do you like Kucinich

[seabeyond]

reading a thread someone said Kucinich has strong majority support at du. i am curious if he does.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

1. Sometimes he is all but alone in speaking for issues I support, but 90% of the time it's "meh"

[tridim]

2. Went from love, to like, to meh in about 12 months.

[seabeyond]

3. lol lol. nt

[Shagbark Hickory]

4. The only time I don't support him is when I'm mistaken. Kucinich knows best.

[seabeyond]

5. oooosh, that is some statement. nt

[RaleighNCDUer]

22. I hear you - one indicator for me to re-examine my position is hearing

Kucinich hold a different position. Often as not (though certainly not every time) I find I'm using a flawed argument.

When Kucinich, Sanders and Kerry are all in disagreement with me, I accept that I am wrong.

[HughMoran]

48. pom pom?

I guess it's OK to be a Kucinich cheerleader huh?

[Iggo]

63. You guys have a weird definition of 'cheerleader'. (n/t)

[Echo In Light]

6. Always admire those who stand their ground in the face of overwhelming opposition

Although if more people heard and were able to understand many of DK's views on an array of subjects, I'm sure those views would resonate widely.

[debbierlus]

7. Love him.

[Sebastian Doyle]

8. One of the few solid Democrats left.

If every so-called "Democrat" in Congress stood on principle as Dennis does, we could actually move forward in this country.

[seeinfweggos]

92. and if my aunt had

well you know the rest.

[Cali_Democrat]

9. Everything he says is on point. Unfortunately he's not the person that should be front and center.

I think he would hurt the Democratic Party if he became a real leader within the party. The media would have a field day because many people just don't view him as credible.

Also it doesn't help that he's claimed to have seen a UFO, has a bombshell wife that looks out of his league, and has been married 3 times.

Also, didn't he say that he would like Ron Paul to serve as his VP if he was elected President?

Not a whole lot of credibility there.

[RaleighNCDUer]

24. He never said he would like Ron Paul as his VP -

in an interview he was asked if he would consider him - to which the only politic answer is 'yes', because it does not automatically alienate Ron Paul supporters while leaving a HUGE margin for rejecting him. 'Consider' does not mean 'want'.

Ford, Carter, Reagan all saw UFOs.

How does a hot wife work against him? What has that to do with his credibility?

[slipslidingaway]

55. Thanks for that :) n/t

[PeaceNikki]

58. I personally asked him about this 12/18/2007

He was on At Issue with Ben Merens on Wisconsin Public Radio.

I asked him about the possibility of choosing Ron Paul as a running mate and how it scares his supporters.

He said:

"Of course that's not gonna happen" and then said "his position on international matters, particularly with respect to avoiding war as an instrument of policy has been identical to mine and we salute him for that. Imagine that, Ron Paul, if he was the nominee of the party and if we nominated anyone other than myself, it would be Ron Paul that would stand out there as the one who wanted to get us out of Iraq and not a democratic nominee. So we made the point about Ron Paul's real singular opposition to the war inside the Republican party. but, of course if I was to pick a running mate, it would NOT be Ron Paul. It would have to be someone who is a member of the Democratic party and it would be someone who is very close to the way I look at the world."

I wish I could have pointed out the fact that we know Paul's REASONS for opposing the war. And that the end does not justify the means. And I was kind of grossed out that he "saluted" a piece of shit like Ron Paul.

And I voted "no".

[no_hypocrisy]

10. He's a purist as far as his principles go. Those principles used to represent the democratic party.

[liberal_at_heart]

25. exactly what we need

We need someone that holds the principles that use to represent the democratic party. I agree.

[Individualist]

28. +1

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

11. Mostly harmless.

He doesn't really do much of anything, but he also doesn't go around screwing things up.

[mmonk]

12. Yes. And the Progressive Caucus.

Without them, I wouldn't have stayed in the party this long. They are the difference right now in the Democratic Party not becoming a permanent minority party even with the lack of power they have. Millions wouldn't hold on without them.

[HopeHoops]

13. It's okay on a toasted bagel with cream cheese.

[county worker]

14. I like the fact that he is not part of the herd. He is always saying what needs to be said

no matter if it gets done or not. That's a good thing I think.

[ecstatic]

15. I used to but he lost my trust nt

[WeDidIt]

16. He's as big a dick as Lieberman

And votes with the Republicans every bit as much as Lieberman.

[OnyxCollie]

50. OMIGOD, HE MUST BE STOPPED!!1!

How dare Dennis try to burst the pretty, shiny bubble you live in!

What a sad, little man you are.:rofl:

[bvar22]

56. +1

Trying to equate Kucinich with Lieberman is just plain pathetic.

[Ohio Joe]

17. Yes, I consider him a most excellent man - nt

[Bonobo]

18. I don't like him, no. nt

[ixion]

19. He's one of the only decent politicians in office

in my opinion.

[mkultra]

20. i like his policies most of the time

but i think his methods are kind of pedantic.

[Vidar]

21. Hell yes!

[seabeyond]

23. d*mn. forgot the hell in front of the yes... lol

thanks.

[Zywiec]

26. He is twice divorced

and married to a third wife that is 31 years younger than he.

At least he has sound judgment.

[seabeyond]

30. wink.

:)

[me b zola]

27. Very much so. And I am a strong supporter of President Obama

I hate that people get put into boxes and then we're supposed to conform to it. For me it is simple. Do I share the values of an elected official, and do I believe that they are sincerely working on our behalf. For me the answers are yes and yes to both Dennis and Obama.

[seabeyond]

32. "yes to both Dennis and Obama." good point. not my intent though

to be clear. i understand some battle the two to each other. wasnt what the poll was about. not even a thought

[me b zola]

38. Sorry, I wasn't trying to point to you

It's just been one of those polarizing topics lately and I responded more to the atmosphere than to your OP. There are some who strongly support Obama that have taken to saying disparaging things about Dennis, as if a person can't like and respect both men and the work that they do. I think that Obama and Kuch are largely working toward the same goals and polarization here disheartens me. It seems to be self-defeating.

Again, sorry if my post sounded as though it was directed at you, that was not my intention.





edited for spelling

[seabeyond]

41. you are exactly correct. i appreciate you brought up what you did.

i hadnt thought of it, but after you said it.... and hanging at the board, you are right. it is a feeling that some may have.

i... was just clrifying, lol, not my intent.

but i love what you said. can respect BOTH at the same time.

good stuff

[harun]

29. mis-post

Thanks!

[seabeyond]

33. wow. harsh. and yuk.

string up the ones that have a flat out "no"?

[comrade snarky]

35. Go right ahead

I like what he says but when it comes down to getting things done and working with other people it just ain't there. I don't think Kucinich is a good spokesman for the left.

A problem Bernie Sanders for example (whom I much prefer) doesn't have.

If that's enough for you to put me on ignore please do. I don't enjoy talking to people who think their opinions cant be questioned.



Wait, unless... do you know what "meh" means? It's less than "don't like". Somewhere between "like" and "don't like', as in "stirs no strong feelings one way or another".

[harun]

40. Actually I misread the poll when I checked out the post

I thought it was yes, meh, or other. I didn't even see that we had a middle ground. So my original post was not correct.

Anyway...

It seems everyone is complaining about the "Corporate" candidates yet at the same time trashing the few in congress (less than 10) who are not bought and paid for "Corporate" politicians.

All the Republicans have to do now is wait until the next Congressional elections and they know the backlash on the Dem side will be everyone staying at home. The candidates are not getting them what they want. So they will come back to power, for sure back in power in the House. It seems unlikely now but wait and see come election time.

[comrade snarky]

44. As I read your post I thought that might be the case

Anyway, even with that. Not being a fan of Dennis is no where near something a person should be kicked off DU for.

A might bit over the top there. Much like your 2010 predictions. The repubs would have to get what... 35 seats for a majority? At a time when the Tea Partiers are going to try and primary moderate republicans? That worked out so well for them in NY with Doug Hoffman.

I'm not happy about a lot of what's going on now but the sky isn't falling.

[chandler2]

31. DK is a breath of reasonable and common sense. nt

[zipplewrath]

34. Talks a nice game

A little short on results, but in the current desert through which we wander his is the nice occasional mirage upon the horizon.

[Bushknew]

70. Your talking about Obama right?

[Ghost in the Machine]

90. He doesn't get results because, hey.. look what he's up against...

it's hard to fight the very large group of corrupt corporate whores all by yourself. Do you think there's a reason *why* the corrupt corporate whores don't vote with Dennis Kucinich? That's right, they have to protect themselves to keep their status quo...

Peace,

Ghost

[zipplewrath]

94. I don't disagree

It's not that I disagree, it's that when one is struggling to not drown, one tends to not care if the life guard is pure, only if he can stop the drowning.

[KrR]

36. So if DK was President.... We would get Single Payer right?...

Right????...

[closeupready]

37. Missing the option for "Hell, yes!"

So I voted yes.

[seabeyond]

42. bah hha. i noted that in a post above. i realized my failings from another

poster. lol

[bvar22]

39. Here is a poll from 2007 for comparison:

DU ha always been SOLID for Kucinich, but it is NOT the personality.
It IS The Issues.
There HAS been an influx of very loud No Issues "Centrists" over the last year, but DK has a SOLID majority, as do "Liberal" Issues here.


”Unlike the other candidates, I am not funded by those corporate interests.
I owe them no loyalty, and they have no influence over me or my policies.” ---Dennis Kucinich

[seabeyond]

43. interesting. thanks for sharing that. nt

[Alexander]

45. Solid for Kucinich? That poll looks like he was just barely ahead of Edwards.

A 4% margin doesn't exactly equal "solid" in my book.

[Norrin Radd]

51. The Edwards people were browbeating us to support him

over Kucinich, as he was "electable."

[Alexander]

53. So were a lot of other people.

As much as I agree with him, the sad fact is Kucinich didn't break 1% in either of his presidential bids. That is not, by my definition of the word, "electable".

I always thought Edwards was a fraud, and the only time I ever voted for him was when he was the bottom half of the ticket in 2004.

[L0oniX]

60. +1

[HughMoran]

46. How could one not like Kucinich?

Now, if you asked if he was the best Congressman he'd still get high support, candidate for President - meh (my humble opinion.)

[Alexander]

47. I like some things about him, and I don't like some things about him.

I've even met Kucinich, he's incredibly nice in person.

However, I know as mayor of Cleveland he had a lot of problems with members of his own party. He just barely survived a recall and lost in the next election to George Voinovich.

I also don't like how he advocates banning handguns, while as mayor he carried one around because he was afraid of getting shot.

Nor do I like his complete 180 on abortion just before he ran for president in 2004.

His personality and style turn a lot of people off.

But I do agree with him when it comes to 80-90% of the issues.

So I put myself down as "meh".

[Spike89]

49. Like his stands mostly

He's got the ideals I can back, but I'd never vote for him in a position where he needed to lead and develop consensus. We need politicians and we need rabble rousers with unwavering convictions...they just are not the same thing.

[flvegan]

Yes, very much so. Wish we had more just like him.

[asdjrocky]

52. A once in a generation mind.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

54. Yes, but I don't deify him like some posters do.

[OnyxCollie]

61. Link, please.

Freepers tell me that liberals think Obama is the Messiah, yet I've never known anyone to say that.

[Posteritatis]

76. Someone in very this thread all but calls him infallible. (nt)

[bvar22]

57. With out DK in the Democratic Party, who would tell us the TRUTH?

*that giving a Trillion Dollars of our Children's Money to the failed Wall Street Bankers won't really help Main Street.

*that Single Payer Universal HealthCare is not only possible, but cheaper.

*that "For Profit" HealthCare is obscene

*that Mandatory Health Insurance is NOT REALLY Universal HealthCare

*that the Democratic Party and American taxpayers should NOT be forced to subsidize some of the richest CEOs in history by subsidizing the HealthCare Insurance Cartel and HMOs.

*that the USA SHOULD give the Imperial Palace (Green Zone) back to the Iraqis, close the permanent bases, expel all Corporate Consultants, withdraw ALL US Troops, and begin paying reparations NOW.

*that redeploying some troops at some future date is a PRO-WAR position.

*that the "Oil Law Benchmark" supported by the Democratic Party is a War Crime

*That we can have election accountability with "Paper Ballots publicly hand counted at the precinct".

*that we CAN cut $Hundreds of Billions$ from the Defense Budget and STILL spend more than any other nation.

*that the RICHEST Corporations in history do NOT need $Billions$ in welfare subsidies

*that NAFTA (Free Trade) has not been a good thing for Americans who have to work for a living

*that Impeachment is not optional, our reps are SWORN to protect The Constitution and abide by International Treaties.

*that the USA should join the rest of the civilized World in banning Land Mines

*that the USA should join the rest of the civilized World in the International Criminal Court.

Who would deliver these TRUTHS if Dennis was gone? :shrug:

Dennis Kucinich is one of the very few reasons I am still a registered Democrat.

[bvar22]

59. Man, the 12% minority who don't like Kucinich....

...sure are LOUD, PERSISTENT, and OBNOXIOUS at DU.



"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone

[seabeyond]

62. or maybe they just stick out so much to you. you arent hearing all those

opposing them. i bet they think the other way

i dont get on the K threads, so not a part of this. but i do have my own issues and i have to continually tell myself the ones i hear are not indicative of the whole.

[Raine]

64. One of the few honest & real

Democrats in the party.

[emilyg]

73. Yes. +10

[Iggo]

65. I voted for him in the primary.

California. Voted DK and voted No on 8, and felt great about it.

DK was out of it by then but still on the ballot, and I didn't care if Clinton or Obama won. I was okay with either of those two and ready to support whichever one won.

DK's my man.

(EDIT: Now THAT's a cheerleader, Hugh...lol.)

[HughMoran]

82. Yep

& the other person said they would "assume they were wrong" if DK disagreed with them.

That's even worse than cheerleading!!

[burning rain]

66. Meh.

He makes a strong case against, and votes against, many of the things I dislike, but he's too much of an "aginner" for my taste. He's sort of a Jesse Helms of the left: like Helms for much of his career, Kucinich doesn't pass much legislation but takes high-profile and controversial stands that ultimately don't have much of an effect on policy, but serve to build his political constituency and machine. Bernie Sanders by contrast provides a good example for practical lefties--he can't get preferences like single payer through, but he does pass a lot of amendments.

[Fearless]

67. I preferred Kennedy... but heroes are so hard to come by these days...

:(

[Capn Sunshine]

68. I LOVE Dennis

a lot of people here misunderstand politics. I mean REALLY misunderstand things. I've been amember of the progressive caucus as long as its been in existence. That said, I'm a big fan of Dennis, and trust me, he's a very savvy politico, which of course DQs him with the purity brigade, but so what.

"Department of Peace" is brilliant. HE is brilliant.

Oh, and his wife is as smart as him. Don't mess with her.

[phasma ex machina]

69. Yep

:kick:

[BREMPRO]

71. used to like him and then i met him in person- funny anecdote

He came to a rally for Jean Hay Bright who was a progressive running against Snowe in the 06 Senate race (she was a very nice person and good on policy but inexperienced and was completely out of her league running against Snowe). So Kucinich was the special guest and keynote speaker at the event and i was excited to see him speak in person and meet him. He came with his wife and she was very charming but he seemed full of himself and a little phony with his hairsprayed shoe polish black dyed hair- his speech was about the war and other injustices and he raised his voice to an awkward overwrought crescendo of morally righteous indignation. The tone and content was not appropriate for the event which was supposed to be about supporting Hay Bright- it was all about him and save the world stuff. Then he comes to the point where he is going to introduce Hay Bright and he says something like : "and now to introduce the next Senator from the great state of Maine..." and he pauses for a moment, turns around to look at the banner with her name on it, and says "Jean Hay Bright"! He friken forgot her name!! real personal.

I also lost respect for him after he pursued the impeachment well after it made any political sense, when there was less than a year left. I'm all for prosecuting the bastards but impeachment at that point would have distracted us from more important issues and could have cost Dems elections IMHO. His single minded single payer crusade ignored evidence that there were equally important issues about cost controls in delivery and the fact that it was never politically possible to pass. His idealism is admirable, but he's not an effective politician at working with others or getting things done.

One thing in his support, he was the only politician of note to show up for the anti-Iraq war rally and march in Kennebunkport i went to- he gave the event more visibility and at least he walks the walk with the people. that he should be commended for. I don't know how they feel about him in his district- i can't imagine they are too happy about his focus only on national issues and his own national political ambitions.

[sandnsea]

72. Meh, I used to like him

But he's just as willing to sell progress down the river for ideology as the right is.

[Shagbark Hickory]

74. I May have spoke TOO SOON. I voted before this evening's episode of Hardballs.

...Where Dennis the menace uttered the same unclear poli-babble the rest of them are saying.
Either you're for the people or you're for the insurance companies. It's really that simple.

[BREMPRO]

75. how funny, I thought he actually was sensible for a change

the buy in on medicare for 55-64 is a huge victory if it passes, a significant step toward single payer. I've mostly complained that he's too much of an idealist, and now here he surprises me and understands the necessary compromise- and that the legislation being considered now is actually better than a weak public option. McCaskill also made sense especially regarding the cost savings from getting more insured and less using expensive emergency room services and she reflected the frustration with the extent of misinformation about this issue. There are proposals also to require private insurance to spend 90% on health care, and a provision for a trigger to kick in if they don't lower rates.

the perfect is the enemy of the good.

[Shagbark Hickory]

78. But it's not medicare! You have to pay for it and you can only get it if you don't have insurance.

It's lipstick on a pig.
They're only using this tactic to appeal to people who don't bother with the fine print.

[BREMPRO]

80. so you're saying having affordable single payer medicare availble to those without

insurance 55-64 is a bad thing? that is about 5 million currently unisured who could get insurance at about half the price of private insurance. The other provisions include a competitive non-profit private exchange modelled after a succesful plan in WA state. We have to see the CBO scoring and the fine print- which hasn't even been printed yet. At least wait till the final bill before the declaring defeat.

[Shagbark Hickory]

93. It's not an improvement over a public option which includes uninsured OF ALL AGES and wouldn't have

an 80/20 copay.

People seem to have selective memory about medicare.
Medicare (part B, is it?) only covers 80%. That means people can still easily go broke on medicare.
And you still have to qualify for this part of medicare. Not every medicare recipient does.

That's why there's a lot of private health denial companies selling supplemental medicare insurance.

Furthermore, medicare has a lot of waste fraud and abuse and that's not sustainable. It's going broke.
I realize that is a right wing talking point but in this case, it's reality.

Why settle for medicare (public option) that only covers people ages 55+, the highest risk pool, when there could be a public option that covers people of all ages, where if you want you can choose 100% coverage and the risk people is spread over all age groups to get the cost down.

There's plenty of people, myself included that will say a 50% discount on private insurance is still not affordable and it's questionable as to whether there really will be subsidies to help us. Subsidies are generally on available for those that are dirt poor.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

77. He's a trouble making non-conformist....we need a lot more like him.

In lieu of the bought and paid for stooges now infesting the capitol.

[gleaner]

79. Yes ....

The more I listen to him and watch is actions on various issues, the better I like him.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

81. Can't say never met the man.

[seabeyond]

88. his politics.... you know

i have a son like you. very literal. frustrating as hell, lol

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

89. I was just teasing you this time. My apologies, didn't mean to antogonize.

[seabeyond]

91. ya ya ya

:)

[saltpoint]

83. Yes. There's much to admire in him. Sadly though, he is at the

very far margins of influence in U.S. socio-politics.

A long argument can be had that that positioning is or is not Kucinich's fault.

But it is a very short argument regarding the influence he wields in the direction government takes.

Twice he has offered his candidacy to Democrats and twice he has been rejected by Democrats in overwhelming numbers.

That gauge is telling.

[gimama]

84. LOVE me some DK

REAL morals,ethics & values, compassion, logic.. Authenticity is SOO ..sexy!;)

[bluedigger]

85. Like? Or Like like?

DK is a good egg. And thoroughly unelectible as a national candidate. Too bad.

[TexasObserver]

86. I like Dennis, but I'm not "in like" with him.

He's one of many Democrats I generally favor.

[winyanstaz]

87. I admire him very much.

[Desertrose]

95. Yes....

Gotta admire his courage.