Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Is Obama this SMART?? BRILLIANT NYT reader comment with SOLUTION to Afghanistan decision.

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:42 AM
Original message
Is Obama this SMART?? BRILLIANT NYT reader comment with SOLUTION to Afghanistan decision.
This is a comment to Bob Herbert's "A Tragic Mistake" in the NYT. Is there any chance Obama could do this? It would be BRILLIANT. Does he have the guts? What do you think?

9.
MNW
Connecticut
December 1st, 2009
7:20 am

A serious, viable, realistic, politically expedient scenario follows:

President Obama presents his case for additional troops for Afghanistan, along with the rationale for this action, and fulfills the requests of military commanders and Secretary of Defense Gates. Whether or not his reasoning is compelling remains to be seen.

He will then call upon the Congress to establish a Draft to supply the necessary manpower for these additional troops. He will also ask the Congress for an increase in taxes - via the tax code or by a special war tax - to provide the revenues to cover the costs of expanded operations in Afghanistan. Failure to take these steps represents a lack of responsible leadership and a neglect of the fiscally prudent measures necessary to support a continued costly war effort. (Note www.costofwar.com)

The ball will thus be firmly placed in the Congressional "court", which is exactly where it belongs, given the requirements of the US Constitution. As a Constitutional scholar and professor of this subject matter, the President is well aware of these necessary steps in the process of shared governance with the Congress. Wars and the purse strings are the provenance of the Congress and rightly so, as the Congress represents the people - or at least they have a moral obligation to do so.

This approach, if Obama has the fortitude for it, will be a master stroke - politically speaking - and totally compatible with his nature. (Remember that the ball is in their court.) There will be no more avoidance of war-making decisions by the Congress who prefer to spare themselves and to leave it up to any President. (Great skirts to hide behind.) Why put their political lives on the line, after all. But then there is that pesky Constitution.

The usual resulting chaos in the Congress will place the Republicans war seekers on the horns of a dilemma (with friction in their ranks) because they prefer not to ask for a Draft (politically dangerous as the electorate on the whole does not favor war escalation) and they prefer to avoid taxes of any kind as they believe only in a "borrow and spend" mode of fiscal activity. All their concerns regarding deficit spending (remember Health Care reform) will disappear immediately, strangely enough.

Sensible Congressional Democrats will weigh the political consequences and support neither the Draft, the taxes, or the war in Afghanistan in its entirety. (Sorry, Mr. President, but our constituents do not support these efforts.) Or they will do what they do best - forego a unified front, and that for once will be to our advantage. Obama will retire to the Oval Office, look over the Rose Garden, and await Congressional decisions. (I await also - all the Op-Eds.)

The monkey wrench, of course, is if Obama throws in with the Republicans, which means he isn't as thoughtful or politically astute as one might hope. But then is being a one-term President worth a problematic "finish the job" proclamation and its possible failure? (And we do need him as a Democrat, in the last analysis.) Who's to say, but a viable third party candidate may have my vote this next time around, since I prefer careful thinkers in any political driver's seat. (And the above scenario does get him off the Afghanistan hook, after all. Not a bad result.)

So lessons are learned and we may have to finally accept the fact that possibly charismatic oratory does have its limitations. Fool me once......

http://community.nytimes.com/comments/www.nytimes.com/2009/12/01/opinion/01herbert.html?sort=recommended
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
FarLeftFist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
1. Interesting...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oviedodem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:46 AM
Response to Original message
2. I don't think ANY modern day Prez would have the "cajones" to do this. Simply
it is a political risk that presidential egos will not undertake
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rocktivity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
3. I don't see him gambling his popularity on a draft--even Bush was smart enough to avoid that.
Edited on Tue Dec-01-09 11:51 AM by rocktivity
But Obama could esaily nationalize the military-industrial complex and heavily tax, if not rightout seize, their profits. THAT would balance our budget and get us out of there REAL quick! But as Keith pointed out last night, Obama's intelligent enough to realize his strategy will waste more time, money, and lives while enriching defense contractors. I think he's got something up his sleeve...

:evilgrin:
rocktivity
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bobburgster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:49 AM
Response to Original message
4. I love it!
Make Congress earn their damn pay for a change.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SpiralHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:50 AM
Response to Original message
5. Interesting indeed
The k and the r.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JackintheGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
6. Several problems spring immediately to mind
1. the myriad "rope-a-dope" scenarios trumpeted in these very pages that have never come to fruition
2. the demonstrated lack of bravery-in-conviction that Obama has already shown in repeated bids to be centrist
3. The phrase "sensible Congressional Democrats": as Bugs Bunny would say, "it is to laugh."

It would be brilliant, and Obama would never be re-elected (draft+taxes), but that would be fine since it would show the dems as sensible and proactive and successful in a major campaign promise, leading to:

Somebody Else (D) in 2012
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lilith Velkor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #6
21. Actually, the "rope-a-dope" scenarios did come to fruition
Those trumpeting them just happened to be wrong about who the dope was.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
7. God, if only.
knr
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
8. a "viable" 3rd party candidate.
Who? David Dinkins?

That isn't really much of a solution. (Hint - if Obama calls for a draft, then who gets blamed for this very unpopular idea and who looks like a loser when it gets shot down. Clue - his surname starts and ends with a vowel.)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
whatchamacallit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
9. If only...
That would certainly have me believing again.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tigermoose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
10. This would backfire - bigtime. Congress would authorize and fund it...
nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
earthside Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
11. A Dream.
If Pres. Obama doesn't have the guts to recognize the altered situation concerning Afghanistan and our federal debt and tell the Pentagon brass to take a hike ... he certainly will not have the audacity to try the "reinstate the draft" strategy.

Besides, throwing the Afghanistan dilemma to Congress for resolution actually makes Pres. Obama look even weaker.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FormerDittoHead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
12. He might just do this! Isn't this basically what he did with health care reform? n/t
:sarcasm:


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gold Metal Flake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
13. YES! And then we get our ponies!
What a lovely fantasy.


Face it, Obama is another Bill Clinton and we are simply the cattle streaming toward the knives.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
notadmblnd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:56 AM
Response to Original message
14. a draft would be political suicide
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Orangepeel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:58 AM
Response to Original message
15. ridiculous that this would be a political masterstroke
it could be argued that it would be the responsible thing, given that the country shouldn't be in a war that the people won't support in real terms.

But that it would be politically smart?
:rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 11:58 AM
Response to Original message
16. Draft Young Republicans FIRST!!!!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
avalonofmists Donating Member (54 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 12:07 PM
Response to Original message
17. Fool me once......
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 12:09 PM
Response to Original message
18. That was my recommendation since early last week
Make the rich and their children pay in treasure and blood - that will end the wars.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. Simply put: "Make the rich and their children pay in treasure and blood - that will end the wars."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lilith Velkor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. Make them HOW?
Why not just shoot them and leave other countries out of it?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 01:25 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Draft 'em and tax 'em. (But it would be nice to leave other countries out of it).
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lilith Velkor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #24
31. I'm sure all those rich people in Congress will get right on it.
And since none of them are lawyers, there won't be any loopholes. Mmm-hmm. :eyes:

Don't you pro-drafties ever sit down for 2 minutes and think about what you are proposing?

It would take a populist coup to pull this off. Which falls under "just shoot 'em and get it over with." No need to send kids off to die to teach them that sending kids off to die is wrong. :crazy:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 12:19 PM
Response to Original message
19. If he did that, wouldn't he get whacked? They whack for less. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 01:08 PM
Response to Original message
22. they are floating a war tax balloon, but don't think a draft is in the cards
he's not the brave--not even Bush was that foolhardy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FLAprogressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 01:27 PM
Response to Original message
25. oh please, it's another "chess game" post
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 01:28 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Actually it's not. I think we all know the chances of him doing this "are snowball in hell" range
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #25
29. Seems that way to me too. Plus the fact that by now most Congress critters are
Probably not even aware that they can vote AGAINST a resident's war budget figures.

As far as the President beiong a Constitutional scholar, we all saw how scholarly he was about the Constitution when he did the wrong thing about FISA.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
maxpower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 01:31 PM
Response to Original message
27. Great Point
I sure hope this is his strategy. But I've had them dashed so many times before.


Peace,
Max
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GeorgeGist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
28. A 10 dimensional chess jedi does not lose ...
at tic-tac-toe.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Thickasabrick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 03:32 PM
Response to Original message
30. No way it would happen - OTOH I very much enjoyed Herbert's article. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Libertas1776 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-01-09 04:10 PM
Response to Original message
32.  sounds like a brilliant masterful stroke of political finesse...
which is why it probably isn't in Obama's game plan.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Thu Apr 25th 2024, 11:32 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC