How much extra money do you have each month for mandatory insurance?

[ZombieHorde]

AND then how much extra money do you have for your co-pay, which has no cap?

AND then if you get really really sick, and use up your annual allotment, how much extra money do you have for your entire medical bill plus the mandatory insurance which is no longer helping you with your medical bills?

I know I don't have a lot of money. Our "fun" money is about $200 a month for the four of us.

[Dr Fate]

1. I suppose that cash will go where my donations to the DNC & DCCC used to go.

Seems fair enough to me.

[sandnsea]

2. How much do people have with no coverage

If you get really really really sick and don't have insurance at all, how quick do you think that $200 a month will go then?

The House bill has no annual caps. We need to focus on what we are FOR and get people to advocate for those things. Opposing everything has not worked too well.

[ZombieHorde]

3. You are right about poor people being screwed with or without this bill,

but taking our last little bit of money only makes our situation worse.

"Opposing everything has not worked too well."

Straw man.

[sandnsea]

4. Medicaid will be expanded to 150% of poverty for everyone

People will have subsidies to help cover their premium. Have you needed to see the doctor the last few years and weren't able to go?? Or needed a cardiologist or other expensive treatment??

[ZombieHorde]

5. I have not been to a doctor in over 10 years.

"Medicaid will be expanded to 150% of poverty for everyone

This should help a lot of people, unless the poverty rate is lowered.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7229846

I wonder how much the middle class can afford each month.

[pnwmom]

9. Then you're an emergency room trip waiting to happen. n/t

[regnaD kciN]

8. I'm not sure that's a done deal...

It seems like the increase from 133% to 150% is on the chopping block right now.

[sandnsea]

24. These and subsidies are the most important issues

In my mind, they always have been. The bottom 60%, or so, cannot afford full health care premiums and never will be able to. These two issues are worth killing the bill over. That and the caps and pre-existing if they're going to keep the mandates.

[regnaD kciN]

6. It depends on how much you earn...

If you're a family of four, as you indicated, your "federal poverty level" is currently $22,050.

If you're earning less than 133% of that ($29,392), you'll be covered by Medicaid, so don't have to worry about paying for insurance.

Above that, you are supposed to buy insurance.

If you are making between $29,392 and $88,200, you'll get subsidies to help with paying for insurance. How much you'll be expected to pay varies with income level -- if, say, you make between $66,150 and $88,200, you'll be expected to pay 9.8% of your income, which works out to between $540 and $720 per month. If you make under $66,150 (and, judging by your $200/month left over, I would guess that you do), that percentage drops, although I don't have the numbers for each bracket.

BUT...under the current Senate bill, you are exempt from the mandate if there is no policy available with premiums at 8% of your gross income or less. So, say, you make $50,000. 8% of that is $333.33. If you can't find a policy that offers family coverage for $333.33 or less (and, count on it, you won't be able to), you are exempt from paying the penalties for not having coverage. There are also going to be some other hardship exemptions available, but they haven't been spelled out yet.

Bottom line: although I don't know your income or your budget, I strongly suspect that, if you only have $200/month extra after all the bills are paid, you are probably going to have to pay very little for insurance if you want it, and won't get penalized if you don't. (Note that this is under the current Senate bill -- the House bill has higher penalties and no exemption, and I keep hearing rumors that the House is likely to win out in conference on this issue. :-( ) But, if I'm wrong (say, you make $150,000 per year but still only have $200 left over per month), look on the bright side: the penalty would only be $187.50 per month, so you'd still have $12.50 left over. :sarcasm:

[pnwmom]

10. +1. n/t

[pnwmom]

11. dupe

[ZombieHorde]

22. I am glad to see some good news in your post.

"If you're earning less than 133% of that ($29,392), you'll be covered by Medicaid, so don't have to worry about paying for insurance." = Good news.

"BUT...under the current Senate bill, you are exempt from the mandate if there is no policy available with premiums at 8% of your gross income or less." = Good news

I feel a little bit better, lets hope these aspects are not removed.

[Heywood J]

25. I can only imagine the difference that makes for so many people

if, say, you make between $66,150 and $88,200, you'll be expected to pay 9.8% of your income, which works out to between $540 and $720 per month.

If you're living in any sizable city and trying to own a house or condo, that's a hell of a lot of money coming out of someone's pocket. Especially considering you're paying 9.8% of your pre-tax income, it seems. I have no idea how they intend to implement this and have any sort of economy left over that doesn't rely solely on the top 1%.

[pnwmom]

7. You mean after making the payments on the house, the cabin, the Mercedes,

and the Lexus? I don't want to even think about it!

:sarcasm:

The point isn't how much money you have left over at the end of the month; it's how much you start with and what your priorities are.

Without insurance, how much money do you have available for that unexpected trip to the emergency room? That unexpected week in a hospital?

[regnaD kciN]

12. Irrelevant straw-man...

It really doesn't matter, if you can't afford insurance anyway.

I don't know the OP's financial situation; but there are going to be people who fall through the cracks; who will have just a bit too much for subsidies but too much in terms of living expenses (for example, those carrying mountains of credit card debt for previous medical care incurred when they were a victim of "recission" by their previous insurance company when they got sick) to allow them to meet any policy's premiums, period. If they get sick, they're screwed either way -- the difference would be, under the mandate system, even if they didn't get sick, they'd still get screwed, by penalties for not having coverage.

That's why I'm a bit allergic to those who use the "but this bill will save 22,000 lives a year -- how can you be against it?" gambit. If it was a bill that raised taxes so that 22,000 more lower-income people could be fully covered, I wouldn't mind paying the extra tab. But this bill does nothing to "save 22,000 lives." It merely requires that those 22,000 people purchase insurance, and gives them subsidies that may or may not be sufficient to allow them to purchase insurance (which might only cover 60% of their medical expenses anyway), and penalizes those for whom the subsidies aren't sufficient. Big difference.

[pnwmom]

14. It does matter if the reason you can't "afford" insurance is that

you're choosing to spend it on vacations or new cars instead.

I agree that probably isn't the case with the poster, but there are people who do live that way, especially younger childless professionals.

[regnaD kciN]

15. There are a lot more people who, as I indicated...

...won't be able to afford insurance because of huge credit-card bills (often from prior medical costs, divorce, or an extended period of unemployment rather than extravagant spending). I have no idea whether there will be an exemption for such situations.

And, no, I'm pretty sure that the reason the OP only has $200/month free isn't that they're blowing the rest of it on luxuries.

[ZombieHorde]

13. Lets say I got insurance for $200 a month, and then I went to the hospitial and

came out with a $1500 bill, with a co-pay of $500.

Without insurance, I can pay $200 per month and pay off my bill in 3+ months, depending on interest.

With insurance, my bill is $1000 less, but I have no money left over for the co-pay.

[regnaD kciN]

16. Your math doesn't work out...

If you had a $1,500 bill from the hospital, you'd need eight months or more to pay it off, not three.

Besides, I think the problem would be more if you went to the hospital and came out with a final bill of $15,000 (or even $150,000), not $1,500. Believe me, even a short hospital stay will likely run into five figures.

[ZombieHorde]

18. Yea, I realized I used the $500 number instead of the $1500 number

when I was getting into bed and thinking about the HCR bill.

I should not post right before bed, or right after waking (which I am doing now).

Either way, I think my point still holds. If someone has to spend all of their extra money on insurance, they will not have any money left for the co-payment.

[regnaD kciN]

17. I call foul on your "debating" technique...

You posted one thing, I responded to it, then you went back and changed the post I responded to to say something totally different than what I was responding to.

I've never seen that technique used before on DU. I thought people here had more integrity than that.

If you're not interested in honest give-and-take, I'm not interested in continuing your game-playing.

[L0oniX]

19. 0$

[calico1]

20. Well I guess they better start building more

prisons because a lot of us will have to end up there.

[kenny blankenship]

21. As your accountant, I would advise you to set a little aside every month - for your FINE

and other legal expenses.

[ZombieHorde]

23. I think I actually may be on medicaid, I am a student, so my income is low. nt