DU has jumped the shark

[liberal N proud]

Since January, this site has increasingly become abrasive and negative Obama and Democrats. It started out as just criticism and has escalated to anti Obama, Anti Democrats.

Now it is full court press against anything Democratic. Completely opposite what this site was originally set up to promote.

I ask all of you Obama/Democratic detractors who are posting all the negativity here tonight, what is your purpose here? Why are you posting on a Democratic discussion board?

I can think of one possibility? You all want Sarah Palin and a Republican controlled Congress in 2012. If that is not the reason, you are all sure working real hard to make just that happen.


:crazy:



[Flame away! I have my teflon underwear on!

[HuckleB]

1. I think you're spot on.

[marybourg]

2. It's full "court". nt.

[RevCheesehead]

3. ...

:popcorn:

[Taverner]

4. Well considering the hypocrisy of the Dems...

Starting with "Impeachment is off the table" and continuing with the escalation of Irafpak, and now with no PO, no medicare expansion, but yeah, you'll be required by law to buy insurance -

[spanone]

5. k&r

[glen123098]

6. Oh comeon, I havent seen one post that supports sarah palin

Thats just nonsense.

[Botany]

7. Please I worked my ass off for Obama and passing a bill that codifies ...

..... insurance company profits sucks.

[RevCheesehead]

11. I have news for you, Buddy...

your ass is still there. :evilgrin:

[KansasVoter]

8. I want a democratic president in 2012, 2016, 2020........

But I am still really disappointed in Obama on many points.

Is that OK with you????

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

45. I wanted one in 2008 n/t

[Captain Hilts]

9. The idea of not voting in 2010 or 2012 is mind boggling. But I think we need to focus

on getting better Democrats. Like Adm. Joe in Penn, for example.

[Matariki]

112. Exactly

and pretending that the present crew is doing a bang-up job and is somehow above criticism isn't going to help *anything*

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

10. It's the quaint notion that Democrats should hold public servants acoountable.

Even if they have a (D) plastered after their name.

[Blue-Jay]

12. When you start out as an oppositional site

it's hard to accept a supporting role in victory.

[HuckleB]

18. I think you're on to something.

And it may be that some of us simply feel more comfortable in the opposition role.

[liberal N proud]

67. That could be many peoples problem here

They simply have to oppose the man. They have been doing it for so long they can't help themselves.

[Starry Messenger]

13. Interesting perspective.

I see it as the total opposite. Since January this site has seemed to me in full court press against anything remotely considered liberal before our victory. Completely the opposite of what I felt the site was set up to promote.

I post here to keep reminding people what we once stood for.

[Itchinjim]

14. knr

[leeroysphitz]

15. In Soviet Russia the shark jumps DU! n/t

[Gabi Hayes]

16. gee...could it have to do with the fact that many here sincerely believe that this

has become a simulacrum of the previous adminstration in MANY substantive ways?

as Lizz Winstead once replied, on Politically Incorrect, to a wingnut who questioned her claimed non-partisanship by asking her if she'd ever voted for a republican in her life: "Sure. Bill Clinton."

that's the way a alot of leftish dems are feeling right now.

[robcon]

17. Why do we post negativity? Disappointment in our president.

That's why.

edit:spell

[joeunderdog]

79. "full court press against anything Democratic"

That's what we are upset at our President for doing. When is Obama gonna go Left on something?

What has C H A N G E ed?

[mike_c]

19. I'm here because I want Palin to be president....

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

I just wanted to see how it felt to type that. :rofl:

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Stinky The Clown]

20. You're on the wrong side of the Looking Glass, pallie

From where I stand, I see people in opposition tot he same sort of shit we've been through for the last decade and a half.

No one here wants Palin. That's such a stupid thing to say and makes you appear a fan and not a thinker. People who are voicing opposition want things to go to the left, not the right.

But you go on .... that nostril flaring thing is a nice touch.

By the way, I unrecced this and I will own that.

[Jamastiene]

21. Oh, ain't this rich.

lap dog

It must have taken you all day to come up with that OP.

Unrecced

[A HERETIC I AM]

22. The expression "jumped the shark" has jumped the shark. n/t

[phasma ex machina]

87. +1 nt

[endless october]

23. people are pissed off that healthcare got gutted.

and that the war got expanded. and that the patriot act got renewed.

you have to let people vent their frustration over these issues, as they are top issues for many of us.

and saying that because some of us are pissed off, we want a Republican controlled government? that is flat out fucking ridiculous.

[DainBramaged]

24. Been here since 2001 and if I want to be negative about this Administration, I'm gonna BE negative

and NO ONE is going to tell me different.

You can use the ignore feature if you think some of us should be in lockstep with you purists here.

[leeroysphitz]

25. LOL. DU is so full trolls that your thread can't get positive recs?

[Bucky]

26. I feel the same way, but I totally understand it.

They let themselves get backstabbed by Lieberman. They didn't make Obama a man to be feared. They underestimated the enemy. Someone in the insurance lobby got to Lieberman, reminded him who he works for, and ordered him to knife the Dems; so the little poodle did his trick.

We should be angry. The Senate Democrats don't fear us. The president doesn't fear us. No one in Washington fears the Democratic leadership.

They're still our best hope for serious healthcare reform, though that's unpopular to say now. But maybe we have to act like crazy motherfuckers--not here in DU but out in the streets--before we get this done. DU is just one of the places where people can get their crazy on. We're hurt and we're angry. Let the anti-Obama rhetoric vent out. He's got to win us back. In the long run I'm his, but right now he's acting like the grass roots Democrats don't matter.

Something has to change.

[KamaAina]

27. Teflon underwear ain't gonna help you

well, not here, anyway :evilgrin: because Teflon is nonstick, not flame resistant. :P

[Starry Messenger]

39. !!

Nice catch. :D

[we can do it]

62. Kevlar

[Ignis]

66. Are you mad?! Teflon sounds perfect!

:evilgrin:

[Lerkfish]

28. well, that's a wrong conclusion.

but thanks for the laugh. I was going to say DU has jumped the shark because people like you think its ok to give away the farm to the party we outnumber.

[liberal N proud]

61. I'm DONE!!! Democratic Party can go to hell for all I care on the DU front page

is the wrong conclusion.

That is the way to aid the GOP.

[malaise]

30. Spot on n/t

[kiva]

31. Misspellings and missing words aside,

your problem seems to be that you conflate criticism of Obama with criticism of the broader pool of Democrats - it's possible to disagree with the president but still agree with other Dems.

[liberal N proud]

64. Technically there were not actual misspellings

Just words misspelled as actual words.

But to the finer point, there is so much leaving the Democratic Party sentiment on this site right now and that is against the original intent of this site of promoting Democrats.

[kiva]

114. When you do not spell a word correctly, it's misspelled.

It doesn't matter if you spell it as another word, it is still not the word you intended to use. I'm not a perfect speller, nor do I possess flawless grammar skills, that's why I like edit.

As far as threatening to leave the Democratic Party...as I understand the rules, posters can say they are not voting for a Dem, but they cannot campaign for or urge others to support a candidate from another party.

[laughingliberal]

32. No, it is not a full court press against anything Democratic. It is a full court press against

those policies which some Democrats are advocating and voting for which are, decidedly, not progressive and 180 degrees from the 2008 party platform.

And that false dichotomy of "you must want Palin" would not make it in a high school debate class and it won't work here.

Fail

[WCGreen]

33. You see democrats are a feisty independent bunch...

In all my years working in and around the party, I can safely say that at no time did I ever see a party wide consensus on any issue.

If you want lock step blind obedience, try the GOP...

They are really good at that...

Well, until Sarah Palin came along and upset the applecart...

[WillyT]

34. New To Politics, Huh ???

:wtf:

[Richard D]

35. I think it's the democratic party that did the jumping

[bigwillq]

52. ..........

:thumbsup:

[we can do it]

36. Oh So We Should Just Be Happy bout Getting Screwed, I See

pass the valium, we're all happy here

[laughingliberal]

44. Well, as long as someone with a (D) after their name is doing it...

doesn't that feel better??

Isn't this kind of marching in lockstep with any fucking idea * came up with one of the things for which we criticized Republicans? Are we no better?

[Mnpaul]

97. Fred Phelps ran with a (D) behind his name

should we ban criticism of Fred Phelps

[laughingliberal]

108. God, I had forgotten that. But, a (D)'s a (D). Right?

:sarcasm:

[Luciferous]

107. +1

[EmeraldCityGrl]

37. Go use the fear tactics somewhere else.

Obama is losing me over his position on Afghanistan, but more dangerous is the war he's starting in Pakistan.

You will be eating those words in another couple months. If you want to continue voting against your own
best interests go for it, but don't tell the rest of us how to feel about what's taking place.

[liberal N proud]

59. You like seeing thread like this on the front page of DU

I'm DONE!!! Democratic Party can go to hell for all I care with 300+ recs?



That is one way to help secure a GOP victory in 2010 and 2012

[ima_sinnic]

80. hey, should we gloss over what the "Democrats" are doing then?

should we all pretend everything's fine and post fake messages about how great they're doing and how we can't wait to buy our federally mandated overpriced useless "health insurance"?
hey, where do I sign up? oh boy!!!1!!

that'll keep the GOP out of office in 2010 and 2012! YOU BETCHA11!

:rofl: :wtf:

[liberal N proud]

85. Only trying to point out radical divergence from the original intent of DU.

[ima_sinnic]

88. your "concern" is duly noted (nt)

[EmeraldCityGrl]

84. Don't you think threatening

at this point that unless I unconditionally support Everything Obama is doing
SP will be president, is NOT "jumping the shark?"

And why if you are not disturbed by some of the policies of late would you be
done with the Democratic Party? I would think you would be pleased.

We are not sheeple. We can agree to disagree. After everything we have been
through in the last few decades to not question and question early is just
plain stupid.

There are many qualities I love about Obama, but I'll never forget for a moment
what's happened in the past and most profoundly, power corrupts and absolute
power corrupts absolutely.

[sad sally]

113. Here's where I lost it today:

President Obama was talking to a group at a Virginia Home Depot, clearly explaining to them how and why energy saving ideas could create jobs (cash for caulkers). There was no ambiguity or confusion in what he was saying and then out came the famous Bush phrase, "In other words," and he reexplained in more folksy terms what he'd just said. Then there was some inside joke about insulation not being sexy - not sure why the reference to sex in relation to energy savings was necessary - guess you would have had to be there to get it.

Yeah, these are petty little things - continuing the occupation in Afghanistan and using secret mercenaries and not-so-secret drones in Pakistan that could get the US into War #3 are more likely to end up losing more of us.

[Windy]

38. Bravo!!! You are 100% correct!!!! If you don't BASH Obama, you are a traitor around here.

DU has become ugly, irrational, knee jerk and intellectually deficient.

[ima_sinnic]

83. you are free to be screwed over by the "change meister" and not complain about it

some of us choose to complain.

[No Passaran]

40. We are not robots. That's why liberals are and always will be the ones to bring about real changes

And here you are asking yourself why we are posting on this board and how this is not what the site was originally set up as. How do you know? I have 3 years on you here. I was here during the Patriot Act, authorization for the invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq. You have to hold people accountable

[elocs]

41. Wow! You stumbled upon the great, dark secret here.

In reality we do want Sarah Palin and a Republican controlled Congress is 2012. I can't wait for the movie to come out. Maybe Tom Hanks will play you. Cool. :bounce:

[liberal N proud]

58. Dividing the what little organization there is in a Democratic party sure helps the GOP

[KakistocracyHater]

that was the point of your post: to divide

Obama & too many of the Democrats have LEFT ME; a lot of people feel the same way, I'm sorry if that upsets you. Try posting something to unite us maybe.

[Popular Front]

42. Obama is our COMMANDER IN CHIEF

He is a Democrat, and he is our President. We owe the Commander in Chief our respect and loyalty, as he has earned it.

[bigwillq]

51. Hello.

Welcome to DU! :hi:

[Popular Front]

55. Thank you! n/t

[dgibby]

69. Unless you are a member of the Armed Services of the USA,

he is your President, not your CIC.

As for my respect and loyality, he has that as my President, but loyality and respect have nothing to do with disagreement re: policies.

[Generator]

43. That's funny because it seems like Obama and the "democrats"

have been abusive towards us. What exactly is the difference between a Republicon controlled congress and a Lieberman controlled senate? Will President Palin send more troops to Afghanistan or less? Will she kill universal health care that Obama has FOUGHT so darn hard for? We are working against Democrats. Bullshit. The "democrats" work with Republicons and against us. It's a rigged game.

[MisterP]

46. all right, tell us a policy that we're upset about, and then tell us why we're wrong

for starters:
% escalation in Afghanistan and Pakistan
% giveaways to banks instead of direct aid to homeowners
% appointing neoliberals
% taking single payer off the table despite its 60-70% popularity
% letting torturers and their enablers walk (and claiming that "it'll cause a civil war" will require additional proof beyond the mere existence of teabaggers)

[liberal N proud]

60. So you didn't get everything you asked for on Jan 21, 2009

So switch parties and see what you get from the GOP. Must have forgotten the last 8 years already.

[MisterP]

93. that wasn't an answer

people being slaughtered by drones, taxpayer money going to fund banks that are busy throwing people out of their homes, or to the ever-more-demanding insurance vampires (see the movie Daybreakers), insured people being bankrupted by bills, unemployment, and sabotaging the economy are major issues, and people actually care about them

anyone can tell people to shut up and be grateful that things aren't even worse (I mean, it's what we've been hearing for 8 years at family get-togethers)

[Odin2005]

47. The site is fracturing ideologically.

Marxists vs. Social Liberals vs. Left-Libertarians vs. Anarchists vs. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_liberalism">Classical Liberals.

It's sad. :( (I'm a Left-Libertarian, BTW.)

[bigwillq]

49. Why is it sad?

Go find a fan club site if you want a site where everyone agrees and is the same as everyone else.

[Odin2005]

54. people are viciously attacking each other rather than discussing how to create change.

[liberal N proud]

57. Exactly

All this crap I am seeing here today about I am leaving the party, Obama has lost my vote and so on does nothing but divide.


Thereby helping the republicans.

[Raster]

89. And your snarky sharky post is helping the healing?

:rofl:

[phasma ex machina]

92. +1 On a good day color me Classical Liberal, Anarchist otherwise. nt

[Odin2005]

116. *Odin points to his avatar*

:)

[phasma ex machina]

94. Deleted

[IntravenousDemilo]

48. I see it as a new and necessary phase in DU's evolution.

One that concerns itself with holding Democratic lawmakers' feet to the fire so they don't morph into Republicans any more than they already have. It's the same good fight as before, for democratic (as opposed to merely Democratic) ideals. The battle for rights, dignity, and human decency hasn't ended just because there's a Democrat in the White House and the party controls both houses. We have to be even more vigilant than before in keeping a respectable ideological distance between the two major parties.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

50. Moon bombings.

Consider, some of the craziest posts you're seeing that are anti-Obama/anti-Dem are from the same people who went nuts over the "moon bombing," or similar bits of irrationality (9-11 twoofers, etc.)

[A HERETIC I AM]

71. ....

:spray: :rofl:

[Parker CA]

53. K&R

[StarfarerBill]

56. Nope; just a full-court press against center-right surrender monkeys.

Why anyone thinks that a D after a pol's name entitles said pol to immunity from righteous anger and disgust is beyond me... Reagan's Syndrome is infecting some Democrats.

:banghead:

[Owl]

63. not worth commenting on.

[alcibiades_mystery]

65. They're going to make you a better person, by Gawd

Through dissent, son! Ain't you heard! It's being squelched and silenced the world over, and is surviving only by a thin thread and the heroic efforts of DU heroes!

[liberal N proud]

70. Must have been on FAUX

:rofl:

[alcibiades_mystery]

72. LOL

Indeed.

[Neecy]

68. lol

Now it is full court press against anything Democratic

Is escalating an occupation into a full-scale shootin' war "Democratic"?

Is murdering civilians in sovereign nations with whom we aren't at war with Predator drones "Democratic"?

Is handing a flood of taxpayer dollars without condition over to the bankers and oligarchs and sharks "Democratic"?

Is giving the back of your hand to the GLBT community "Democratic"?

Is continuing secrecy, spying, and data vacuuming "Democratic"?

Is forcing every citizen, by law, to purchase a product from an abusive, out of control industry "Democratic"?

None of these things - NONE of them - are "Democratic". Some are Republican, some neocon, some neoliberal, but NONE of them are even remotely "Democratic".

If anything, we're trying to save our party from becoming a Palin look-alike, so you can take your lectures and shove them right up your ass.

[aikoaiko]

73. This is still 100 times better than during the primaries.

my 2 cents.

[racaulk]

111. For real!

I couldn't agree more. That's a period of time on DU that I don't care to relive at any point in the foreseeable future, thank you very much. The tone around here now is still better than it was two years ago.

[Joe the Liberal]

74. Just because this site is called "Democratic Underground"......

doesn't mean we'll all fall in line behind anyone with a (D) next to their name.

"While the vast majority of our visitors are Democrats, this web site is not affiliated with the Democratic Party, nor do we claim to speak for the party as a whole." -from the "About DU" page

[bridgit]

75. Whoa, whoa, whoa: Democratic!? I thought DU was all about the wsws.org

smack-talk shit-talk & trying to get me medicated :cry: Oh well, go figure? http://www.wsws.org :shrug: Or more to the point *do* we learn something new everyday :dunce:

[Starry Messenger]

76. You asked what our purpose was.

Yet you are only talking to people who agree with you...hmm.

[liberal N proud]

81. Disagreeing and criticizing is different than what I have seen today

Take a look at the front page for example

Something about the Democratic party can go to hell

And another post stating that Obama should resign

One earlier was asking everyone to join the poster to leave the party with them.

We can and must disagree for Democracy to work, but this site was not set up to drive a wedge right down the middle of the progressive Democrats.

I was only trying to point out radical divergence from the original intent of DU.

[Starry Messenger]

86. And many of us have said that your understanding is different than ours.

Are you going to address that? If Democrats aren't acting like Democrats then yes, we are going to complain.

[baldguy]

77. You're logged into the wrong site.

Since it's the REPUBLICANS that don't tolerate criticism of their leaders & debate over their policies, or variance from the party line.

On the other hand, the Democratic Party usually encourages it's members to speak up & bring new ideas to the attention of the leadership. And to call out the leadership when it makes bad decisions.

[liberal N proud]

82. See the above reply

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7235535&mesg_id=7236229

[flvegan]

78. Oh, brother.

:eyes:

[muriel_volestrangler]

90. With a lack of leadership of the party, it's not surprising that Democrats don't all pull together

Looking in from another country, with a parliamentary system where there is one definite leader for a party, and MPs who step too far outside can be thrown out of the party (though not out of the Commons), I have earlier been thinking that some DUers could do with remebering that a 'party' means a collection of people taking each other's part - ie working together.

And on some issues, Obama has led, whether or not the majority of DUers have liked the direction, eg Afghanistan. But on healthcare, he, and Reid, just seem to have caved. This was a major part of the Democratic platform for the 2008 elections, and it's falling to pieces, because they aren't attacking Lieberman, or Republican senators in close 2010 elections. Where's the rhetoric like "Lieberman doesn't care about people dying, he's just interested in insurance profits!"? That's the kind of attack stuff that the Republicans used to stop the Democrats using a filibuster. Make them afraid they'll get hammered for letting people die, in 2010 adverts.

[Lyric]

91. Why do you assume that the problem is the angry people

and not the leaders who have done things (and failed to do other things) that are worthy of being angry about?

You're bitching about the fever instead of the sickness that causes it. Getting rid of the symptoms doesn't cure the disease. It just makes the end a little more comfortable. Frankly, I'd rather be uncomfortable and try to fix the underlying sickness than comfortably oblivious and dying, but hey, each to their own.

:shrug:

[arcadian]

95. What about "underground" don't you get?

Why don't you start Democraticaboveground.com, I'm sure it will go just swimmingly.

[thelordofhell]

96. Things haven't been the same since they dumped the DUzy

[Subdivisions]

98. Again? Well, fuck! n/t

[That Is Quite Enough]

99. I dunno. I think it's jumped the couch also. Not that that's really stopping me from posting. :p

The environment here isn't completely inhospitable to intelligent life. Yet.

[G_j]

100. whatever...

Most of us are discussing policy.

[zenprole]

101. Critics Need Not Apply...

..or is it Thinkers? After 30 years of Friedmanite kool-aid with the party a full and willing participant, why wouldn't people criticize? It's what some call a target-rich environment.

I don't buy the troll/Republican stalker/pro-Palin line, either. Maybe if the Democratic Party stood for and achieved something other than massive fundraising followed by post-election brutalization of the shrinking base, there wouldn't be grounds for criticism. Or there'd be much less and on the periphery.

Please filter your frowny face response for informed, principled criticism. Obama and the Party have earned every particle of vitriol that's been dumped on them. And we're not even into 2010, when the fun and national collapse really starts. Essential further reading is Dmitry Orlov's page, "The Collapse Gap" in specific.

[rucky]

102. Everything's Peachy!

[PVnRT]

103. Fuck off

Blah blah blah pony blah blah blah you want Sarah Palin blah blah blah

The only thing that has jumped the shark is you people that keep using the same old bullshit to silence anyone you disagree with.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

105. admirably efficient post n/t

[dorkulon]

104. Another one? How many sharks is that now?

[EFerrari]

106. PETA must have Skinner on their speed dial.

[Raster]

109. There have been so many sharks jumped at DU...

...we are now rivaling Shamu as captive marine act of the year!

[grahamhgreen]

110. WTF! It is the Obama who has abandoned the party who elected him! Come back BO!!!!

[foo_bar]

115. in an alternate dimension:

It's official Democratic Underground has jumped the shark

What has become of this website? I am seeing people defend Obama everywhere I look here and it's getting really disgusting.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5839067

[dusmcj]

117. I'm anti wannabe-progressive-doughball. How's that work for y'all ?

The mindlessly dogmatic ideological clownass stuff is taken care of by the GOP, we don't need to contribute.