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It's 8:47 PM EST and we now know we've been fucked.

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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:47 PM
Original message
It's 8:47 PM EST and we now know we've been fucked.
NO PUBLIC OPTION!

Everything else Obama is saying is bullshit.

We've been betrayed, lied to, conned, fucked and fucked again.

Twist Obama's words any way you want to, but it doesn't change anything.

We've been fucked.

Time to start searching for a Democratic candidate in 2012.

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EmilyAnne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
1. Uh, that is not what I heard at all. Sorry. nt
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abelenkpe2 Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #1
12. mandating insurance
no public option

subsidizing those too poor to buy insurance.

It's bullshit. Corporate bullshit.
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busybl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #12
24. go away
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abelenkpe2 Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-10-09 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #24
70. Get over your glow
It was a great speech. I love Obama too, but you are wrong if you think he stated that the public option will be in the bill. He defended it as a good idea but said he was open to other alternatives. Mandating insurance and giving subsidies is a handout to insurance companies.

See:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x368823

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x368612

Sorry, but you know I'm right about that.
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polpilot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:55 PM
Original message
Homeland Health Security....Arrest the poor for not buyibg insurance.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:49 PM
Response to Original message
67. I wonder if they are going to round up the homeless and put them jail
for not paying up.
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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
2. I'm behind on the Tivo, but it feels that way for me too
"time to act is now" blah blah blah
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LSK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
3. huh???????????? you miss the past 5 minutes??
:wtf:
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armyowalgreens Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
4. I heard his support of the public option.
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abelenkpe2 Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #4
19. You heard wrong
Read the text of the speech. He says its a good idea, but not part of the plan.

He wants to mandate insurance, subsidize the poor, set up exchanges and let everyone keep what they have. It's everything corporations and republicans want and nothing the democrats were hoping for.
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armyowalgreens Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. I just heard him say it on national television. Show me the part that proves your point.
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abelenkpe2 Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-10-09 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #22
71. He defended the public option
but clearly stated he was open to other alternatives. So it is still up in the air whether or not a public option will be included. It will only be included if every other idea is deemed to be unaffordable. He also said everyone will have to buy insurance. And those unable to pay will be subsidized. How can you not see this as a give away to insurance companies?

See:


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x368823

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x368612


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SOS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #19
48. From the speech:
"But I will not back down on the basic principle that, if Americans can't find affordable coverage, we will provide you with a choice."

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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #48
59. Which means........?
Edited on Wed Sep-09-09 08:57 PM by Cyrano
Exactly where in that statement do you see the words "public option?"
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SOS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #59
60. In this one:
Edited on Wed Sep-09-09 09:33 PM by SOS
"An additional step we can take to keep insurance companies honest is by making a not-for-profit public option available in the insurance exchange."

"I will not back down on the basic principle that, if Americans can't find affordable coverage, we will provide you with a choice."

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polpilot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:48 PM
Original message
Names? The Rep. from NY?
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
5. Dream On, Fella....
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:55 PM
Response to Reply #5
26. Explain what part of this is a public option
There's no public option here.

"Now, I have no interest in putting insurance companies out of business. They provide a legitimate service, and employ a lot of our friends and neighbors. I just want to hold them accountable. The insurance reforms that I’ve already mentioned would do just that. But an additional step we can take to keep insurance companies honest is by making a not-for-profit public option available in the insurance exchange. Let me be clear – it would only be an option for those who don’t have insurance. No one would be forced to choose it, and it would not impact those of you who already have insurance. In fact, based on Congressional Budget Office estimates, we believe that less than 5% of Americans would sign up.

Despite all this, the insurance companies and their allies don’t like this idea. They argue that these private companies can’t fairly compete with the government. And they’d be right if taxpayers were subsidizing this public insurance option. But they won’t be. I have insisted that like any private insurance company, the public insurance option would have to be self-sufficient and rely on the premiums it collects. But by avoiding some of the overhead that gets eaten up at private companies by profits, excessive administrative costs and executive salaries, it could provide a good deal for consumers. It would also keep pressure on private insurers to keep their policies affordable and treat their customers better, the same way public colleges and universities provide additional choice and competition to students without in any way inhibiting a vibrant system of private colleges and universities.

It’s worth noting that a strong majority of Americans still favor a public insurance option of the sort I’ve proposed tonight. But its impact shouldn’t be exaggerated – by the left, the right, or the media. It is only one part of my plan, and should not be used as a handy excuse for the usual Washington ideological battles. To my progressive friends, I would remind you that for decades, the driving idea behind reform has been to end insurance company abuses and make coverage affordable for those without it. The public option is only a means to that end – and we should remain open to other ideas that accomplish our ultimate goal. And to my Republican friends, I say that rather than making wild claims about a government takeover of health care, we should work together to address any legitimate concerns you may have.

For example, some have suggested that that the public option go into effect only in those markets where insurance companies are not providing affordable policies. Others propose a co-op or another non-profit entity to administer the plan. These are all constructive ideas worth exploring. But I will not back down on the basic principle that if Americans can’t find affordable coverage, we will provide you with a choice. And I will make sure that no government bureaucrat or insurance company bureaucrat gets between you and the care that you need.'
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BolivarianHero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #26
31. Not bad,,,
Unfortunately, the DLC and the lobbyists have so corrupted the Democratic Party that we cannot expect something stronger to come out of Obama's mouth.
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #31
58. Not bad? It is bullshit.
So, you are saying that Obama is not his own man? That he can't lead?
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tigereye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #5
56. sir! Great to see you!


:pals: Miss seeing you! :hi:
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:47 PM
Response to Reply #56
65. Thank You, Ma'am!
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The Velveteen Ocelot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
6. I thought I heard him say there would be a public option.
But maybe I'm watching C-SPAN in an alternate universe.
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Engineer4Obama Donating Member (610 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:49 PM
Response to Original message
7. Delete
Edited on Wed Sep-09-09 07:49 PM by Engineer4Obama
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Ikonoklast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:49 PM
Original message
Are you deef?
Some people here, I swear, just WANT to hate.
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dancingme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:49 PM
Response to Original message
8. Sarah Palin, is that you?
because Palin hears things that the rest of us don't.
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dhill926 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:49 PM
Response to Original message
9. yep, that's the ticket......
to a new republican majority. You sure you want that?
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rwheeler31 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:49 PM
Response to Original message
10. Oh brother you need a hearing aid.
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tsuki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:49 PM
Response to Original message
11. Cyrano, I understand your fustration, but today I recognized that
health care must become a movement beyond corporate party lines.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. And since Scalia said corporations are the same as people, it needs to move beyond their line too
I see a lot of the President's proposal that makes sense.

I maintain it's needlessly convoluted, which is the sort of thing republicans WANT -- because then they get to say it's bureaucratic and inefficient!
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tsuki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #15
29. The co-op thing won't work because it can be legislated away.
Lawton Chiles gave us a co-op to purchase insurance. Worked great. When Jeb Bush was elected, he did away with the co-op, threw us all on our own, and made it illegal to have a third party negotiate lower rates for us.

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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. Sorry, I just didn't hear any public plan in this speech
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LSK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. did you run to the toilet and take a dump???
:wtf: :wtf: :wtf:
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armyowalgreens Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. LOL
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abelenkpe2 Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #17
21. There is no public option in the plan
Take the cheetos out of your ears
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LSK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. did he not spend at least 5 minutes on a public option???
What fucking television show are you watching? Does FOXNEWS have a spoof on or something?????????/
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abelenkpe2 Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-10-09 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #25
73. Read the speech
He defended it as a good idea but said he was open to other alternatives. That is not a promise that it will be in the final proposal.
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busybl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #21
28. I think you might be reading yesterdays speech.
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Ikonoklast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #21
37. Go back into your Mom's basement.
You are being willfully ignorant and didn't even listen to the speech if you think that is what Obama said.

There will be a public option. Period.
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abelenkpe2 Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-10-09 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #37
72. You are deluded
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Robb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #17
23. Best response of the thread.
Only pity is the DUzys are on hiatus. :rofl:
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Inspired Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:51 PM
Response to Original message
13. Boo fucking hoo.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:51 PM
Response to Original message
14. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Hissyspit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:52 PM
Response to Original message
18. Here:
Edited on Wed Sep-09-09 07:53 PM by Hissyspit
irst, if you are among the hundreds of millions of Americans who already have health insurance through your job, Medicare, Medicaid, or the VA, nothing in this plan will require you or your employer to change the coverage or the doctor you have. Let me repeat this: nothing in our plan requires you to change what you have.

What this plan will do is to make the insurance you have work better for you. Under this plan, it will be against the law for insurance companies to deny you coverage because of a pre-existing condition. As soon as I sign this bill, it will be against the law for insurance companies to drop your coverage when you get sick or water it down when you need it most. They will no longer be able to place some arbitrary cap on the amount of coverage you can receive in a given year or a lifetime. We will place a limit on how much you can be charged for out-of-pocket expenses, because in the United States of America, no one should go broke because they get sick. And insurance companies will be required to cover, with no extra charge, routine checkups and preventive care, like mammograms and colonoscopies – because there’s no reason we shouldn’t be catching diseases like breast cancer and colon cancer before they get worse. That makes sense, it saves money, and it saves lives.

That’s what Americans who have health insurance can expect from this plan – more security and stability.

Now, if you’re one of the tens of millions of Americans who don’t currently have health insurance, the second part of this plan will finally offer you quality, affordable choices. If you lose your job or change your job, you will be able to get coverage. If you strike out on your own and start a small business, you will be able to get coverage. We will do this by creating a new insurance exchange – a marketplace where individuals and small businesses will be able to shop for health insurance at competitive prices. Insurance companies will have an incentive to participate in this exchange because it lets them compete for millions of new customers. As one big group, these customers will have greater leverage to bargain with the insurance companies for better prices and quality coverage. This is how large companies and government employees get affordable insurance. It’s how everyone in this Congress gets affordable insurance. And it’s time to give every American the same opportunity that we’ve given ourselves.

For those individuals and small businesses who still cannot afford the lower-priced insurance available in the exchange, we will provide tax credits, the size of which will be based on your need. And all insurance companies that want access to this new marketplace will have to abide by the consumer protections I already mentioned. This exchange will take effect in four years, which will give us time to do it right. In the meantime, for those Americans who can’t get insurance today because they have pre-existing medical conditions, we will immediately offer low-cost coverage that will protect you against financial ruin if you become seriously ill. This was a good idea when Senator John McCain proposed it in the campaign, it’s a good idea now, and we should embrace it.

Now, even if we provide these affordable options, there may be those – particularly the young and healthy – who still want to take the risk and go without coverage. There may still be companies that refuse to do right by their workers. The problem is, such irresponsible behavior costs all the rest of us money. If there are affordable options and people still don’t sign up for health insurance, it means we pay for those people’s expensive emergency room visits. If some businesses don’t provide workers health care, it forces the rest of us to pick up the tab when their workers get sick, and gives those businesses an unfair advantage over their competitors. And unless everybody does their part, many of the insurance reforms we seek – especially requiring insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions – just can’t be achieved.

That’s why under my plan, individuals will be required to carry basic health insurance – just as most states require you to carry auto insurance. Likewise, businesses will be required to either offer their workers health care, or chip in to help cover the cost of their workers. There will be a hardship waiver for those individuals who still cannot afford coverage, and 95% of all small businesses, because of their size and narrow profit margin, would be exempt from these requirements. But we cannot have large businesses and individuals who can afford coverage game the system by avoiding responsibility to themselves or their employees. Improving our health care system only works if everybody does their part.

While there remain some significant details to be ironed out, I believe a broad consensus exists for the aspects of the plan I just outlined: consumer protections for those with insurance, an exchange that allows individuals and small businesses to purchase affordable coverage, and a requirement that people who can afford insurance get insurance.

And I have no doubt that these reforms would greatly benefit Americans from all walks of life, as well as the economy as a whole. Still, given all the misinformation that’s been spread over the past few months, I realize that many Americans have grown nervous about reform. So tonight I’d like to address some of the key controversies that are still out there.

Some of people’s concerns have grown out of bogus claims spread by those whose only agenda is to kill reform at any cost. The best example is the claim, made not just by radio and cable talk show hosts, but prominent politicians, that we plan to set up panels of bureaucrats with the power to kill off senior citizens. Such a charge would be laughable if it weren’t so cynical and irresponsible. It is a lie, plain and simple.

There are also those who claim that our reform effort will insure illegal immigrants. This, too, is false – the reforms I’m proposing would not apply to those who are here illegally. And one more misunderstanding I want to clear up – under our plan, no federal dollars will be used to fund abortions, and federal conscience laws will remain in place.

My health care proposal has also been attacked by some who oppose reform as a “government takeover” of the entire health care system. As proof, critics point to a provision in our plan that allows the uninsured and small businesses to choose a publicly-sponsored insurance option, administered by the government just like Medicaid or Medicare.

So let me set the record straight. My guiding principle is, and always has been, that consumers do better when there is choice and competition. Unfortunately, in 34 states, 75% of the insurance market is controlled by five or fewer companies. In Alabama, almost 90% is controlled by just one company. Without competition, the price of insurance goes up and the quality goes down. And it makes it easier for insurance companies to treat their customers badly – by cherry-picking the healthiest individuals and trying to drop the sickest; by overcharging small businesses who have no leverage; and by jacking up rates.

Insurance executives don’t do this because they are bad people. They do it because it’s profitable. As one former insurance executive testified before Congress, insurance companies are not only encouraged to find reasons to drop the seriously ill; they are rewarded for it. All of this is in service of meeting what this former executive called “Wall Street’s relentless profit expectations.”

Now, I have no interest in putting insurance companies out of business. They provide a legitimate service, and employ a lot of our friends and neighbors. I just want to hold them accountable. The insurance reforms that I’ve already mentioned would do just that. But an additional step we can take to keep insurance companies honest is by making a not-for-profit public option available in the insurance exchange. Let me be clear – it would only be an option for those who don’t have insurance. No one would be forced to choose it, and it would not impact those of you who already have insurance. In fact, based on Congressional Budget Office estimates, we believe that less than 5% of Americans would sign up.

Despite all this, the insurance companies and their allies don’t like this idea. They argue that these private companies can’t fairly compete with the government. And they’d be right if taxpayers were subsidizing this public insurance option. But they won’t be. I have insisted that like any private insurance company, the public insurance option would have to be self-sufficient and rely on the premiums it collects. But by avoiding some of the overhead that gets eaten up at private companies by profits, excessive administrative costs and executive salaries, it could provide a good deal for consumers. It would also keep pressure on private insurers to keep their policies affordable and treat their customers better, the same way public colleges and universities provide additional choice and competition to students without in any way inhibiting a vibrant system of private colleges and universities.

It’s worth noting that a strong majority of Americans still favor a public insurance option of the sort I’ve proposed tonight. But its impact shouldn’t be exaggerated – by the left, the right, or the media. It is only one part of my plan, and should not be used as a handy excuse for the usual Washington ideological battles. To my progressive friends, I would remind you that for decades, the driving idea behind reform has been to end insurance company abuses and make coverage affordable for those without it. The public option is only a means to that end – and we should remain open to other ideas that accomplish our ultimate goal. And to my Republican friends, I say that rather than making wild claims about a government takeover of health care, we should work together to address any legitimate concerns you may have.

For example, some have suggested that that the public option go into effect only in those markets where insurance companies are not providing affordable policies. Others propose a co-op or another non-profit entity to administer the plan. These are all constructive ideas worth exploring. But I will not back down on the basic principle that if Americans can’t find affordable coverage, we will provide you with a choice. And I will make sure that no government bureaucrat or insurance company bureaucrat gets between you and the care that you need.
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truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #18
32. I would have liked to hear - when he got to the public option section:
It is only one part of my plan - but it is a vitally important part.

I really really would have liked to have heard that it would not be so insignificant a part of the overall plan that it iwll not be bargained away.

And that it would be affordable. (Hillary Clinton never had a chance at having my votr last year because of her blithely stating dureing he rsupposed fight for HC that a family of four living on 24,000 a year would only need 4K a year to be insured. What planet does someone like that occupy. Do they really think that a family of four will give up the Five annual trips to Europe or they will sell their yacht or their jewels!?! We lall know that familuy of four would rather go uninsured than give yup their cruises vacations and jewelry!?!))

The devil is in details... Will this be a mandate for expensive policies that mean nothing unless you can afford additional supplemental insurance?



And of course what I really wanted to hear was this from Obama:

I have said all along that the best way to reform health care would be by employing the Universal Single Payer for all model of health care reform. And even though we currently have another system in place, that system has acted in a criminal fashion and killed and maimed many Americans, denied others their fair share of coverage and rewarded the executives at the top with outrageous levels of salary. The current system needs to be scrapped immediately. So tomorrow I will be signing into law Exectuive Act ___, an Act that will effectively make Medicare available to every American willing to register with the MediCare agency and supply their names, addresses and Social Security number oin return for full coverage.

As far as paying for this, I will see to it that the monies needed are requested on the same line of the Federal Budget that the Congress men and women have theiir health insurance provided for. Good night, my fellow Americans, and Good luck.



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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 07:56 PM
Response to Original message
27. FAIL
That's not what he said.
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azmouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:01 PM
Response to Original message
30. FAIL
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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
33. Uh, no.
:eyes:
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
34. What are you talking about?
I heard PO. ??
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:15 PM
Response to Original message
35. So after all is said and done, could someone please point out to me
where in his speech he endorsed a public option?

And more importantly, did anyone hear him say he would veto any bill that didn't have a public option?
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ipaint Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #35
38. He mentioned the cbo rated house bill plan with 5% enrollment- 10 million in ten years.
Too weak to make a dent in costs for private ins. and the perfect dunping ground for sick people on private ins.

The ins. companies will drop all the sickest before it opens for what little business it will do.
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SOS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:32 PM
Response to Reply #35
50. Here:
"But I will not back down on the basic principle that, if Americans can't find affordable coverage, we will provide you with a choice."
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #50
55. Nice general statement. Then again, death is an affordable choice. (sarcasim)
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SOS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #55
63. The PO will put the scum out of business over time
And they know it.

"An additional step we can take to keep insurance companies honest is by making a not-for-profit public option available in the insurance exchange."

"I will not back down on the basic principle that, if Americans can't find affordable coverage, we will provide you with a choice."

Private insurance is unaffordable.
The public option will be cheaper, because 35% of the money won't be stolen by Wall Street parasites.

If the PO isn't a good deal, why are the insurance bloodsuckers so vehemently opposed to it?
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WI_DEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:15 PM
Response to Original message
36. Good get out of here and look for your candidate for '12 who won't accomplish anything
except elect a republican. Obama is going to get health care reform like no other president has been able to deliver.
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #36
40. I'd love to see it. But answer my question.
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TheKentuckian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-10-09 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #36
75. Not even that. They love people that could never win even a statewide race
and by they I mean the delusional not the left.
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sinkingfeeling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:22 PM
Response to Original message
39. Unplug your ears and mind.
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RevCheesehead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:24 PM
Response to Original message
41. We're DOOOOOOMED!!
Anyone for an emergency DUDQ meeting?
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Bobbie Jo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:24 PM
Response to Original message
42. < 0
FAIL
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blogslut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
43. Um, hello?
Is the crow tasty?
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
44. So you've been hiding where?
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titoresque Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #44
47. the op has been here a long time
and if memory serves me, it's always the same old bullshit.
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:33 PM
Response to Reply #47
51. There are times I act like a complete ass, but I never scream
the sky is falling like this. This is pure bullshit.
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #51
57. "Take the blue pill and you will wake up and remember nothing.
Edited on Wed Sep-09-09 08:53 PM by Cyrano
Take the red pill, and I'll show you just how deep the rabbit hole goes."

All sarcasm aside, wake up take a look around and try to grasp what's being done to us.

It ain't easy. Try hard. THINK!

















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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
45. What station were you watching?
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:26 PM
Response to Original message
46. lol
It's a frickin riot in here tonight. :rofl:
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Sheepshank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:31 PM
Response to Original message
49. Public Option was there
The clear example of Public universities leaving plenty of room for Private universities. It's there.
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JimWis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:33 PM
Response to Original message
52. He said the wanted a public option. If I didn't say that, then why
did he go on to explain that it would be funded by premiums, etc.. When he said it was for people who didn't have insurance, and if you read that part carefully, you sill see that he was trying to make a point about all the lies and crap out there against public insurance, that it was optional, you didn't have to choose it if you didn't want it. Better read the text again. The public option is still in there.
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placton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:35 PM
Response to Original message
53. let's not forget tort reform
screwing another group of solid Dem supporters
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NeedleCast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 08:37 PM
Response to Original message
54. eyeroll.jpg
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
61. your teevee is not working properly. if you were fucked during the speech, call the police
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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
62. I remember when he was for single payer
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
64. I don't believe I've ever seen so many DUers so deluded.
Get a good night's sleep, think about what Obama said and didn't say tonight, and try to work up a rational reply tomorrow morning.

As for tonight, I can never remember seeing so many DUers who heard what they wanted to hear and totally ignored what was actually said.

People! Please! Wake up! We are once again getting fucked beyond belief.

On a more positive note, I still want to see Obama succeed and throw both the Republicans and the corporations that own them into a pool of molten lava.

Unfortunately, I don't see this ever happening with a Democratic party that has completely forgotten who FDR was, what he stood for, and what he accomplished.
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ddeclue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:48 PM
Response to Original message
66. +1
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Libertas1776 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 10:58 PM
Response to Original message
68. All I heard
was a proposal for a sorry excuse, watered down choice tantamount to a public option, maybe, albeit a real shitty one. It is also my understanding that you cannot simply join up for this apparent "splendid little option," which may not even rear its head for another 4 years, if you already have insurance, even if it is the crappy slave wagers plan at Wal-Mart, you have to stick with that. I sure would like to get my hands on what some of these DUer's are smoking :smoke:
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abelenkpe2 Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-10-09 12:01 PM
Response to Reply #68
74. Indeed
They should try actually listening instead of hearing only what they dreamed was in there.

WTF people. Wake up!
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cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-09-09 11:00 PM
Response to Original message
69. Yawn.
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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-10-09 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
76. I could be wrong but the way I heard it is
he said he was open to other ideas that would achieve the same goals. I believe it was a nice way of saying,, "bring it," to the critics. He said he won't back down on the goals the public option would meet and he knows and they know that no other ideas will do this. The relevant part of the speech:

It’s worth noting that a strong majority of Americans still favor a public insurance option of the sort I’ve proposed tonight. But its impact shouldn’t be exaggerated – by the left, the right, or the media. It is only one part of my plan, and should not be used as a handy excuse for the usual Washington ideological battles. To my progressive friends, I would remind you that for decades, the driving idea behind reform has been to end insurance company abuses and make coverage affordable for those without it. The public option is only a means to that end – and we should remain open to other ideas that accomplish our ultimate goal. And to my Republican friends, I say that rather than making wild claims about a government takeover of health care, we should work together to address any legitimate concerns you may have.

For example, some have suggested that that the public option go into effect only in those markets where insurance companies are not providing affordable policies. Others propose a co-op or another non-profit entity to administer the plan. These are all constructive ideas worth exploring. But I will not back down on the basic principle that if Americans can’t find affordable coverage, we will provide you with a choice. And I will make sure that no government bureaucrat or insurance company bureaucrat gets between you and the care that you need.
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