. Automakers pay their suppliers 45 to 60 days after the car parts are delivered. And these suppliers delay payments to their subcontractors for up to a year.

This system worked until credit markets froze and consumer confidence took a nosedive last fall. When people stopped buying cars, the automakers nearly halted vehicle production in December and January. As a result, not only are auto parts suppliers losing work from the carmakers, which include foreign and domestic companies, they will be receiving much smaller paychecks starting March 1.

This month cash-strapped suppliers have been struggling to replenish their raw material inventories and meet operating expenses. In the past, suppliers have been able to put their billings, or receivables, up as collateral for loans. But, with bankruptcy still a strong possibility for General Motors and Chrysler, many suppliers have not been able to use those receivables as collateral.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/25/AR2009022503450.html

[madrchsod]

1. my daughters "ex employer" biggest problem is...

the inability to get the orders they do have shipped in time...the lay-off took all the younger workers and left people that can`t run the new production lines. many have older workers have permanent live long injuries from yrs of repetitious work. right now must of their business is current replacement parts and stock piling parts that are obsolete. even though she is laid off she still receives 4% profit sharing,supplemental pay,and current employees received a pay raise. she has call back rights for a year that will keep her seniority and pay scale.

it will be interesting if they put in the three new lines now that the industry has stopped production

[DainBramaged]

2. The 'average' age of the auto worker throughout the industry

is 52. As you said, many with traumatic reptitious injuries, and without the strength to go for 8 hours straight. I'm 58 in May, I have to walk about 2-3 miles a day between buildings where I work solving problems and doing routine maintainance. I get home at 7 to 8, and take a couple of hours nap, get up, eat, hit Du, go back to bed depending on my shift the next day, and sleep most of the weekend because I am dog tired.

And there is NO waiting list of people who want to learn the assembly trades because they are paid a lot of money to telemarketing or work at the mall and not get their hands dirty.

[SmileyRose]

5. When DU was beating on UAW workers I probably came close to getting tombstoned

I don't think I ever cussed so much in my whole life. I was so mad it made me feel ugly inside.

My husband's uncle is retired Ford UAW. He hopscotched to regular retirement (30 pension credits) but god bless him, I don't know how he dragged his ass to work that last 5 years. His credits hit 30 right when the buyouts started and he took it. He's either walker or wheelchair bound now and needs help brushing hair, buttoning shirts and tying shoes sort of stuff. He's really disabled. When I take him to retiree meetings I'd say more than half the guys in the meetings are medically disabled from putting their bodies on the line.

One girl I knew at the Atlanta Ford plant had a permanant bruise all down the left side of her body from getting in and out of the car for 10 years and bumping the sides of the door in and out. A man who worked right next to uncle for 3 years still could not grow fingernails even 4 years after he changed to a different job.

Shitting on people who disabled their bodies for their bosses and expect the meager promises of a half decent income and medical care if they somehow manage make it and to live longer than 30 years of working is just evil.

[ConcernedCanuk]

3. If companies as large as GM Chrysler and Ford haven't got their financial shit together by now

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let them die

some other auto manufacturers with more financial responsibility/intelligence may evolve

or not

We should NOT be bailing out companies where corporate execs pull in million dollar salaries while the company goes down the tubes

Let the companies fend for themselves

"bailouts" are just another burden on the impoverished taxpayer

us taxpayers need no more burdens - really!

[Maru Kitteh]

7. So who is "we" exactly? Are you worried about your US tax dollars?

Are you worried about the jobs of your US Union auto-worker family members?

My family members aren't lucky enough to be union, but my small town absolutely RELIES upon two factories here - and those factories absolutely rely upon the American auto industry.

When you say let them die, THIS is what you are saying. My town should just die. On a more personal note, allow me to tell you about my sister.

With 30 years of her life given to the factory, she is the sole support of a household of 8. Her husband was disabled in another factory that's long closed now, and she's now taken in her son who was disabled in an accident, and his five children. His wife is dead, and they had nowhere to go. If the factory closes down, they will lose EVERYTHING. I already partially support my young adult daughter and fully support my mother. I can't take on 8 more, I simply don't have the resources.

Excuse me if I tell you where to jump off.


These are not just "companies" you are asking to die - these are people.

I have to believe there must be a middle ground between mindless cash-grabs and free-market Darwinism. If we don't find it, my family, my town, and my country is SCREWED.

[SmileyRose]

8. I wish I could recommend your specific post.

:hug:

[Maru Kitteh]

13. Thanks. I appreciate it very much.

:pals:

[ConcernedCanuk]

9. I'm 58 - survived many companies that went bust - not rich - but survived

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It amazes me when I see people spending thousands of dollars to keep a sick pet alive,

while their own health suffers for lack of funds

put the money/labour/effort where it will do some good for themselves

the TRUE meaning of selfishness is taking care of oneself first,

for if one does not take care of themselves, someone else will have to, and they also will be unable to care for others

And the people will not die - they will reorganize, get thrifty, help each other out - that's always been the way it works

To suggest that I am asking people to die , well

That doesn't deserve a reply

. . . . . .

[DainBramaged]

11. You don't deserve any replies form any of us in the UAW

You are suggesting people should die so corporations survive. A typical Rethug talking point.

[Maru Kitteh]

12. But you did; and I can't let you off that easily.

Do you not understand that there is a direct correlation between the total upheaval of communities accompanied by a lack of employment and/or prospects and suicide rates? This is demonstrable and quantifiable by anyone with even limited curiosity and research skills.

My sister has no other prospects. She did not finish the 8th grade. If her job is dissolved, they will all be homeless. If seeing 5 of your grandchildren turned onto the street and feeling partially responsible for it doesn't lead one to despair, not much will.

Her story is just one tiny bit - like a small capillary far away from the beating heart of the automotive industry, but equally dependent.

[ConcernedCanuk]

20. Chrysler has been bailed out and reorganized more than once

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If little ole me starts a business, and I make bad decisions, my business will die

I won't

This "too big to fold" idea is insane

People need/want cars

If Chrysler folds, some other company will pick up the slack

AND NEED TRAINED WORKERS

Sure - there's a gap

that's why we have Unemployment and Welfare benefits

to fill that gap

There are probably more suicides and broken families from the USA's illegal wars

"This is demonstrable and quantifiable by anyone with even limited curiosity and research skills"

then get back to me . . .

[Maru Kitteh]

34. Who the ever-loving FUCK is this "we" you keep prattling about?

Are they your tax dollars? NO
Is it your welfare system? NO
Is it your unemployment NO
Is it YOUR town? NO
Is it YOUR FUCKING FAMILY? NO


DID THE UAW, the valve factory or my sister START ANY FUCKING ILLEGAL WARS?? NO.

Was that a desperate and ignorant red herring argument on your part? Yes.


Kindly shut the fuck up. Your conservative republican ideals are not welcome here.

[ConcernedCanuk]

35. wow

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[pampango]

36. Double wow. I know we trash Mexico, China and India. But Canada?

Our economies are so integrated, including the auto industry, that good times and bad flow across the border quickly.

Most of us know that the actions of the US affect the rest of the world, so the rest of the world is interested in what we do. Similarly I am interested in what happens in China (particularly in business and pollution) because it affects us. I don't control what China does, any more than the rest of the world controls what we do, but I reserve the right to comment on and make suggestions regarding policies I would like them to adopt.

I don't see how it is progressive to jump down the throat of every "foreigner" (especially on so strange as distant as a Canadian) who dares to offer an opinion on US policy. Back in the "Bush days" most of us were sympathetic to "foreigners" who voiced concern about the effect American policy has on the rest of the world. Now it is "Back off. Mind your own business."?

Canada has already done many of the things that President Obama is trying to accomplish, e.g. national health care, effective regulation of the financial industry, progressive taxation and a strong social safety net.

[olegramps]

37. Sorry, but you sound like one of those cold hearted Christian Republicans.

[madokie]

15. I stand with you Maru

[DainBramaged]

10. You don't even live here, how dare you tell us how to run our country

They aren't bailouts either talking point spewer, they are LOANS. You aren't paying to support anything here. Mind your own business.

[Maru Kitteh]

14. Amazing no? Let the unions die, let the towns die, screw the actual human tragedy, who cares right?

You'll notice I never got an answer as to how many of that person's US tax dollars were at stake, who exactly this "we" was?

[Romulox]

17. Can you imagine the whining if we want on a Canadian site and told them how to spend their tax $$$?

[DainBramaged]

19. THIS IS DU, Foreign nationals telling US how to conduct our business

If we embargoed Canada tomorrow, they would die.

[ConcernedCanuk]

24. If we embargoed Canada tomorrow, they would die - YEAH? who supplies you with much of your oil/gas?

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We would NOT die

Cuba didn't

and Cuba doesn't have anywhere near the resources Canada does

Some US-Americans have to get over themselves

USA is NOT number one

unless you consider it's ability to slaughter with impunity across the Globe

Some should take a humble pill now and then

[Romulox]

26. Oh, I see. You're turning this thread into one about the "short man's complex"

zzzzz

[pampango]

29. Really. Reminds me of the "My dad can beat up your dad" arguments in the first grade.

"If we embargoed Canada tomorrow, they would die."

"Would not. Cuba didn't. And what about oil and gas."

Would to die.

Would not.

Would to.

Would not.

Not sure if that is more of a "Might makes right" or "My dad's stronger than your dad" argument, but in either case it doesn't accomplish much.

[DainBramaged]

30. No I was waiting for your interfering ass to reply so I could tell you this

CLICK

XXXXXX

You're off my screen forever. Go tell your fellow Canucks how to run their own fucking country pal.

[ConcernedCanuk]

32. "DainBramaged" - Suitable nic for sure!!

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AND

I DO tell my fellow Canuks how to run my country - don't listen all the the time but I do "tell my fellow Canucks how to run their own fucking country"

I was a Union Rep for OPSEU and BMWE

That's be our Provincial Government of Ontario and CP Rail

no lightweights them

and I made improvements decades ago that workers still attribute to my efforts

more affectionately known as a "shit-disturber"

lost lots of jobs that way

but improved Health and Safety Standards in major employers for DECADES

That would be MILLIONS of people . . .

Ya can't shame me for that

What have YOU done??

[ConcernedCanuk]

21. Telling you how to run YOUR country?? - umm we have plenty of the "Big 3" plants up here . .

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Including the Ford plant in my hometown of Oakville Ontario

AND

if you have any idea of how much the USA's economy and Canada's are interdependent

Then what the USA does IS MY BUSINESS

Because whatever the USA does affects us Canadians directly

IF the the USA stops doing business with Canada

THEN, and only then, will what y'all do down there be

"none of my business . . "

[Romulox]

22. Having a GM plant in Ontario doesn't make you a US taxpayer.

What a bizarre argument.

:crazy:

[ConcernedCanuk]

23. "What a bizarre argument" - indeed - where did I claim to be a US taxpayer?

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I DID say about the burden on us taxpayers

IF I had been referring to US-American taxpayers, it would have been capitalized

WE Canuks pay taxes too ya know

so our failing companies cost us jobs/security/money as well

I'm almost given up trying to reason with you there Romulox

So make an intelligent debate if you want to continue

Otherwise - I'll ignore you next time

enuf is enuf - I do not participate in flame-baiting/wars

[Romulox]

25. You keep on saying, "We" should do this, and "we" should do that..

This hasn't nothing to do with "we" as in "Canadians and Americans". This has to do with spending American taxpayer $$$.

"WE Canuks pay taxes too ya know"

Then take your concerns to your own parliament.

[dionysus]

28. good. we'll shutter your plants and move them to flint michigan. thanks for the idea!

:hi:

[Romulox]

16. Err, do you follow the news? We're giving trillions to the banks.

So the "free market" cant rings very hollow at the moment.

[eilen]

18. We bailed out the banks so they would loan monies out

so the auto companies and others that rely on customers financing would not die. It is not the auto companies fault their customers are having trouble getting loans, it is the banks that froze the credit.

We tried to stop the house of cards by bailing banks to end the credit freeze. They are not holding up their part of the bargain. I see no reason to punish the auto companies for this.

[Kalyke]

27. First, Ford isn't on the chopping block.

They're holding their own and beating Toyota for quality and cost.

Secondly,

See the post just below yours. No. 7. And then tell me who'll die - the company (no... it'll just close, not die) or the people who are laid off, can't find work and will starve as a result.

[ConcernedCanuk]

33. I sorta like to respond to people that take note of my posts

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your comment:

"people who are laid off, can't find work and will starve as a result"

well - I'm 58 - worked since I was 17 years old - well before that if you count paper routes and snow shoveling

anyways

I've worked for dozens of employers

seen many fail and ending up unemployed

In my 58 years

of all my dead friends and relatives I cannot connect even ONE with loss of employment . . .

maybe I'll know more when I'm 68??

[SmileyRose]

4. This is not auto industry - this is a problem in ALL American business.

We sell to restaurants and pre-meltdown the fact our largest customers were set up on a 365 due date was "good business". And if one of the largest chain fast food places in America decided to let their account go 180 days past due we did not sweat because the orders kept coming and the money eventually showed up. This is extremely common in small and large businesses alike.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

6. Gee, what a surprise.

Well, let's throw some money at them, too. What's a few more billion on top of trillions spent already?

[Romulox]

31. We haven't spent "trillions" in aiding the automakers. You're thinking of Wall Street. nt