Nelson on now. Bill will go to a very limited conference with the House

[laughingliberal]

and any material changes will result in my voting against cloture on the final bill. There goes that White House assurance they would try to push the bill a little left in the conference. Now, a very limited conference. We're gonna get ping-ponged.

[still_one]

Its going to pass. The WH/Dems, right or wrong, believe less damage both politically

and for HCR in general is better with the passage of it

In the course of time we will need to see if that is true

They are counting on independents and moderates, not liberals obviously

[Laelth]

3. I think the WH is desperately, terribly WRONG about this.

I think this bill will do a lot of damage to the Democratic Party, and the paltry reforms we will get from it are not worth it.

Kill the bill.

Forcing people to buy insurance is no more the answer to a failed health care system than forcing people to buy houses is the solution to homelessness.

:dem:

-Laelth

[Thickasabrick]

4. Agree - the republicans will run on killing the mandates - we will

be screwed for decades.

[still_one]

5. I tend to agree, unless they believe they can change it before it becomes fully active in 2014

Why else would the progressives and liberals in the Senate vote for it?

[Laelth]

7. They want to be good soldiers. They want to be good team players.

They want to support the President, and they don't want to face Rahm's ire.

Those are the principal reasons, I think.

:dem:

-Laelth

[TorchTheWitch]

8. they want campaign money

they want to get re-elected, and they want to keep whatever chairmanships they have or get a chairmanship. Everything comes down to their own personal careers.

[laughingliberal]

9. I think that's it, entirely

I think we have some progressives in the House and Senate who are right on in their philosophies. In the end, they have to protect their political survival. Will be interesting to watch which Dems announce retirements before the 2010 elections.

[atreides1]

1. We're not going to get ping-ponged

We're going to get screwed, and they won't even kiss us first!

[AlinPA]

2. Lieberman will stop cloture. He needs to show more of his power.

[still_one]

6. No he won't, he succeeded in what the insurance companies want /nt