Dems agree to drop gov't-run insurance option

[onehandle]

Source: AP

WASHINGTON – Democratic senators say they have a tentative deal to drop a government-run insurance option from health care legislation. No further details were immediately available.

But liberals and moderates have been discussing an alternative, including a private insurance arrangement to be supervised by the federal agency that oversees the system through which lawmakers purchase coverage. Additionally, talks centered on opening up Medicare to uninsured Americans beginning at age 55, a significant expansion of the large government health care program that currently serves the over-65 population.

Sen. Tom Harkin of Iowa told reporters he didn't like the agreement but would support it to the hilt in an attempt to pass health care legislation.

Developing...

A 'limited buy-in' at age 55 according to Keith... Whatever that is.

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_health_care_overhaul

[supernova]

1. And institute Medicare instead?

[SemiCharmedQuark]

3. Only if you're 55 or older.

I doubt Bernie will vote for it.

[supernova]

5. I would like to see

them pass the Medicare option at 55 now and then every so often, say, every 3-5 years, lower the age by about a decade. So, 55 now, and then 45 in another 3 years, then 35, then 25.

We'll get to single payer before you know it!

[SemiCharmedQuark]

8. I'm glad for a lot of my family--many of my middle aged aunts and uncles need that buy in.

But I'm only 26 and I have no insurance. I haven't been to a GP since I got kicked off my mom's insurance. My husband is 29, but at least he gets his checkup when he goes home to England.

I'm glad for my family, but I can't help but be disappointed.

[dixiegrrrrl]

17. Here are options for those of us with no current insurance:

this site has database of free/low income medical clinics supported by Federal Government.
Doctors offer a 2 year stint working at these clinics in exchange for their medical training costs.
Think of Peace Corps in America.
These are well stocked quality clinics, I go to the one near me, have since 1998.

http://www.needymeds.org/free_clinics.taf

[Hissyspit]

22. Band-aid stuff. Very necessary, but shouldn't be.

Because we could do better. But apparently we won't.

[villager]

59. I go to one near me, too -- and wound up on the Board of Directors there!

Now I get a behind-the-scenes look at health care funding battles...!

[Ruby the Liberal]

10. This was Rep Weiner's Plan (not his amendment, but an alternative)

To its credit, Dr. Dean made the best point - we HAVE to have something concrete to show immediately, or we are going to hurt in 2010 and 2012.

If this is a step we need to take to get to 676, I am all for it (in the short term).

[tsuki]

16. We are going to hurt in 2010 and 2012. Democrats look weak and

Americans don't like weakness. This is an issue that many non-political people are following.

[Ruby the Liberal]

23. Funny that. I have noticed over my years that we are much more organized and

cohesive (for lack of better terms) when we are the minority in opposition.

WTF is up with that?

[dflprincess]

26. Any news on what it will cost to buy in?

And will people still need a "medigap" policy?

[wordpix]

64. if you're a young family or out of work, screw you - sarcasm

:sarcasm:

[gateley]

2. Bernie Sanders won't vote for it, no matter how much they expand Medicare.

I'm so disappointed. WHEN will we stop knuckling under?

[Zen Democrat]

4. If we had the votes, we'd have single-payer. But we don't. I'll wait for details.

Gene Robinson just said he has always thought we'd either get something called a public option that really wasn't, or something not called a public option that acatually was. Let's see what they've agreed to. I think it's interesting that Lieberman is for expanding Medicare, but only because he campaigned for that in 2000. He's a bit boxed in now, since his only constituency is himself, it appears.

[bluestateguy]

6. I think he's vote for cloture and vote no on such a bill

nt

[bluestateguy]

7. I wonder what Joe Lieberman will find to bitch about now

He'll find something. Trust me.

[Cant trust em]

11. Supposedly he was really happy about this.

I must've read this somewhere today.

[dysfunctional press]

69. that proves what a p.o.s. it must be.

[underpants]

9. Dems agree to drop gov't-run insurance option (5 mins ago)

Source: AP/Yahoo

WASHINGTON – Democratic senators say they have a tentative deal to drop a government-run insurance option from health care legislation. No further details were immediately available.

But liberals and moderates have been discussing an alternative, including a private insurance arrangement to be supervised by the federal agency that oversees the system through which lawmakers purchase coverage. Additionally, talks centered on opening up Medicare to uninsured Americans beginning at age 55, a significant expansion of the large government health care program that currently serves the over-65 population.

Sen. Tom Harkin of Iowa told reporters he didn't like the agreement but would support it to the hilt in an attempt to pass health care legislation.

THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE. Check back soon for further information. AP's earlier story is below.

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_health_care_overhaul;_ylt=Am8bz6STbGODgJLsvHnIgOtPXLoF;_ylu=X3oDMTJxcmRrZDJiBGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMDkxMjA5L3VzX2hlYWx0aF9jYXJlX292ZXJoYXVsBGNwb3MDMgRwb3MDMgRzZWMDeW5fdG9wX3N0b3JpZXMEc2xrA2RlbXNhZ3JlZXRvZA--

[Capt. America]

12. Surrendercrats...how the fuck did the rethugs gets everything they wanted when they ran the show.

The Demowhiners have no discipline and they are bought and sold just like the Rethugs. Fuck them all.

[superconnected]

33. ".how the fuck did the rethugs gets everything they wanted when they ran the show" - Pelosi/Reid.

[Smashcut]

77. What makes you think it was only the Pukes getting what they wanted?

I think the truth about our one-party system is so nakedly apparent now it's almost embarrassing.

[Capt. America]

85. A single party of the corporations, by the corporations, for the corporations.

[endless october]

13. the public option is not negotiable.

the public option was the compromise between single payer and the current system.

the public option was the concession for keeping single payer off the table. it is the halfway point, and destinations to the right of it are unacceptable.

[regnaD kciN]

18. Unfortunately, it WAS negotiable...

...and was just negotiated out of existence.

Hope you enjoy our new "health care plan" -- pay whatever private insurers demand, or pay a fine for the "privilege" of remaining uncovered.

Boy, aren't I glad I've supported Democrats! :sarcasm:

[Kablooie]

53. No. It was eliminatable. Didn't have to be negotiable.

[Doctor_J]

28. Jan 2011

that's when the Repukes will take back the House and Senate. No real reason to work for the Dems next year.

[Newsjock]

14. When does the revolution start?

America says, "Don't bother me; Dancing With the Stars is on."

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[pleah]

29. I have had my pitchfork ready for years, no one will join me.

:mad:

[slay]

86. It should have started years ago

maybe when dancing with the stars is over... sigh.. :(

[krabigirl]

87. Seriously. It never will. I'm just planning on leaving. My kids deserve better

[Cant trust em]

15. I need some additional analysis on this

My initial sense is to ask what about the people who are 45 that are still priced out of the market.

I want to see what Dean, Weiner and Krugman have to say.

[PFunk]

19. I see alot of young folks dropping out of politics (and voting) because of this.

While it's a lot better than the "watered down" public option before it. It has nothing that would make those under 55 happy about it. And it's them that the dems should be angling for, not throwing under the bus. Especially with '10 around the corner.

[Doctor_J]

30. Yup. Large % of new Obama voters will sit out next year

I hope the president likes dealing with Speaker Boner

[PSPS]

58. Sadly, I don't think Obama cares

It seems all he cares about are vacations and "date nights." That's precisely why this "reform" idea is dead -- Obama dropped the ball for his summer vacation. (Remember this was supposed to be finished by August.) This allowed time for the fake "teabaggers" movement to hijack all the media and momentum.

[ecstatic]

67. Would young folks buy into Medicare, if the option were available?

Some would, but most wouldn't. And putting a mandate on it wouldn't be helpful for '10 either. So what's the answer?

[JoeyT]

82. A mandate might be helpful if it were actual single payer.

Though if you didn't want to fool with a mandate, I guess you could go with a 3 month period after you buy in before the insurance kicks in. At least after everyone that wants in now has bought in. That way you could prevent people waiting until they got sick to buy in.

[krabigirl]

88. They don't care about anyone.

[IndianaGreen]

20. from single payer off the table, to watered down public option

to no public option at all. Olympia Snow and Ken Conrad are quoted as saying they are opposed to opening Medicare to 55-64 year olds. How many surrenders are yet to come?

Can't say any of you weren't warned by us, the bitter supporters of Single Payer.

[HughMoran]

24. I wonder what will happen in conference?

This fight doesn't end here by any stretch. If reform doesn't help people get affordable insurance, then it's no reform at all and Dems will be to blame.

[regnaD kciN]

78. Actually, it would be WORSE than "no reforrm at all"...

...because it would not only not get help people get affordable insurance, but legally-require them to buy unaffordable insurance.

This wouldn't be a case of "do-nothing," but of making things worse for average Americans.

I will caution, though, that we still don't know the outlines of this deal. It may eliminate the public option, it may not. It may offer alternatives that make it not much worse than what was on the table beforehand. What it won't do, sadly, is make it better than "slightly worse," no matter what.

[Loge23]

25. A huge win for the insurers

Make no mistake about this - this is a lopsided victory for the insurers.
Yes, Medicare may be available to some over 55 - not all, not all by a longshot.
The insurance companies still have no real competition and can continue to offer whatever they want and charge whatever they want for it. This changes quite little.
Woo-Hoo Insurers! Time to party!
As for the rest of us, dig a little deeper.

[IndianaGreen]

38. The old workers go under Medicare, and the young ones are mandated

to buy into a corrupt broken system. What a deal!

[mike_c]

27. words

fail

:cry:

[superconnected]

31. Pelosi and Reid never stop failing us. I swear they have rubber spines.

[Skip Intro]

32. I don't believe in the end a bill that says "too bad" to the uninsured under 55 will be what comes

of this. I don't believe most Senate Dems will stand for it.

[bread_and_roses]

43. Alas, there is little to no evidence that the Ds will "stand for" anything at all but campaign $$

and only the $$ from big Corps REALLY count, don't you know, cause who the hell else will the rest of us donate to, they tell themselves, and are right on target to date. As far as what they will "stand for" from the Corporatocracy or the Rs, the evidence says they'll stand for just about anything at all. This Bill was saying "too bad" to the uninsured before they started talking about the sweetener for the 55+. But then, older voters are the most reliable voters.

[regnaD kciN]

79. No, but what well may come of this...

...is a bill that has lots of bright and shiny new plans to distract voters from the real message of "too bad" until 2014...by which time, they'll all have been re-elected anyway. When the mandates kick in, and people find out what the real price-tag will be, will they take steps to fix it? (I remember an analysis of Hillary Clinton's very-similar HCR plan last year as "make it mandatory, and then fix it when people complain.") Who can tell? I'd rather have the best possible plan from the get-go, and improve it from there once we find out what works and what doesn't. Sadly, I think what we're likely to get will be far from the best possible plan this time.

[andym]

34. Any more details? nt.

[Gman2]

35. Unfortunately for us, Mass. program is not as definitive as Canada's was locally.

We have Mitt Romney's program as our blueprint. Bogus. As soon as we have a model, we will demand more.

[quakerboy]

41. Demand and watch them laugh all the way to the bank

Hey, demanding has worked so far, right?

[mvd]

36. Really expected better from the Democrats

We have the WH, The Senate, and the House - yet no one took a stand for a strong public option. There better be that Medicare expansion, or this will be a total-cave in. To show how bought some of our Senators are, the "moderates" won't vote for a public option under any circumstances while the progressives care about the Party.

Maybe a Medicare expansion will be better than a public option in name only. But does this new private plan have any enforcement clout?

[regnaD kciN]

80. The fact is, we DIDN'T have the Senate...or maybe even the House.

Sure, the Senate is 60-40 D, but, if anything is clear from this experience, it's that 5 or 10 of those D votes are really DINO, and can be counted on to side with the Republicans when it comes to defeating true progressive legislation. In a chamber where, most of the time, you need 60 votes, that's a huge stumbling block.

And even the House, which should be more progressive, could only pass a watered-down public option by a razor-thin 220-215 margin.

Let's be clear: the blame here should not go to Obama, nor to Reid, nor to Pelosi (who really tried to move heaven and earth to get a strong public option). The blame goes to the DINOs; but, more to the point, the blame goes to the "Americans hate 'liberals', so we have to repudiate what our party stands for in order to survive" mindset that first took over the party after McGovern's loss in 1972, and deepened through the Reagan era. Grassroots Democrats have done a great deal to increase our numbers (and by "our," I mean "progressives," not just "Democrats"), but enough scared-bunny centrists with zero party loyalty are still there from the bad old days to join with Republicans and provide an "anti-progressive" bloc with the votes to roadblock serious reform virtually every time -- but, when a Republican is in the White House, will happily join the G.O.P. to pass their conservative agenda.

The only solution, as far as I can tell, is to target those who have really blocked the will of the majority here. And those aren't Obama, Pelosi, and Reid -- they're Lieberman, Nelson, Lincoln, Conrad, Baucus, and Landrieu (and a number of similar DINOs in the House). They're the ones who need to be removed, not "all the bums" (a strategy that will have us looking at another decade of Republican hegemony starting in 2012).

[placton]

37. see that riverboat?

that's gonna take us down the river - we been sold

[quakerboy]

39. And that, kids, is how we gave the majority to the republicans

again. Even as they stare into the Bush legacy. Fuck.

[Aleric]

40. This post is mistitled

It should be titled - Harry Reid fails...again... don't look so shocked.

[regnaD kciN]

42. To put this in perspsective...

But liberals and moderates have been discussing an alternative, including a private insurance arrangement to be supervised by the federal agency that oversees the system through which lawmakers purchase coverage.

Here are the monthly premiums for my state (Washington) under that system for next year:

Individual
Aetna CDHP $420.98
Aetna HDHP $299.02
Group Health High $538.87
Group Health Standard $340.95
KPS Standard $355.90
KPS HDHP $304.24
KPS High $537.03
Kaiser Foundation High $543.57
Kaiser Foundation Standard $446.57
UnitedHealthcare HDHP $357.54
UnitedHealthcare CDHP $391.30

Family
Aetna CDHP $1,004.62
Aetna HDHP $654.85
Group Health High $1,186.86
Group Health Standard $810.07
KPS Standard $768.19
KPS HDHP $664.82
KPS High $1,128.36
Kaiser Foundation High $1150.20
Kaiser Foundation Standard $1025.87
UnitedHealthcare HDHP $731.73
UnitedHealthcare CDHP $866.19

(Now, keep in mind that, for federal employees, most of these premiums are paid by the government -- which won't be the case for ordinary citizens using the system.)

So, in short, if you're an individual in my state, you'd be legally-required to pay between $299.02 and $543.57 per month for mandated coverage under this system. If you have a family, make that between $654.85 and $1,186.86 per month. Or, of course, you could pay a fine for the privilege of being uncovered.

Gee, aren't we glad we're getting this instead of a public option? Aren't you proud of our Democratic lawmakers?

:puke:

[regnaD kciN]

76. Let me add to this...

It appears to be even worse than this. I told my wife about the agreement when I picked her up at the bus stop, and the word at work (where everyone is covered by the system) is that, if the plan is opened to everyone, they have been told they can expect premiums under the system to "skyrocket," as lots of high-risk people will suddenly be buying into it. So, those figures I gave above are probably going to be much lower than what we will be legally-required to shell out under that system in the future. :-(

[blue_onyx]

44. If it doesn't allow everyone to buy into Medicare....

then I hope this health care "reform" fails. I will not vote for Democrats, including Obama, if people are forced to buy private insurance with no alternative.

[mvd]

47. I'd like to read more about the new private plan

From what I have read, it may be ok if it is run like they run it for Congresspeople - but I'm not sure it will be. :hi:

[blue_onyx]

56. If it will require me to hand over money to private insurance companies

then I won't support it. The public option was the compromise and now the Dems are giving in even more. It makes it hard to justify going out and voting for Democrats.

[mvd]

57. I would agree about the new plan

If it's just like any other private plan, not good at all. Aetna basically admitted recently when dropping thousands of people that they weren't making ENOUGH of a profit for them!

[d3m0l1sh3r]

45. AHHH

nooo =/

[me b zola]

46. Reuters has quoted Reid saying that is not true

Senate Democrats reach compromise on health plan


WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Senate Democrats said they reached a broad agreement on Tuesday on a possible compromise over a government-run insurance plan in a sweeping healthcare overhaul and would seek cost estimates on the deal.

Healthcare Reform

"We have a broad agreement," Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid told reporters, refusing to give any details on the talks.

Reid said reports the government-run "public option" had been dropped were "not true."


http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE5B807720091209

[Hissyspit]

48. UPDATE: On Rachel Maddow - Reuters Reporting Reid Says Public Option Not Dead

[mvd]

50. Good. We should be able to have the public option..

AND Medicare expansion, the way we outnumber the obstructionists.

[wordpix]

65. maybe Dems on the Hill are getting our reaction here and here's mine

PUBLIC OPTION NOW! MEDICARE FOR ALL NOW!

[w4rma]

49. Blue dogs are shooting themselves in their own feet with this.

Any Blue dogs up for reelection next year shouldn't expect to have seats if they kill the public option.

[AlphaCentauri]

51. I don't care about abortions, I want a public option

Abortion is just a distraction to keep the public sleeping

[wisteria]

52. Did anyone ever really think the public option would survive?

The point is to pass Health Care Reform, with the public option still in the bill, we would not be able pass these reforms. Perhaps, the alternative being discussed will be a good replacement.

[mvd]

54. I see no reason why we can't get THEM to cave on the public option

The progressives have caved enough IMO. We would at the least have to get the Medicare expansion.

[blue_onyx]

63. Yes

They caved in to get 1 damn Republican vote. If anyone thinks that makes it "bipartisan", they're insane.

[dysfunctional press]

72. why should they cave, when they know the dems will....?

and a shitty bill will only serve to HELP repugs at the polls next year.

the repugs will all be having wet dreams tonite.

[mvd]

75. That's what I meant

We should be providing incentive for them to cave. How about withholding money/support? Reconciliation? Throwing Lieberman out of the caucus? There are options.

[regnaD kciN]

81. If "Health Care Reform" merely means "you have to buy private insurance"...

...then we'd be much better off NOT passing anything!

[Kablooie]

55. The GOP is dying and has no power so let's make sure they get everything they want!

You are going to see them arrogantly prancing about and spouting how powerful they are.

[Echo In Light]

84. Gotta help maintain that "two party" ruse - that takes priority over actually helping people

... in this sick, dying empire

[2Design]

60. is congress willing to drop their socialism supplied insurance - WTF n/t

[CaptainHowdy]

61. Just Wonderfull...

Can they make any more of a clusterfuck out of the health care bill?

[Ken Burch]

62. For the love of God, DON'T ask that question...

They can ALWAYS make the bill more of a clusterfuck.

[Bluebear]

68. I'm sure they can!

Welcome to DU!

[ecstatic]

66. My uninsurable parents turn 55 next year. I'm happy for them

Now they need to figure out how to help people 55 and under.

[Odin2005]

70. This bill is dead to me.

:puke:

[dysfunctional press]

71. nobody is going to march on DC when the weather is this crappy.

i for one, am just so entirely sick of all the bullshit.

it's true that we get the government we deserve, i guess.

[QC]

73. How very, very hopeful and changealicious! n/t

[onehandle]

74. ---> I'm asking a mod to lock this thread since we don't know what the Hell is going on

[Vidar]

83. Tactics like these are precisely why France was able to win WWII without Russia or

the US. :sarcasm:

[Tommy_Carcetti]

89. Ugh. Any chance it gets added back in from the House version via conference?

Otherwise, the bill's more watered down than your average can of Old Milwaukee.

[Waiting For Everyman]

90. We should just HAVE the damn filibuster, then!

Bring it on. Fight the fight. Without the fight, there's no chance to win it. Talk until the end of the year and see what happens.

60-vote logic makes bad law, and bad law is what's killing us. We have enough bad law already.

[anarch]

91. so basically, what's left is

subsidizing the private health insurance companies, and also increasing their customer base by instituting penalties against those citizens who don't purchase their services? What the hell is going on? I guess changing the laws about pre-existing conditions or whatnot is some kind of a good thing, but overall this is just purely shameful and ridiculous.