Toyota, Accused of Destroying Rollover Accidents Evidence

[DainBramaged]

6th of September 2009 <--------- For all of the thread busters who feel that bad news about God ToyHonNis must be squelched.

Japanese manufacturer Toyota currently finds itself involved in a potentially image-damaging storm. Dimitrios Biller, a former Toyota Motor attorney, is accusing his former employer of hiding and destroying evidence regarding rollover accidents and has asked Dallas attorney Todd Tracy to refile 15 lawsuits against Toyota.


Biller, who worked for Toyota until 2007, filed a suit against Toyota this summer. He claims Toyota didn’t disclose all evidence useful for rollover suits or for National Highway Traffic Safety Administration regulations.

Todd Tracy said in an interview quoted by Autonews that he is planning to refile the 15 lawsuits, some of them some six years old. He believes „this opens any cases that Toyota's had from years ago if Dimitrios Biller's allegations are true.”

About the authenticity of Biller’s claims, Tracy said “I can't imagine that he would make the allegations that he did with the very specific facts that he did without having some ammo backing him up,”

Toyota declined to comment on the new allegations, saying it will not speak about unfiled lawsuits. The Japanese manufacturer did say, through the voice of spokesman Mike Michels, they are „confident that it has complied with our obligations with respect to our product liability litigation.”


http://www.autoevolution.com/news/toyota-accused-of-destroying-rollover-accidents-evidence-10593.html

[unhappycamper]

1. This reminds me of the Mitisubishi flap of a few years ago.

Too bad Toyota pulled this crap. :(

[TxRider]

I dunno..

I have a toyota 4 runner, 4x4 SUV.

I've had it sliding sideways at 60mph on the freeway avoiding some idiot in a huge US SUV and although II was expecting a rollover, it didn't even come close.

I did roll over a toyota 1 ton pickup once, but any vehicle can roll I don't see what the big deal is.

[madokie]

3. The big deal is

when that top comes into your space and smashes one's head. Thats what I think the big deal is anyway.

[Mosby]

19. Toyota doesn't make a 1 ton truck. nt

[lutefisk]

56. Toyota made a one-ton pickup in the 80's. It looked like a regular long bed, but was very heavy duty

"A one-ton model came later (at least by 1985, when it had the 22RE engine), and in 1987 the one-ton Toyota truck had a 2,655 pound payload and could tow up to 5,000 pounds when properly equipped, though with a 116 horsepower 2.4 liter engine, it must have been interesting to drive with that load."

http://www.toyoland.com/trucks/t100.html

[Mosby]

69. That's not a 1 ton truck pictured at that site

it's this truck:

http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2009/03/whats-the-most-reliable-pickup-ever-made.html

The current Tundra double cab is the largest pick up ever made by Toyota, and it's a 3/4 ton (maybe).

[TxRider]

74. Hey that's my old truck!

And yes they did make a 1 ton long bed truck...

"In 1985, a four-speed electronically-controlled automatic transmission became available. In 1987, Toyota found that its owners were the most loyal (based on Ward’s reports) and most satisfied (based on J.D. Power). At that time, a wide variety of options were available, with standard and long beds, Standard, Deluxe, and SR5 trim levels, regular and XtraCab, and the 1-ton truck, with the highest payload capacity of any compact or midsized pickup - 2,655 pounds."

http://www.toyoland.com/trucks/tacoma-hilux.html

I didn't tow with it..

I did use it commercially though, and it did just great with 2000lb in the back.

I even put a tarp in the back and filled it to the top with water once, quite a scary ordeal driving it full of water though...

What vehicle are they talking about these rollovers with anyway?

[madokie]

2. One of my neighbors has a corolla

I looked at it while he was working on it, putting struts on, and I must say for an auto to be so tinny ,ie cheap, built it sure has a following. He loves it even though its a '03 model and he has to work on it all the time. It's a piece of shit if you ask me and all this on top of the fact that it's not very safe to be in either. What a bunch of dumbbutts who buy them :-)

[TK421]

63. Ummm...I had an 88 Camry..similiar build to a Corolla with some minor differences...

This thing was a tank and required very little care...dependable to the end when it came for inspection time ( two years later ) needed more than I could afford...but still could have kept on running. I had to give it up because I was very poor at the time and just took the $75.00 from the junkyard. The expenses for repairs just to pass inspection were more than what I could afford...but then again I got this car for nothing...it was from a family that used it as a beater to make trips to the grocery story..etc...... This car never left me broken down, though ( unlike the piece of shit Ford Tempo I had and the rental Chevy Malibu that had a water-pump leak that caused it to overheat three days after I took it out for rental )....hey, go figure? :) Fucking American pieces of fucking shit!!!!!!!!!!!

COINCIDENCE? I THINK NOT!!!!!

edited to add: My very first car was my father's car ( an 88 Nissan Stanza ) best car there ever was...and the only reason I lost it was because one of your asshole daughters ( who, undoubtedly was driving under YOUR insurance policy!!! ) decided to make an illegal left-hand turn on me when I smacked into the bitch!!!! I got out to see if she was okay...she didn't even know what she did...she was complaining about her knee that banged into the steering column....like I fucking CARED! My car was totalled...I got a piece of shit rental from her insurance company ( the Chevy Malibu!!!!! ) they are AWESOME!! :sarcasm: No, really...they are pieces of fucking shit

[snooper2]

4. Didn't you post this subject two weeks ago?

We get it, you don't like Toyota :)

[Romulox]

5. This must not be discussed! Don't you know that Toyota is the corporation that CARES about people?

Toyota is like an old friend to me, and I know in my heart they would never do me wrong. :hug:

[DainBramaged]

6. Toyota, people before profit............

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[snooper2]

7. I don't think there is a single car corporation that "cares"

about people...

I also know that companies make shitty and good vehicles...

You'll never catch me in a POS Toyota Echo, but I'll take a Tacoma any day. If they weren't so damn expensive ( even used ) I would have got one, but ended up getting a 03' Dakota with a gas sucking 14mpg 4.7L V8. Still a good truck...

[Romulox]

9. Was the Tacoma the one with all the recalls due to structural defects?

Or was that the Tundra?

[snooper2]

13. beats me but - but Toyota trucks are rock fucking solid..

So is my Dodge and so is my buddie's Chevy 1500 ( with 560HP he doesn't really need :) )


You should watch this...Top Gear did their best to try to destroy a Toyota truck, left it in the ocean, hit it with a wrecking ball, set the damn thing on fire, had it on the roof of a 23 story building that was demolished...the fucking thing still runs!

:rofl:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lrk6vsb77xk

[Romulox]

16. "Toyota Rust Recall Maybe Coming Due to Rusty Tacoma and Tundra Truck Frames "

Looks like there's problems with both trucks. :hi:

http://image.internetautoguide.com/f/auto-recalls/toyota-rust-recall-maybe-coming-due-to-rusty-tacoma-and-tundra-truck-frames/18484815+w527+st0/rusted-tundra-frame-toyota-truck.jpg

http://blogs.internetautoguide.com/6533826/auto-recalls/toyota-rust-recall-maybe-coming-due-to-rusty-tacoma-and-tundra-truck-frames/index.html

[Xicano]

46. I love my Tundra

I love my Tundra. I've had it now for nine years, it has 90k miles and its frame looks nothing like that and its never had any problems whatsoever and drives just as nice today as when I bought it.


Here's a couple of pics of my Tundra.

[Romulox]

58. Rust is caused by road salt. A shiny truck pictured near palm trees misses the point.

:hi:

[Xicano]

59. And I go snow skiing every year up in Big Bear, CA where I drive on 'road salt'.

And I still love my Tundra. :)


:hi:

[Romulox]

61. LOL. Sorry, but that's not the same thing as living in Detroit or Minny. nt

[Romulox]

38. The trucker's braggadoccio has strangely fallen silent... nt

[DainBramaged]

14. Toyota Announces Safety Recall on Select Vehicles

Recall with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) involving approximately 95,700 Toyota and Scion vehicles sold in the United States.

On certain 2009 and 2010 model year Toyota Corolla, Corolla Matrix, and 2008 and 2009 Scion xD vehicles all equipped with 1.8 liter engines, Toyota has determined that if the vehicle is operated in extremely low ambient temperatures, there is a possibility that condensed moisture from the positive crankcase ventilation (PCV) port may seep into the brake system vacuum port and freeze. Should this condition continue, ice may slowly accumulate at the brake system vacuum port and in the extreme case, ultimately plug the vacuum port. As a result of the accumulation of ice, power assist to the brakes would gradually decrease and lead to lengthened vehicle stopping distances.

Since this condition only manifests in extremely low ambient temperatures, vehicle owners from 19 affected states will begin receiving a Safety Recall Notification via first class mail in early September, 2009. Those states are: Alaska, Colorado, Idaho, Illinois, Iowa, Kansas, Maine, Michigan, Minnesota, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, New York, North Dakota, South Dakota, Vermont, Wisconsin, and Wyoming.

http://pressroom.toyota.com/pr/tms/toyota/toyota-announces-safety-recall-100493.aspx?srchid=K610_p220562709

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

15. You just got done saying how they are horrible because they withold information.

So here they have found an entirely theoretical problem and are doing a voluntary recall (which is the RIGHT thing to do) and you think this is bad. And the repair necessary is minor.

Recalls like this happen all the time to EVERY car manufacturer. There's nothing special about Toyota in this case.

[madokie]

49. What about someone driving one of them up to say Canada

and they are from around here in OK and they bought it here. I don't think toyota is a good company if this is any indication that is

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

8. He doesn't like non-Americans nor their corporations regardless of where they are.

We're talking here about someone who refers to Asian people as "rice" in his posts.

[Romulox]

10. And you, the tireless champion of the American worker.

PS: Do you know what "n/t" means? :hi:

[DainBramaged]

11. I guess the thread police have shown up, oh well

and the defenders of the japanese corporations begin their assault..........

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

12. Fixed.

And yeah, sorry that I don't feel the need to use racial epithets to make my points.

[Romulox]

17. You have no credibility on this issue. nt

[DainBramaged]

20. You are a lying slanderous stalking piece of shit.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

21. Why don't you just put me back on ignore?

You've done it twice now, and made a big show of it each time. You're doing a very, very poor job of ignoring me.

[DainBramaged]

22. You've been stalking my ass for months scumbag, you just don't know when to let go

and your slander is getting more than annoying. Leave me the fuck alone and bother someone else. I guess you have some severe problems to try and draw attention to yourself everytime I post a thread, and the evidence is plain and goes back months.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

23. I'm not going to engage in petty bickering with you.

Keep your personal attacks to yourself.

[DainBramaged]

24. Bullshit you've been bickering with me for months, should I post the links?

You personal attacks, slander and stalking are seriously troublesome, and you really need to see someone rather than stalk me. You've been drawing attention and even when your attacks have been deleted you continue.

Is there something wrong with you? Or should I call the cops or my attorney because I feel you are a threat to me.

[Romulox]

37. This one is OBVIOUSLY a sock puppet. He doesn't post in any other sorts of threads

Just trolls domestic auto threads.

[DainBramaged]

39. I make NO bones about my affiliation with GM/Chevrolet/UAW

But some folks on here need a good rinsing out.......maybe disinfection.

[Romulox]

40. I love how these people act like you're a secret agent because you support domestic industry.

I don't understand the point of this website, sometimes. Feels like a LOT of the true liberals have been run off, and most of who is left are either "centrists" (people who would've been George HW Bush Republicans, 20 years ago) and a few "progressives" scared of being tombstoned.

[DainBramaged]

26. Here ya go, in every thread I start, you're there, including the deleted ones

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=6490264#6490297



http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=6489787#6490129

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=6487628#6490230

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=6487628#6489522

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=6487363#6489205


This is just a few days and doesn't include the deleted posts of your.

Find a thread where I have replied to you.

[Romulox]

33. And YOU are doing a very, very poor job of hiding your true colors!

Remember when you masqueraded as a "champion of the working class" way back when? You might want to make a new sock puppet, because your cover is hopelessly and forever blown. :hi:

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

45. I don't recall masquerading as a champion of anything.

Really, that's not my style.

[Touchdown]

27. Not true! He also hates Apple because they use the chinese (Taiwanese actually)

... to build their computers. And everybody knows, that those $300 Acer netbooks and $500 Toshiba laptops are built by well paid union members in Ohio.:eyes:

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

28. Oh no, now you're going to get accused of "stalking" him. n/t

[DainBramaged]

29. Nope, I don't hate Apple I just think they're way overpriced

in spite of Acer and Toshiba using child labor to build PC notebooks just like Apple. And I just bought a new Acer netbook so there, bbbbbbbbbbbbbbzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Romulox]

32. Hooray for $2800 sweatshop Apple computers! They prove that capitalism works!

:eyes:

[Touchdown]

34. Taiwan's a sweatshop country? Really?

Hmm. Haven't heard any stories about them lately. I think I'm going to need a little link or two.

[DainBramaged]

35. Judging Apple Sweatshop Charge

Steve Jobs' Think Different campaign celebrated labor leaders like Gandhi, who used strikes as a form of civil protest, and Ceasar Chavez, who organized poor, migrant farm workers. But a British newspaper at the weekend published a rather shocking report about the factories in China that make his company's iPods.

A report in the middlebrow Mail on Sunday entitled "iPod City" features photos and first-hand accounts from inside factories operated by Foxconn, a company contracted by Apple to assemble millions of iPods by hand.

According to the report (paraphrased here by Macworld UK), Foxconn's giant Longhua plant employs 200,000 workers, who work 15-hour days but are paid just $50 a month -- miserable even by China's standards. It claims they work and live in the plant, in dormitories housing 100 people, and outside visitors are forbidden.

The report says another plant that makes Apple's iPod shuffle in Suzhou, Shanghai, employs mostly women, because they are more trustworthy. Another factory is secured by Chinese police officers, the paper said.

Workers at these factories earn more -- about $100 a month -- but are not housed by the company. The paper says rent and living costs eat up about half the worker's salaries.

It should be no surprise that Chinese factory workers are low paid but the report makes conditions sound positively Dickensian.

The situation is too murky for a rush to judgment on Apple's ethics here, and it may well meet minimum global standards. But for a company that has staked its image on progressive politics, Apple has set itself up as a potential lightning rod on global labor standards. Sweatshops came back to bite Nike after its customers rose up in arms; and Apple can expect a similar grilling from its upscale Volvo-driving fans in the months ahead.

http://www.wired.com/gadgets/mac/commentary/cultofmac/2006/06/71138

[Touchdown]

41. That story is why I was careful to say "Computers" not music players.

I know about the iPod, and it's shameful. You just have no room to judge since you bought a sweatshop netbook.

[DainBramaged]

42. Right, I'l emember that the next time I find American made electronics or computers.

:eyes:

Some game, damned if we do, sock puppeted if we don't.

[Touchdown]

43. Thank you for conceding.

You started it 2 weeks ago with your BS in a Mac thread. Now you just argued what I said 3 posts ago.

And... stalking has nothing to do with it. You are just notorious.

[DainBramaged]

47. Whatever Mac is AS GUILTY as anyone else in spite of their bullshit image

And I didn't concede shit, it's a fact of life, something I wish I didn't have to deal with, so the people who think they score victories on the internets can pound salt.

[Touchdown]

50. BS image? Baseball, Hot dogs, Apple Pie and Chevrolet?

Except those made in Canada, Korea, Germany, Brazil, Mexico, and whereever else not in America, right?

And yes you did concede. You're just too stupid to notice.

[DainBramaged]

52. Bite my ass douche bag

goodbye.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

55. Just can't stop, can you? n/t

[Touchdown]

48. What The Foxconn sweatshops also make.

Intel motherboards
HP and Dell computers
Playstation 2
Playstation 3
XBox 360
Wii
Motorola Cellphones
Amazon Kindle


This company is a monster. You can't go anywhere and buy anything not touched by Foxconn.

That think different campaign? 11 years ago? C'mon! Should I bring up "Baseball, Hot Dogs, Apple Pie and Chevrolet"... except those models made in Korea, Mexico, Germany, Brazil and Canada?

[Romulox]

36. Apple notebooks are made by Foxconn in China. As are virtually all of Apple's hardware products.

"I think I'm going to need a little link or two."

www.google.com

:eyes:

[Touchdown]

44. Foxconn makes display screens,. Try again.

Or shut the fuck up.

$2800 is also Power Mac territory, no monitor there. Certainly more expensive than Apple's top of the line notebook.

And.. LOOKIE HERE! Foxconn (富士康) is the trade name of the Taiwan based firm Hon Hai Precision Industry Co. (Ltd.) (LSE: HHPD). Foxconn is the largest manufacturer of electronics and computer components worldwide, and mainly manufactures on contract to other companies.

Fancy that! You failed.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxconn

[Romulox]

57. Calm down and read the link you yourself provided. It explains everything--

that Foxconn makes all sorts of products (not just displays), that it is the primary contractor for Apple, and that it makes products in China.

You could've just read the wiki link you provided, but you made yourself look like a gibbering idiot instead. Why? :shrug:

[Touchdown]

64. Uh' actually it's not the "primary contractor for Apple"

They make the Mac Mini and the iPod/iPhone family. That's it.

They do not make the Macbooks (like you allege), or the Power Mac, which is the only thing from them that costs $2800.

If you are going to throw out hyperbole, then you should know what you're talking about. A Foxconn employee was killed (suicide? maybe), but you only blame Apple for it.

You don't blame...
Hewlett Packard
Dell
Sony
Microsoft
Intel
Nintendo
Motorola
Amazon & many others who all use the same manufacturer... Foxconn.

It's the hypocrisy, Stupid!

[Romulox]

66. Are you drinking? From the link YOU supplied in your post #36:

From YOUR link:

Foxconn has worked with Apple since 1986. They produce the Macbook, MacBook Pro and MacBook Air, as well as the iPhone and the iPod.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxconn

Are you just playing some sort of bizarre game here? Count me out.

[Touchdown]

70. alright, conceded. Now answer my central question.

Why all the wrath on on a computer company you don't (and probably never did even before you had this for an excuse) like as opposed to the other companies that use this same exploitive manufacturer. Do you think Apple had that man killed? Do you think without Apple's orders, that Foxconn would be a utopian workplace of the future?

Or is the death that occurred the result of the victim losing an Apple prototype, and thus they are complicit? Do you have such hatred for any company where a needless, and corporate strongman death occurs, or just Apple because you never liked them anyway?

Should I not buy from them because of this death? Apple happened to be Foxconn's only client who expressed a public regret over the death of that employee. Not even you're children's favorite Nintendo (Foxconn makes the Wii, and the Gamecube previously) said anything about it.

Who else should I avoid?

Should I not buy from Ford because Henry hired gunmen to shoot and kill unionizing workers in the 1920s?
BMW because they built fighters for the Luftwaffe?
Toshiba because they profited off of WWII slave labor in Japanese occupied pacific islands?
Mitsubishi, because they built the Kamikazi planes?
Excel Energy, because they run a coal fired power plant, and there is a long history of exploitation, murder, corruption, and needless deaths from unsafe conditions in the mines they get their fuel from?
Home Depot because a customer was run over by a fork lift?
Wal*Mart for an employee being trampled to death last x-mas, and a pregnant customer being trampled on 2 years before?
Volkswagen because the first one was made at Hitler's orders?
Mattel, because people have died making their toys in China?
Wendy's because the dead founder was anti-abortion?
Flamingo Las Vegas because it was built by a mobster?
Nike, Reebok, Sketchers, etc. for the same sweatshop labor you accuse Apple of using... even if conditions have improved? They still let it happen at one point in their history.
Clothing lines way too numerous to mention because of Central American sweatshops, notorious for rape and murder?

When is a company forgiven? When have they atoned for their past sins?
Why Apple, and few else?

[Touchdown]

71. I see you're too chickenshit to respond to the actual argument.

Typical.

[Romulox]

72. One of the reasons I knew that Foxconn made the Macbook is

that when I changed the harddrive in mine (a far too labor intensive process, by the by!) the name "Foxconn" and "Made in China" were printed on almost every part, including the SATA cable I ripped during the procedure (grrrr!).

I hold in my grubby little hand at the moment a copy of Mac OS X Snow Leopard (family pack) I installed on the same Macbook yesterday without incident. Pretty nice (if a bit underwhelming--but hey--Finder is faster, as is waking up from Sleep!)

Now, tell me again how pointing out the fact that Macbooks (like the 3 my family owns, hence the "family pack" upgrade for Snow Leopard :hi: ) are made by poorly treated labor in China displays "wrath on on a computer company you don't (and probably never did even before you had this for an excuse) like,". :hi:

[Touchdown]

73. Because it's a low blow to single one company out.

when corporate boardrooms all around the world are guilty of allowing the same thing to happen... and that's what you did when you responded to me with your $2800 snark.

If you want to change sweatshop conditioons, you have to change the way business is done across the entire corporate culture. I doubt any of these American and Japanese companies have any say in how Foxconn conducts their personel dept. Maybe it's time they should.

You came off as hostile toward Apple, and I took it that way. My mistake.:hi:

[Romulox]

67. And Mr. Genius Bar? A Macbook can easily cost $2800...

http://store.apple.com/us/configure/MC226LL/A?mco=Nzk2MDg2OA

:hi:

[Brickbat]

18. That's Toyota quality for you! Man, I can smell the quality from here! The best, shiniest,

sparkliest gummy-bear of a company there's ever been! This story just makes me feel like offering them a big ol' tax break!

[Xicano]

54. And here's some Ford quality for you..

Spontaneously combusting vehicles.

What is the Ford Fire Recall?

Since 1999, the Ford Motor Company has recalled over 10.4 million Ford, Lincoln and Mercury cars, SUVs and pickup trucks due to faulty cruise control switches, which can corrode overtime and catch fire. The National Highway Traffic and Safety Administration's (NHTSA) has reported receiving 1,472 complaints connected to the defect, including 65 fires.
The number of Ford fires reported to NHTSA is believed to be far less than the number that have occurred. The national law firm of Lieff Cabraser Heimann & Bernstein, the sponsor of this website, has received over 325 complaints of fires in Ford vehicles linked to the speed control deactivation system.

http://www.switchfires.com/

Recall notice: http://www.ford.com/dynamic/metatags/article-detail/223_important_notice_voluntary_recall_update

Some examples of Ford quality:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRbdjexSYqQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kd8bYToKAs8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cE3IZdU61YE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nyo6RbggUI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LqyzgITGE4

[yost69]

25. So it was ok for the attorney to keep his mouth shut as long as he was employed

by them. But as soon as he gets canned and gets his severance pay he opens his mouth? I hope he goes down with them.

Obviously if he knows all of this stuff now when he is not even part of the company he knew it then.

[DainBramaged]

30. Well, should the information have stayed undisclosed?

You're right, but if they are aren't guilty, let them prove innocence.

[Romulox]

31. Lawyers have an ethical duty to keep the secrets of their clients.

:hi:

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

51. Uh... wrong.

In cases where a potential crime involving injury or death may occur, legal counsel is within their rights to inform the authorities. Attorney-client privilege is not absolute.

[Romulox]

60. LOL. You are OBVIOUSLY not an attorney.

Only a fool would reduce a complicated question such as the applicability of a narrow exception to the general rules which require confidentiality based on such scant evidence. It makes it clear you are not aware of the dimensions of the question. Anger is obviously your smokescreen here as elsewhere.

At any rate, if you interested in educating yourself, you'll see the circumstances under which an attorney may reveal confidences to the detriment of his client are quite limited, and, moreover, the ability to do so hinges on the magnitude of the danger involved, whether the danger has already occurred, or is imminent, and whether the attorney's services have been used in furtherance of the illegal or fraudulent act.

I daresay you don't have access to any of the facts needed to analyze this case, so yours is a blind assertion that the exception is somehow more applicable to this case than the rules based on...nothing more than your love of Toyota, I suspect. :rofl:

Below is the Model Rules of Professional Responsibility on the subject, if you are educatable. You'll notice that if the attorney learned of Toyota's falsifying of past safety data, and his services were not used in this endeavor, the attorney must keep this information confidential under most fact patterns. :hi:

(a) A lawyer shall not reveal information relating to the representation of a client unless the client gives informed consent, the disclosure is impliedly authorized in order to carry out the representation or the disclosure is permitted by paragraph (b).

(b) A lawyer may reveal information relating to the representation of a client to the extent the lawyer reasonably believes necessary:

(1) to prevent reasonably certain death or substantial bodily harm;

(2) to prevent the client from committing a crime or fraud that is reasonably certain to result in substantial injury to the financial interests or property of another and in furtherance of which the client has used or is using the lawyer's services;

(3) to prevent, mitigate or rectify substantial injury to the financial interests or property of another that is reasonably certain to result or has resulted from the client's commission of a crime or fraud in furtherance of which the client has used the lawyer's services;

(4) to secure legal advice about the lawyer's compliance with these Rules;

(5) to establish a claim or defense on behalf of the lawyer in a controversy between the lawyer and the client, to establish a defense to a criminal charge or civil claim against the lawyer based upon conduct in which the client was involved, or to respond to allegations in any proceeding concerning the lawyer's representation of the client; or

(6) to comply with other law or a court order.

http://www.abanet.org/cpr/mrpc/rule_1_6.html

[NoGOPZone]

53. Even when it involves destruction of evidence? nt

[Romulox]

62. Yes, unless an exception to the general rule applies. They're fairly narrow.

See my #60.

[NoGOPZone]

68. There is a crime-fraud exception to attorney client privilige

If the material was under subpoena, this would likely be a valid exception.

[Strong Atheist]

65. Welcome to DU!

:toast: