What I've learned in past 24 hours, since I innocently posted the infamous "prayer" post:

[gauguin57]

(PLEASE READ #3 if you read nothing else here)

Here's what I learned after posting what I assure everyone was meant to be the most innocuous post in the world ... merely stating that, because I pray for the president, I'm praying more these days because of the threatening climate created by the teabaggers and their hate and their guns:

1) You post something. A sh*tstorm comes down on your head. You realize the editing period for the OP is over, so you post a few more times, giving more information about yourself that proves the purpose of your post was "x" not "y" (in my case ... I simply meant to say, hey, if you pray, or if you believe in sending out positive energy on behalf of this president, maybe you could redouble your efforts because things are BAD out there, people.). You post that, of course you write letters and make phone calls and volunteer for the local Democratic party. You just happen to pray for the president in addition to that. You post that you're not a Christian, Muslim or Jew -- that you don't go to church -- that you're not a member of any organized religion. You just believe in god, and pray as part of that belief.

You don't claim any special relationship, or influence, with any given deity. You make it clear you're posting out of concern for the president and our country, not for the purpose of calling attention to yourself or your faith. You say nothing about religion whatsoever (in case some folks don't realize it ... prayer doesn't have to have anything to do with "religion" per se; I consider myself a person of faith, but not "religious"). You believe the tenents of any given organized religion should be divorced from laws and politics (which has nothing at all to do with wishing the president well on a spiritual level, which is all you're really doing when you're praying for him).

BUT ...

2) People either don't read the additional posts or they choose to ignore them so they can continue to make false assumptions about you and hurl nasty, NASTY, REALLYREALLYNASTY insults. At you and those who support you.

3) THE BEST THING I WAS REMINDED OF: There are always great people in the liberal/progressive movement who believe that everyone who wants to inform, discuss, debate in the realm of Democratic/progressive/liberal politics is welcome here. Today, I'm feeling like the atheists and agnostics who encouraged me to do what feels right to me, as long as it's positive, are the heart and soul of the Democratic party and the progressive movement. You guys (and the believers who encouraged me, as well), rock. Those of you who disagree with me, and made your position known without being nasty or insulting ... you also rock.

4) I have learned to try to be more sensitive, myself, about other people's differences. For example, I've been known to slam the hierarchy of the Catholic church (in large part because of they way they treat women). I'm a woman who grew up in that church, and have my issues. I try to make it clear that I'm not insulting individual Catholics or their faith ... just the patriarchy that will not allow change (or women in leadership). HOWEVER: I'm going to watch myself in the future, because I can feel what cruel words about one's faith can do. I'll be more cognizant if I'm being nasty in my posts in the future.

A POSTSCRIPT: I don't think I have ever posted anything that had to do with my private faith, except to offer prayers to other DUers who have lost loved ones. Which, I've noticed, a lot of people do here without having their heads taken off. I was moved to post what I did because I was struck by how frightened I am becoming because of all the teabagger hate -- the guns being carried to presidential events -- the fomenting of murderous hate against Barack Obama by the right-wing media clowns. I posted in the "presidential" forum because my post was about the president's safety ... not about religion/theology.

I am done posting on my original thread. Every time I've posted, the vitriol seems to get stunningly worse. An innocent thread bred other threads of intolerance.
I had the purest of intentions, and I didn't mean to open a gaping wound that demonstrates, in microcosm, just how much we've been at each other's throats in this place. Can't we disagree without tearing each other down? I've been on this board a long time, and I depend on you people to help me stay informed (I see articles here I miss in my other reading), and to debate with me in a civil way so we can come to some understanding and work on this country's problems together.

Despite how bad I've felt over the last 24 hours ... I love you guys.

Please let the thread die so we can save our strength for the work ahead.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

1. My dear gaugin57...

:hug:

K&R

[grantcart]

2. I pray that you don't take any critical remarks personally.

In the end our divisions are miniscule (despite the ardor of our intrlocution), our cause is just and our enemies are vile.


You have a humble spirit and a kind manner.

[Birthmark]

9. nt

[elocs]

3. DU+religion (especially Christianity) or personal faith=vitriol.

This is one of the most clear and obvious truths concerning DU posters.

[whathehell]

64. True, but is this in keeping with DU rules mandating respect for the beliefs of other members?

Or is "respect" only for atheists?

It's beginning to appear so, and that is thorougly inconsistent and hypocritical by my lights.

There are forums for Atheists/Agnostics and for Believers of all kinds, and frankly, unless the topic is particularly related to politics, I think we should keep "religon out of politcs"..Having said that, I hardly think that the mention of a "prayer" by a DUer should be enough to engender the kind of hostility the OP experienced.

[elocs]

65. It shouldn't, but it does. Anti-religious behavior is pretty much winked at here

in spite of the supposed Democratic tolerance for the beliefs of others. You don't have to be here at DU too long to figure that out. There seem to be nonbelievers here who live for the chance to be offended by anything religious.

[whathehell]

113. Yup...Thanks for the confirmation.

[liberalhistorian]

82. Amen! (sorry, couldn't resist!) As a Christian myself, who's

been here for over six years now, I've long noticed the strong anti-religious bigotry here and the uncalled-for vitriol against those of us who express any faith whatsoever. There seems to be little understanding that not all of us Christians are RW fundie theocrats, far from it, and there's a lot of group judging, prejudice and labeling that would NEVER be tolerated here when aimed at most any other group. It's really been getting even more frustrating lately, as the same people who rightfully complaing about discrimination and prejudice against almost any other group then have no problem expressing the same against Christians.

I have never apologized for my beliefs and my faith and I will never do so. I will continue to call out the RW fundie theocrats who have hijacked my religion, as more of my fellow Christians are starting to do, but I remain strong in my faith and beliefs. If it weren't for many Christian churches, the abolition of slavery and the civil rights movement would have taken a helluva lot longer than they did and wouldn't have generated nearly as much attention. But they never look at the good with the bad, it's only always focusing on the bad.

I have no problem with those of other religions or no religion at all. I just wish that that same courtesy could and would be extended to those of us of faith who are here.

[whathehell]

86. Bingo!

[tilsammans]

96. Thank you.

Very well said. :applause:

[Kaylee]

104. +1

[Warpy]

4. I missed it but I've certainly been there

After the third ineffective post, I realized it was best to let the shit fly and hope the thread soon died an ignominious death. It did eventually.

The sad thing is that it's happened more than once. All it takes is for one person to misunderstand and the shitstorm ensues.

Don't take it too personally. Nerves are frayed and some people need to vent. You just happened to be the one to get in the way of the flying feces this time.

[daleanime]

5. Now I feel bad...

for not posting anything when I saw your OP, for me what you believe isn't as important as what you do. :fistbump:

[BlooInBloo]

6. (shrug) If people want to spill goat entrails and say that helps Obama...

rock on.

Who am I to interfere with anybody's mythological beliefs.

It's too bad they have to religious-ize everything, but whatever - it's pretty low on my list of annoyances.

[Wednesdays]

49. Prayer is less messy?

:shrug:

[whathehell]

60. If people want to insult others here, they should be alerted on (shrug)

Stick your "entrails" in your ear.

You're going out of your way to demean the beliefs of this poster (and anyone else who isn't a card-carrying atheist) after she has made a humble and honest entreaty...You're being an insensitive lout.

[Lance_Boyle]

80. It's "demeaning" to opine that "prayer" doesn't do diddly squat?

Some of y'all religionists need to come down off of that cross and fucking drop the martyrdom/persecution complex. I hear it makes baby jeebus cry. :eyes:

[TCJ70]

85. Did you read that thread?

It went beyond what you suggest.

[whathehell]

89. He/she doesn't give a shit...They've got a "friendly" environment for religious bigotry here

and they like playing adolescent bully-boy.

[timtom]

102. Every so often, I take everyone off "ignore" that I had on.

And, one by one, I find myself putting them back on. It's almost as if there's a pattern of behavior I find offensive, or sump'n.

The person to whom you refer is one and went back on my list...again.

[whathehell]

90. Yeah...and I've alerted the mods TWICE on a gratuitously rude one here

and I don't hear or see a thing:thumbsdown:

A little hard to understand given the support for the OP here and the right of DUers to express something besides knee-jerk atheism without being demeaned.

I don't know. Maybe the mods on this thread think that all "real" democrats are Atheists, the rest of us being "second classe", so to speak.

If this is the case, we might consider renaming the board "Atheists Underground"

Why not?..Your religious profile here now seems to mean as much, or MORE, than your political one.

[Jokerman]

97. Maybe the mods have thicker skin than you.

If you honestly believe that this is true:

I don't know. Maybe the mods on this thread think that all "real" democrats are Atheists, the rest of us being "second classe", so to speak.

If this is the case, we might consider renaming the board "Atheists Underground"

Why not?..Your religious profile here now seems to mean as much, or MORE, than your political one.

Then it sounds likely that a persecution complex has skewed your observations.

[whathehell]

101. It's immaterial whether or not the mods have "thicker skin" than I do.

They are supposed to respond to member sensitivities and DU Rules -- Not simply to posts which get under THEIR skin.

Before you label me as having "a persecution complex", try reading the posts of others here who also see the bias on this issue.

I'm afraid you'll find that my "affliction" is shared by a number of others here.:eyes:

[Jokerman]

107. "member sensitivities" - LOL

If the mods locked every thread that offended someone's "sensitivities" there would be little discussion of anything controversial and zero discussion about religion. If you're going to venture out into the big bad world of internet discussion forums you should know that some people may agree with your opinions, some may disagree, and yes, some may even ridicule your opinions. It's the chance you take.

Your affliction IS shared by a number of others here but a mass delusion is still a delusion, just look at the "birthers".

[whathehell]

110. Sorry, honey..That one won't fly

...It's been well observed that some "sensitives", like those of the LGBT community, for instance, are WELL respected here...Others?..feminists?, believers?....Not so much.

"Mass Delusion"?..Yeah..Sure..As Thom Hartmann says, and I paraphrase "We were under a "mass delusion" that germs didn't exist until someone invented the microscope".

Strict empiricism, which is what atheism is largely based on, is heavily dependent on technology and is therefore an imperfect philosophy.

Sorry if you're stuck with it..Having a more open mind, I offer you my condolences..buh bye:hi:

[Jokerman]

117. So, you're feeling threatened by the LGBT community?

At least your delusions are starting to fit a pattern.

Believers are persecuted while gays get "special rights".

Where have I heard that pathetic battle cry before?

I think this is where I back away slowly from the conversation, shaking my head in disbelief.

[whathehell]

118. Yeah..I predicted that you would take that tactic.

It's lame, but it does distract from my point, which is, I guess, the best you can do.

The truth, of course, is that I said nothing about being "threatened" by the LGBT Community, and I think you actually know that. They were mentioned as just one example of a group whose sensitivities ARE respected...I simply questioned why some others are NOT.

Yes, back away...slowly or quickly...and try using the head for something other than shaking.:shrug:

[whathehell]

88. Maybe some of y'all anti-religious BIGOTS oughta go Cheney Yourselves!

[whathehell]

94. And you

can stick your condescension where the sun don't shine...And I'm sure you know where that is!B-)

[whathehell]

114. "opining" would be fine, but it's an inaccurate description of what is done here

Our know-it-all atheists state their belief as "fact"...which is how the arrogance is demonstrated.

[lewiston]

83. I agree!

n/t

[AuntPatsy]

7. I read that thread...you really should just ignore it..not a big deal if you ask me....if your faith

is strong...who cares if another disagrees? In this world you will always find someone who disagrees..granted it got a bit out of hand if you ask me but I can understand why you know..religion has done its fair share of persecuting people who did not deserve it..we never learn from our history..keeps repeating itself..so in a way..I can understand some being sick of it completely..

But if you believe..then do so but don't be shocked when some get downright edgy...to them...religion does not bring comfort...

peace .....take a few deep breaths...you will feel better tommorow...

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

8. Hey, my reply on that thread was meant to be funny. I wasn't trying to be a dick. Just in case. nt

[roguevalley]

16. our party and our side is supposed to be open and welcoming, the

antithesis of the other guys. Unfortunately, it isn't. I am sorry, honey. I have been there too, castigated out of my skin. I wish you and our president well. I pray for him too.

[Sukie]

10. I missed your original post about the prayers.

I am so sorry that you received such pain from it. Still having not read any of it, I will say that I too have sent my prayers out for Obama to remain safe. I will not pretend that I know for sure the grand scheme of the universe, to include whether God exists. But I do know that prayers give people hope sometimes when otherwise none would exist. It is hateful of people to try and take that hope away.

[Birthmark]

11. Welcome to the internet

If you don't have a hide like a monitor lizard, I'd advise you purchase one soon. You'll need it. :)

[whathehell]

62. This isn't just "the internet"...It's Democratic Underground.

We're supposed to be respectful of others even if (gasp)..the "other" isn't a card-carrying atheist...Too often, unfortunately, this isn't the case.

[Birthmark]

108. People is people.

There is nothing unique about DU...at least not unique enough to change human nature.

[Dorian Gray]

115. DU,

like any other website, has its share of "internet warriors."

People who like to be rude for rudeness sake. People who chase arguments. People who like to one up other people.

Meh.

[Cronus Protagonist]

12. Too long -1

[stray cat]

13. Did someone post something that disagreed with your post? On DU?

Surely not diverse opinions from progressives. Although this seems like a Bush your either for us or against us post.

[TCJ70]

18. I don't think it was that people disagreed...

...that caused the problem. It was HOW they disagreed. Check out the OP in GD:P...

[Jo March]

21. Did you read her entire post? It's not a "either you're with me or against me" post

It's not trying to be divisive.

[CakeGrrl]

23. No, it wasn't as noble as diverse opinions, in MY opinion

It was people going out of their way to be pissy to the OP over a simple statement that was almost identical to a comment made earlier in this thread.

It'd be interesting if you could pick out a sentence above our posts that would almost incite a flamefest. It was almost the same wording as the original OP.

If you think "creepy" is an acceptable response to an OP to foster a civil exchange of progressive ideas, then you and I have a difference of opinion on the concept.

[xultar]

26. Did you even see the thread? You should have BEFORE commenting on it. Did you read #3 at all?

She said in there that even people who disagreed (in a non assholish way) rock.
There were some people in the thread who were complete ASSHOLES. It wasn't about disagreeing it was about people being assholes about it.

Did you read anything about this? If you did you would have posted a different reply I'm sure.

[rhett o rick]

74. Ah, another drive by crop-dusting by the stray cat. Always willing stoke the hate. nt

[timtom]

103. It's all about TONE, there, cowboy.

[whathehell]

112. You are correct. Thank you Timtom.

[TrogL]

14. Ask the mods to lock it

[TrogL]

25. Also, "Ignore" is your friend

I've got about 30 people and 20 threads on my list.

[rhett o rick]

76. I agree, not that you'll be able to read this. jk. But I prefer to know what the idiots

are saying. I tried the "ignore" route but keep ending up with lots of ignores in threads. It is my choice whether to respond to the idiots. The fact is that there are always lots of responses to the idiots. An option is to read subject and move on w/o response.

[rhett o rick]

75. Locking threads is chicken-manure. No one is required to read the responses.

And it's very easy to avoid the hate posts. Don't throw out the baby with the bath water.

[ShortnFiery]

15. Keep the faith. There are many thoughtful people here.

As a person who sometimes "puts her foot in her mouth" I try to find comfort in the people who address my going astray with logic and empathy. Mean spirited posts? ... not so much. :blush:

Don't take anything posted on The Net too seriously ... too many keyboard warriors without a thoughtful conscious. :hi:

[Hekate]

17. Gaugin...

:hug:
My other reply stands. I pray for him too, as I've prayed for the soul of my nation these past 8 years. Yes, I believe nations have "souls" or one could call it an "animating principle." Whatever -- we can certainly use all good vibes coming from any source. Dissing your desire to state that is meanspirited.

Hekate

[Rainngirl]

19. I have a button

designed by my cousin that says: "Please keep him safe." It's on a blue background with a white "O". (I got it on zazzle) That is the extent of my prayer, feels good, and I get to believe I might help keep him safe just with my positive, loving thoughts. No harm done, I figure.

(P.S. if anyone wants to yell at me on these threads, I can't even figure out how to revisit any of the threads I've commented on, so I won't be aware of it. Neener neener to the mean people with too much time on their hands)

[SidneyCarton]

20. Don't let them get you down.

K&R

[kimmerspixelated]

22. Cheers Gauguin!

I think a debate is always great, because differing views help us to understand each other, but when the rude decide to participate in a jackass tournament, the only thing taught or bantered is the direction of the real potty mouths on this forum, and then it's just a downer for all involved. I'm thinking it's just the age difference maybe, lotsa young nasties hanging around. They are drawing attention to themselves the only way they know how, I guess. They are sad indeed. They need to learn a little RESPECT!

[rufus dog]

24. It is a tough world

People obviously can't pick up emotion from posts and sometimes project past experiences into others words. I actually ignored your thread until late last night then had to look at the train wreck. It truly was a huge stretch to turn your words into something negative. Sorry you had a tough couple of days.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

27. As they say...

"keep the faith". Don't use up too much mental energy on those whose minds are closed.

Rock on, gauguin57. :hi:

[Rowdyboy]

28. Nothing wrong with your original post or your followup responses.....

Some people here live to attack and anyone espousing even vaguely religious sentiments is going to be crucified (pardon the pun). Remember its just an internet message board where faux outrage is commonplace-its easy to be incredibly rude to people you've never met and never will.

As you know, the VAST majority of DUers are warm, loving and accepting of others beliefs. Sadly the few who aren't are usually louder, obnoxious and very persistent. Giving them attention only encourages them. I quit responding to the few dickheads years ago which is probably why I've been able to stay here.

Best wishes.

[renate]

29. I didn't read your original thread

But I've been here long enough and read enough really personally antagonistic posts on religion that I think I can guess what your experience was like. :hug:

So I am happy to K&R this thread, and to :thumbsup: what you said in #3.

[Chemisse]

30. Thank you for your prayers for Obama

He needs all the positive energy we can send, however we attribute its source. Shame on those who would harass you for that.

It's funny how some things people say get the feeding frenzy going, when the same things said at a different moment in time get no such response.

[Berry Cool]

31. What about those of us who chose not to post anything because we just didn't want to "go there"?

Do we rock?

[southernyankeebelle]

32. I for one am glad you pray for our president. He really needs it

because their are many people out here would just as soon see him dead. That is so sad. I too pray for the president. I remember when JFK was assassinated. I fear a repeat. However, in some cases you got religious zealots out there that want him dead.

[Kaleva]

33. Remember that everyone here is anonymous so don't take things personal

When and if you are attacked here or on any other forum, the folks bashing you have their knives out for someone that's a creation in their minds.

[abq e streeter]

34. I was too saddened by some of the hateful replies to your humble and decent OP

to even know what to say....Saddened and stunned, even though I've seen enough of the "I'm superior because I'm above all that religion shit" attitude...I was still stunned by the insults, and again, air of smug superiority it brought out among some of the people who chose to respond. With a prayer of gratitude that you're on our side, abq e streeter.

[undeterred]

35. ...

:hug:

[Gman2]

36. Say what you mean, mean what you say. Screwum.

If christianity was obvious, proven and rational, there would be no faith involved. Many were fed to lions, or killed slower. You sumpin' special?

[Whisp]

37. I'm sorry you were so hurt by The Stupid around here.

happens way too often.
You sound like a caring and thoughtful person and I regret that some here like to rip thoughtful and caring people to shreds

[progressivebydesign]

38. Sorry I missed the chance to jump in and defend you.

I'm one of the least religious people on here... I'm really more spiritual, and believe that "religion" should be about the good things in people. If someone is doing something positive, I don't care what they believe or don't believe, and I think that any positive thoughts or prayers on our President's behalf can only be a good thing!

[Mrs. Overall]

39. I'm sorry that the post turned into such a train wreck--

your intentions were good, and darn it, DU should be a huge umbrella that encompasses individuals who have an enlightened (mature and non-judgmental) sense of faith and spirituality.

Keep praying and sending good thoughts--Obama and the world need it.

[PassingFair]

40. I would have hoped you learned to put religious postings in the R/T room....

People should be able to disbelieve in a process
without religious people SPAZZING out!

But jeebus, some people were practically having
coronaries in that thread!

[whathehell]

93. Yeah and maybe Atheists should restrict their postings to the Atheist/Agnostic forum.

What's good for the goose, you know:shrug:

[PassingFair]

105. The next time I feel like talking about my atheist practices.... I'll be sure to do that.

:crazy:

[whathehell]

111. Good deal..Maybe the others who "practice" their atheism

by shitting on everyone else will pick up on your example.B-)

[whathehell]

95. Yes, just as people should be able to believe in that process without Atheists "Spazzing Out"!.

That's "passing fair", don't you think?:shrug:

[madrchsod]

41. i ignore people that do not respect the fact that i believe in christ`s words

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

42. I'm sorry, or not sorry...I missed it

As an agnostic, I've come to dislike fundies of any religious stripe, but some of the atheists here are just as nutty.

[Kaleva]

43. The extremes at both ends of the spectrum are nutty in my view.

[whathehell]

78. Agreed...Nutty AND hostile.

[WildEyedLiberal]

98. All extremists are nutty

However, at DU, you will NOT find religious extremists, but you'll find PLENTY of atheist extremists, who insist that they should be allowed to be horrifically hateful and nasty to the liberal/moderate believers here because rightwing fundies elsewhere are nasty to them.

It's sad and petty, but there you go.

[whathehell]

119. Yup, I'm beginning to get that.

[pipi_k]

44. I can certainly empathize with you, seeing as I'm one of those

"foot in mouth" people myself.

I start out with the most honest and innocent of intentions and somehow, some way, somebody will misunderstand what I've said or written.

I try to explain and it only gets worse.

I had something like that happen just last week and the more I tried to explain that it was just a misunderstanding on my part (because the person I replied to wasn't being 100% clear) the shittier the dialog got.

Sometimes I wonder if it's just this "talent" I have for pissing people off. Or maybe I'm just, as the saying goes, "flypaper for freaks". Which is a possibility, since I've attracted more than my fair share of Internet freaks and weirdos over the years. Although, thank goodness, no real freaks or stalkers or anything like that in real life. Maybe I'm just too scary in RL or something... :7


Anyway, even though I'm not a religious type person and I have some very rude opinions of religion, I would never bash someone for asking for prayers if people are so inclined to pray. And I'm really sorry you had to deal with a bunch of assholes who couldn't leave well enough alone.

[SoCalDem]

45. Having been here since June 2001, I can tell you one thing

No matter WHAT you post, SOMEONE will find fault with it, or interpret it as a personal slam directed at them. There are people out here in cyberland who take everything written, as literally aimed at them, personally..

No need to explain yourself..have a :hug: and move on..and don't pay any attention to the "score-keepers" who probably have a steno-pad at hand, to help them keep track of the DUers they want to follow around and harass.

Try not to even remember who the nitpicky meanies are/were.. Life's too short to hold grudges against anonymous people online :)

That's one reason I created this little thread-killer:

[pipi_k]

52. And it happens everywhere

"No matter WHAT you post, SOMEONE will find fault with it, or interpret it as a personal slam directed at them. There are people out here in cyberland who take everything written, as literally aimed at them, personally..


I was a member of another online discussion board for almost ten years. You would not believe...or maybe you would...how many times someone thought I was writing about them PERSONALLY. Most of the time I was referring to someone I knew in real life. But no...some of those nuts were absolutely convinced I was talking about THEM. And the more I tried to convince them I wasn't, the more convinced they got that I was. Wow. Talk about everything being all about THEM....

It finally got to be too much and I had to leave. I have no time or energy for fighting off (not with) the crazies...

[Barack_America]

46. I'm sorry that I missed that thread.

I'm sure I would have agreed with you.

I've been "praying" for him a lot lately too.

[azmouse]

47. You've inspired me to say a few extra prayers for the President and his family.

Keep your chin up. You did a good thing.

[TexasObserver]

48. I thought it was a strange but well meant post, and didn't feel any need to comment.

It's a thin line between praying for good things and sacrificing goats for good things. Both depend on a mindset that finds God approachable for bargaining about earthly matters.

[Obamanaut]

50. I don't believe, or pray - but it is perfectly ok to be respectful of those

who do.

edited to add - in my opinion

[whathehell]

92. Thank you.

[XOKCowboy]

51. Keep checking your original thread.... Not all of DU is that closed minded

Thanks for your original sentiments. Thanks for doing what you think is best for our President. We should all do the same.

[Odin2005]

53. I'm an atheist and I think that vitriol in that thread is disgusting.

Just because one disagree's with somebody's beliefs doesn't mean one has to act like an asshole to that person.

[Sebastian Doyle]

54. There is a contingent of rabid anti-theists here who are every bit as bad

as the most extreme fundagelical church crowd. They aren't doing any favors to their fellow non-believers either.

[Withywindle]

55. I just want to say I admire you for posting this and handling it with class.

It's one of those issues that will probably never be resolved here, because there's a lot of vitriol and so often used as an opportunity to rant and grandstand.

I'm a somewhat agnostic Pagan, and I pray for the safety of Obama and his family too. Even when I'm angry with him. Anyone who has that much undeserved negative, hateful, violent, racist energy thrown at him deserves whatever balancing forces he can get. It's fine with me if people believe it does no good. I know that at least it does no harm.

:hug:

[the blues]

56. Missed the first thread, but... K & R

The heart of the Democratic Party, at its best, is its heart.

[RagAss]

57. Don't take it so hard. I love getting flamed....it's part of the DU "show".

[proteus_lives]

58. You have handled it with class.

Some people are just mean-spirited and closed-minded, no matter who they voted for.

Keep the Faith.

:fistbump:

[BlancheSplanchnik]

59. I didn't like the ugly comments shot at you. You did NOT deserve them.

The Buddha said, "When an evil person hears about your goodness and intentionally comes to cause trouble, you should restrain yourself and not become angry or blame him. Then the one who has come to do evil will do evil to himself."

the Buddha explained Ten Evil Deeds; the ones we can see exemplified by the mean posters, who responded to your kind heart with ugliness, are harsh speech, hatred and stupidity.

It is said that the measure of the Buddha was in his actions as a human being. -- anyway, the common thread I found in all of the nasty comments was arrogance. They were all full of self-importance, fanning themselves with the thought that they are superior to you, congratulating themselves on their eloquent hatred.

I saw only compassion and sincerity in your OP. :hug: It's always seemed odd to me when people cannot resonate with a clearly good heart.

In my Buddhist practice I chant for myself and others, and include this good man and his family in my thoughts.

[rhett o rick]

73. Good post. Besides arrogance there is a lot of fear in those posters

They, as many of us, see terrible things happening in our name and see our democracy slipping away. They are looking for someone to yell at and can easily find that in here. Hard to yell at freepers, they keep kicking me out of their blogs.

I appreciate eastern philosophies and the Buddha quote you included.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

116. Thanks :)

Glad you appreciated the quotes!

I like Buddhism -- it's about self-awareness and our actions... the goal of Buddhist practice is to bring out the four Buddha qualities from within our lives: wisdom, courage, compassion and life-force.

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo

[NuttyFluffers]

61. there's more scanning than reading here at DU.

but that's sorta common for life. few people read with any real depth, empathy, or critical thinking, and DU is not immune.

sorry you had to run into the hysterical mob here. ours is just as bad as others -- except our spelling is better and we have a larger vocabulary at times.

[truedelphi]

100. +1. (And people are proud that they scan!) n/t

[H2O Man]

63. I pray every day.

There are some people who are hostile towards religion and spirituality on DU. Perhaps they have had very negative experiences in their lives. There is certainly a lot of hatred and negative emotions that are aimed at many of our DU friends from the rigid, conservative religious folks in society. I think it is important to focus on those things that we have in common here, which tend to include our values. I might have a different word for the universal energy life force than others here, but we tend to share common beliefs about the need for love, compassion, and social justice. And that is what counts.

[jonnyblitz]

66. don't you xians thrive on the persecution stuff though?

don't you feel at one now with your savior NAILED to that cross? :shrug:

yeah it must suck for you to belong to a persecuted minority religion that doesn't get CATERED to in this country. :sarcasm:

[lukasahero]

68. Did you even bother to read her post?

Why be rude?

[TCJ70]

81. Because it's easier than understanding. n/t

[La Lioness Priyanka]

91. not to mention, there was as much defense of it as there was criticism

but ofcourse not, the majority religion in this country is uber persecuted

[WildEyedLiberal]

99. Except the OP didn't say "the majority religion in this country is uber persecuted"

She said that SHE received hateful vitriol and bilge because she posted a thread praying for the President.

If you really can't see the difference between the two, then I'd say your persepctive is awfully skewed.

No one seriously thinks Christians are "persecuted." Does that mean it's A-OK to direct hateful bile to a specific DUer who dares to allude to his/her beliefs in a personal way? Really?

And the poster you replied is part of why civil discourse at DU is impossible.

[varelse]

67. Hmm

I'm glad I missed that thread. People gave you shit for praying for someone? :wtf:

[redwitch]

69. I am so sorry you worried over it.

I like that you pray for the Prez. I don't understand why that would make anyone feel hostile.

[DFW]

70. Though not one for prayer, personally........

I don't have the slightest problem with anyone else doing it. I'm the same way about alcohol.

Different strokes for different folks.

"Get a life" is not enforceable in a court of law. We all have to deal with that at some time or other.

[darkstar3]

71. I REALLY wanted to bitch here...

I REALLY wanted to bitch at you and tell you to get a thicker skin.

I REALLY wanted to say that if you can't handle discussion of your religion, maybe you should stay out of R/T.

I REALLY wanted to sneeringly ask if you felt like we were somehow oppressing you, and probably make a Monty Python reference.

I REALLY wanted to bitch...about broad brushes and wahmbulances and all manner of unpleasant things...

Then I went back and read some of the comments on your OP.

As an atheist who disagrees, sometimes vehemently, with all religion and religious practices, I am ashamed to read some of the vitriol in that thread. I haven't been here all that long, but I have striven in my time to be civil, and to keep the conversation at least somewhat free of mockery and insult when I disagree with someone. I don't always succeed, but it almost seems like a couple of people in that thread pissed on your religion with a disturbing level of glee. I don't care who you are, or what you've done, that's just not nice, and it has no place in polite discussion or honest debate.

I would encourage you to alert on posts like that, but then you'd be spending too much time policing your own thread, so I don't really have an answer on how to stop this from happening.

But I would like to let you, and many of the posters in this thread (especially those referring to card-carrying atheists) know that we're not ALL bad. In fact, I think for every atheist on this board who takes pleasure in pissing on Christianity, there is another atheist here who is genuinely interested in discussion.

And as far as I'm concerned, pray to whomever, whenever, and for whatever you want. I may not personally think it will do any good, but there's no harm in trying, is there?

:hug:

[DevonRex]

87. Best post. And thank you. nt

[Kaylee]

106. great post. nt

[Peacetrain]

72. My dear gauguin57... I am a Christian with a capital C!, and I pray for the President

and I pray for myself, and I pray for everyone else. The fact you pray, whether you are a Muslim, Christian Jew, Buddhist, etc etc etc or an Agnostic, or Atheist.. it matters not.

Many horrible things have been done in the name of my religion,by people claiming to be Christians and who in fact are 180 the opposite. For Christians we get battered by both sides.. those who use our religion to suppress people, and those who want to punish us for what others did in the name of anything but Christianity.

So saying that, I did not get to see your original thread. I will not look it up per your request to let it die.

But I will stand by your hopes and good wishes for the President.

[CBR]

77. Keep praying Gauguin... do what makes you feel comfortable.

As an agnostic, I support you.

[Vidar]

79. K&R

[bvar22]

84. LIfe is a prayer,

....even for Atheists whether they choose to acknowledge it or not.

"All I really want to know, is are you kind?"----Uncle John's Band, Grateful Dead

There are always two choices:
Kindness or Hate.

We build our lives on these two choices.
Many on that thread did not choose kindness.

[Lilyeye]

109. Good post gauguin

I've been on DU for a year and learned quickly how condesending and rude some folks can be here towards anyone who is a Christian or believes in a deity. It really pisses me off because some people here act no better than those on the Christian right. Both extremes upset and anger me. It was clear that you meant no harm and I am sorry you had to go through that crap. Its hypocritical how we can bash the right for being so intolerant, when some on the left are just as intolerant.