Ending Medicare Advantage will make obtaining primary care and preventive

[JDPriestly]

care more difficult and more expensive for many seniors.

Reducing the amounts paid to Medicare Advantage plans may be feasible, but lots of seniors will simply avoid having tests done and seeking medical care if they don't have Medicare Advantage.

Medicare Part A which is "free" to seniors only covers hospital expenses (and not all of those).

Seniors $110.00 or more per month for Medicare Part B which covers doctors' visits, etc. But there are still big gaps, so wealthier seniors by supplemental insurance which is expensive. I know a woman who pays about $360.00 per month for that. Many pension plans provide it, and some can afford it. But most seniors, especially working class seniors these days cannot afford that. The government will help the very poor, but if you were poor all your life but pinched your pennies to save a little for retirement, you will pay through the nose.

This health care bill sucks for seniors.

I'm aware of this because I'm one of the seniors who will be negatively affected. But this is not just a personal concern.

Does Obama seriously think he is going to be well received in the 2010 election after signing a bill that cuts the Medicare benefits of seniors?

High unemployment and cuts to seniors' Medicare benefits: not a recipe for success.

I checked on the Green Party website and it is not an alternative for me. I'm beginning to ask myself whether I should bother to vote at all.

[Thickasabrick]

1. That is all my 85 year old mother harped on last week. She is

livid.

[maryinthemorn]

4. my 82 mom is in the same boat is not happy with the Democrats

[BzaDem]

2. This is ridiculous spin.

No one is ending Medicare Advantage. Right now, private insurers are getting paid ~15% MORE than it costs Medicare to provide for the same guaranteed benefits. The "cuts" to Medicare Advantage simply tell private insurers: if you want to get huge subsidies from Medicare, you better be able to cover the benefits with the SAME costs as the government does.

[jwirr]

27. Absolutely, I was very satisfied with Medicare before boosh & co.

made all the private insurance changes. I unlike them want to go back.

[Greyhound]

46. But where is the Democratic proposal to simply undo that crime?

*crickets*

As usual.
:eyes:

[laughingliberal]

3. Medicare Advantage programs serve a need. However, they make a healthy profit up and above the

subsidies they are given by the government. They are one step in the direction of privatization of Medicare and I was in favor of ending their subsidy. However, we seem to just be channeling the money to private industry through other routes, now so it won't help and it will piss off the people who use these programs.

[JDPriestly]

30. Precisely. I did not mind having my benefits cut if the insurance

company profits were going to be cut in other ways. Cutting Medicare Advantage will hurt seniors because the insurance companies will continue to offer the plans but charge more.

I have the Kaiser Medicare Advantage plan. It is an HMO, the simplest coverage and the least expensive. When the report criticizing Medicare Advantage plans was published, Kaiser's plan was not included among the plans reviewed. Personally, I think that was because Kaiser's plan is good value for everyone involved. Kaiser cuts costs any way it can. I think it is doctor owned but I might be wrong about that.

The health care "reform" as the Congress and the president want it is not worth the paper it is written on. I was a huge supporter. I now am a huge critic.

[Cleita]

5. Medicare Advantage could be replaced with full coverage under

Medicare so there would be no need for the insurance companies to be funneling Medicare money to their profits. It would be cheaper too. Also Medicare Part D could be put under Medicare administration and not the insurance companies giving it the advantage of being able to bargain for prices like the VA does. I'm all for dumping Medicare Advantage plans. They suck and the doctors hate them. Most of them won't take it so that only the bottom feeder, pill pushers doctors are the ones who see those patients and it's not fair to seniors.

[inna]

14. "Full coverage under Medicare" - exactly! nt

[sandnsea]

6. When introduced, this was a give-away to insurance

When the right complained about Medicare Advantage cuts, it was called bullshit spin.

Now it's being used against Obama and the health care bill??

:rofl:

[Thickasabrick]

7. Why do so many seniors like it? I didn't know enough about it to

argue with my Mom....so I just listened to her bitch and nodded my head.

[Cleita]

10. They haven't been double-crossed yet.

When that happens and they get stuck with a bill Medicare would have paid for and find out that they signed away all their traditional Medicare coverage, then they wake up. It happened to my husband.

Also, they don't know they aren't getting the best doctors. One of mine actually has a sign up in his waiting room that says he will only take traditional Medicare. He is one of the best doctors in my locality for his specialty, but he won't accept any Medicare Advantage and many other HMOs as well.

[Yupster]

12. One problem is how many times did you hear the President say

if you are happy with the insuarnce you currently have, you will not have to change it.

Now what?

[sandnsea]

22. They aren't cutting Medicare Advantage

They're changing the way private insurance is paid.

Isn't it funny that it's okay to support private insurance when it helps the left make their case, even though they're making their case with the exact same lies the right have been telling all year.

[sandnsea]

21. Because their evil insurance company

that administers their particular Medicare Advantage program - works for them. Just like the BC/BS that administers my state pre-existing insurance pool, works for me.

They aren't cutting Medicare Advantage. They're cutting some of the monies that goes to the insurance companies that doesn't enhance the program. The right wing spin is that they're cutting Medicare and/or taking away Medicare Advantage. When people call themselves the left, but have to use right wing spin to advance their cause, they need to do a reality check.

[JDPriestly]

33. Who do you think is going to pay for the cuts in the Medicare Advantage?

Do you really think that the insurance companies will accept receiving less? No. They will raise their prices for seniors. Many seniors who receive often less than $1000 per month or just a little more than $1000 per month for Social Security will be without the supplemental insurance that covers non-hospital, doctor's visit costs.

Those who will suffer most are people who have very low monthly incomes but some (though not a lot of) savings. They will be expected to spend down their savings on the health insurance premiums before they can be eligible for Medicare/Medicaid.

Besides, how do you think seniors will feel? Many of the younger people, those 65 or about to become 65, have paid into Medicare most of their working lives, and now they see benefits cut. It would be different if payments to health insurance corporations were being cut across the board. But it appears that the only cuts in this bill are to Medicare and Medicare Advantage. There are no other effective cuts.

As Matt Taibi pointed out in the discussion with Bill Moyers, the limits on the percentages of premiums that may be taken in profits is very easily gamed. So, the only meaningful cuts will be the Medicare cuts. This makes Obama and the Democrats look like the anti-senior party.

I cannot understand why Obama and Rahm Emmanuel and the Democrats in Congress want to go into the 2010 election with seniors furious at them. Seniors vote, and they vote their interests.

I remember talking to an elderly woman in Ohio in November 2008 who said she was undecided about who she would vote for. Her pension or the unborn babies?

Obama did not just win because of his popularity among the young. Some of the independents and Republicans who voted for him were seniors. This bill will not be forgiven.

[jwirr]

29. I can tell you that from my own experience. The insurance company

that provided Medicare D convinced me that "then I would not have all the worry about what was covered" - they are great sales persons. And they do give me what I need but I got that before with Medicare.

One thing that I absolutely hate about these insurance companies is all the paper they mail to us. Books and books of stuff none of us read because we do not understand it anyhow. They have stranded us in the cereal aisle looking for a healthy cereal when our eyes are too bad to read the fine print.

To me this is a nightmare of misinformation and misunderstanding and I am not only choosing for myself but my severely disabled daughter.

[JDPriestly]

31. Kaiser reminds me if I need to have a test. They provide

ongoing supervision of my health care. I think the co-pays and prescription co-pays might be a little cheaper. From my point of view, the difference is that I am assigned a doctor at Kaiser, and Kaiser pretty much looks after me. Kaiser not only has primary care but also a hospital and specialists who work at the hospital.

I believe that the doctors work on salary. They are under a lot of pressure to see a lot of patients and not to spend too long with each one, but they are supported by excellent staff including nurse practitioners.

Some years ago, I fell and had some injuries that were difficult to deal with. Nothing really serious. My Kaiser doctors were just wonderful. I could hardly believe it. I don't think the regular Medicare would fit very well with the Kaiser system. I would not like to lose my Kaiser care.

I don't know how Medicare Advantage works with other insurers.

[IndianaGreen]

8. Seniors vote in great numbers

and they are going to be pissed!

[grasswire]

9. consider medigap then

coverage is much better with medigap. Insurers can't cheat ya with medigap.

[JDPriestly]

34. Medigap insurance is more expensive to seniors than Medicare Advantage.

That's my understanding.

Also, in L.A. a lot of doctors won't accept Medicare because they don't like the rates. It is very expensive to live in L.A.

[frazzled]

11. Medicare supplement plans and Medicare Advantage are NOT the same thing

Medicare Advantage is private insurance you purchase INSTEAD of Medicare. If you get Medicare Advantage you are disenrolled from regular Medicare. It was a (Republican) "experiment" to allow private insurers to "compete" against Medicare to bring costs down. It was a failure in that regard, and we are paying HUGE subsidies to these private insurers.

What you are saying is a bullshit right wing talking point. The progressive position is to stop paying these subsidies to private insurers to provide an alternative medicare plan, when they do nothing to improve health or costs.

Get the facts straight before complaining, and please explain it to your parents. They will still have Medicare and still have the option to purchase any Medigap supplemental insurance they want.

[Cleita]

15. You know what I wish for? I wish I could buy into Medicare Part E.

(Doesn't exist, but could). This would be a medigap insurance run by Medicare. I'll bet they could do it for half of what I'm paying now. Then I would have full coverage. After what Secure Horizons did to my husband, I refuse to be forced into a Medicare Advantage program and I really hate having to pay private insurers for medigap.

[lib_wit_it]

17. Exactly! Problem is, as usual, these plans were sold in a misleading fashion and so many of us

bought into it. I am a fairly well-informed and intelligent person, but i just can't keep up with every detail of every political and financial decision I have to make, and that's been done for a reason. All the spin from both sides is hard to unravel and it is all for someone politico or profiteer's gain and to our disadvantage.

So, what's new?

[AlinPA]

19. Thank you. Good explanation, frazzled. Plus that $360 # is very high.

[JDPriestly]

36. My mother pays $360 for her Medicare supplemental.

Sorry, that's the price.

[JDPriestly]

35. I have Medicare Advantage. My mother has Medicare supplemental.

Her insurance is 3 times the cost of mine and not as good. The lie is that Medicare Advantage (at least Kaiser's) is not worth what it costs. My Medicare Advantage is better than my mother's more expensive Medicare supplemental.

[dysfunctional press]

13. i'm 48 and disabled, on medicare- but NOBODY will sell me supplemental coverage...

for the 20% that medicare doesn't cover- and there's no requirement for them to do so.

my solution- i simply don't pay that 20% to anyone. they have to settle for whatever medicare pays them.

[chandler2]

16. Read my lips: Obama candy will prevent most defections...

Right after the Holidays and maybe even before the State of the Union address, O will toss out some candy to seniors. Probably that
$250 O check that was in the news recently. Then, during the speech itself, he'll hint about some other candy for liberals and
they'll promptly eat it, wash it down with some Kool aid, and fall into line before the Fall elections.

As Frank Rich noted in today's NYT, Americans are suckers.

[JDPriestly]

37. The $250 isn't going to help much when the cost of

Medicare Part B that is Medicare Advantage and Medicare supplemental insurance goes up. The increase could be quite high, and the $250.00 won't cover it at all. Seniors are much harder to fool than many younger people. Seniors have the time and have to count every penny.

[AlinPA]

18. Medicare part B is $96.40/month. Supplemental plans like Highmark Security Blue

can be bought for far less than $360, more like $150-185 (that is SW PA).

[Cleita]

26. What if we had a choice for a Medicare part E a medigap policy operated by

Medicare that would cost an extra $20 a month. It could be done.

[JDPriestly]

38. I would still want Kaiser.

The problem with a strictly Medicare plan in L.A. is that you would have to find a doctor who would accept your plan. And that is not easy.

[babylonsister]

20. I don't know if this will provide any comfort, but

Karen Tumulty has been following this reform for awhile.

http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/12/19/putting-some-of-the-reform-back-into-health-reform/

snip//

Reid's earlier version would not have allowed the board to act unless Medicare spending grew faster than overall health care spending--something that pretty much doesn't happen these days. The new version is signficantly stronger, thanks in no small part to pressure from the Obama White House and a group of reform-minded freshman Senators. It would trigger action from the board if growth in health care spending exceeds that of Medicare spending, which is pretty much guaranteed to be the case.

All of that sounds pretty technical, but getting the details right is the difference between a health care bill that will work and one that won't, economists say. And many experts have been worried about the direction the bill appeared to be headed.

Read more: http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/12/19/putting-some-of-the-reform-back-into-health-reform/#ixzz0aGk4Y5Te

[JDPriestly]

39. This confirms the fact that the primary purpose of this bill is to

lower the money going to Medicare. The only costs to be saved are related to Medicare. And the Medicare commission idea is absolutely ominous. Seniors, I among them, will not like this bill.

I will not vote Republican. Unless the direction in D.C. changes, I will just not vote. And for someone as politically active as I am, that is huge. I cannot vote for candidates who do not stand up for my interests.

Seniors are the most vulnerable demographic in our population.

Even children are better off. Most of them have parents to look out for them. Many, many seniors have absolutely no one on their side. And the Obama administration and Congress are proving not to be on the side of seniors.

[donco]

23. I have Medicare advantage now (Coventry),

it covers limited dental (which Medicare doesn’t) my drugs (part D) my gym membership (24 hour fitness) which Medicare doesn’t. The downside as I see it is that it is only available in the largest metro areas. In other words it discriminates against a large portion of the population.

When I didn’t have it (Medicare Advantage) I had to pay separate insurance carriers for the supplement, dental, and drug coverage. That came to more than the $63 dollars that I now pay for the combined coverage and that is not including the gym.

Just joined the 2010 plan,(Mercy) dropped Coventry for another plan but saved $50 dollars by doing so. With the new plan I still have the combined drug coverage but sadly had to kiss the gym membership and the dental goodbye.

[JDPriestly]

40. I think I pay $115 extra each month for Kaiser Medicare Advantage.

I don't get a gym membership and pay $20 on top of that for optical and dental coverage. My dental coverage is pretty worthless. The optical coverage is only valuable to me because I have very poor vision. It would be useless for most people.

The supplemental plans are much more expensive. True, the Advantage plans mostly help Americans living in cities. But that is reasonable. My mother lives in a small town. She knows her doctor. Her doctor knows her. It is hard to get lost in a town where people know each other. It is very easy to get lost in L.A. especially in the maze of finding medical care and navigating Medicare rules. Medicare Advantage is pretty much a necessity for seniors in huge cities.

[begin_within]

24. That would really hurt SCAN, which I think is one of the best Medicare Advantage plans

My Mom switched over from Kaiser Senior Advantage to SCAN and it's so much better. So far SCAN has paid for everything her doctor asked for, except one prescription which was an off-label use and was probably a bad idea anyway. I have no complaints about SCAN at all, based on 2 years of her using that plan. I have a lot of complaints about Kaiser and their cheapness and willingness to overload their system with patients.

[shraby]

25. We pay about $145 per month to American Family for

a policy that covers 100% of what Medicare doesn't pay, plus there is NO deductibles, NO copays, NO "out of area" bullshit, we can pick our own doctor, go to any hospital and have any tests we need. We didn't take the Medicare Advantage because of those very drawbacks.

[iamtechus]

28. Same story here!

My wife and I chose not to get medicare advantage and it has turned out to be a good decision. We used to have a BCBS HMO plan through my employer and it sucked. Our HMO doctors where shills for big pharma and the insurance co. They would try to talk you out of seeing specialists or getting tests. No problems with those now.

[JDPriestly]

41. Do you live in a really big city like Los Angeles or New York?

I used to have a PPO. I hated it because I had to go here and there and everywhere just to get tests and see specialists. With Kaiser I just go to one place.

When I get my flu shots, I walk into a room with nurses sitting at tables and processing the shots in a very efficient way. I love the fact that all my records are on a computer. I had a Worker's Comp claim, and my Worker's Comp doctor reminded me that my general practitioner had ordered me to go back for an additional blood test (and that I had not gone back). When you are older, it is good to be covered by a medical provider who reminds you about what care you need. I get reminders in the mail and sometimes a phone call.

I understand that if you become seriously ill, Kaiser may not give as good a coverage as some other plans. But for someone like me who is basically healthy, it is excellent.

There are no extras with Kaiser, but they give you the preventive tests you need and track your progress. I really like the way they handle that.

[shraby]

44. We live in Two Rivers, WI..google it.

[JDPriestly]

48. Found it.

Two Rivers is a city in Manitowoc County, Wisconsin, United States. The population was 12,639 at the 2000 census.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Rivers,_Wisconsin

Manitowoc County is a county in the U.S. state of Wisconsin. As of 2000, the population was 82,887. Its county seat is Manitowoc<1>. The United States Census Bureau's Manitowoc Micropolitan Statistical Area includes all of Manitowoc County.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manitowoc_County,_Wisconsin

Los Angeles County

Population in July 2008: 3,833,995. Population change since 2000: +3.8%

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Los-Angeles-California.html#ixzz0aNEahosv

http://www.city-data.com/city/Los-Angeles-California.html

It's relatively easy to find a doctor in Two Rivers because you don't have many choices. You probably only have one, maybe two hospitals right near you.

In L.A., we have a very different problem. It's very hard to find the right doctor and hospital. There are so many but not all of them will take Medicare without Medicare supplemental or Medicare Advantage. Then there is the problem of choosing the right place for tests and hospital care. Medicare Advantage makes it easier because you know the doctor you are assigned will accept your health care insurance and you know what hospital your doctor belongs to, etc. Medicare Advantage is essential in large markets. Elderly people can easily get lost in the confusion.

[Nikki Stone1]

32. The goal is to eventually get Medicare off the books. That is why they couldn't have either

a public option or a Medicare option. The whole point of setting up this exchange is to push medical costs for everyone including seniors back onto the individual, and even seniors. It looks like this change in Medicare will happen incrementally.

[JDPriestly]

42. Basically, they took the money baby boomers paid into Medicare

and Social Security and spent it on wars and military equipment. They cheated us.

[Nikki Stone1]

43. That sounds about right.

.

[Greyhound]

45. K&R. This is the surest way to keep the Republiks alive and put them back in power.

As they are learning (again) without the Republiks, the Democrats have no one to blame for their incompetence and malfeasance.

[Tracer]

47. I made sure that I didn't sign up for any Medicare Advantage plan ...

... knowing the the management costs were substantially higher than regular Medicare.

I also buy a Medigap plan from Blue Cross for $86.00/mo. And Medicare and BCBS had paid every single bill that I've had for the past 4 years (and they've been substantial), in their ENTIRETY.