Christian Scientists Seek Prayer Provision in Health Care Bill

[Kadie]

Christian Scientists seek prayer provision
Victoria Colliver, Chronicle Staff Writer

Friday, December 18, 2009


If the final version of the health care legislation being hammered out in Congress requires all Americans to carry health insurance, Susan Breuer thinks it's only fair that the new law cover those who rely on her form of medical treatment: prayer.

" 'Why' isn't the question," Breuer said. It's "Why are we excluding it?"

A lifelong Christian Scientist, Breuer of San Mateo is a full-time practitioner, meaning she provides prayer professionally for the purposes of healing. Breuer was trained by a church-sanctioned teacher and is paid by those who come to her for healing.

With time running short for Congress to pass a health care bill by Christmas, Christian Scientists are lobbying lawmakers to include a provision that would ban discrimination against "religious and spiritual" health care and encourage private insurers to cover prayer as medical treatment.

Such a provision was passed by committees in both the House and the Senate this year, but was stripped from the House bill as well as the current version being debated in the Senate. But Christian Scientists are hoping they can still get the measure reinserted into the Senate bill, and ultimately locked into the final legislation.

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/12/18/MNTL1B607U.DTL#ixzz0a4dkajFH

[YOY]

1. I was hoping for the Onion.

n/t

[GreenPartyVoter]

2. It's one thing to pray over an illness. It's another thing to _only_ pray over it and seek no

relevant medical help. I hate hearing about people, especially children, who die from lack of health care simply because of doctrine.

Suffer the little children, indeed.

[T Wolf]

3. Shouldn't we also include voodoo, snake-handlers, and other imaginary medicines?

Honestly, if this is in and womens' health care is not...

[jmowreader]

30. Voodoo combines spiritual healing with herbalism

There's nothing imaginary about vodou healing--herbalism works.

[lukasahero]

4. Oh FFS

No wonder this country is falling apart - it's filled with morans.

[jxnmsdemguy65]

43. Interestingly enough,

Ted Kennedy was a champion of the Boston-based Christian Science church, getting much of its medical exemption legislation through Congress....

[AngryAmish]

5. If chiropractic is covered I don't see why this should not be

Same amount of evidence that either works.

[T Wolf]

18. Not by a long shot. Chiropractic actually involves knowledge and physical intervention.

Praying to an imaginary being may have a minimal benefit IF the patient believes in it (the power of the mind, and all), but to only rely on "prayer" is downright ignorant and, as held by legal precedent, against the law.

[Warpy]

21. Chiropractic shortens the acute phase of a back injury

considerably, as proven some years ago. So part of that one actually works.

However, peer reviewed studies have shown that prayer is actually detrimental, at least to heart patients. There is no way the practice should be paid for by taxpayers.

Religious people love to get tax money for the stuff they claim to be doing for gawd.

[stopbush]

24. There is scientific evidence that chiropractic works to relieve lower back pain.

There's no evidence for a lot of the other stuff chiropractors claim.

So, there is evidence to support chiropractic in certain situations.

Prayer - on the other hand - has been shown to have a NEGATIVE effect in people recovering from medical procedures. What effect it has in curing diseases is, well, none.

[jmowreader]

32. If used properly, chiropractic is good

Some of these guys will tell you chiropractic can cure every disease in the world just by manipulating the spine. These people can be discounted.

My dad wouldn't be able to walk today were it not for chiropractic, though. About once a month we'd have to carry him to the chiropractor--he wouldn't be able to walk to the car, much less into the clinic. When he'd leave he was fine.

[AngryAmish]

correllation is not causation

[jmowreader]

40. IOW...

that he couldn't walk before he went in to the chiro, but could after he left, is proof chiropractic doesn't help with skeletal problems? Strange.

I think chiro, when used in the right way, is fine. It's like anything else. You wouldn't go to a proctologist to have a brain tumor treated...well, Republicans suffering from rectocranial inversion might, but you're not one of them.

OTOH, one Bartlett Joseph Palmer, the son of chiro's founder, claimed chiropractic could treat scurvy, malaria, gonorrhea and epilepsy. Those things it CAN'T treat.

[Kadie]

46. Going to a chiropractor really helped my back,

but I would not go to him for any other type of ailment. I met one chiropractor years back that wanted me to call him before I ever called my regular doctor. I haven't been back to him since.

[fascisthunter]

6. Go F*ck yourselves you fanatics!

[Sebastian Doyle]

7. I don't have a problem with this

If it helps illustrate how GOD DAMNED RIDICULOUS (pardon the pun) the corporate mandates are, then praise Jesus and pass the prayer book! O8)

[HuckleB]

16. Say what?

Apple meet orange.

[Sebastian Doyle]

25. Not at all

Read the excerpt from the article again. This woman is saying that Christian Scientists should be exempt from the forced corporate mandates because they do not see doctors, they pray for healing.

Whether or not you think their religious beliefs (and avoidance of medical care - even those who CAN afford it) are crazy isn't relevant. It's an issue of someone being forced to pay a corporation, and in this case, someone being forced to pay a corporation for something they would not use.

[HuckleB]

28. Unless the Christian Scientists were planning to become tax resistors...

... under a single-payer system, they're purely hypocritical.

Take a look at the variety of systems in place in Europe. Do they, or do they not have mandates?

[Sebastian Doyle]

31. Even the "worst" of the European systems has something the US doesn't have

The countries where any level of privatization is allowed have laws on the books that prohibit insurance companies from being "for profit" business, and they are tightly regulated.

I'd say the odds of that happening in the current corporatist damaged political environment in this country are less likely than Max Baucus and Joe Lieberman becoming born again single payer advocates by tomorrow.

The insurance corporations ARE the problem. Forcing people to pay them is NOT the solution. And if the religiously deluded can help illustrate that reality, more power to them.

[HuckleB]

34. And you think every system in Europe was developed all at once?

At this point, the religiously deluded are helping to show that opposing this bill blindly is not helping anyone.

Also, can you link me to some evidence that no insurance company in Europe can make a profit?

[Ikonoklast]

8. Nothing stopping them from praying all they want right now.

Just don't expect anyone else to pay for it.

[MineralMan]

9. Homeopathy and crystal healing must be covered!

Laying on of hands, too, and chakra healing, too.

Think of all the idle dreamers who would be employed. A quick course down at the local metaphysical shop or on the web will take care of the training and you're ready to hang out your shingle.

I'm going to start my course of study today, then demand access to local hospitals for my homeochakric healing techniques. Yessiree.

[HuckleB]

13. Oh, ye of little faith.

;)

[MineralMan]

19. I gots lotsa faith. I have faith that I can turn this into some bucks.

I just registered www.homeochakrictherapiesinc.com and my website will be up soon. Just think, a few bottles of evian and some colored stones to wave over it and I'm golden. For the high-potency remedies, you have to actually dunk the stones in the water, lest it forget what water it is.

Cancer? No problem. For the low introductory price of $200, you get 6 drachms of diamant refractory solution. This miracle remedy is prepared by shining a strong light onto my wife's sacred ring. The refractions of multi-colored light enter the water and cover all Chakras.

I have homeochakric remedies for every damn thing. Save your medical budget. Covered by all major insurance, including the Public Option.

I'll be rich and I guarantee that the patients will be no worse off for my therapies.

[HuckleB]

29. Don't forget the warning labels, however.

"Do not eat the colored stones."

[MineralMan]

33. No, no...I keep the stones. Are you kidding.

Mostly, I just wave them over the bottles of Evian before transferring the water with the memory into tiny little bottles. For the high-potency remedies, I dip the stones in the water. The only exception is the one I mentioned, where I get some colored light from a diamond into the water.

THE WATER REMEMBERS!

The dose is 1 minim. A 6 drachm bottle will last for a year. At $200, it's a bargain. You won't find that kind of value at the local Urgent Care Clinic, and the stuff can't do you any harm, so it might do some good.

This will be a goldmine! Taking in those government checks, and I don't have to see the patient more than once. After a year, they'll either be better or dead. Either way.

[HuckleB]

35. What if I let my goldfish swim in it?

Will they live forever?

[MineralMan]

36. As long as you don't overfeed them.

But, it's impossible not to overfeed them, so they will surely die. I am so sorry.

[HuckleB]

37. Who's feeding them?

Hmmm. Maybe that's the problem.

[MineralMan]

39. Hmm...it's a fine line. However, goldfish are quite inexpensive, and

look very much alike. Some find that a series of them works well. This technique works especially well if children consider the goldfish a pet. They'll never know.

Whatever you do, though, do not release goldfish into a local pond or lake. I hate catching goldfish when I go fishing. For some reason, those cute little fish grow into mud roiling monsters when released. They lose their pretty color and they don't taste all that good, although common carp are good to eat.

[HuckleB]

10. What sort of malpractic insurance to "prayer doctors" need to carry?

[Ghost in the Machine]

44. Malpractice?? No way! It was an Act of God if something went wrong..

Acts of God aren't covered under malpractice insurance... maybe God just didn't *like* the person who wasn't healed and/or died...

Jeese Louise! Don't you heathens know ANYTHING!?!?!elevens!!??


:rofl: :hi:

[hughee99]

11. When did praying become a "for profit" business?

I remeber the good old days when anyone could pray to any "higher power" they wanted, free of charge. I didn't realize that there was a "skill" to praying. I wonder if deities have special prayer queues for prayers submitted by professionals, like some motor vehicle registries have special windows for car dealerships and businesses that do a lot of business there.

[MineralMan]

12. I give you Oral Roberts.

[hughee99]

20. Good point. n/t

[T Wolf]

22. Prayer and religion HAS ALWAYS been a "for profit" business. nt

[frebrd]

27. Fifty-seven years ago my father was a CS practitioner.......

praying for profit (not sure how much profit there was in it). Would have been embarrassing as hell, except that I had already left home (and never went back).

Edited for spelling.

[wryter2000]

14. Maybe they want to be paid for praying

Okay, this is now officially a farce. Time to shut this turkey of a bill down.

[Mari333]

15. okayyy!! It is now officially a circus

SEND IN THE CLOWNS

[stopbush]

17. Kerry, Teddy and Hatch were the main Senate supporters of this stupid provision.

How many of you posting realize that?

[T Wolf]

23. AS part of the horse-trading that fucks up every piece of legislation that Congress

considers.

[The River]

38. Well Known

actually. The "Mother" church is located in Boston.
Any political power the church has comes through Mass. politicians.

As someone raised in that "religion" it is very "new age" except for the
faith healing BS. Part mindfulness meditation, part positive thinking,
part mind over matter and no thou-shall-not "rules", ceremony, or clergy.
You have to hire a Justice of the Peace if you want a church wedding; there's
no one in the church with that authority.

The church is dying out because of the "NO Doctors" rule
and they damn well know it but refuse to change.
I dumped it 45 years ago.

[blueberrypickn]

26. I wanna get PAID TO PRAY!!

gimme a break...

if some folks want actual healthcare, far be it for somebody else to miss out on their ca$hcow opportunity for faith-healing.

Sure, one can have a belief in the power of prayer... I simply don't believe in the power of payout opportunity.

[DailyGrind51]

41. Who charges for prayer? If you want to pray, pray, but do it for free!

[BlueIdaho]

42. Wait till Lieberman gets ahold of this one...

[rucky]

45. This would certainly cut costs.

eh, why the hell not? Anybody else want to throw anything in the bill?