Dealing With A Conservative Brother

[JMMendez1989]

Well for those of you who have seen my previous posts, you known I've had a recent political awakening. It started with research on why Obama won the 2008 election and research to understand party history. It also started by listening to Thom Hartmann. Who I think is a brilliant political mind. Ed Schultz is pretty cool too. They don't come off as loony as Hannity and Beck who I constantly disagreed with even when I was a Republican.

Well I have a twin brother. He is VERY VERY Conservative. He has a good heart and believes he is standing up for the middle class. Falling for that lie that tax cuts for the rich help him. I tried to explain to him how some conservative thinking doesn't work. He has been lied to so much that he believes Eisenhower cut taxes which is complete bull!

He is annoying to debate, he talked over me and started screaming. Anyone has any experience like this. Its like, I love my brother and all, especially since he is my twin. But completely ignorant and doesn't do research. Just would like some advice. And remember I don't want to alienate him. He's still my bro.

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. I married into a religiously and politically conservative family. The best decision we ever made was

to never discuss politics or religion. Too often everyone was left angry or with hurt feelings and since no one ever changed their opinions, what was the point except to cause problems in the family?

Good luck dealing with bro. He may try to force political discussions on you for a while. Just grin and bear it but don't engage. :hi:

[seabeyond]

2. yep. so my motto with two brothers and a father. i dont talk politics with you

i dont talk politics with you. i am not talking about this with you. i dont want to talk about this with you. i will not talk politics with you...

[mitchum]

3. That's why mom has always liked you best

[Centrisms Voice]

4. First, calm him down

When he's in a calm mood, make him promise to answer you questions only with logic for the next x minutes. (Don't make X too big a number at first.)

Then, start with "If the rich get a tax cut, what's to stop them from socking it away in a Cayman Island bank instead of using it to hire middle class workers?"

I have lots of others, if you need them. :)

[pitohui]

5. people who talk over you and scream at you, you just have to distance yourself from them

i'm sorry he's your bro, i really am, but we are not going to be able to give you the secret super cia special brainwashing ability to change the mind of fuckwits WHO SCREAM AT YOU AND TALK OVER YOU

all you can do w. these people is never talk to them on any deep subject

over time, because you never talk to them on any deep subject, bro or no bro, EVEN IF IT"S YOUR MOM FORGET YOUR BRO, no you won't be close

so what? you're already not close

he screams at you and talks over you, he doesn't care about 1) what you think and 2) what you feel so, yah, why not just be realistic and accept he doesn't care about the deepest core of you and find other people who DO accept the deepest core of you

be cordial, be polite, but accept that you have a distant relationship

everybody doesn't have to like you

NOT EVEN YOUR OWN BRO

i didn't speak to my "bro" for 18 years (not because of politics, i'm sure his are better than mine but just because) -- you are not automatically fitted together as human beings just because you're family

with family be polite, don't argue, and yes, this means if they have fucking crazy beliefs you get more and more distant

what's the alternative? fighting all the time?

it is what it is...

[babylonsister]

6. I'm a twin, too.

I don't understand where he got the idea he was standing up for the middle class, unless it's the brainwashing being done via faux and that ilk. I don't listen so I don't know. My twin is a lib, so no problems there.

I have 2 brothers who love Rush and faux. One I hadn't talked to in over 3 years until recently because of politics.

The advice you got was sound; don't even go there. It's not worth it. But demand your twin doesn't either. Politics should be off limits if you want to retain your relationship. And that's kind of sad, because it's so important to what's going on in our country, but there it is.

[Ian David]

7. Intervention time.

Tell him you're walking away from him until he gets help.

As a twin, this will be especially jarring to him.

[Xipe Totec]

8. Listen and ask questions

ask him what kind of country he wants for his children.

Ask him is he believes in the constitution.

Ask him if he believes in the rule of law.

Don't try to change him; let him change himself.

[demwing]

11. This is the best advice I've seen

Don't try to chnge someone. Lead them (not push them, and don't desert them) to the truth, and let them change themselves. He's your brother. You love him. It will be hard, but he's worth it. Good luck :)

[Ozymanithrax]

9. There are things I can not talk to my brother about.

So I know where you are coming from.

As a true believer, facts don't matter. Obama is a socialist because he is. Obama will take away his guns because Democrats have done that every time they come into office. We can not have rational conversations, so we talk about the weather (every time we talk about his or his wife's health problems health care comes up and Obama is personally going to kill them both.)

I understand where you are coming from, but I have no solution.

[tinkerbell41]

10. Welcome to DU!!!

I have a brother also, with a wife. I haven't figured it out. I usually get pissed and hang up the phone. I love him, but as you said, ignorant and doesn't do research. In fact my WHOLE family tried to convince me I'd be a sorry pathetic mess because Obama wouldn't win. There was no explaining it to them. If you find a solution let me know.

[ZombieHorde]

12. Try just discussing concepts without labeling them liberal or conservative.

For example: Mr. X died in a horrible accident, I am glad we have programs like WIC to help his spouse and kids until they can get back on their feet. So sad.

[appamado amata padam]

13. My brother, and, most sadly,

my Mom. :cry: A sister who claims to be "not into politics." I think she is pretty liberal; she just doesn't realize it. Her husband is sort of a "hippie," and was vocally against the Iraq invasion. A couple of others I'm not sure about.

Anyway, I don't see any of them very often, and we realized a long time ago, for the sake of peace and civility, we could not discuss politics.

[izquierdista]

14. Facts don't work

They aren't making their decision on facts, so you can't sway them by using facts. As Spock's mother said, "Logic, logic, I'm sick to death of logic!"

Instead of facts and logic, use emotions and feelings. Tell him how unembarrassed you are that Obama can give a good speech, where Dubya would mangle the English language. Appeal to kindness and charity and point out Greed in Republicans, along with "Lust" (Sen. Ensign), "Gluttony" (Limbaugh), "Sloth" (Clarence Thomas), "Wrath" (Fred Phelps), "Envy" (every single one of them), and "Pride" (all the flag wavers). Ask him where the Republican health care proposals are. Don't they care about middle class who can't afford the premiums?

You can't point out hypocrisy, because that goes right back to logic. When you get them started screaming, just shake your head no until they have to stop to take a breath. Then remind them that loud is not right, it is just loud. Figure out a way to get THEM to ask YOU, as in "do you know how to keep an idiot in suspense?......................." No, better not use that one, even though you may want to, because name calling is something they excel at. But do build up some suspense, until they really want to listen to your opinion on the subject at hand. If they come out with a right-wing talking point, give it a partial OK, but then ask how this is supposed to work.

For example, there is a right wing talking point on how malpractice reform will cut medical costs by a gazillion dollars a year.
You: "OK, maybe there's a lot of medical malpractice claims......but if there was single payer....and everyone was covered....people couldn't sue because of "sovereign immunity"...they would just go back to a different doctor and have it done right.....wouldn't they?

That last one may not be 100% correct, but as I said earlier, facts don't matter. You want to get them to ask NEW questions. New questions which will take their one-track talking point off into a different direction where it will get stuck in the mud. Questions are the death of conservatives, because they don't have any new answers to counter them with. All they have are their same old tired answers that they always turn back to (tax cut anyone? I'm sure a tax cut is the answer). In fact, isn't that what the definition of a conservative is?

[B Calm]

15. Ask him if he'll listen to Thom Hartmann for two weeks.

[stevedeshazer]

17. Even I can't listen to Thom for two weeks straight, and we live in the same town.

I'd be happy with two hours to start with.

It's a long and hard process, and I speak from experience as my brother is very right-wing.

[Mari333]

16. 2 of my little brothers are ultra right wing

One is a born again teabagger, and the other is an NRA gun toting rabid Ron Paul homophobe. actually, they are both loaded with bunker mentality, the first one is an investment banker (big surprise)
I changed both their diapers when they were babies, so they know not to mess with me.
I just dont discuss politics with the first one. at all. or religion. Hes in Ohio , so that helps.
The second one, we dont even speak. I love him from afar.

[rurallib]

18. There is a video of Al franken at the Minnesota state fair

where he is confronted by some blood thirsty wingers.
Al listens to their complaints and uses their concerns to reframe the conversation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCNs7Zpqo98

I'd suggest try Al's approach.