Gingrich: "HCR Will Cut $500-B Out Of Medicare/Caid." What's the truth?

[stopbush]

This is a major talking point for those opposing HCR. I heard Gingrich say this on MTP this morning, so I'm assuming it's either an outright lie or a creative way of spinning a positive in the bill into a negative.

So, what's the truth?

[hobbit709]

1. Truth and Newt are mutually exclusive

[backscatter712]

2. He may be talking about the cuts to Medicare Advantage.

Medicare Advantage was always a boondoggle and giveaway of tax money to the private insurance industry - good riddance.

The truth is that these cuts won't affect patient care, just profitability for rich assholes.

[sandnsea]

7. They aren't eliminating Medicare Advantage

They're changing it to a more competitive bidding structure to hopefully reduce how much it costs.

http://obama-mamas.com/health-care.html

[stopbush]

8. I thought that's what it was about. Liberals need an answer to the Gingrich lies.

I seem to recall a few liberals correcting the liars a few weeks ago, but it seems that isn't happening at this point and the Rs are having success weaving the lie into the discussion without a challenge. Soon, it will be cited as a fact by the MSM.

[Jamastiene]

3. As far as Medicaid goes, the feds will pay 100% the first few years, then

the states will have to start picking up the tab starting at 10% and on up as the years go by. Most states have already cut Medicaid to hell and back. I'm not sure if the proposed Medicaid expansion will end up being mandatory for the states though.

I can't say anything about the Medicare issue, because I do not know.

One rule of thumb: If Newt Gingrich is saying something is true, it is most likely bullshit.

There is plenty about this HCR that is all kinds of wrong, but expanding Medicaid would not be one of them, imho.

[sandnsea]

4. Medicare Advantage & MedPAC were being overpaid

The so-called "cuts" are adjustments to those programs, cost saving benefits that Republicans also say don't exist.

http://obama-mamas.com/health-care.html

[lapfog_1]

5. It reduces ineffienciencies in Medicare

and saves $500B (I believe over 10 years) which is used to fund the subsidies and other parts of the program (Bernie Sanders Community Health Centers, grants and loans for more health care professionals, etc). Also, it pays more for preventative care in Medicare which is estimated to save an enormous amount. And, I believe, it also raises the compensation rates for rural providers for Medicare patients (that was kicked around, I don't know if it's in the Senate bill, pretty sure it's in the House bill).

So, yeah, it CUTS $500B over 10 years... and does it while providing better health care and more compensation for rural doctors for Medicare patients.

Wording is everything.

[Ikonoklast]

6. The truth is that Newt Gingrich is a lying sack of crap.

He speaks, he lies.

Simple.

[laughingliberal]

9. They are cutting $500 billion out of Medicare

The figure President Obama spoke of most was $177 billion of it in cutting the subsidies to Medicare Advantage programs. They are assuming the balance can be saved by adopting 'best practices,' and cutting waste, fraud, and abuse. My concern is that, as always, those who commit the bulk of the waste, fraud, and abuse are the hospital corporations and there will be little in the bill to increase investigation and enforcement of this sector. Instead, we will, likely, see continued hits to the sectors who, actually, can save us money like home health and hospice. They, traditionally, operate with increasingly smaller margins and lack the financial power to lobby heavily. But, yes, Gingrich is correct on the figure.

[amborin]

11. wasn't AARP's lobby involved in this? so now those folks must buy AARP, which is more $$$

[laughingliberal]

23. Medicare Advantage subsidies needed to be cut. They make a healthy profit without our money.

And, yes, AARP is in it for themselves. They were not on board with health care reform til it was moved almost entirely back into the hands of private companies. They also supported the horrible Medicare part D plan.

[BeFree]

10. Typical

Dems cut government spending and pubbies complain.

You know we kicked their ass when all they can do is complain that dems did the right thing.

[underpants]

12. So doctors and hospitals will make less-isn't that another way of putting it?

and in doing so they are driving DOWN the price because the market has to follow.

[FreakinDJ]

13. If his "Lips are moving - He is Lying"

[OHdem10]

14. jhe truth is somewher 450 and 500. Yes this Bill has always

been Medicare Reform much more than HCIR. They were so
stealth about it--many people lost confidence and trust.

They left themselves wide open for GOP to walk in and
exploit.. Sure the GOP will exploit but they are starting
with a truth--Medicare is being cut.

Permitting the Conservative Dems to write the bill--what do
you expect. They are closer to Republicans on Entitlement
Spending than Liberals.

By doing all the cutting, they are giving the GOP a big
gift. We can never again acuse GOP of trying to end Medicare.
"Your own party....." IMO, this whole bill has been handled
horribl6y by the Senate from the GET GO.

[amborin]

15. $43 billion trimmed from Medicare, according to CommonDreams:

"The Senate bill is even weaker than the already comprised piece of legislation passed by the House of Representatives. The number of uninsured capable of gaining insurance will be somewhere around 24 million. With private plans as the alternative, estimates are that more than $450 billion in tax-payer money will be transferred to private insurers in order to allow the uninsured to gain coverage.

However, that coverage will be something akin to the lowest form of car insurance - you get by before the eyes of the state, but get into an accident and you will find yourself facing massive debt. Estimates are that the low-coverage plans would only cover 60% of costs. Even worse news comes for the more than 20 million people who will likely remain uninsured. They will now also have to forfeit 2% of their annual income because of it. A nightmarish scenario indeed - uninsured and penalized!

Smaller parts of the bill also promise negative outcomes. Medicare plans are still being trimmed by $43 billion. Democrats claim it is fat-cutting through the elimination of tax-payer subsidies to private insurers. Seniors fear the long-term impact of the cuts will result in reduced services, especially for quality of life issues such as the ability to participate in exercise programs for free."

snip

commondreams.org

[leftstreet]

16. That's been the intention all along

Especially as several gazillion boomers are poised to start shifting from for-profit health insurance to Medicare.

[amborin]

19. so it not only doesn't expand Medicare, it cuts it!

or should i say guts it?

[stopbush]

21. Wrong, and absolutely wrong. See post #20 below. eom

[amborin]

24. Not wrong, according to Daily Kos:

"It's one-sided for the ad to say the bills would strengthen Medicare. The bills do contain benefits for beneficiaries, including closing the so-called doughnut hole in the prescription drug plan over time and providing additional cost-sharing assistance for lower-income people.

But the House bill also calls for $477 billion in Medicare spending reductions over the decade.

Richard Foster, the chief actuary of the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services, has warned that the reductions in the House's bill could lead some providers to drop out of the program, "possibly jeopardizing access to care for beneficiaries."

Also, people enrolled in Medicare Advantage private plans, which generally offer better benefits that standard fee-for-service Medicare, can expect changes as the bills would cut spending on those plans to bring them more into line with standard Medicare."

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/12/1/809452/-Pro-HCR-Groups-Lying-About-Limits-on-Premium-Increases,-Many-Other-Issues-in-Bill

[stopbush]

25. No. we're talking about people who are buying supplemental Medicare insurance

from private insurers who are receiving taxpayer money to be in the program in the first place. Most are there to make a quick buck by providing a few extra services while making a haul on the subsidies. The "access to care that would be jeopardized for beneficiaries" only effects those who have the $ to buy supplemental care through private insurance.

Basic Medicare benefits wouldn't change at all. You, Kos and your buddy Newt are implying that the bill makes across-the-board cuts to basic Medicare when it doesn't.

[Lasher]

17. PolitiFact has an article about it.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/aug/14/barack-obama/obama-claims-medicare-benefits-will-not-be-cut-und/

[stopbush]

20. Thanks for the link. Here's the money quote:

"The core benefits of Medicare won't change," said Marc Steinberg, deputy director of health policy for Families USA, an advocate for health care consumers. "Most Medicare Advantage plans are solid and resemble traditional Medicare." However, some insurance plans have entered the program "to make a quick buck. They may have to reconsider their budget, which could mean some patients will see changes in the services provided above and beyond traditional Medicare."

Stuart Guterman, assistant vice president for the Commonwealth Fund’s program on payment system reform, had a similar view.

"People enrolled in (Medicare Advantage) get services that people in traditional care do not get under Medicare," he said. "Insurance companies can afford to cover these services because taxpayer money is subsidizing them. Plans will most likely not offer those extra services, but in no case will patients get less Medicare benefits than people in the rest of the program."

So, the Gingrich line is bullshit.

[kestrel91316]

18. I don't know, but I DO know that if Newtie said it, it's prevarication.

[Bitwit1234]

22. The are cutting some of the profits of the Advantage Programs

which were a give away to the Health Companies anyway. bush and the republicans passed this bill which let these companies compete with Medicare. (See they gave a Public Option against Medicare but dont' want a Public Option against the insurance companies.) And as per usual most of the Advantage programs are the ones who are siphoning off money from Medicare with the outrageous and double billing and not paying Hospitals and clinics. But of course, this is what the republicans wanted when they wrote the bill, give insurance companies a foothole in Medicare.