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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:43 AM
Original message
It Seems Most Who Are Disappointed Have No Clue How The Senate Works.
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 09:50 AM by WeDidIt
You might want to google the phrase "The Great Compromise" or even "Connecticut Compromise".

The Senate was created with a single purpose in mind, a CONSERVATIVE approach to legislation. By this I do not mean a rightwing approach, but a slow, methodical approach.

See, all the big states with the large populations were in favor of the Virginia plan which would have had a single body for legislation where representation was based solely upon population. This was too much for the smaller states to swallow, thus the Senate came into being.

That single creation meant it would take more than 80 years before the single most odious legal action enshrined by our constitution would be altered, the existence of slavery. And even that required a war to change.

And since the Congress as we know it came into being, the House has always been the Reactive body while the Senate has always been the Deliberative body. The Senate becomes a check on the more aggressive legislation by the House, to slow things down. In other words, a more conservative approach.

And when it has served the aims of the Left, it has been decried by the Right and lauded by the Left. Examples of this are found in many of the moves over the past eight years by the Bush Administration which have simply failed. Social Security privatization would have been a slam dunk without this more conservative approach by the Senate. since it was a non-starter in the Senate, it became a non-starter overall.

This is why incrementalism is the ONLY WAY to advance any ideas in our form of government. That's how Social Security began and it's how Medicare began. Neither were what they are now when first enacted.

And that's how HCR will go, too. This approach also guarantees one thing, if the health insurance companies are to survive, they must make the system better, else incrementalism works to their disadvantage and they are pushed out in favor of a public plan. If they behave themselves, they can continue to exist and will become more like the Dutch example of healthcare delivery. Either way, they are never going to be what they once were.

Am I pissed off we didn't get more out of HCR? HELL YES! What that means to me, however, is we need to move the political leanings of the Senate further to the Left as that will be the way to build upon this foundation to form a more perfect version of health care reform.

If, on the other hand, the LEft just gives up and sits at home all disappointed, the right wins and this foundation will be wiped away, never to be visited again in any of our life times because to do so would be far too risky politically.

So the choice of how this proceeds is up to the left. Be whiny poutraged babies, and the Republicans get what they want. Fight even harder to move the ideological bent of the Senate to the left, and you'll see this legislation change quickly in legislative terms.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:45 AM
Response to Original message
1. I won't even bother reading your OP
Starting it off with the idiot fucking "poutrage" crap, completely wipes out any point you may have.

this is flamebait.

alerted.
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NoPasaran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:59 AM
Response to Reply #1
21. You won't read it, but you will reply to it?
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 09:59 AM by NoPasaran
Sounds like you're playing with matches yourself
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WhaTHellsgoingonhere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 06:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
73. Don't think so. The difference between flame bait and "legit" is...
...about 400 posts to your post count.
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SemiCharmedQuark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:46 AM
Response to Original message
2. Last week you wanted to primary Obama in 2012. You said the fate of the party depended on it.
?
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. Yes, I was pissed as hell, still am
I calmed down and redirected my energies to where they would be better directed.

I'm still pissed at Obama for failing to lead on this. He made a huge mistake by not pushing hard for a public option, IMO. Instead he concentrated his efforts on just getting a bill, and I can understand that to a degree, but that was the safe move. He should ahve taken a risk and pushed for the PO, IMO.
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SemiCharmedQuark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Would you consider your own anger "poutrage"?
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #7
42. When I was ready to give up on the Democratic Party?
HELL YES it was "poutrage".

Once I realized how I was fucking up, I rethought my position and realized my anger was directed wrongly. It should be directed at the Republicans of forced the Dems to go this route and the Blue Dogs who held the bill hostage, not to mention Liebertraitor who gave the likes of Nelson, Lincoln, and Bayh the cover they wanted.
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Kahuna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 11:13 AM
Response to Reply #42
57. I love you, WeDidIt. Your honesty is refreshing. Would that we would
all follow your example. :loveya:
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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #5
74. I must disagree
He did not just fail to push for the public option and concentrate on getting a bill. He blocked all attempts to have any form of PO survive in the Senate and pushed to get the bill we see before us. No other explanation of the behavior we saw throughout the debate especially the refusal to give up the 'bipartisan' crap long past the time everyone knew it would not happen. He held on to that, I believe, in order to push the bill to the right and blame Republicans. We will never know what bill we could have cut in the Senate had the president been pushing for it. Remember, the Blue Dogs are Rahm's political offspring. Had the president (via Rahm) asked for their cooperation, I am convinced he would have gotten it.
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Le Taz Hot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:46 AM
Response to Original message
3. "Poutrage"
You guys need to have a meeting and come up with something a little more original. The names and excuses are getting old already. Unrec for hyperbolic dogma.
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Buzz Clik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #3
56. I considered "Whining, Childish Assholes", but it was a bit harsh.
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racaulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:47 AM
Response to Original message
4. You lost me at "poutraged whiners."
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 09:49 AM by racaulk
This renders what you have to say is irrelevant and inflammatory. Using language like that you're not looking for a discussion, you want a fight.

K&U


Edited for clarity.
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. I fixed it
Now nobody will read it.

Oh fucking well.
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racaulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. No one was reading it anyway.
Check the first replies in this thread.
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racaulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:53 AM
Response to Reply #8
16. You may want to fix it in the text of your OP also, not just the title.
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pnwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:10 AM
Response to Reply #8
29. Well I read it, and I thought you made some excellent points. Thanks. n/t
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Tailormyst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-24-09 10:46 AM
Response to Reply #8
83. You act that way and then are surprised when people don't read your post?
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KG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
6. 'whiny poutraged babies'? is that all you got?
wanker.
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Echo In Light Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #6
18. The bigger the mouth online, the greater a flaming pussy in real life
Count on it
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KG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:00 AM
Response to Reply #18
24. i just love insults in the guise of a scolding wrapped up in an effort to supposedly edify.
esp when they come from mental midgets. good fun!
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Echo In Light Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. Well, I usually avoid interacting w/people of that mindset. Rubbed me the wrong way this a.m.
:hi:
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Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #18
32. Odd Correspondence Between Improperly Capitalized Subject Lines
and Organized Blowhards at DU, an operation that is not healthy. Some don't mind but I think its a crime.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. Yes, I Noticed That As Well, And Thought It Interesting.
There's also a distinct scent of ham and rice hovering over this place lately.
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racaulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #33
61. I would simply b delighted to have that for dinner tonight.
There's been way too much pizza around lately.
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racaulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #32
37. Heh heh...
:thumbsup:
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #18
38. You mean like all the reactionary screamers in GD right now? I, myself have largely left this
cesspool to the ranters.
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #18
63. New fodder, or another sock puppet?
The panic is palpable.


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canetoad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
9. True words
Rec.
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RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
10. after I saw that you attacked a man who wrote about feeding the homeless...
there is nothing you could say that I would find worthwhile because of who it came from.

the wages of being a jerk.
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:50 AM
Response to Original message
12. oh here we go -- the day shift is in full swing
poutroage - whiners?

How ROVIAN of you. You'd probably feel right at home with the RW chorus. The only difference is the sweater color.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #12
36. You're one of the ones touting the beauty of Teabagger Alliance, aren't you?
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 10:22 AM by KittyWampus
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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:51 AM
Response to Original message
13. Oh no, we're quite clear that the Senate runs on corporate money.
That's the real "check" you speak of.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:52 AM
Response to Original message
14. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Junkdrawer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #14
19. What Echo In Light said.. n/t
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Echo In Light Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. These play it safe, middle-of-the-roaders have all but killed this party
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:53 AM
Response to Original message
15. Nice post. But for some reason I read you title as:
It Seems Most Who Are Disappointed Have No Clue WHY The Senate DOES NOT Work for the people...
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:54 AM
Response to Original message
17. FAIL, honey. changing your crap title doesn't change
the whiny outraged babies line in the last paragraph.
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Tailormyst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 09:59 AM
Response to Original message
22. If he was a success you wouldn't have to scream so loud about how successful he is.
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 10:00 AM by Tailormyst
People would already know it. Your posts have been "full of fail" as my teenage son would put it.
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ima_sinnic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #22
25. lol! +1 for the subject line
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ima_sinnic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:00 AM
Response to Original message
23. it doesn't matter how it was "designed" to work, b/c it's "working very well for them," no?
The way the Senate works is, whoever has the bucks for bribery and corruption gets what they want.

see, wasn't that easy?

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KG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #23
41. it's a psuedo - intellectual justification for why everybody should just shut up and enjoy their
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 10:29 AM by KG
shit sandwich.
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NJmaverick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
27. DU could use a Civics 101 class
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 10:07 AM by NJmaverick
For many this is the first time they are following a bill from start to finish. As a result they don't have a lot of experience to put much of what happens into proper perspective.
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #27
34. You've got that right
As I understand it, they no longer teach civics in middle school.

I think we're seeing the results of that failing in DU today. I knew this shit when I was 14.
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NJmaverick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #34
51. I never understood why it was eliminated
it's resulted in a few generations that have no idea how our government works.
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Kahuna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 11:18 AM
Response to Reply #27
60. When they have old people like Ed Shultz and Bill Press bleating
in their ears, daily, they just follow their example. Age isn't he issue. If it was, what's Ed and Bill's excuse?
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #27
71. Civics 101 doesn't teach how the Senate works
When I took high school civics (in 2002 so not that long ago) the textbook and the teacher portrayed the filibuster as the "Mr. Smith Goes to Washington" kind. They didn't explain how it changed in the 1970's with the addition of dual track authority. It also didn't explain all of the procedural votes that the Senate has to go through.

The Senate is the most absurd legislative body on the face of the planet and plenty of people who are politically informed don't understand how it works. Hell some Senators don't even really know how it works.
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
28. FDR didn't start with a privatized Social Security and promise that it would
be federalized at some indefinite later date.

The Senate is giving away the store to the private sector, which caused the problems in the first place.

That's not incrementalism. Incrementalism would be lowering the age of Medicare eligibility by five years per year. Incrementalism would be allowing the uninsured to buy into an affordable public option and gradually allowing everyone to do so. Incrementalism would be negotiating prices for the most expensive drugs first. Incrementalism would be adding a 100% catastrophic care benefit like Japan has. Incrementalism would be requiring first-dollar coverage of recommended standard diagnostic tests.

What the Senate (and the House) are doing is not incrementalism.

It's retrogression.

It's saying, "Here, medical-industrial complex. Here are 30 million new captive customers."
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OHdem10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:16 AM
Response to Original message
30. Put lipstick on a pig and it is still a pig. This is a RW Bill and
if the GOP had not been intent on stopping any bill,
believe you me, this bill under the right circumstances
would have gotten Republican votes.

Here is the principle. The GOP is supposed to be the Party
of Big Business. This bill favors Big Insurance and Big Pharma.
not the average American. Yes, it does expand coverage--taking
10 years to get 30 million covered. The first year we all
start paying taxes. Only the children get protected re pre-existing
conditions the first year. Insurance Company does not get
hit for 3-4 years. Favoring business is acceptable for GOP,
they do not shrink from being the Party of Big Business. The
problem here is the Democrats are doing the same thing. Who
actually looks out for the average American.

Put lipstick on that pig and you still have a pig.

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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:16 AM
Response to Original message
31. Urecced.
n/t
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elleng Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:21 AM
Response to Original message
35. Thanks
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hlthe2b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:24 AM
Response to Original message
39. What an incredibly condescending attitude...
Good heavens...
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Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:26 AM
Response to Reply #39
40. Check out the OP's avatar
And tell me its not a shitstirring punk ass trying to start flames.
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RetroLounge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:30 AM
Response to Original message
43. K & Unrec
Thanks for your panglossian concern...

RL
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phasma ex machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:31 AM
Response to Original message
44. +1 "we need to move the political leanings of the Senate further to the Left"
Speaking as a proud poutrager, many people ignorant of constitutional separation of power now blame the executive branch of government for the failure of the legislative branch.

Power to the poutrage! :woohoo:
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:35 AM
Response to Original message
45. Unrecommeding any OP with "poutraged whiner" in it on the critical issue of HCR.
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 10:37 AM by chill_wind
eom
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NJmaverick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #45
46. .
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 10:49 AM by NJmaverick
.
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joeybee12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:42 AM
Response to Original message
47. Yes, we're all stupid, you're the only educated one...thousands of apologies..n/t
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Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
48. Name callers have no confidence in their own 'positions' so they
hurl stupid names. The Senate works in many ways. Was the Patriot Act taken slow and incrementally? Or did they skip so much as reading it in a rush to vote yes? Seems we went into Iraq rather suddenly, all at once, with a very fast vote.
So how does the Senate work again? Instant when it serves them, slow when it does not. Can you really argue otherwise?
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KG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #48
49. where was that 'incrementalism' when it came to handing billion$ to wall st?
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:48 AM
Response to Original message
50. Ahh more of your electronic tripe.
I tried cutting you some slack in the past with some of your half-witted posts, but alas, this one takes the cake.

I find that you add nothing to the conversation and as such are nothing more that a ridiculous distraction.

And as such, I will be blocking you.

Why am I informing you instead of just blocking you? because if you get more people informing you that they are blocking you, perhaps, just perhaps, you will think before you post such drivel in the future.

Somehow, I don't think it would have any effect upon your massive ego, but what they heck, I can dream.

Cheers!
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HuckleB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:56 AM
Response to Original message
52. K & R.
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ThomWV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 10:58 AM
Response to Original message
53. And where, pray tell, does this reading of history come from?
I'd be real interested in references for your version of how our Government came to be the way it is.
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DailyGrind51 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 11:08 AM
Response to Original message
54. You have to cut deals no matter how they may stink, to get anything passed.
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Buzz Clik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
55. YOU don't get it, pal. This is DU, and we want our stuff now Now NOW!!!
If we don't get our stuff now, we're going to start pouting. Then yelling. And then we're going to have a fit and blame anybody who's convenient.

Don't bother with the civics lesson, bub. We are not nearly mature enough to comprehend what you're saying.
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Kahuna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #55
58. And if you're lucky, some pip-squeak will call you "rancid" and think
he got away with it. Next time, I will be sure to show him how "rancid" I am. I guarantee his head will explode. Stay tuned....:popcorn:
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racaulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #58
62. And if you're lucky, someone will blame gay people for getting Bush elected twice.
Sound familiar, Kahuna?
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #62
65. Please tell me that didn't happen.
:wtf:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #65
66. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 06:17 PM
Response to Reply #65
69. Oh, it sure did.
But trust Kahuna when she says she supports gay rights. I mean, how could anyone miss it?
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Buzz Clik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #58
64. Kung Fu posting. Should be awesome.
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Clintonista2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #58
67. The rancid coward ran from the thread with its tail behind its back
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 02:07 PM by Clintonista2
Get pwned much?
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Kahuna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-24-09 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #67
82. Hardly. Read on icehole. There comes a time when you just
Edited on Thu Dec-24-09 10:15 AM by Kahuna
have to let close-minded people have their allusions and move on.
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racaulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-24-09 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #82
84. Does "moving on" include bringing up the subject you left behind in another thread.
In a thread where the person you were complaining about was not participating?

Your way of "moving on" sounds a lot more like passive-aggressiveness.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #58
68. You blamed Bush on gay people, then told them you will never forget it.
Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 06:26 PM by Forkboy
Yep, that qualifies as rancid. We don't need a next time to see how rancid you're becoming. Stay tuned indeed... :popcorn:
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Kahuna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-24-09 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #68
81. No, I did not. Reading is fundamental. And you again assume way
to much. By, his ilk, I was referring to Naderites. Really. Is "gay" all you identify yourself as? That's really sad.
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jonnyblitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #58
75. you certainly have been doing a good job proving my point!!
I love you, too, Kahuna. SMOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOCH :loveya:
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Kahuna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-24-09 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #75
80. You have no point. Your only point is to harrass people who disagree
with you. Yesterday morning, I saw you harrassing another good, long time DUer for no apparent reason. If I'm in the same company as THAT DUer, I'm flattered.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #58
78. Did you read what Forkboy wrote to you?
Cause you really should take it to heart. He nailed it.
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Kahuna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-24-09 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #78
79. Forkboy has his opinion. That doesn't make it fact. He doen't know me..
so, who is he or anybody else on DU to lecture me about anything? Really.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-25-09 12:09 AM
Response to Reply #79
85. People voice their opinions
sometimes it feels like lecturing. You have to admit, your opening salvo in that thread was fairly confrontational and broad brushed.

A lot of LGBT folk here are angry and disappointed with Obama - that doesn't mean they hate him. Some might, but I think the majority are just extremely pissed off at the man.

And a lot, if not most of the people expressing newfound anger at Obama over healthcare and Afghanistan are people who don't even have LGBT rights on their radar screen and never did.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 11:18 AM
Response to Original message
59. Excuses. I ain't buying no more.
The reality is liberals aren't represented sufficiently in government when it comes to legislation. Through Bush's most influentials years, he had the smallest margins of Senators possible and got things passed that were ideologically conservative.
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 06:20 PM
Response to Original message
70. This has gotten old. nt, unrec.
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Xicano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 06:23 PM
Response to Original message
72. Compromise? Here's what YOU are not getting.
How much fucking compromise are we going to have to do? We have already done nothing but compromise on top of compromise on top of compromise. We are all fucking compromised out. There are WAY too many folks as a result of endless years of compromise who are backed up against a cliff and more compromise will send them over the edge.

Sorry, but, NO MORE compromise!




Peace,
Xicano
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ipaint Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 06:25 PM
Response to Original message
76. Exactly why real reform for people will never originate in the Senate
or the House.
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WT Fuheck Donating Member (392 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-23-09 06:27 PM
Response to Original message
77. How gracelessly condescending of you.
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ThePhilosopher04 Donating Member (435 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-25-09 01:41 AM
Response to Original message
86. Not only is this NOT "incrementalism"...
it was a total cave-in to private insurance...it's one thing to give a starving, homeless person food and shelter, it's another to lock them up and feed them rat poison, which is essentially what this bill does.
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