First, it was Kucinich. Then it was Dean. Now, it's Jane Hamsher.

[t0dd]

I'm noticing a trend.

Starting fifty posts ridiculing these heroes does not detract from their credibility. Their courage to speak out and take action against deeply flawed legislation should not earn them the condemnation they receive here.

Jane has fought tirelessly for effective health care reform and other progressive ideals. Her reaching out to someone from the opposite end of the political spectrum may be a controversial approach, but she demonstrates that party affiliation becomes irrelevant when you are dealing with a corrupt DC establishment. When you have an administration that puts corporate interests ahead of the people of this country, it makes little difference to me how that is brought to light. Unfortunately, to some here, bi-partisanship is only acceptable when our President champions it; otherwise, it is an unspeakable evil. And why is that? Because it preserves the partisan war. Because its conducive of naive allegiance. Because it ensures a continuous flow of donations.

And I think this latest witch hunt shows that some here are very uncomfortable with dissent. But suppressing uncomfortable ideas, that Obama may not be what he marketed himself as, that he may only be a slight improvement on the previous administration, is not aligned well with reality.

Trying to stir up animosity against these individuals will not redeem Obama to many of us. We are tired of this administration: its empty rhetoric, its anti-Democratic policies, its backroom deals, and its lies. More people will come to share this view. And nothing will change that, no matter how much noise you create.

[ixion]

1. yep... anyone who chooses the populism path gets character assassination

:argh:

[OregonBlue]

21. Hamsher has gone after Bernie Sanders and Howard Dean but that's not character assassination. That's

populism. So it's okay for her to criticize anyone who's arguments she disagrees with but we're not supposed to criticize her for working with slime like Norquist? Wow, talk about going for party purity.

[laughingliberal]

120. You can criticize anyone you like. It does not, in and of itself, discredit the information they

report or their stand on an issue.

Sanders is teaming up with DeMint to block Bernanke's repeat performance at the fed. I'm saving him a space under the bus.

[tabasco]

91. Pick up a history book sometime.

Morons like Kucinich and Nader have busted left of center coalitions ever since politics began, resulting in reichs and dictatorships.

[ixion]

104. lol... so tyranny is the result of progressives not being centrists?

...


...



:rofl:

[nemo137]

105. There are times when you could make that argument.

I was reading a book on the Spanish Civil War today and wondering at how similar descriptions of the Republic's government sounded.

[ixion]

107. That conflict was seen as a proxy war between Fascism and Communsim

which is barely distinguishable from the former. The two extremes are on opposite ends of the political spectrum, yet share many of the same qualities. Only the rhetoric is different.

The true populists generally get used as cannon fodder, and the Spanish Civil War was no exception.

I can see why there would be an argument for the Republic being tyrannical, but an even more persuasive argument can be made that the Nationalist movement, which spawned the Franco the dictator, were even more so.

The Republic was, at the onset, a populist movement:

1931 Constitution

The king's departure led to a provisional government under Niceto Alcalá-Zamora, and constituent Cortes to draw up a new constitution, adopted on December 9, 1931. This led to a republican-socialist government under Manuel Azaña. Among other constitutional freedoms, the new constitution was to establish freedom of speech and freedom of association, Separation of Church and State and a right to divorce as well as extending universal suffrage to women. It also stripped the Spanish nobility of any juridical status, simplified the Legislative branch to a single chamber called the Congreso de los Diputados, and established legal procedures for the nationalisation of public services such as land, banks and railways.

The Republican Constitution also changed the symbols of the country. The Himno de Riego was established as the National Anthem and the Tricolour, with three horizontal red-yellow-purple fields, became the flag of Spain. Under the new Constitution, all of Spain's regions had the right to autonomy. Catalonia (1932) and the Basque Country (1936) exercised this right, with Andalucía, Aragón and Galicia in talks before the breakout of the Civil War. Overall, in spite of a wide range of liberties, the Constitution failed to agree in key areas with the conservative right, which was very rooted in rural areas, and the Roman Catholic Church, which was stripped of schools and public subsidies under the new Constitution. (For the later constitution, see Spanish Constitution of 1978.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Spanish_Republic

[nemo137]

114. I was thinking more about the problems in the coalition.

When the socialists pulled out of the gov't and left a weakened group of republicans in charge.

[CreekDog]

2. Okay but when Hamsher is part of a move against Bernie Sanders, isn't it the same thing?

:shrug:

[FLAprogressive]

7. someone else wrote that article.....

[CreekDog]

11. That's why I didn't say she *wrote* it

but i don't know how you separate her from it.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

39. He wrote it on behalf of FDL as he says "Sign FDL's petition etc.". Does she own the site?

[MH1]

10. shhh, she is a "hero"

:banghead:

[frazzled]

3. Well, on the other side of the coin ...

First it was Obama, then it was Emmanuel, then it was ... etc. etc.

Are you saying you can dish it out but you can't take it?

People argue about politics. Get used to it.

[FLAprogressive]

4. K&R but it simply doesn't matter anymore. To some here Obama & his admin are sacred cows

And any criticism of them, especially of individuals, must be stifled immediately.

[OregonBlue]

26. I don't agree. I think there is true anger at anyone who would ally with scum like Norquist and

accuse Sanders and Dean of being unprincipled. It really is not that much different than the teabaggers who want to purge the party of Charlie Crist, etc. She seems willing to do whatever it takes to bring down the Obama administration without caring that it would in effect put a much more corrupt bunch back in power. Bringing down Rahm or Obama won't put more Progressives in power, it will put the right wing back in power. That's why I can't support her. If she had teamed with someone like Nader or Kucinich to go after Rahm that would have been a whole other thing.

[FLAprogressive]

28. No there isn't. It's just a distractor.

[OregonBlue]

63. Sorry but you are wrong. There are plenty of us that are very angry with her for this. She lost me

with this one and lots of us have taken her off our links altogether. I wrote to FDL and asked them to remove me from any petition Jane supports. I can't support her in trying to take down the administration because I think if she and Grover succeed, we're not gonna be at all happy with what takes it's place.

[bettyellen]

66. yeah there is, and lots of it.

[laughingliberal]

121. Plenty of people here were throwing Dean under the bus before he decided to support the bill moving

forward to conference. Now, apparently, he is back in their good graces. I'm assuming if he does not support the final bill coming out of conference, he'll be back here under the bus with us chickens.

[mmonk]

122. Yes, that is how it works.

[emilyg]

81. You got it.

[WonderGrunion]

95. You talk about sacred cows with a sigline like that?

People who worship in glass churches of popularity shouldn't throw stones.

[fascisthunter]

5. the conservatives want to kill all progressive ideals in this party

so expect all progressives and liberals to be attacked online and on tv. I think we are all used to it, but now we at least can see that it's people within our own party doing it. You see it even here.

[FLAprogressive]

9. so do the "centrists" and "pragmatists"

[fascisthunter]

30. Oh... I Meant to Include

but yes, those too.... they are conservatives

[Sebastian Doyle]

6. It's all coming right from the Message Discipline LLC daily talking points.

Rahm The Angry Dwarf has always hated Dennis Kucinich and Howard Dean. And now Jane Hamsher is going after him. It's completely transparent and predictable what's going on here.

[inna]

103. exactly. Message Discipline it is, however

I think it's starting to backfire on Rahmster at this point. Against his (ever smug) expectations.

[Skidmore]

8. Don't even put Dr. Dean in the same sentence. He has not

sucked up to the likes of Norquist to make his arguments.

[Le Taz Hot]

111. Wait a minute!

During the 2004 campaign Dean said that we should go to the south and talk with those who are unemployed and uninsured and disenfranchised by the current partisan political system as we have much more in common with them than we are willing to admit. And Der Party Loyalists on this board CREAMED him for it. 'Member? I do. The point is that there are those who think we have a lot more in common with people like the teabaggers than the blind partisans would like to admit. And yes, sometimes that makes for strange bedfellows. But the strangest bedfellow of them all? Obama, supposedly a Democrat, and his capitulation to big pharma and the insurance companies and MANDATING insurance with no public option. Now THAT is a strange bedfellow.

[bertman]

116. THANK YOU, Le Taz Hot!! That describes it to a "T". nt

[Cleita]

12. Infiltrators and their chorus is all this is about.

We know who the real liberal patriots are and they will be trashed even here on DU. There is a division that is becoming more apparent in our Party and I think it's time for us to decide who we are as Democrats. I'm a social democrat and will always be even if I find one of these days that I have to register as an Independent.

[Yuugal]

20. +1 nt

[OregonBlue]

23. Are Sanders and Dean true Progressive or DINO's? Do they pass the DU purity test?

[Cleita]

33. This purity label is such crap that I haven't even acknowledged it since it

reared it's ugly head. It so smacks of the old latte liberal and elitist labels from that last decade that I can't lower my IQ that much to address it. Sanders is a social Democrat like myself. Dean is actually pretty centrist, by his own acknowledgment until center moved way to the right. So they aren't DINOs by any stretch of the imagination like Baucus, Nelson, Landrieu and Collins are. A Democrat In Name Only (DINO) is a Republican that is registered as a Democrat.

[azmouse]

13. Read this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7325429&mesg_id=7325429


'nuff said.

[BrklynLiberal]

83. Grover Norquist.....is not even worth his weight in horse crap & certainly not to be trusted

one iota.

He is a perfect example of the lesson taught in the story of the Frog and The Scorpion.

The Scorpion and the Frog
One day, a scorpion looked around at the mountain where he lived and decided that he wanted a change. So he set out on a journey through the forests and hills. He climbed over rocks and under vines and kept going until he reached a river.

The river was wide and swift, and the scorpion stopped to reconsider the situation. He couldn't see any way across. So he ran upriver and then checked downriver, all the while thinking that he might have to turn back.

Suddenly, he saw a frog sitting in the rushes by the bank of the stream on the other side of the river. He decided to ask the frog for help getting across the stream.

"Hellooo Mr. Frog!" called the scorpion across the water, "Would you be so kind as to give me a ride on your back across the river?"

"Well now, Mr. Scorpion! How do I know that if I try to help you, you wont try to kill me?" asked the frog hesitantly.

"Because," the scorpion replied, "If I try to kill you, then I would die too, for you see I cannot swim!"

Now this seemed to make sense to the frog. But he asked. "What about when I get close to the bank? You could still try to kill me and get back to the shore!"

"This is true," agreed the scorpion, "But then I wouldn't be able to get to the other side of the river!"

"Alright then...how do I know you wont just wait till we get to the other side and THEN kill me?" said the frog.

"Ahh...," crooned the scorpion, "Because you see, once you've taken me to the other side of this river, I will be so grateful for your help, that it would hardly be fair to reward you with death, now would it?!"

So the frog agreed to take the scorpion across the river. He swam over to the bank and settled himself near the mud to pick up his passenger. The scorpion crawled onto the frog's back, his sharp claws prickling into the frog's soft hide, and the frog slid into the river. The muddy water swirled around them, but the frog stayed near the surface so the scorpion would not drown. He kicked strongly through the first half of the stream, his flippers paddling wildly against the current.

Halfway across the river, the frog suddenly felt a sharp sting in his back and, out of the corner of his eye, saw the scorpion remove his stinger from the frog's back. A deadening numbness began to creep into his limbs.

"You fool!" croaked the frog, "Now we shall both die! Why on earth did you do that?"

The scorpion shrugged, and did a little jig on the drownings frog's back.

"I could not help myself. It is my nature."

Then they both sank into the muddy waters of the swiftly flowing river.

[depakid]

14. I'd agree, except that when one attacks Bernie Sanders- one shouldn't expect a chorus of cheers

[Forkboy]

29. Yeah, not the brightest strategy I've seen.

[Xicano]

15. K&R

Apparently the corporatist amongst us forgot what the Democratic party principles are. For them its: "who cares! go team go!"

Sickening.



Peace,
Xicano

[WeDidIt]

16. Heroes?

Okay, Dean is a hero.

The other two?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Yeah, um.

Right.

[REP]

62. You read my mind

"Anti-choice until I'm running for president" isn't a heroic position no matter how it's spun. Hamsher hasn't done anything heroic other than made her name recognizable, which passes for heroic for some these days.

[fishwax]

17. I was equally outraged when Kucinich and Dean reached out to Grover Norquist

[snagglepuss]

18. Brilliant. "bi-partisanship is only acceptable when our President champions it"

K & R

[ProSense]

19. Kucinich was pro-life when Kerry

was running the first PAC free campaign in history, fighting Reagan administration corruption (BCCI/Iran Contra) and voting against DOMA in 1996.

[Don Caballero]

22. All three have lost a ton of supporters for their idiotic stances.

Myself included. We will never support them for their attempts at dividing our party.

[Xicano]

24. But you'll support a liar and someone who works against Democratic principles

And ignores his Democratic base for his wall street buddies.

Thanks for letting us know your priorities.

eom.

[Don Caballero]

25. This is DU not Hate our President Underground.

Go elsewhere to spread lies about our President. Quit trying to splinter our party.

[Xicano]

53. What I hate is un-Democratic policies.

Sorry, but, it isn't me who's splintering our party. For that you need to look at the President. HE'S the one acting against Democratic party principles. HE'S the one siding with wall street not me.

So is it a lie that he's supported FISA, lied about NAFTA, lied about a public option, has defended torturers, bailed out wall street instead of main street, etc?

Sorry, but I care enough about our party than to see us resemble the republican party where they throw their party principles out the window so they can yell "go team go!!"

Sorry, but I have principles.



n/t

[Forkboy]

27. Proof, outside of your word?

Somehow I don't think losing you was all that hard, so I'd like evidence of the ton of others please.

[ima_sinnic]

31. WHO's "dividing" "our" party?

pretty soon it's going to be "your" party, because I see a whole lotta bailin' goin' on. You can keep the corrupt lying war-criminal bankster-ass kisser status-quo lover, we'll be voting for someone with principles and a proven record of progressive ideas, ACTION, governance, and legislation.

[WeDidIt]

32. Jane Hamsher and Dennis Kucinich for two.

Dena walked his divisive shit back.

[ima_sinnic]

36. no, they're in the faction that was already split off by the "democrats" aka "centrists" aka

fucking republican democrat PIGS.

notice that not one real progressive is anywhere to be found in that septic tank known as the obama administration.

[WeDidIt]

38. No, they're idiots

Neither are progressives.

Both are egotistical idiots.

C.F. Ralph Nader

[Don Caballero]

34. Those who publicly speak against our President

We expect that from the Right Wing Reactionaries and blood thirsty Neocon set, but when members of our party start sniping we must come out against them. We must not allow these folks to degrade the President.

[Name removed]

41. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Cleita]

44. Ever live in a country with a dictator?

I have and you can never criticize el generalismo for anything. Is this what you are proposing? Freedom means being able to criticize those who hold the power of life and death over you.

[Sapphocrat]

84. "Not allow"? Not "ALLOW"?

That is one of the most un-American comments I've ever read on DU. Talk about pissing on the First Amendment, and trying to bully dissenters into silence.

"The President is merely the most important among a large number of public servants. He should be supported or opposed exactly to the degree which is warranted by his good conduct or bad conduct, his efficiency or inefficiency in rendering loyal, able, and disinterested service to the Nation as a whole. Therefore it is absolutely necessary that there should be full liberty to tell the truth about his acts, and this means that it is exactly necessary to blame him when he does wrong as to praise him when he does right. Any other attitude in an American citizen is both base and servile. To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public. Nothing but the truth should be spoken about him or any one else. But it is even more important to tell the truth, pleasant or unpleasant, about him than about any one else." -- Teddy Roosevelt, May 7, 1918

"Any other attitude in an American citizen is both base and servile."

[NMMNG]

85. " We must not allow these folks to degrade the President. "

And what do you suggest be done to stop it? :popcorn:

[golddigger]

109. Okay!

:eyes:

[eilen]

110. Is this opposite world?

Did you just post that we should not criticize our president because he is a Democrat?

shaking head.

[Sebastian Doyle]

48. The DLC

It's been their sole objective from day one. Divide. Undermine. Destroy.

[Individualist]

51. Exactly,

and they've succeeded in creating a huge rift within the party. I said long ago that DLC is the cancer that's destroying the party.

[ima_sinnic]

52. that was my point, but poster didn't "get it"

funny how "sharp" they are about things like "how Congress works" and "how the Supreme Court works" and "how little time Obama has had" and "investigating corruption is McCarthyism" but "apparently" so freaking DENSE about other things.

[Cleita]

35. Jeez imagine the idiocy of clean air and water for everyone; health care for

everyone; safe food to eat and proper shelter; decent paying jobs for everyone. Yes, what they stand for is so idiotic. :sarcasm:

[Name removed]

42. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ima_sinnic]

49. omg, stop! my lips are chapped, it hurts to laugh!!

:spray:

:yourock:

[Don Caballero]

57. A BJ joke

How mature. Dean, Kucinich and Hamsher are working against our Democratic President and Democratic Congress.

[Forkboy]

59. Still waiting for that proof of your assertion.

[Individualist]

46. Very few people are going to buy what you're trying to sell.

[flvegan]

56. That's a good disciple. Obey.

[WonderGrunion]

96. Dean has not attempted to divide the party

The other two are fame hounds that feed at the trough of the left but don't actually support helping the poor and downtrodden.

[stopbush]

37. I missed Dean & Kucinich buddying up with Norquist. Link please?

[mzmolly]

75. Ditto.

eom

[WonderGrunion]

97. Dennis did vote with the Repukes and against the Progressive Caucus

on health care reform. Dean is a Democratic warrior. He never sides with repuke scum.

[jonnyblitz]

another great post from you. K & R.

:thumbsup:

[WeDidIt]

40. It's pretty sad when Joe Lieberman has a more progressive voting record than Dennis Kucinich

Yes, that's right. Dennis Kucinich votes with the Republicans more often than Joe Lieberman.

That tells you how "progressive" Dennis Kucinich really is.

[ima_sinnic]

45. is that why the "democrats" ran Joe Lieberman for VP in 2000?

imagine that! who knew?

:rofl:

oh, and by the way, don't blame Nader for Gore's loss, check Lieberman.

[WeDidIt]

47. Which means that Dennis Kucinich is further to the right than Lieberman

Wow, Kucinich is an outright fascist because Joe Lieberman votes with the Democrats more often than Dennis Kucinich.

[Sebastian Doyle]

54. You must be off your meds again

Kucinich further to the right than Lieberdouche? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


BTW, "votes with the Democrats" is a useless designation, thanks to the DLC and the Blue Balled Cowards. A while back here, somebody posted a chart that showed uber-right wing false "Democrat" Diane Feinstein "voted with Democrats" more often than Ted Kennedy. That's how completely full of shit those figures are.

A more accurate measurement would be "votes according to the traditional principles of the Democratic party".

[WeDidIt]

65. According to the voting record, he is.

He votes with the Republicans more often than Lieberdouche does.

[WonderGrunion]

98. He votes "With Repukes" more often

He could always abstain if he didn't agree with a bill but didn't want to vote with the Repukes. But not voting with the repukes wouldn't get him on Faux News as much as he likes to be.

[ima_sinnic]

55. gee, I don't think anybody is very impressed by your spinning, but do go on

slow train wrecks are fascinating.

[Forkboy]

58. LOL...thank you for escorting yourself into the realm of irrelevancy.

Anyone who could type that with a straight face simply isn't meant to to be taken seriously on any topic ever. :rofl:

[WeDidIt]

64. I'm very sorry that the truth hurts, but it is, in fact, the truth.

Kucinich votes with the Republicans more often than Joe Lieberman.

The way you can tell is for any legislation to pass, Joe Lieberman MUST vote for it just so it gets out of the Senate, but then Kucinich votes AGAINST legislation claiming some noble "principle".

At end of the day, Lieberman votes with the Dmeocrats more often than Kucinich.

It's a simple, but very true fact, sad though it is.

[Name removed]

73. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[WeDidIt]

78. You;re looking at pre-2009

In 2009, Dennis Kucinich voted with the Republicans more than Joe Lieberman.

It's a fact. I'm sorry you're hero has feet of clay, but there you are.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

70. You are the second person I have ever put on ignore

You deserved it.

[sabrina 1]

88. More disingenuousness from you.

Kucinich voted against the War in Iraq and against every suplemental to continue funding it that followed. By contrast, many so-called Democrats voted with Bush on issues like this.

He never voted 'with' Republicans. He voted for what he believed was right. Republicans voted against Democrats. Democrats otoh, did not vote against Republicans, they voted with Bush because, we know now, they agreed with him.

Your credibility sinks lower with every baseless claim you make ... try telling the truth for once, it's not that hard. And remember, while lies like the ones you tell, in the dark ages might have passed without comment, we are now living in the age of Google where your lies are easily refuted.

What exactly is it you are trying to achieve? Whatever it is, here's some advice. Try telling the truth, you'd have a better shot at succeeding at whatever it is you're trying to do. I see your handle now, and I know I will read lies and distortions. That about all you accomplished.

[KittyWampus]

43. Kucinich and Dean are/were elected Democrats. Hamsher is an attention whore duped by Norquist.

And what does a bogus call for an investigation into the CofS have to do with the Health Care Bill?

[Tutankhamun]

50. The way Jane Hamsher went after Rahm Emanuel was admirable.

One need not deify or villify her to analyze her latest actions with ojectivity.

[KittyWampus]

60. Falling for Norquist's bogus call for an investigation into nothing is admirable?

[geek tragedy]

61. Just realize that when you join forces with the VRWC in order to

hunt and ultimately destroy yet another Democratic administration--when you take up arms with the enemies of progress and openly aid and abet their agenda--that you will be rightfully considered traitors to whatever cause you claimed to uphold.

Those 'leftists' who would help the Norquist/Gingrich/DeLay/Abramoff movement destroy this administration are the enemy just as much as Tom Tancredo and Sarah Palin.

[MH1]

76. +1

[blondeatlast]

112. Word. nt

[Danger Mouse]

67. I don't think joining forces with Norquist is a good idea.

He's no more trustworthy than any other cynical Republican anxious to make a useful idiot out of somebody naive enough to trust them.
I wasn't pleased with Obama's misguided attempts at bipartisanship, either. I don't see how Hamsher OR Obama made a good move in trying to reach out to Republicans.
It's just offering your hand out to a rabid dog. Inevitably, you are going to be bitten.

[seeinfweggos]

68. G-R-O-V-E-R N-O-R-Q-U-I-S-T

the useful idiots brigade has been outed. i don't include dean because he supports hc reform unlike hamster and kook.

[fascisthunter]

72. The Kooks are the ones Pretending this Bill is Good

[WeDidIt]

79. The kooks are the ones pretending this bill is worse than the status quo n/t

[spiritual_gunfighter]

69. Next one under the bus is

Cenk Uygur. I have already read two OP's claiming he isn't a true liberal and his "show sucks anyway". Just a heads up on who is next on the chopping block.

[MH1]

77. You mean Cenk will be joining Bernie Sanders under that bus?

[havocmom]

71. tempted to make Havocdad register with DU so we can Rec this again!

Nail, squarely pummeled! Thank you. Please put this OP in your journal, so it is easier for fair-minded DUers to find!

[mzmolly]

74. I don't recall Dean or Kucinich getting on Grover Nordquist

bandwagon?

[LostInAnomie]

80. Don't lump Dean in with those other two clowns.

[bvar22]

82. HERE is the Democratic Party I joined 42 years go::

In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all—regardless of station, race, or creed.

Among these are:

The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation;

The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;

The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;

The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;

The right of every family to a decent home;

The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;

The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;

The right to a good education.

All of these rights spell security. And after this war is won we must be prepared to move forward, in the implementation of these rights, to new goals of human happiness and well-being.

America’s own rightful place in the world depends in large part upon how fully these and similar rights have been carried into practice for our citizens.---FDR's Economic Bill of Rights

FDR was the leader of that "Democratic Party", which bears no resemblance to the Party using that name today.
My votes and support belongs to those individuals who best represent THOSE principles as outlined by FDR no matter what their Party affiliation.
Unfortunately, only a handful of "Democrats" like Kucinich and Independent Bernie Sanders qualify for that support.

[Vidar]

86. K&R.

[beardown]

87. The repubs death spiral, part two

The repubs jumped the shark when they started to value their party over the nation and it's citizens. I'm now seeing the same nation destroying flaw appear more and more frequently in the dems.

When a few folks stand up and declare that the emperor has no clothes, regardless of whether or not the emperor is a dem or repub or even a whig, the folks responding the strongest and vilest are the ones that have joined the repubs in placing party over nation.

[merkins]

89. K&R

[dysfunctional press]

90. really- jane hamsher's been elected by her constituents to represent them in public office?

good for her.

what office was she selected to...? :shrug:

[Missy Vixen]

92. Bravo

I have to laugh at the other posters insisting that Jane Hamsher is in this for "the money". What you stupid assholes don't know (and frankly, I hesitate calling them "stupid assholes"; it's an insult to stupid assholes everywhere,) is that Jane Hamsher is a three-time cancer survivor. When she's not doing that, she and Christy Hardin Smith built firedoglake.com with their own blood, sweat and tears. Christy "retired" from the site a few months back. She has lupus. Do any of you think that the two of them might have some stake in seeing health care reform that will actually help somebody in this country pass?

Jane doesn't need their money. She needs the Democrats in Congress and in the White House to act like they've even read the party platform before, let alone defend it. It would also be nice if Democrats would actually vote to protect their constituency's interests instead of their own, but I realize I'm asking an awful lot.

:sarcasm:

[WonderGrunion]

100. Laura Ingraham survived cancer too

Maybe the two of them can start a Grover Norquist fansite together.

Every member of the Progressive Caucus EXCEPT Dennis voted for the health care bill. It gives 30 million Americans access to health care that don't currently have it. I'd say they are voting for their constituency's interest.

Dennis and Blowhard Jane...not so much.

[WonderGrunion]

93. Don't include Dean with Kucinich and Hamsher

Dean never sides with Republicans. He wants this bill to pass so it can be worked on later. Kooch votes against the Progressive caucus and with Repukes. Hamshire just cuddled up with that sociopath Norquist.

[Nikki Stone1]

94. Bravo.

Thank you for posting this. The shills are out in force today.

[WonderGrunion]

101. You don't have to be a shill to see the Hamshire-Norquist alliance

as thoroughly disgusting. Just like when Dennis threw the Progressive Caucus under the bus and voted with the Repukes on HCR.

[Greyhound]

99. NADERITE!1!!!

BAN HIM!!!!

I for one, welcome our corporate overlords.


:sarcasm:

[inna]

102. exactly. KR

[nemo137]

106. It's not "reaching out."

It's not including tax cuts in an appropriations bill. It's not horse-trading. It's not a feel good commercial. What Hamsher did is roughly the equivalent of if a respected progressive voice had said in 1993ish "You know, Mr. Scafie, I think you're on the right track."

You really think another term or two of endless, fruitless investigations is going to be good for the country? You think that's going to do anything to make your life and mine and our fellow citizens' lives better? You really think that Grover Norquist, a man who has gone on record as wanting to roll back the clock to the Gilded Age, wants to put people over corporations? You think that Norquist isn't actually part of the DC establishment?

She's either an idiot or an asshole, at least in this.

[Echo In Light]

108. "Trying to stir up animosity against these individuals will not redeem Obama to many of us"

Knowing that, they're aiming for those on the fence, not us lefties ;)

K&R

[blondeatlast]

113. Dean isn't a useful idiot. He doesn't belong in your OP. nt

[FarLeftFist]

115. Can't she reach out to someone from this side of the political spectrum, like an actual progressive.

[Sultana]

117. Heros?

Who the fuck is Jane Hamsher?

[earth mom]

118. Totally agree. It's sickening the shit people around here EXCUSE Obama for.

The bankster bailout, the ampted up wars, the massive ripoff & giveaway to health insurance companies and that's just some of it.

:puke:

[democracy1st]

119. Would have appreciated if jane had teamed up with someone other than a liberal hater,

there's plenty of repubs she could have teamed up with.