Something Big Is About To Happen

[MannyGoldstein]

The last time my spidey-sense tingled like this was the day after Katrina - everyone and everything seemed lost and unsettled, and it ended up marking the end of the ascendancy of the Crazy/Stupid Right.

We are now in a similarly unsettled period. After 16+ years of being in lock step with the third-way crowd, large numbers of Democrats are throwing off the yoke of the crypto-Republican DLC. Progressives in Congress, unions, and media pundits are demanding - DEMANDING - a non-sucking "Public Option", even as our President tries to flee from it. Dr. Dean has emerged from under the bus where he was tossed and is again leading the charge, and gaining strength daily, as Obama's job approval numbers head earthward.

I'm not sure what's going to happen - but it will be big, and it will be interesting. Stay tuned!

[BlooInBloo]

1. Yah - I heard Clinton will take over and lead the way to single-payer.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

3. That worked so well last time.

[RufusTFirefly]

31. She never led to single-payer in the first place. Why would she now? n/t

[BlooInBloo]

32. She wouldn't.

[redqueen]

47. LOL

:D

[WI_DEM]

50. Like he did in '94?

[madfloridian]

2. He has emerged from under the bus several times.

:hi:

I just got the C-Span schedule and he was on C-Span 2 tonight about his book. I missed it.

[PM Martin]

4. The Public Option will work fine.

[dflprincess]

9. The public option as written in HR3200 is a piece of crap

it won't even be an "option" for the majority of us for years and it comes with copays and deductibles that are as high as the worst private policies currently available. The entire bill is is nothing but a gift to the private insurers as most of us will be mandated to buy their lousy products.

[PM Martin]

11. I did not know that till now.

I will have to do more research to see the ups and downs of these different ideas.

[SpartanDem]

21. The public option will open to everyone

there's been confusion between businesses and individuals.

Individuals are allowed to shop on the exchange right away, if they're willing to drop their employer-sponsored coverage

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/aug/28/anthony-weiner/employers-dont-have-keep-coverage-under-health-ref/

[dflprincess]

27. The public option (again, the HR3200 one) won't be available to anyone before 2013

(it took 11 months to get Medicare up and running) Per the CBO only 10 million people will be covered by it by 2019. Its premiums and out of pockets will not make it any more affordable for those who are not eligible for subsidies.

Nothing in the bills currently being pushed do a thing to really improve access to health care, they only push insurance and, for the most part, private insurance and the out of pockets will still keep people from getting care. Rep. Weiner's comments appear to be based on the CBO report as well as what is in the bill. And, keep in mind, Weiner is a supporter of single payer so he's not making comments from an anti-reform position.

HR3200 is a scam designed to protect health insurance company profits and campaign "contributions".

[eomer]

38. Wow, I didn't believe you so I looked it up -- you are right!

Excerpts from HR 3200:

(c) Transition- Individuals and employers shall only be eligible to enroll or participate in the Health Insurance Exchange in accordance with the following transition schedule:

(1) FIRST YEAR- In Y1 (as defined in section 100(c))--

(A) individuals described in subsection (d)(1), including individuals described in paragraphs (3) and (4) of subsection (d); and

(B) smallest employers described in subsection (e)(1).
(2) SECOND YEAR- In Y2--

(A) individuals and employers described in paragraph (1); and

(B) smaller employers described in subsection (e)(2).

(3) THIRD AND SUBSEQUENT YEARS- In Y3 and subsequent years--

(A) individuals and employers described in paragraph (2); and

(B) larger employers as permitted by the Commissioner under subsection (e)(3).

(25) Y1, Y2, ETC- The terms ‘Y1’ , ‘Y2’, ‘Y3’, ‘Y4’, ‘Y5’, and similar subsequently numbered terms, mean 2013 and subsequent years, respectively.

Well, at least they made it easy to fix -- all that needs to be done is change 2013 in that one spot to 2011, say. Assuming passage in the fall that would give a bit more than a year to ramp it up.

[dflprincess]

45. Do a Google search for the CBO report as well

I can't find my link to it and, being at work right now, I can't take too much time looking for a new one. It's actually a little easier to read as you don't need to keep flipping around looking for the definitions like you would have had to do in your excerpt and it will give you the estimates for when & how many people will be covered.

If they wanted to take time to "transistion" us into a new system I do not understand why they don't just start expanding Medicare eligiblity by group. Start by opening it up to the uninsured and then start expanding age ranges, etc.

Obama claims single payer would be a good idea if we were "starting from scratch", but we don't have to start from scratch for that, we have Medicare which is up and running. This goofy "insurance exchange" sounds more like starting from scratch when you consider how long it will take to get it going - and it still won't guarantee access to care.

[eomer]

52. I agree that would be the best solution.

As long as the end result would be that everyone is covered by Medicare single payer then I think that would be a great solution.

The problem comes from taking the approach that there is not enough "support" for a single payer system like that, which in reality means that too many politicians have been bought and paid for by corporate interests.

If we don't get single payer then we will need to be careful that the insurance companies cannot game the system and use the public option as a place to dump sick people so they can end up with just the healthy ones.

[dflprincess]

53. You can bet they'll be gaming the system

and when the public option fails because it's become too expensive to maintain they'll point to it as proof "government" health care doesn't work.

Sure there may be some regulations passed to keep them from raising premiums or denying coveage - but they'll just pay the fines when caught breaking them. Just like Walmart apparently considers the fines it pays for breaking labor laws as part of doing business.

It's the question no one ever asks Obama or any of the others who support this faux reform. They all say we need a public option to "keep the insurers honest". So they admit the private insurers are crooked and not to be trusted but they're doing all they can to protect them, while doing nothing to be sure we can actually get health care.

[lib_wit_it]

59. We need to demand single payer. Demand it! If that means being rude at town hall meetings, shutting

out the Rs, marching on Washington in the millions--whatever. Why can't we get the facts out there and get people as excited about the truth as they are about the lies?

Medicaid for all=single payer.

[create.peace]

5. By the pricking of my thumbs.....nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

6. Well they are spooked in DC

with all the threats of voting third party if they don't fucking get it with the majorities they have.

<------- I will not vote for you

What the RNC?

No, Third party....

LONG PAUSE.

Realize, I am almost on first name basis with the staffer... she said they have gotten way too many calls like this... seems the Greens are popular these days.

[TomCADem]

7. Scary - Sounds Like Something Pastor Steve Anderson Would Say

It is scary when the left starts to sound like the right.

[MannyGoldstein]

8. Yeah, Pretty Much Identical To Anderson

As my Congressman would say "On what planet..."

[TomCADem]

19. Same Anti-Government Paranoia, But With A "Liberal" Gloss

What I don't understand is how someone can be so distrustful of government, yet at the same time want a public option? I would think that the desire for a public option entails some faith that our Democratically elected leaders can implement and run it. Yet, the paranoia of your OP complete with references to "spider sense tingling," just does not seem consistent. I get the impression that you think it is perfectly consistent to hold the Obama administration in contempt, yet demand that the implement a public option run by this same administration. Go figure.

[MannyGoldstein]

24. Medicare Is Run By Bureaucrats, Not Pols

That's a big difference.

I may be the one person in the US who trusts bureaucrats more than almost any other group.

[omega minimo]

17. As scary as when the right pretends to sound like the left

[Robb]

10. ...

...Something wonderful.
:rofl:

[Fuzz]

12. Thank you Nostradamus

[RagAss]

28. LOL

[Arkana]

13. Then why haven't I Leaped yet?

[NMDemDist2]

14. works for me!

:evilgrin:

:hi:

[bertman]

15. If you need some verification, I'll go out and try to scare up some chicken entrails.

I'm just hoping that whatever big happens, it's GOOD big. And not bad big.

[Liberal_in_LA]

29. lol n/t

[deaniac21]

16. I love science!

[KittyWampus]

18. That's not your "spidey-sense", it's jock itch.

[scheming daemons]

20. How come your spidey-sense missed the market collapse and the election of Obama?

I'd say your spidey-sense is a little weak if it didn't detect anything big since August of 2005.

[Arkana]

22. I heard from Tellurian and Walt Starr that Hillary will seize power

and everything will be all sunshine and roses and unicorns farting out rainbows.

[MannyGoldstein]

25. Dear God That Was Good!

Fortunately I was *between* sips of my Sam Adams when I read that.

[MannyGoldstein]

23. Actually, I Caught Both Of Those

I pulled my money out of the market at a good time, and was behind Obama from the start and was pretty sure he'd win after SC*.

But this is even bigger.

*Note - I've also done some incredibly dumb things as well - I just happened to get those right,

[MannyGoldstein]

26. Wow! I'm Back up To 0 Votes!

I'm sure the Rahm-a-trons will fix that right quick.

[ljm2002]

30. I so hope your spidey-sense is right about this!

I've felt something the last 10 days, too. Teddy Kennedy's passing seemed to have an effect also, like it kind of coalesced a lot of free-floating political energy. And all of a sudden, there are some actual facts about health care emerging from all the ridiculous political theater that the dim bulbs have been carrying out for their overlords -- not to mention all of the content-free talking head programs. But now, we're hearing about the public option, and even single payer is brought up sometimes.

Well -- here's hoping!

[defendandprotect]

33. Public Option we need is . . . MEDICARE FOR ALL, EVERYONE IN, NO ONE OUT -- !!

[autorank]

34. The "third way" needs to hit the highway

DEFINITION

* Main Entry: third way
* Pronunciation: \thurd\
* Function: cynical, pejorative noun
* Etymology: straight from Wall Street crooks
* Date: 1990's

1: a load of crap from the start, a betrayal of the middle, working, and poorer classes;

2 a: a fat bunch of trickle down lies compounded by smiling free traders and bank robbers who also ran the banks :b movement based on a name devoid of meaning, intellect, or soul

[mmonk]

39. The Third Way is what Mussolini called his movement and party:

http://blogs.roanoke.com/rtblogs/dancasey/2009/08/05/quote-of-the-day-benito-mussolini-on-corporatism/

[autorank]

64. They don't even have enough respect for us

to smile when they're screwing us. Thanks for the excellent reference and link.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

35. Wow, spidey-sense only one day after Katrina.

If you could speed that up a couple of days it would really be useful.

[redqueen]

49. Yes, which is when the ascendency of the right *started*...

in some alternate universe somewhere, anyway.

[anAustralianobserver]

36. I was just saying something like this to my girlfriend!

I'm avidly watching this, mainly through DU.

The only 3 cards the Republican party seem to have left are:

- their FOX and AM radio propaganda media
- their confused remnant supporters who think Obama is the NWO Antichrist or something
- the intimidation/blackmail of key members of your Congress (mainly the Senate?)

This is a very weak hand to hold! The schism in the US cultural psyche is not sustainable and it will integrate somehow soon! My guess is that by October there'll be new crucial healing developments in your nation's internal and external affairs.

[MannyGoldstein]

40. One More Republican Card

Obama's administration is composed almost entirely of Republicans who call themselves Democrats.

[anAustralianobserver]

58. I'll be watching Obama's speech next Wednesday to see if it's only aspirational or substantial

Watching the debate from Australia makes me very appreciative of my Australian Medicare (all ages) card

[1]

37. i agree. it is happening. and it is big. we need not fear. it is happening...

something big is about to happen!

[robcon]

41. I am surprised. I never thought I'd see such mindless crap on DU.

Maybe your "spidey-sense" or "tingles" mean that your foot fell asleep.

[MannyGoldstein]

42. Any Specifics That You Disagree With? n/t

[Name removed]

48. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[1]

43. i feel it too, manny,,,

storm clouds gather.

[RadiationTherapy]

44. Meh. Most people go through this and forget all the times they were wrong.

I may experience anticipatory 'tingles', but it is silly to try and tell anyone.

[redqueen]

46. Uh... how is Obama trying to flee from it?

Pathetic. You might have had a point there, but ... fail.

[Echo In Light]

51. Perhaps another False Flag will be staged on behalf of vested intere$ts

... if there is the perception that those 'damn liberals' aren't going to buckle like a belt as usual. Don't fool yourself for a second in thinking that the ones who really control this country are willing to sit back and allow any substantial non for-profit HC implementation to occur - they'd sooner see a nuke detonated over a city to shut everything down, they're that singularly devoted to the Profits Over People mentality.

[David Zephyr]

54. K&R.

The Left won't be docile anymore.

[bunkerbuster1]

55. Is it going to be HUGH?

(sorry, had to post that.)

[bvar22]

56. I pray you are right, but....

...I have an overwhelming sense of dread that we are going to get Mandated Health Insurance coupled to a weak designed to fail provision that they call a "Public Option" that won't be available to "The Public" (HR 3200).

[progressoid]

57. I remember a lot of times when great things were going to happen in the last few years.

FOI documents, whistle blowers, investigations, etc were going to bring down the Bush admin. Didn't happen.

Everybody got moist jeans thinking about Rove, Cheney, Rummy, Gonzales, Blackwater, KBR, etc arrested and tried. Didn't happen.

I'd rather deal with what's actually happening. Not warm fuzzy feelings.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

60. Michael Jackson gets planted tomorrow -

that might be what you're picking up?

[old mark]

61. About time...Hard to rise from the dead when they won't

bury you to begin with....

mark

[abumbyanyothername]

62. Error: you can only recommend threads which were started in the past 24 hours

Thanks for this.

[t0dd]

63. Error: you can only recommend threads which were started in the past 24 hours (ditto)

THANK YOU.