"We Have The Best Health Care System In The World!"

[tucsonlib]

[sakabatou]

1. We suck at healthcare

[Ineeda]

2. The actual care is good....

...if you can get it and if you don't end up broke. Two big ifs.

[tucsonlib]

3. Then Please Explain These Statistics n/t

[Ineeda]

8. I could be wrong, but

the first two statistics relate to money. Because we all have to cover the costs of the uninsured who seek care in emergency rooms, or those whose illnesses are not detected early by preventive care. This adds tremendously to the overall cost. The second two columns relate to life expectancy and infant mortality - directly linked to lack of available care because it's not affordable or because coverage is denied. I'm not smart enough to explain the last category.

[tucsonlib]

9. Then You Do Agree That Our Health Care SYSTEM Is Broken?

That is, after all, the point, isn't it? Not the quality of the care itself.

[Ineeda]

10. Reread my first post. I wasn't disagreeing with you. Sheesh. n/t

[Frank Cannon]

11. Doctors, particularly primary care practitioners, are leaving the system

They are just as sick of this horseshit as you and I are.

http://www.kaiserhealthnews.org/Daily-Reports/2009/September/15/Doctors.aspx

[Merlot]

35. Because we have to cover the costs of executives pay and bonuses

as well as shareholder profit.

[hughee99]

4. I agree, I think the "care" is great

It's the coverage that sucks. Too many people don't get the care because they don't have the coverage.

[BREMPRO]

33. look at japan- a third the cost with the best outcomes overall- Why don't we ..

take a hard look at what they are doing, and LEARN SOMETHING. This xenophobic blind mantra of "we are number one" and we are the best and everyone follow our example has to stop. We live in a global village and we should have the smarts and humility to look at other systems and see what we can take from them to make one that works for us. Make health care work, and it won't matter if republicans vote for it- they will become extinct. If we get a weak watered down bill that is a gift to the insurance and drug industry, and makes things worse, who would ever vote for another democrat? I agree with jay rockefeller- i dont care how long it takes, i want to get it right, a real improvement to health care.

[Ozymanithrax]

5. Well, we beat Mexico all to hell....

[grantcart]

6. I wonder if you take out their infant mortality if they have longer life expectancies

for people who survive past their first year?

[Ozymanithrax]

16. Life expectancy 2008

Mexico

Total population: 75.84 years

Male: 73.05 years

Female: 78.78 years

U.S.

Total population: 78.11

Male: 75.65

Female: 80.69

[tucsonlib]

17. And Your Point? n/t

[Ozymanithrax]

19. You wondered about life expectancy after infant mortality.

The difference is that Mexico is a third world nation. Many areas do not have running water or even electricity. Mexico City is currently having their water rationed. It is simply turned off 2 days a week. You do not drink the water there unless it is boiled or filtered or both.

The fact that we only beat Mexico City shows how bad our system is.

[tucsonlib]

20. Re: You wondered about life expectancy after infant mortality.

Actually, that wasn't me. But thank you.

[grantcart]

21. no my point is that if you could take out the infant mortality what would the

life expectancy.

Your figures show the comparison WITH infant mortality averaged in.

[bhikkhu]

29. And we may as well look at Cuba too:

http://www.medicc.org/publications/cuba_health_reports/cuba-health-data.php

Infant mortality: 5.3 per 1000,

Life expectancy (average both sexes): 77.6

Physicians per 10,000 people: 62.9

Pretty good for a dirt poor nation, under sanctions and "misgoverned by despicable communists"

[Cleita]

7. We do for Dick Cheney. The hell with the rest of us. n/t

[stuball111]

12. Actually US health CARE is great

it's the insurance part that sucks,and if it was under a Universal system, where doctors couldn't run the bill up, and care is given on an as-needed basis instead of as-the-insurance-pays, the cost would go way down. I have been under doctor care in both Canada and here in the US, and find that the care is as good here, maybe even better. But the fact remains that when people are uninsured or under insured, they tend to delay or even choose to not get help. This causes the cost to rise, life expectancy to drop,and children often don't get care that would make them healthier later on in life. I find that doctors will "pad" the bill here, do things that are not needed, I was sent for x-rays, MRI, CAT scan and a PET scan for one issue that a simple PET scan could have sufficed. And it turned out that a simple x-ray would have done the job! You just don't see that in Canada, if you need an expensive scan, they will prescribe it. I do find that doctors don't push preventive care much here, they rather like to push pills.

[tucsonlib]

14. Re: Actually US health CARE is great

I'm confused. You defend our quality of care as being "great", but then contradict yourself with:


"I find that doctors will "pad" the bill here, do things that are not needed." And:

"I do find that doctors don't push preventive care much here, they rather like to push pills."

[stuball111]

15. It's these differences that

result from the present insurance system. One of the differences I noted was that profit seems to be the underlying motive, the care is good, but excessive, and that's not really poor care. I have had doctors up there tell me that herbal teas and stuff are good for colds and flus, which is true. Doctors are also in the pocket of big pharma down here it seems. Without those two points, the care is about the same, like I said, just excessive.

[ejpoeta]

13. well, in some regards we are, i guess. look... we spend the most money....

so in that way, i guess we are the best. and we are the best at wasting money, because look at our life expectancy and infant mortality... looks like mexico has a higher infant mortality than us. boy, we should be SOO proud!!

[spanone]

18. hey! we're number one.....at sucking

[burrowowl]

22. We are Number 1! In expenditure!

and we beat Mexico in Infant Mortality!
We are first in Arms Spending, more than all of the world put together!

:mad: :mad: :mad:

SHAME ON U$A!

[tucsonlib]

23. And Here's One More "Only In America" Statistic

http://www.physorg.com/news172424058.html


What the hell is wrong with us? :banghead:

[madamesilverspurs]

24. Steak and lobster are yummy.

Which means nothing to those for whom ramen noodles are a veritable feast.

[Avalux]

25. Shove this in the faces of the crazies; they will still not believe it.

Americans have the delusion that everything we do in this country is better than everywhere else in the world. It's time people wake the hell up and realize it's not true. For a democratic nation, we should be ashamed at our healthcare mess.

[SalviaBlue]

26. knr thanks

[LynnTheDem]

27. #37 = best in the world!!1! USA! USA! USA!

Let's just continue to stay blind, thump our chests, and pretend all is well!!1!

What's so bad about being #37 in the world anyways!!1!



Right, freeps?

[MisterP]

28. you can't trust the OECD and other countries' statistics! they were prepared by foreigners! n/t

[Kablooie]

30. See? We've got more physcians per capita than Mexico! A Glowing recommendation for America!

[TCJ70]

31. We have great health care...

...it's the cost that's causing the problems.

[Mudoria]

32. We probably have the best health care in the world..

Doctors flock here from all over the world so we get many of the best and brightest. The "system" we use has to be the worst in the world at delivering this world class healthcare though. It's despicable that millions of citizens are either uninsured or underinsured and risk death or bankruptcy the way the system works.

[Quantess]

34. We're Number 37

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x368982