If you ask me, we'd be better off keeping those 30 million uninsured.

[Orrex]

What did they ever do for us, anyway?

And who could possibly support zero co-pays for routine screenings and maintenance?

If only we could have held out for that single-payer bill. You know, the one that wouldn't have made it out of committee in any form?

[dawg]

1. You're missing the point ....

Obama could have just willed single-payer into existence if he really wanted to. Lieberman and Nelson both would've voted for it, as well as four or five Republicans.

[leftstreet]

2. Stop it. Obama could have mobilized a Single Payer movement

Fatcat Congress members would have had NO CHOICE but to go along

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

5. Sure they'd have a choice.

What makes you think they wouldn't?

[leftstreet]

8. Last I heard they're elected, not appointed

At least I THINK that's how it still works

:eyes:

[el_bryanto]

6. Particularly if Obama dangled some yarn in front of them. Those Fatcats would be helpless!

[tblue]

9. +1

[cliffordu]

12. I doubt that the peeple would get off their dead asses in the

numbers needed to effect that kind of leverage.

Really.

[leftstreet]

14. They got off their 'dead asses' and voted for him

:hi:

[cliffordu]

16. Yes, they did.....

But I haven't seen many of them on the mall or anywhere else fighting this fight.

I called and written and shoved my cats around over it....but the newness of the political activism people felt during the election seems to have faded back into an obsession with sports and JOBS, and, on the other side teabaggers....

I have little hope that the numbers that turned out last time will even come close to being matched this time.

No matter what the legislation coming out of the administration...

[rudy23]

3. Wow, too much straw. I can barely see in here.

Scarecrows all over the place.

[Orrex]

22. How so?

Do you really think Single Payer would have gotten off the ground? How's the reading of the Sanders amendment coming along? The OP was clearly a deliberate and self-aware caricature of the opposition to the bill; it wasn't presenting that caricature as an accurate representation of the opposition's views. For that reason, it's hardly a straw man.

Besides which, anyone who expected a Progressive's Wish-list of a bill was setting themselves up to fault Obama for its failure.

Krugman noted recently that healthcare proposals are weakened every time they're defeated, so that each bill is progressively worse (excuse the pun) than what preceded it. The current bill is indeed far from perfect, but it puts us in a position of having something to improve upon, rather than having to pass something even weaker when healthcare reform is presented again.

[LynneSin]

4. *** sigh ****

I got you the really big box of popcorn.

There is logic with what you have said. I know that HCR isn't perfect but it doesn't mean we can't ever visit there again.

I know many people who will benefit when this bill is passed and no not Heathcare CEOs but everyday folks like you and me.

But just incase - I'm ready:

[Ozymanithrax]

7. But corporations are running the world and we must tilt at corporate windmills.

Really, Corporations whose soul and messenger is Cheney-Nyarlathotep must be opposed at all costs. Thirty million are but a small price to pay in the never ending struggle against elder corporate gods who dance mindlessly to strange flutes at the center most blot of all eternity.

[Warpy]

10. You need that sarcasm tag on that one.

Really.

[Orrex]

20. Sarcasm tags are for amateurs!

[Warpy]

21. You must be dying for a barbecued ass today

People who don't know you and who are suffering from Christmas funk are not going to take it kindly.

[Orrex]

23. Mmm... Barbecued ass.

[Sebastian Doyle]

11. Nobody said it better than Obama himself

People who can't afford insurance now aren't going to be able to afford it any better when it's "mandated" and it makes as much sense as a mandate that homeless people buy houses.

The man needs to listen to some of his own speeches and remind himself of what sort of President he told us he would be.

[Echo In Light]

15. Re your sig line, the mythology applies to our presidents as well

[SammyWinstonJack]

17. Say ANYTHING to get elected and then do whatever the hell the corporate masters want.

While pulling the wool over as many eyes as possible. Nothing new.

[tinrobot]

18. That's where the subsidies kick in...

If someone is too poor, then subsidies will make up the difference. The subsidies will be available for people with incomes up to 400 percent of the poverty line.

[Sebastian Doyle]

19. So in other words, government subsidies for rich criminal bastards?

Not that it would be the first time (MonSatan, tobacco companies, etc) but why in God's name should we do that again?

Just cut the filthy pieces of shit out of the picture and use the government subsidies to actually pay for health care and not some fucking billionaire's mansion.

[StreetKnowledge]

24. No Argument From Me.

It would be better (and almost certainly cheaper) to cover people via public insurance options. But nooooo, can't piss off the American aristocracy......

[tinrobot]

26. Very true.

[Vinca]

13. It will be interesting to see how many of the 30 million will be able

to afford insurance even with a subsidy. Especially older people who are on the hook for 3 times the going rate. Something I read gave me the impression my husband and I would be eligible for a $700 subsidy. Our last insurance quote was about $20,000. If I could afford $19,300 a year, I probably wouldn't be uninsured.

[mmonk]

25. Bingo. 30 million is talk.