What if Colin Powell had become president?

[DutchLiberal]

Would there be a birther-movement? Would there be people screaming they want their country back? Would there be the same kind of resistance to a black man in the White House? Just asking... :shrug:

[ejpoeta]

1. i don't know. powell is black, but he is also a republican. so i don't know if they would

take it the same. I mean, haven't they been going after powell since he supported obama and stuff like that??

[emulatorloo]

13. Limbaugh claimed Powell's endorsement of Obama was because of race. Only race, not policy

Some Conservatives See Race In Powell's Obama Endorsement
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/19/limbaugh-george-will-powe_n_135968.html

[lamp_shade]

2. Yes... I believe there would be (w/o the birther movement).

[NYCGirl]

3. There'd be lots of DUers calling him a war criminal. NT

[DutchLiberal]

8. But that has actually factual merit...

[HamdenRice]

4. In 2000? In a way we'd be worse off because the repug party would have been rehabilitated

That was the last time he seriously considered running. None of the catastrophes of the Bush era would have occurred, but the overall economic trends of Reaganism would have continued.

We'd still be frogs in increasingly hot water, but we wouldn't have reached boiling point and jumped out.

I worry that any reasonable repug in 2000 would have locked in a repug majority for a long, long time.

Better that Junior fucked things up and put them out of power for a generation.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

22. Unfortunately he didn't mess things up fast enough

He was able to hold everything together just enough to be re-elected(?) to a "second" term in 2004 but everything just fell to pieces right before he left office. Actually, his slide began really almost as soon as he started his second term but, unfortunately, of course, we couldn't "take back" the election and impeachment had been unilaterally put "off of the table" by our *representatives* in Congress, so we had to let him continue to mess things up for another two years. Stupid.
:puke:

Personally, I would've preferred a more sane and "sensible" Republican like Colin Powell (or maybe even John McCain v1.0) in 2000 to 8 years of Bush, Cheney, Rove, et. al being the ones calling the shots. Powell probably would've taken AQ and his PDBs a LOT more seriously. Reaganism isn't really going away under President Obama anyway (although he is moderating it a bit like Clinton did and Gore or Kerry probably would have)

[DutchLiberal]

27. Agreed on all points.

People like to pretend that, now with the financial crisis and Obama in office, Reaganism has come to an end. But I see no signs of that. In fact, I see banks going back to 'business as usual' already.

We need the Republicans to become 'sane' again. It's the only way the Democrats will be forced to the left again.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

38. Agreed

It will be interesting (in a "trainwreck" sort of way) to see what happens to the Republicans over the next few years. So far, all of the evidence seems to point towards less moderates and more nuts. Frankly, I think that the Republican Party, if it doesn't instead purge itself of or tone down the nuts, it will basically whither away to nothingness and its more "moderate" members will jump ship and become Independents and/or join the Democratic Party- at which point the Democratic Party might split between their progressive and conservative "Blue Dog" sides.

I don't honestly see much of a future for the GOP unless they manage to come up with a dazzling and charismatic leader and, more importantly, policies and programs that can appeal to a large portion of the electorate and draw back in some minorities as well. If that doesn't happen, which I don't honestly think it will, there's virtually NO hope for their continued existence at all (in their present form) IMHO.

*It really is amazing how things turn out. After the successive losses of the 2000, 2002, and 2004 elections, I thought that maybe it was the Democratic Party that would be consigned to the "dustbin of history" and that Republicans would become a more or less permanent ruling majority (in fact, I believe that somebody wrote a book prior to the 2006 elections about this). However, beginning in 2006 and continuing in 2008, it has been the REPUBLICANS whom actually appear ready to be retired, particularly when considering the apparent electoral alignment of the country last year. Of course, as with the political fortunes of the Democratic Party, that could all change in the blink of an eye but it's rather hard to see how when the overall ideology of the country is much more in line with the Democratic Party on nearly all of the major issues. :shrug:

[DutchLiberal]

40. People have said the same about the GOP between 1933-1953...

Of course it wasn't a party of crazies back then, but all 'experts' were questioning whether the Republicans would ever govern again. And after 12 years of Reagan-Bush, who predicted two terms for a Democrat?

The problem is the two-party system. This bitter fighting 'on life and death' between two parties would never have happened in a multiple party system. I mean, sure there's a lot of disagreement between parties in The Netherlands, but they know that, when forming a cabinet, they have to work together to get a majority. This results in much more constructive opposition, instead of 'just opposition'.

What do you think? Is the US ready for a 10-party system? ;)

[Proud Liberal Dem]

44. A multi-party system would probably be more representative

and I do think a lot of people, myself included, would like to have more choices, although I generally feel pretty well represented by the Democratic Party. I do think we need some "new blood" in leadership positions and some new faces in the US Senate. Is the US in general ready for a multi-party system? Who knows? Until there is a third party that can significantly cut into the votes of the Republican and Democratic Parties (like what frequently happens in states like Minnesota), we will probably have to continue choosing between just the Democrats and Republicans. There seems to be a constant threat of progressives "bolting" the Democratic Party but most progressives avoid doing so because they know that it might allow the Republicans another chance to get back into power. Once the Republicans are no longer a threat electorally, there may eventually be a split between the progressive and moderate/conservative members of the Democratic Party leading to a more robust Green Party or the formation of another "progressive" party.

[Aviation Pro]

5. Remember....

...Colin Powell's parents were immigrants from Jamaica. There is no doubt in my mind there would have been a birther movement.

[LeftishBrit]

Probably yes.

Especially as only ways that Powell could have become president would be if either:

(1) He'd switched parties and run as a Dem (well, stranger things have happened). Then he'd be a Dem *and* a party-traitor *and* black!

or

(2) He'd had a white, extreme RW-er as running-mate. In that case, I honestly doubt that he'd even be alive by this stage.

Remember that his wife discouraged him from running in the 90s, precisely because she feared for his safety if he did.

[Nitrogenica]

6. The "culture war" that dominates the right wing would also try to

destroy Colin Powell, only if he ran as a Democrat.

[Walk away]

7. Colin Powell turned his back his race when he...

sold his soul for the warmongering right-wing monsters who sacrificed 4,000 young lives for money and power. Maybe the republican party would have happily elected him since they owned him.

His recent, grudging change of heart would disqualify him but I can't believe a Democrat would vote for him.

[aikoaiko]

9. No, because it is the fear of Democrats succeeding that drives much of the hatred toward Obama.

Any latent racism just makes it easier for some people.

[SammyWinstonJack]

19. +1 nt

[goclark]

10. Good question ~ I am African American

The Colin Powell that held up that little bottle would not be on my list of Presidents.

I would not become a Republican to vote for him I know that ~

I would respect his position but not his Party.

I can say that the outpouring of support that AA's have given to President Obama would not be there for Powell.

We embrace Obama for so many reasons - not just because he is African American. We love the MAN and his MESSAGE,

As a Race we did not throw our total support for JJackson and so many others.

[emulatorloo]

11. Republican fringe would have stayed home and not voted. n/t

[autorank]

12. Yes, some variation, no doiubt about it. That's why he didn't run. There's

another reason, his role in torture.

But as to your question, *certain* people, hard core racists, would have been just as upset.

[OHdem10]

14. The Conservatives stopped Colin Powell dead in his tracks. by of

course saying he is too Liberal for a Candidate of their
Party.

The different leaders of various conservative groups came
out en masse to put a stop to the discussion.

"Too Liberal" can be code for many things.

[AspenRose]

15. Yes.

http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/news/1996/04/11/1996-04-11_powell_got_hate_mail__wife_s.html

"Retired Gen. Colin Powell received shocking hate mail before taking himself out of the running for the presidency last November, his wife revealed in an interview.

Alma Powell whose distaste for the limelight reportedly played a major role in her husband's decision to nix a presidential bid told the Ladies Home Journal that she feared for the war hero's safety on the campaign trail. "A black man running for President is going to be in a dangerous position," Alma Powell said. "I did not want him to run," she said. "I told him that from the very beginning."

She added, "I don't want to describe the hate mail we've gotten. You think everybody loves Colin Powell. Everybody doesn't like Colin Powell."

Alma Powell cited two letters she received in one day one calling her husband a "wonderful man" and the other slurring him as typical of the mail mix. "Those two opinions flourished in great multiples," she said."




I don't think the GOP would have let Powell get that far. He wouldn't have made it past the primaries because it would have been Teabagger City at events. And as someone already pointed out, he's the son of Jamaican immigrants.

[Jennicut]

18. Pretty shocking. I think the Rethugs tolerate African Americans in their party

but truthfully want nothing to do with them.

[AspenRose]

21. And I predict....

....that any republican who reads that article would blame Democrats for sending Powell the racist hate mail as a means to make the GOP look bad.

PUMA types probably would send that kind of mail, but not the average, typical Democrat. Instead, Liberals would be screaming "war criminal" (which would have nothing to do with race).

[Jennicut]

24. Powell is not my favorite person because of the things that happened leading up

to Iraq. However, all of us liberals could care less about his race. Its all the racist RWers who sent him the hate mail. We don't get caught up on what race someone is...they see it first and everything else about a person after.

[AspenRose]

33. Well, most of the time

(see Ferraro, Geraldine)

[Jennicut]

36. LOL. Forgot about that one.

[DutchLiberal]

28. So why do African Americans join the GOP in the first place?

Do they loathe themselves? :shrug:
It makes no sense.

[AspenRose]

31. Traditionally, blacks trend socially moderate to conservative

and are *traditionally* religious. Again, I repeat: that's a generalization and probably doesn't illustrate the representation of blacks on DU.

(There's a reason why "down low" is rampant in the black community.)

You will notice that some of the most vocal blacks on the GOP side are also tied with religious, traditional family organizations and/or viewpoints that reiterate the GOP worldview. Alan Keyes, J.C. Watts and Star Parker come to mind (not to be confused with Star Jones). The GOP tolerates them because they tow the line. The minute they walk away from it, however (like Colin Powell did), they're officially traitors.

And as silly as it sounds, once *some* black folks make *serious* money, they will turn to the "money" party as a status symbol (which is my theory about black athletes who are also republican, e.g. Lynn Swann). It is a way of trying to gain acceptance and avoid stereotyping socially among their white peers, and distinguish themselves from poorer, "urban" blacks who (usually) vote democratic.

Why do some gays join the GOP? Why are there Log Cabin Republicans? :shrug: The quick answer may be "self-loathing," but there are probably many different reasons.

[BlooInBloo]

16. He would never, ever get nominated by republicans.

[AspenRose]

20. Nor would Condi.

Or Michael Steele. Or Ken Blackwell.

[Sebastian Doyle]

29. But Ken Blackwell doesn't need actual votes

...just access to the machines.

[AspenRose]

32. LOL

:thumbsup:

[AspenRose]

45. Hell, there are times when the conservatives doesn't want anything to do with Steele

"During the first wave of tea-party protests in April, one prominent group in Chicago pointedly said it did not want RNC Chairman Michael S. Steele to speak at an event, even though his staff denied he had been formally asked to appear."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/09/12/AR2009091201254.html

[hfojvt]

30. that's what I said too

Back in 1995 all these pundits were salivating at the idea of Powell beating Clinton and I thought that was hilarious. These people actually thought the Republican party could nominate a black man. I really was hoping he would try though, because it would have started a civil war in the Republican party.

[Overseas]

17. No because Democrats would not hire amoral right wing PR firms to stir up

dangerous sentiments in vulnerable populations to protect private profits.

So much of the angry racism is a by-product of professional right wing PR firms, hired by private insurers (this summer) and Old Energy corporations (late summer & fall), to stir up dangerous (anti-reform, anti-government, anti-Democratic President Obama) fear and hatred in vulnerable populations through "genuine grass roots groups" that have "been around for years" (just dormant during the rampant profiteering of Republican administrations). Those deliberate and reckless campaigns have been successful. They've even gotten Medicare recipients and some Veterans to shout down "government interference" in health care.

The Right has been so successful at moving our national dialogue to the right and gaining control of our major mass media that they can trust the broadcast reporters (except the few token liberals) to cover the town hall storming as "genuine grass roots" expressions, rather than the Astroturfing events that they really were.

GOP leaders can trust a lot of reporters to cover issues like "death panels" as though they weren't ridiculous concerns over bills co-signed by Republicans themselves during the last dismal Republican administration.

The GOP has hardened their vicious power grabbing By Any Means Necessary, and Democrats haven't been willing to stoop so low as to whip desperate people into dangerous frenzies to make their points.

[ddeclue]

23. I think he was born in Haiti... I want to see his birth certificate...

:rofl:

[ecstatic]

25. I think he should run in 2016 just to throw them off

Like how they accidentally voted Steele as RNC head? I think the same thing would happen again and Powell would become the nominee. I would love to see the repug heads exploding left and right.

[AspenRose]

34. My brother and I were talking about that last night, actually

Except for 2012 instead of 2016. A black candidate for president for both parties. Yes indeed, massive head explosions....!

It'll never happen though....

[La Lioness Priyanka]

26. who would incite these flames?

[Forkboy]

35. I'd still be vomiting.

[TheKentuckian]

37. I'm not sure Powell would win the Republican nomination if he were white

He's just too close rational on most issues and to the left of virtually every Republic on the national or statewide level.

That said, if he were to have would have run and won the GOP nomination then they'd have to be radically different than they are now, throwing the racists, theocrats, and financial libertarians under the bus and moving on with a more of a throw back look.

[treestar]

39. No, but only because he is a Republican

There are crazies on the left, but they seem to be the exception, whereas on the far right, crazy is the rule.

[Raine]

41. Yes I think so

maybe not birther but something else equivalent that would question his legitimacy for the office. The RW nuts in his own party would do it.

Edit: added word

[Xicano]

42. Yes because Colin Powell tried to whitewash the My Lai massacre in Vietnam.

I could not support someone for President who's history shows that in a critical moment of decision making, especially in something as big of a deal as a US military unite massacring a village of people, is adept at choosing to make clearly bad decisions.

[DutchLiberal]

43. Why would the (crazy) right-wing be angry with that?