Commenter says he was aboard NWA Flight 253, saw suspected terrorist board the plane

[carincross]

Source: Metro Detroit Local News and Talk

MLive.com commenter, Pug (a k a Kurt Haskell), says he was aboard Northwest Airlines Flight 253 and saw suspected terrorist Umar Farouk Abdul Mutallab board the plane in Amsterdam.

"I was on this flight today and am thankful to be alive. My wife and I were returning from an African safari and had this connecting flight through Amsterdam. I sat in row 27, which was 7 rows behind the terrorist. I got to see the whole thing take place and it was very scary. Thanks to a few quick acting people I am still alive today. For those of you talking about airline security in this thread, I was next to the terrorist when he checked in at the Amsterdam airport early on Christmas. My wife and I were playing cards directly in front of the check in counter. This is what I saw (and I relayed this to the FBI when we were held in customs):

"An Indian man in a nicely dressed suit around age 50 approached the check in counter with the terrorist and said "This man needs to get on this flight and he has no passport." The two of them were an odd pair as the terrorist is a short, black man that looked like he was very poor and looks around age 17(Although I think he is 23 he doesn't look it). It did not cross my mind that they were terrorists, only that the two looked weird together. The ticket taker said "you can't board without a passport". The Indian man then replied, "He is from Sudan, we do this all the time". I can only take from this to mean that it is difficult to get passports from Sudan and this was some sort of sympathy ploy. The ticket taker then said "You will have to talk to my manager", and sent the two down a hallway. I never saw the Indian man again as he wasn't on the flight. It was also weird that the terrorist never said a word in this exchange. Anyway, somehow, the terrorist still made it onto the plane. I am not sure if it was a bribe or just sympathy from the security manager.

"FBI also arrested a different Indian man while we were held in customs after a bomb sniffing dog detected a bomb in his carry on bag and he was searched after we landed. This was later confirmed while we were in customs when an FBI agent said to us "You are being moved to another area because this area is not safe. Read between the lines. Some of you saw what just happened."(The arrest of the other Indian man). I am not sure why this hasn't made it into any news story, but I stood about 15-20 feet away from the other Indian man when he was cuffed and arrested after his search.

"What also didn't make the news is that we were held on the plane for 20 minutes AFTER IT LANDED!. A bomb could have gone off then. This wasn't too smart of security to not let us off the plane immediately."

Read more: http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2009/12/commenter_says_he_was_aboard_n.html

---

Has anyone checked out this account? Certainly, no one is talking about this on the MSM! Maybe we ought to talk to Mr. Haskell before we invade Yemen!

[defendandprotect]

1. Quite a story which shows this whole thing smells even more than anyone knew!!

[Daemonaquila]

2. Needs verification.

An interesting story, possibly true, but in need of verification. If this really what happened several people really screwed up.

[dmr]

48. Agree. Lori Haskell was on the local news tonight

Video at link:

http://www.9and10news.com/category/story/?id=194308

- snip -
Haskell spoke to Northern Michigan's News Leader from her law office in Taylor, MI, that she runs with her husband Kurt. She and her husband say that after the incident, they realized they'd seen Abdulmutallab involved in a suspicious moment at the Amsterdam airport.

They say a well-dressed Indian man presented Abdulmutallab to an airline agent posted outside of their flight's gate and said the 23 year-old Nigerian needed to get on the plane. The Indian man told the agent that the younger man did not have a passport and was Sudanese.

"We never saw again until the incident when he tried to blow up our plane," says Lori.
- snip -

[truthisfreedom]

3. Freaky. We have to keep track of this story.

Seriously.

[high density]

4. Of course they weren't immediately let off the plane

Where were they supposed to go? Back to the terminal so that could get blown up instead?

[jberryhill]

11. Well, you see....

Whenever you have a crime scene with a hundred people in a closed vehicle, the first thing one should do is scatter them into a larger
building...

[blondeatlast]

23. ...

:spray:

[jberryhill]

5. This story is bullshit

I like how it has morphed since yesterday, though, but still doesn't reflect boarding reality at Schiphol.

Passport control is not run by the airlines, and is after check-in, but well before the gate.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

6. I don't know about "passport control" exactly

but the last few times I flew international, I was asked for the passports at the airlines check-in. At the security check, they seemed more interested in the boarding pass, though I passed both to the TSA guy.

[blondeatlast]

10. My experience as well, although I was asked for my passport at TSA. nt

[nodehopper]

7. I fly out of Schiphol often, most recently last week.

They do check passports at the gate--that is the last place where the passports are checked. It is possible that either that was the last hurdle for this duo or somehow they managed to get into the airport at a place that allowed them to pass the previous passport checkpoints. I read his account yesterday and I do not see how it morphed. But yeah, the main point of my post is, the airline reps most definitely do check passports at the gate--I flew Lufthansa, so at that particular point my passport was checked by Lufthansa gate attendants.

[jberryhill]

8. And you got to the gate area without a passport?

No, you had to have a passport to get to the gate area.

[blondeatlast]

13. That's been the case at every airport I've been to--and that's been several all

over the world.

[jberryhill]

22. You do not get to the gate area without a passport at Schiphol

Or Frankfurt, or CDG, or SYD, or BRU, or BKK, or CAI, or GRU, or even GCM for that matter.

[blondeatlast]

24. I was unclear, sorry. I'm actually agreeing with you but I understand why

that wasn't clear.

[jberryhill]

28. Oh... missed that....

The point is that while a passport might be checked at boarding (since the airlines actually get fined if they deliver someone to an international terminal who doesn't have one) - one does not get into the boarding area of an international terminal without having had a passport check prior to then.

[HipChick]

29. Don't they get fined and also have to return the person from to point of origin at their own expense

[jberryhill]

31. Yes

...and that would have gone for the carrier who got the person to AMS.

[blondeatlast]

30. Exactly right. Maybe I need some more caffeine this AM, lol! nt

[jberryhill]

32. Then there is the other bogus part....

About the "bomb sniffing dog".

I always enjoy seeing the crack team member of the USDA Beagle Brigade upon arrival in the US.

The Beagle Brigade, of course, is simply looking for fruits and vegetables.

Bomb detection is done earlier than the point at which the bags are sent up into the international baggage claim and customs area, because looking for a bomb at that point would be stupid (as if some terrorist is going to have a bomb in checked luggage; get to his destination; and then claim the bag and go through customs in order to get a bomb into the country which could perfectly well be built here without all the trouble of smuggling it in).

[Ghost in the Machine]

46. Yet someone managed to get explosives on the plane...

doesn't it make sense that they would use dogs again, just to double check everything? If someone got explosives onboard, they could have stashed some anywhere, could they not??

Peace,

Ghost

[jberryhill]

50. Yes - and it would be checked BEFORE moving luggage into the terminal /nt

[Ghost in the Machine]

53. What if no one thought of it until AFTER the baggage had been unloaded?

What is the standard protocol for dealing with potential bombs on planes.. you know, since they aren't supposed to *be* on planes to begin with?

[jberryhill]

54. Because international luggage - all international luggage - is screened prior to claim

I travel with a lot of odd looking electronic stuff. I regularly get the little "we checked your bag" note that TSA puts into the bag when they open it.

The USDA APHIS beagle brigade works the claim area because that's where people are with their carry ons.

People bring a lot of interesting stuff back from AMS.

[nodehopper]

37. what are you talking about?

I said that at Schiphol airline gate agents check passports at the gate. I have no idea if the man somehow managed to bypass other security checks, I am just saying that yes, at Schiphole the gates are one of the areas where your passport is checked. At that particular point it is checked by gate agents working for specific airlines, which is what was being disputed.

[HipChick]

14. I flew on KLM, and they would not let me board initially because my ticket

did not match the name on my passport at the time - my first name on the ticket was an abbreviated version of my full name on the passport - so until this story is verified it smells BS too...

[barkingbill]

42. it isn't bullshit.

if you have someone vouching for you from security or who has clout you do get to the terminal

it is possible....the customs people could do this...they do it for these sudanese refugees apparently...have you guys even read the story?

[jberryhill]

51. Dutch customs officials can't change NWA or US customs rules

The guy had a validly issued US visa.

[malaise]

9. In which airport can you play cards

directly in front of a check in counter these days?

[blondeatlast]

12. Not buying a word of it without some verification. nt

[barkingbill]

45. i wish people would have said this about WMDs in iraq

and a million other things cnn and nyt and the govenment have pushed on us.

[HipChick]

15. Where is the Indian man he said that was arrested by the FBI? n/t

[WeDidIt]

16. I don't buy any of that story. It sounds contrived and bogus as hell.

Anybody can post anything they want to on the internet. There is nothing to suggest there is any veracity to this story.

[marshall]

36. It seems to coincide with other things I am hearing

I'm not sure if it's somebody embellishing or guessing, but some of the elements are corroborated from other things I've read.

[barkingbill]

39. its the only story that explains how he got on the plane

i dont find it odd. and the guy, kurt haskell, has been interviewed by everyone from npr to fox news.....
its gone mainstream...

maybe you don't like what it suggests?

[jasi2006]

17. Why not have keith and Rachel check this out.

They are most thorough in their investigating.

[jberryhill]

33. Because the story is facially stupid

A) You can't get to the gate area of AMS without a passport; and

B) Bomb sniffing dogs don't work in the baggage claim area of US customs.

Point B is the particularly stupid one. Bomb detection is done before sending the bags up into the terminal. What idiot is going to smuggle a bomb into the US?

[barkingbill]

41. these points of yours are easy to shoot down .

B) they brought the bomb sniffing dogs after the plane landed BECAUSE of the incident....is that so hard to understand?

A) you CAN get to the gate area of AMS without a passport if you have a sharp dressed man with you who works for, security, the airport, customs, or a government etc etc....who has clout who is vouching for you. that is what the story reports....ok? maybe you guys are unsettled by what this is suggesting and not the story itself?

[jberryhill]

49. Bomb Sniffing Dogs...

"alert" by sitting down. Most people wouldn't notice the alert. They are trained that way because having the dogs paw at the package or become excited is counterproductive.

If there is suspicion of an explosive on the plane or it's cargo, the plane is searched and the cargo is not moved into the terminal building until it is checked. Running it up through baggage claim, instead of checking it on the tarmac is just plain stupid. Nobody in their right mind would handle luggage suspected of containing an explosive device. You think someone said "There might be a bomb, so let's have the baggage handlers throw it around, put it on the conveyors into a secure terminal, and THEN we'll check it for explosives.". That would be stupid.

No "sharp dressed man" is getting you into the gate area or onto the plane without a passport. There are entirely separate authorities here. First, the Durch government doesn't let anyone into the area who has not been cleared by them. Second, the airline doesn't take pax without passports because they will be fined in the US and have to take the pax back. The Dutch government doesn't have any clout with the airline and vice versa.

[HipChick]

18. Substitute Pakistani for Indian (we look very alike) and suddenly this story makes a lot of sense

lol!..from the comment section...and now you'd have a story - how would this man know what the ethnicity was of these men anyway?

[blondeatlast]

21. My ex is Indian and has been mistaken for Italian and Spanish.

I don't buy a word of this.

[KittyWampus]

19. So now it's an Indian man. Yesterday that detail hadn't been included yet.

[HipChick]

20. Yesterday, it was just a man in a well-dressed suit...Hmm

[Swamp Rat]

25. Captain Kirk says he was aboard NWA Flight 253, saw suspected Klingon board the plane

or was it Captain Kangaroo? :think:

[mn9driver]

26. No one is talking about it because this is total nonsense.

1. The guy had a tourist visa issued by the US State Department in 2008.
2. He lived and attended school in England for a while.
3. He traveled to Yemen.
4. He traveled to lots of countries.
5. He was from a rich family
7. He arrived at Schipol from Africa and immigration control would NOT have allowed him into the terminal in the first place without a passport.
8. HE HAD A PASSPORT!!
9. Another bomb? In a carry on? That some guy just quietly sat with while waiting for the dogs and cops to come and arrest him? Those are some good space brownies that Mlive guy ate in Amsterdam.

There is nothing in this fabrication that checks out or makes any sense at all.

[barkingbill]

44. its not... ill help you with this one....

the question is not "did he have a passport?"

obviously the guy probably had a passport at one time, probably a nigerian one....i dont think that's the issue here.
the question is...maybe someone wanted to get him through security without any questions asked....maybe that someone is the sharp dressed man?

is the question why he wouldnt board the plane with his normal nigerian passport?

well maybe he, or whoever organized this, were afraid he would be frisked or people refusing him because he was on the terror watch list.

get the picture?

they wanted to make sure he was on that plane. who the "they" is....should be the next thread....

[jberryhill]

52. That makes absolutely no sense

His name was on the passenger list.

He had a valid US visa.

If you are a ticketed passenger with a valid visa, and you want to get on the plane with "no questions asked" then you present your damned passport.

There is nothing in the passport that is going to trigger a search. One of the reasons why US bound flight check in closes early is because the passenger manifest is sent to the US and checked before the plane takes off.

http://www.dhs.gov/xnews/releases/pr_1186668114504.shtm

Get it? The DHS knows who is on the plane before it can leave a foreign runway to the US. There is nobody in Holland, even wearing a tuxedo, who can change that.

What you are saying is not even internally consistent.

[The Backlash Cometh]

27. An Indian man?

I'm waiting for the hysteria to sit in and the call begins for a recall of all this special Visas.

[proud2BlibKansan]

34. Playing cards in front of the check in counter?

Did the people in line have to step over them to get to and from the counter?

[Truth2Tell]

40. Sitting on the floor next to or near

the ticket counter is something I have done many times. Reading a book, talking to someone, or even playing cards. I don't see that part of the story as implausible at all.

[clear eye]

35. K & R n/t

[TornadoTN]

38. This is another one of those bullshit stories made up for attention

As I understand it, this guy had a Passport and a Visa. That makes the whole, "This guy has no passport" part of the story just ridiculous.


Plus, I fly international regularly and I'm asked for my Passport at least twice (sometimes more - especially in China). Once at the check-in counter and once again going through the security gate. You don't make it to point B.) unless you've already shown your passport at point A.)

Flying from Tokyo-Narita to Detroit, you get the special privledge of getting to show it several times when they queue the lines up to get into the waiting area after you've connected from a flight from mainland China. It's happened to me in London and Johannesburg as well and they hoard you for your boarding pass and passport all along the way.

[barkingbill]

43. again...if he has someone on the inside helping him your point is mute...

thats what kurt haskell is contending right? that someone with clout, a customs official, agent etc..., helped the guy through security? is this hard to understand?


as for the "as i understand it" ....what does that mean? do you have inside information he used his passport at the airport? if so...please devulge...sounds like you are just saying "of course he had a passport...he had a visa."

again i explained this to someone else before....he probably had a passport at one time. most people do. the issue is maybe someone was trying to get this guy through security since he was on a terror watch list and had explosives strapped to his underwear....ugh.

[HipChick]

47. Do you believe everything that is posted on the internet?

Airlines are fined bigtime $$$ if anyone arrives here from a foreign country without proper documentation, and then they fly the person back at airline expense..I know freepers want this to be a story really bad..but until some verification shows up..still smells like BS