Just reported that Obama told NPR that taxing the Union Cadillac

[OHdem10]

health plans is a Good Idea.

[AllentownJake]

1. Hope he has a plan to raise a lot of street money or pass EFCA

Otherwise there goes half of his GOTV operation in 2010 and 2012.

[laughingliberal]

83. Rahm is already counting the insurance & Phrma industry donations

I saw reports from the get go that this whole bill is to get those donations to Dems and keep 'em away from Rethugs. They don't figure they need the stinking unions anymore.

[Name removed]

2. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[eleny]

3. Just reported where?

[bigwillq]

8. Link

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/reuters/2009/12/23/2009-12-23T212747Z_01_N23165378_RTRIDST_0_USA-HEALTHCARE-OBAMA-URGENT.html

[eleny]

15. Thanks, b!

[bigwillq]

16. You're welcome (nt)

[IndianaGreen]

111. No wonder Forbes is jumping for joy!

A good way for employers to ditch health plans for bare bones benefits.

[wryter2000]

4. This is so wrong

Union people gave up so much to get good medical benefits.

[AllentownJake]

9. Yep and they man half the shit on election day

They are going to say fuck you eventually.

[cali]

19. what's wrong here is the OP making allegations that appear not to be true

there is nothing to indicate that Obama said anything about union health care insurance.

[wryter2000]

71. I sure hope it's wrong n/t

n/t

[lamp_shade]

5. Link?

[bigwillq]

7. Link

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE5BG46S20091223

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/reuters/2009/12/23/2009-12-23T212747Z_01_N23165378_RTRIDST_0_USA-HEALTHCARE-OBAMA-URGENT.html

I posted two links here because I thought it was going to bring me to the NPR page, and it didn't. I think the two articles are the same.

[sandnsea]

6. Democrats in Oregon passed a health premium tax

to help pay for our health care plan. Lots of Democrats think it's a good idea.

[HuckleB]

12. This Oregonian supports that health premium.

I need more information about Obama's proposal, but I'm finding the knee-jerk responses to be not so interesting. However, the responses may be related to the false OP title, something which seems to be in fashion today.

It seems like Obama gets criticized for not putting everything on the table, as well he should, and then he gets criticized for putting something on the table. That may make Obama a hypocrite, but it doesn't make his critics anything but hypocrites either.

[Bluenorthwest]

This Oregonian and his Union do not support this

So, there you go.

[HuckleB]

76. Your union opposed the Oregon tax?

What union is that?

[blindpig]

63. Which tells ya what about lots of Democrats? n/t

[HuckleB]

77. That some want to find ways to pay for health care for children?

It's not the only mechanism for paying for the program, either.

[Wardoc]

10. LOL, thanks Obama. Just when you thought the damage couldn't get worse.

[BeatleBoot]

23. Homework is hard

isn't it?

[FrenchieCat]

11. I read the links. Can you point to the "Union" he used that is in your title?

I don't see it in either the Forbes or the reuters articles.

[bigwillq]

13. Yes, I think the OP needs to edit (nt)

[HuckleB]

14. I can't find it.

:shrug:

[robdogbucky]

114. I'm only going to post this once on this thread

Can none of you bent cheerleaders read for yourselves?

This is the second post on this thread asking where is the reference to the union.

If you actually read the page that the orignal poster linked, you would see in the box on the right the first selection is a glossary of terms. In that glossary, item #2 is:

Cadillac health plans:

These are high-cost insurance plans that require little or no out-of-pocket expenses for medical treatment. Many union employees, workers in high-risk professions and corporate executives have them. The Senate bill calls for imposing a tax on such plans, something ardently opposed by unions, which are a key Democratic constituency.

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE59Q56220091027


You people are starting to turn my stomach. The term "cadillac plan," has always been the way the right refers to the union benefits. DLC cheerleaders should know that.

I am going to stop now, as I don't want to get pizza'd, or Tstoned, or whatever is the whim of the elite tonight.

I'm outa here for a while.

The Kool-Aide drinkers are on a bender.

You can all go pee all over yourselves.

It is not pretty.

Fackin' Idjits.



Just my dos centavos


robdogbucky

[Xicano]

17. Here's a copy of a bulletin I posted concerning this topic with respect to my union - the ILWU.

The redactions I made are only to cover co-workers' names and dollar figures. Posting names and tax & benefit figure details about my union I don't think would be appropriate.

[eleny]

18. A quote from the article linked to above - and a question...

""Taxing Cadillac plans that don't make people healthier, but just take money out of their pockets because they're paying more for insurance than they need to -- that's actually a good idea and that helps bend the cost curve," Obama said in an interview with NPR,..."

What I don't get about this is why penalize the insured if he thinks that they're being taken advantage of by the insurance company.

Oh, nevermind.

[county worker]

20. I just got an email from Obama.

I know it was not really from him but I replied to take me off the mailing list. My reply could not be delivered. Figures!

[HuckleB]

27. Yeah, it's always good to select oneself out of information.

That way your view of the world can get narrower and narrower, until you really can get through the old eye of the needle.

[eleny]

40. The mails I receivevd lately were heavy with requests for donations

There's lots of ways to get the same info without getting the appeals for cash.

[HuckleB]

42. True enough.

But in the age of the Internet, many people seem to be honing the information they receive down to a narrower perspective each year.

[eleny]

66. Right, so I opted out of mail from the administration where they always asked for $$$

[HuckleB]

75. Can you opt out of fundraising requests only?

That is a nice feature, if it's possible.

[glitch]

101. "information" is apparently now highly subjective.

It really shouldn't include propaganda, don't you think?

[chimpymustgo]

96. Try unsubscribing at the bottom of the email. I did last week, after my reply bounced back.

[Vinca]

21. A Democrat pissing off the unions just doesn't make sense.

[Umbral]

100. It's unusual for them to do it so overtly, but they've been stabbing them in the back for years. nt

[dysfunctional press]

102. what did they think about clinton and nafta?

or clinton and gatt?

or clinton and the wto?

[Xicano]

104. We (unions) spent several million dollars trying to counter lobby NAFTA.

But Clinton signed it anyway. Then Clinton threatened to do to striking American Airline pilots what Reagan did to striking Air Traffic Controllers. Then Clinton a year latter also threatened striking American Airline flight attendants what he threatened against American Airline pilots.

Corporatocracy is all we have.

[Zhade]

115. An actual Democrat? I'd agree. So... there ya go.

NT!

[MadBadger]

22. Read the link from Reuters. Didnt see anything about unions.

[HuckleB]

24. There's nothing.

It's a dishonest OP.

[BeatleBoot]

28. Someone going to send an alert to the mods?

[HuckleB]

34. I'm having too much fun.

[Xicano]

35. Did you read the bulletin I posted above from my union?

There is a tax on union "Cadillac Plans."

[HuckleB]

41. So you don't care about other Cadillac plans?

You're just going to pretend that Obama is singling out unions?

[Name removed]

56. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[HuckleB]

62. Nice excuse.

You make excuses for an inaccurate OP over and over again, so I begin to wonder if you give a rat's arse about anyone else, much less about accuracy. Too bad it just got your dander up even more.

:rofl:

[Romulox]

25. Corporatist phoney. nt

[HuckleB]

29. Say what?

Can you find where Obama said anything about unions?

[Romulox]

31. Did I stutter? nt

[HuckleB]

33. Well, your knee certainly jerked in response to a false OP.

[Romulox]

44. Nonsense: Obama quote makes it *clear* union plans not exempt from his scheme

KING: I hate to interrupt, but would you make sure that -- some of these unions have negotiated pretty good plans, too. Would you...

OBAMA: Oh, absolutely.

KING: ... make sure theirs are carved out, or should some of them be subject to that?

OBAMA: This is a very important issue. I've been talking to the unions about it. I've been honest with them about it. What I've said is, is that the -- we want to make sure that guys are protected, guys and gals who have got a good benefit, that they are protected, but we also want to make sure that we're using our health dollars wisely.

And I -- I do think that giving a disincentive to insurance companies to offer Cadillac plans that don't make people healthier is part of the way that we're going to bring down health care costs for everybody over the long term.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0909/20/sotu.01.html

:hi:

[HuckleB]

47. He's including all Cadillac plans, and King is making political with his questioning.

You think it should only be some Cadillac plans?

[Romulox]

54. Oh noes! King is "making political" (sic).

:wtf:

[HuckleB]

58. He knew full well that Obama was including ALL Cadillac plans...

... but for entertainment purposes, he wasted a question in bringing up unions. A real interviewer could have used that time to dig further into other areas of importance.

[Raineyb]

74. And how is this supposed to be good for unions?

Union members, unlike the fat cats CEO's who often get the nice juicy fat health insurance packages, give up wage increases to get and keep their medical plans. So not only are their wages not going up with inflation but you want to tax them as well? How exactly is this good for union households?

That IS of importance to working people.

[HuckleB]

78. Yawn.

You're just continuing the red herring that is the OP.

Ugh.

[Raineyb]

87. You're refusing to answer the question. Typical when you parrot what's said

without bothering to think beyond the sound bite. Your objections don't address the very real problem I've mentioned. Apparently you don't give a damn. It would be more honest to say so.

[HuckleB]

88. I don't play pointless games.

Especially with someone who runs to the pointless smear.

The OP lied. I called the OP on it.

Apparently you defend lies.

:eyes:

[Raineyb]

90. The OP did not lie.

You're just being a jerk.

[HuckleB]

93. BS.

The OP lied, and you're defending a lie. And now you're continuing to call names.

If you're going to bash Obama for having lied about his stance on the public option, which is something I am bashing him about, then you can't pull this type of crap.

Seriously, get a clue.

:eyes:

[Raineyb]

95. You're the one who STILL refuses to answer the question.

The union plans are subject to this tax and it's a tax on people who gave up wage increases to keep their health insurance. How the hell is this not a slap to working people?

The OP is not lying. The union plans will be taxed as well and you refuse to acknowledge it because you're too busy calling people names yet you want to lecture about name calling?

You have no business telling anyone to get a clue when you couldn't find your ass with both hands and are completely full of shit.

[Bluebear]

129. word

[Romulox]

113. Your response is contrived. nt

[robdogbucky]

116. Read a little more

You people are starting to turn my stomach. The term "cadillac plan," has always been the way the right refers to the union benefits. DLC cheerleaders should know that.

I am going to stop now, as I don't want to get pizza'd, or Tstoned, or whatever is the whim of the elite tonight.

I'm outa here for a while.

The Kool-Aide drinkers are on a bender.

You can all go pee all over yourselves.

It is not pretty.

Fackin' Idjits.

[fascisthunter]

26. So, Democratic Leadership has come to the conclusion that they don't need Unions

or their own base anymore. I guess they think they have done enough for the right wing corporatists, so they won't need us on the left anymore.

Wait a second... the link I went to says nothing about unions. Are you sure?

[HuckleB]

32. Can you find where Obama said anything about unions?

[fascisthunter]

38. I edited my post as you were responding to me

Wed Dec-23-09 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #26

Edited on Wed Dec-23-09 10:35 PM by fascisthunter

go back and read my post again...

[HuckleB]

43. Got it.

[fascisthunter]

48. I just posted a link that I think supports the OP

but I may be mistaken. Take a look....

http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14051359

I admit I had to look on Google but it really was the first thing I found, it didn't take that long. I am hoping this is all BS.

[HuckleB]

51. If the OP said "all" Cadillac plans, that would support it, IMO.

[fascisthunter]

57. The Thing Here is, Many Feel this Effects Unions the Most

That's why its framed this way I suppose:

What Makes a Health Plan a 'Cadillac'?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/09/30/AR2009093004730.html

[HuckleB]

61. Feel?

Feelings are great, but I suspect far more non-union people will be affected by this tax than union people. If people want to attack Obama over this tax, that's their right, but it's dishonest to frame it as the OP has framed it. And I'm not going to refrain from calling such dishonesty out.

[fascisthunter]

65. look... I know where you are coming from, but nitpicking over semantics

I should have stated that they "THINK"... but I'm pretty sure you knew what I meant. I posted links so that you may understand where people are getting this info from and why it's being assessed the way it has, fair or unfair.

[HuckleB]

80. I know. I know. You're right.

I need a beer.

Cheers!

:toast:

[fascisthunter]

94. cool

:toast:

[frazzled]

30. And what about the Wall Street Cadillac plans?

This isn't a provision aimed at unions per se.
Unions have been convinced that getting a dollar of benefits is worth more than a dollar in wages (and that's what they've gotten). Well, that's probably only true because the cost benefits has gone through the roof--and needs to come back down for the rest of humanity. People like John Kerry (whose whole candidacy was garnered on union support) were the ones to propose this excise tax. You'd better understand it more before deciding it's such a bad thing.

[HuckleB]

37. I think those are included in Obama's statement.

I presume that my nonprofit Cadillac plan will also be included.

[Kansas Wyatt]

36. He is NOT a multidimensional chess player...

He's actually dumber than DimSon.

And, he's bought and paid for, just like DimSon too.

Not only is he not happy with just shooting himself in the foot... He's trying to blow his whole fucking leg off.

Either he doesn't need union money or HELP getting out the vote or he's got the Diebold combination.

[tridim]

98. LOL!

You. Are. AWESOME! :hi:

:rofl:

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

109. lol! Last week someone said it wasn't 3d chess, it was a 3 card monte.

:rofl:

[Zynx]

39. I didn't see anything about Unions in there. This is intellectually dishonest drivel.

[Romulox]

45. No fair that people remember Obama's previous utterances on the matter!

:hi:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0909/20/sotu.01.html

[Zynx]

59. Some union plans happen to fall under this. So what?

They are not the target.

[eleny]

50. I don't see any specific plans in the article linked above...

So, you tell us - which plans are targeted for taxation? Please provide a link to support your claim.

The unions appear to feel targeted by this plan. I haven't seen anyone from the administration or the Congress make a public statement saying the union health plans are not a target.

[Zynx]

55. If some union health plans fall under the specifications, so be it.

They more likely target health plans enjoyed by executives.

[eleny]

60. I see, your presuming something that may or may not be so

For the unions sake I hope your right. But having no assurances from the administration I remain suspicious.

Thanks for your reply.

[robdogbucky]

117. Read the glossary of terms

to the right of the linked article.

Unbelievable parsing by the cheerleaders on this one.

I knew what he meant.

The RWers know what he meant.

Sheesh

Just like a circular firing squad or the Scottish Suicide Brigader around here now.

[fascisthunter]

46. Plan to tax 'Cadillac plans' splits Democrats

I googled and found this:

Plan to tax 'Cadillac plans' splits Democrats
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14051359

[Xicano]

49. ARE MY FUCKING POSTS INVISIBLE? THE OP IS NOT BEING DISHONEST!

FUCK! I only posted a bulletin from my union's DC lobbyist reporting back to us about this bill. Guess what? His report matches what the OP says about taxing UNION so-called cadillac plans.

Sheeze!

[fascisthunter]

52. I Googled, and Found this:

Plan to tax 'Cadillac plans' splits Democrats
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14051359

There's more if people Google.

[eleny]

64. Damning quotes from your link...

"Here is how the Senate plan would work: If a policy costs more than $8,500 for a person or $23,000 for a family, then the insurer would have to pay a 40 percent tax on the cost above that threshold. The amount triggering the tax would rise with inflation. Retiree policies would face a slightly higher threshold."

"The CBO estimates that this new tax would raise nearly $150 billion in the next decade and even more after that. The Senate would use this money to give poorer people subsidies to buy insurance, but the primary goal is to encourage companies to pick cheaper insurance plans and avoid the tax entirely, which is why the Senate bill delays the tax until 2013."

"But unions and many House Democrats argue the tax would actually force union families and middle class workers to pay more out-of-pocket costs. Unions have aggressively negotiated for richer health benefits in recent years, which could affect everyone from firefighters and teachers to miners and steelworkers."

http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14051359

[fascisthunter]

68. I Saw that last paragraph and that's what jumped out to me too

so the OP was not lying or making shit up, but I think those who don't like this info being posted here are trying to discredit the person who posted the OP. "Kill the messenger"

[eleny]

70. Yes - And according to them Howard Dean has completeely embraced the Senate bill

The spin they're dishing out around here can only convince the uninformed. I guess they're going for that segment of readers.

[HuckleB]

53. As has been pointed out to you, the OP is dishonest.

Obama is proposing to tax all Cadillac plans, not just union plans.

[ipaint]

67. Oh good, he's screwing over everyone with a good plan.

I was worried there.

[HuckleB]

81. Maybe.

There are other ways of looking at this proposal. But one has to be willing to put everything on the table for a full assessment.

I'm fine with criticizing the proposal, but pushing the "union" routine was dishonest, and sophistry at its worst.

[Bluenorthwest]

69. But the OP is not dishonest. The OP did not say 'just union plans'

you said that. And 'Cadillac plans' is a right wing term. Your little tantrum does not face inspection well. This will tax Union plans, and that is what the OP said.

[HuckleB]

82. We all know what the OP pushed, without a link to back it up.

Don't even try to play that crap. It ain't working.

[Zhade]

118. Except YOU'RE the one who's lying -- about the OP.

You've already been shown to be wrong, yet you continue to lie by insisting that the OP is.

[Oregone]

72. This is as stupid as the notion that different people should get different quality of plans

One fucking plan, for everyone already. Isn't it time for single-payer and end this shit?

[bullwinkle428]

73. "I'm on record as saying that taxing Cadillac plans

that don't make people healthier but just take more money out of their pockets because they are paying more for insurance than they need to do, that's actually a good idea," he says. "That helps to reduce the cost of health care over the long term."

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=121783002

[mcablue]

127. "No family making less than $250,000 will see "any form of tax increase."

Barack Obama said during the campaign. Can he tax cadillack plans without breaking this promise?

[nadinbrzezinski]

79. Watch as the Unions STAY HOME in 2010

and no, I ain't exaggerating.

[laughingliberal]

84. Alternate Headline: Union Members Now Under Bus with Women & Looney Left

Getting quite cozy under the bus, now.

[laughingliberal]

85. What they call "Cadillac Plans" are, actually plans we considered the standard major medical plan

you had with when working for a good company. One problem with this tax is it seems to be based mostly on the cost of the premium without taking into account that the premium is inflated. A lot of mediocre and, even, crappy plans will fall under this. Union workers, especially, have reason to be pissed. These plans were included in their contracts in lieu of higher pay a lot of the time. I'd be pissed.

[Warren Stupidity]

108. problem is that most of the CHILDREN here have no idea

what that was like.

These plans were included in their contracts in lieu of higher pay a lot of the time.

The unions BOUGHT decent health care with wage and job concessions. Exactly.

[Freddie Stubbs]

86. Did he actually use the phrase " Union Cadillac?"

:shrug:

[HuckleB]

89. Nope.

[Freddie Stubbs]

91. So, this thread is based on a lie about President Obama?

:shrug:

[HuckleB]

92. Obama is discussing a part of HCR that may tax all "Cadillac" health plans.

The OP decided to frame it as an attack on unions, despite the probably reality that far more non-union people will be affected by such a tax.

I don't get it, either.

[jillan]

97. Everytime I start to soften on my feelings about this bill - I read SHIT like this.

This is a tax increase on the middle class - another campaign promise broken.

[MadBadger]

99. He didnt say union cadillac plans. The OP is lying

He referenced Cadillac plans but never mentioned the word Union. The link is a bunch of places in the thread

[Warren Stupidity]

106. The framing remains rightwing.

And the 'cadillac' plans in question are the superior healthcare plans fought for and won by unions, plans frequently paid for in recent years with huge concessions in wages and with the jobs of union members.

The other 'cadillac' plans, the ones that are given to top executives of major corporations, will not be affected by a minor inconvenience like a tax.

I reluctantly support this shitty legislation, but that does not mean that the facts are not what they are, nor does it mean that the Obama administration is not rather disappointingly center-right, nor does it mean that the senate is not a filthy cesspool of corporate corruption.

[robdogbucky]

120. Can't you read?

You people are starting to turn my stomach. The term "cadillac plan," has always been the way the right refers to the union benefits. DLC cheerleaders should know that.

I am going to stop now, as I don't want to get pizza'd, or Tstoned, or whatever is the whim of the elite tonight.

I'm outa here for a while.

The Kool-Aide drinkers are on a bender.

You can all go pee all over yourselves.

It is not pretty.

Fackin' Idjits.

[MadBadger]

123. That would have nothing to do with my ability to read

My reading ability led me to read and see that the word union was never used.

[robdogbucky]

124. I believe it does have something to do with not only your ability to read

but your innate curiosity as well. Which appears to be non-existent. Have you been asleep or out of the country for the last 8 or so months?

Did you read my post above which cut and pasted the actual page from that glossary that I linked that was sitting there on the linked page right next to the underlying article?

If a headline said "Bronx Bombers win first WS in a decade," would you then say "I didn't think the Yankees won this year's WS from reading that." (?)

I think you have revealed yourself as being at least uninformed as to the ongoing auto manufacturing restructuring/bailout scenario, which BTW lead up to and into the Teabaggers tour de force and the current HCR debate/process. It is all of the same piece. Tell me you didn't notice that, or better yet, I did not read those exact words anywhere in the last 8 or so months.

The phrase "Cadillac plan," as defined even on the linked page of glossary terms, which you no doubt refuse to read out of spite at this point clearly identifies it in the debate on HCR as mainly referring to the unions' hard won health benefit packages.

If you can read, well then, what the hell have you been reading?

I knew what the poster meant. The RWers sure know what the poster meant. Yet you didn't and continue to parse on the silly point of the literal words did not exactly spell it out that way. Neener neener neener.

Cripes, I thought we were done with this obfuscation as a tactic with "I did not have sex with that girl."

I guess not with the "I did not campaign on the Public Option."

I think I get it now. You really did know what they were talking about. You are culturally aware. Just not feeling like reading much tonight.

Go ahead, pee away. I left.


Out

[Zhade]

121. Bullshit. The OP didn't say "only union plans". You're the one who's lying.

NT!

[MadBadger]

122. The subject line says, "taxing the union cadillac health care plans"

When in fact, Obama doesnt ever mention unions

[robdogbucky]

126. Yeah, sure

and the headline did not refer to the Yankees.

[Warren Stupidity]

103. Our leaders adopt the framing and rhetoric of the right without hesitation.

Why is that?

[spoony]

105. So the NPR transcript says the fees wouldn't come in until above $23,000

Anyone know a typical union plan cost? He also said the Congressional plan (for members, I mean, not the Congressional bill) is $15,000, but I haven't found confirmation of that.

[IndianaGreen]

112. $8,500 for single people, and LGBT couples

Obama keeps having DOJ defend DOMA in the courts.

[Bluebear]

119. He has to uphold The Law Of The Land!!!!!!!11

For gay issues. Prosecuting torturers, not so much.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

107. Channeled Hillary's mandates and now McCain's taxing?

[IndianaGreen]

110. Good luck getting any campaign money from union households!

:puke:

[Juche]

125. Supposedly it is a good idea

Hear me out. My understanding is that extremely high quality health plans are about $12000 per individual, $24000 for a family. The average price in the US is about $4000 for an individual and $12000 for a family. The higher quality plans result in higher consumption of health care, which drives up demand, does little to improve health and helps speed up health care cost growth. Something like 30-50% of all health care spending is technically wasted as is. So you tax them and as a result there is less unnecessary care that doesn't improve health and that drives up health care costs.

Having said that, passing that legislation involves pissing off unions. Which makes me wary about doing it because unions have done a lot for this country and they shouldn't be the first to sacrifice.

However, there are other ways to curb health cost growth. Expand medicare, have a public option, reimport drugs from overseas, let medicare negotiate drug prices, strong regulations on insurance companies.

All of those will also cut costs. But until the tax on high cost plans, those piss off pharma and insurance companies instead of unions.

My point is that, all of these ideas (a tax on high qualify plans, a public option, prescription negotiations, etc) will slow health care cost growth and save trillions over the next decade. And all involve pissing off certain interest groups (unions, pharma, insurance companies)

However if this administration is willing to piss off the unions but not willing to piss off pharma and the insurance companies, that is a bad sign. A really bad sign.

If we get reform with a high cost plan tax but no public option or prescription negotiations, that means the dems are willing to piss off unions but not insurance companies or pharma.


I know I'm repetitive, but it bears repeating.

Taxing high cost plans will slow health care cost growth. But so will a public option, prescription negotiations, reimportations, regulations, etc. If Obama and the dems are willing to slow health cost growth by taxing high cost plans but they are not willing to slow health care costs growth \by having a strong public option or prescription negotiations, then we are a far bigger plutocracy than even I thought. This means, plain as day, that the dems will screw over unions to slow health care cost growth but will not screw over pharma and the insurance companies to slow health care cost growth.

I hope it doesn't come to that.

[robdogbucky]

And reading the rest of the underlying NPR article on interview:

There are more gems in it.

http://www.google.com/ig#max8

Obama Defends Health Bill Against Attacks From Left
For the reading impaired:

"...This notion I know among some on the left that somehow this bill is not everything that it should be ... I think just ignores the real human reality that this will help millions of people and end up being the most significant piece of domestic legislation at least since Medicare and maybe since Social Security," Obama told NPR's Robert Siegel and Julie Rovner..."

robdogbucky says: I am saving this, and I just read another comparison of those programs and this one in a what if Obama & Cos. drafted those programs. Does he mean helping the millions of people that will be forced into a mandate or will still not be able to purchase adequate private mandated insurance?


"...For Obama, the political stakes over the fate of this health care bill are extremely high. Facing sagging ratings in the polls, along with a unified and re-energized Republican opposition, Obama is counting on the health care bill to help bolster Democratic fortunes as the 2010 midterm congressional elections approach..."

robdogbucky says: Need I say more?


"Right away, there are a whole host of insurance abuses that will be put to an end after this bill is signed so that through fine print, insurance companies can't suddenly drop you when you get sick," he said.



robdogbucky says: And the list of things it left by the wayside, at the doors of hearing rooms, in deposit slips to Congressmens' bank accounts, etc.


"...While the House and Senate bills are largely similar, there are some thorny differences that will have to be reconciled, including how the plan is financed and how the divisive question of restrictions over federal funding for abortions is handled.
"Ninety-five percent of the House bill and the Senate bill are in accord," says Obama. "There are going to be some tough negotiations around the 5 percent."

robdogbucky says: Well, I could have said that and not made it sound so foreboding in a self-fulfilling prophetic way myself, comparing the groundwork for excerpt 4 in excerpt 2.


I know, I know, he didn't say "Democrats," or "working families" or women SPECIFICALLY, he said, wait for it....THE LEFT, but I think you can kind of get the drift where this is all going. It's like reading a "Coming Attractions," Playbill inside a club.


I just can't anymore. Cheerleaders, have at it.


rdb

[robdogbucky]

128. Oops, deleted my first entry for cause

Self-Deleted. Sorry

[Brickbat]

130. This makes me so angry. It's time for unions to withhold endorsements, money and manpower during

campaigns. I'm sick of this shit.