Australian astronomer finds crater from ancient stories, Google maps

[Adsos Letter]

Source: iTWire
by William Atkins

Duane Hamacher, a doctoral candidate at Macquarie University, used ancient folklore from an Australian Aboriginal people and modern Google maps to locate a meteorite crater in central Australia.

Hamacher considers himself an educator within the field of astronomy. He is associated with the Sydney Observatory and the Foundation for Astronomy at Macquarie University.

He investigates how the Australian Aboriginal peoples have incorporated the darkened sky above their lands into their ancient cultures.

Duane Hamacher looks at paintings, stone arrangements, historical literature, and other ancient folklore to understand their cultures with respect to astronomy, archaeoastronomy, and ethnoastronomy.

Link: http://www.itwire.com/content/view/30255/1066/

[tabatha]

1. I am glad there are still enough of those stories memorized.

[Adsos Letter]

2. We lose many, many valuable insights when we lose oral traditions.

[proud patriot]

32. I am too

:)

[enlightenment]

3. Ah, I LOVE interdisciplinary research!

Way to go, Mr. Hamacher.

[Adsos Letter]

13. William Dever, one of the leaders in Syro-Palestinian archaeology

has long been calling for greater dialogue/cooperation and integration of the various disciplines that can be brought to bear in reconstructing the past. An excellent work, in which he presents his case for a stronger interdisciplinary approach and the current roadblocks to it, can be found in: What Did the Biblical Writers Know and When Did They Know It?: What Archaeology Can Tell Us About the Reality of Ancient Israel

An eminently readable book by an eminent scholar in the field.

He has had a long-running argument with Israel Finkelstein over the nature of ancient Jewish history.

Link: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/080282126X/ref=s9_simp_gw_s0_p14_t1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-2&pf_rd_r=14DS9GS6ZXEGCYHH2E6G&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=470938631&pf_rd_i=507846

[enlightenment]

27. I have appreciated Dever's views on the value of

interdisciplinarity for awhile now, even though I have not a great deal of scholarly interest in Biblical archaeology. Dever keeps it on a rational plane, however, and that makes it worthwhile to read - and he practices what he 'preaches' (apologies, Dr. Dever!), which is what drives the multi-focal point forward.

Thanks for the link!

[bertman]

4. I heard an interesting comment the other night that said that MOST of the world's history

has been passed down through storytelling/oral traditions and not through the written word.

I believe it was in reference to some of the tribes in South America that are now almost extinct.

[alfredo]

5. It appears to be at about two o'clock from the Geographical center of Australia.

Watarra National park is at the center of Australia. And that is near Ayres rock.

[duanehamacher]

24. This is Tnorala - Gosse's Bluff Crater

Tnorala

[alfredo]

26. So is this the same one mentioned in the OP

[eppur_se_muova]

30. Hey, it's the (re)-discoverer! Welcome to DU! nt

[duanehamacher]

31. no, different craters

No, Gosse's Bluff crater is well known, but is in Arrernte country. The crater I found is in Palm Valley (also Arrernte country) and was previously unknown. Gosse's Bluff is nearby, but still a bit distant.

[aquart]

6. The meteorite fell 20 million years ago but the aborigines remember it?

What's wrong with this picture?

[duanehamacher]

7. crater find

That is not what I said... there is a LOT more to it than that, which the media doesn't include b/c it takes up too much space. -Duane Hamacher

[Boudica the Lyoness]

9. Where can we find out more?

Thanks :)

[Brother Buzz]

10. The Arrernte people made the connection between falling stars (meteorite) and the crater?

That is really cool they had enough extended knowledge to make that connection. Are there dreaming stories of other (recent) crater sites that helped make that connection?

[Mojorabbit]

11. Welcome to DU

I'd love to hear more about this. It is wonderful and fascinating.

[Adsos Letter]

14. I'll second that "Welcome to DU!" Where can we get an accurate accounting?

[Boudica the Lyoness]

8. I wondered the same thing.

The aborigines have lived in the area for only 20,000 years and the meteorite fell millions of years ago. Weird. Maybe I'm missing something or it has something to do with their ancient Arrernte dreaming stories.

[duanehamacher]

12. explanation of crater finding

As hard as they try, the media rarely get it right. All of the explanatory information is lost and people are left scratching their heads. Case in point.

An Arrernte Dreaming story told about a star that fell to a place called Puka in Palm Valley (a relatively small area). The stories were recorded in the mid and late 20th century... not "ancient" times). The story prompted me to look there for a crater on Google Maps and lo-and-behold, we found one. We *estimate* the crater age to be in the millions of years due to the level of erosion, but we do not know for sure.

The *possibility* that the Arrernte deduced that it was caused from a cosmic impact is taken from the Arrernte Dreaming story of Gosse's Bluff, a 142 Ma crater that has origins attributed to a cosmic impact. We don't know if the Puka story and the crater are connected, other than being in the same place. It may be a case of sheer coincidence. But there certainly is a crater, and it was found using the story.

Papers on these findings will be submitted to the journals 'Archaeoastronomy' and 'Meteoritics & Planetary Science'. Please go to the following website in a week or so for updates and paper pre-prints (I won't have access to the university webpages until the 4th):

http://www.warawara.mq.edu.au/aboriginal_astronomy/

-Duane Hamacher

[Boudica the Lyoness]

15. This is so interesting.

Thanks so much for the link and welcome to DU. :yourock:

[Adsos Letter]

16. Thankyou for your clarification, as well as pointing us to further info.

And welcome to DU.

[duanehamacher]

17. Coordinates of Puka Crater

-24.051481, 132.709375

Use Google maps or earth

-Duane Hamacher

[Lochloosa]

18. Thanks duanehamacher

and welcome to DU

[myrna minx]

21. Thank you so much for the link and welcome to DU!

:hi:

[duanehamacher]

23. Thanks for the welcome, but...

...I'm not a Democrat, I'm a Libertarian :P

[myrna minx]

25. Well, to the gallows with ye!

;-) I haven't had an opportunity to read your link as of yet, but I appreciate you taking the time to respond to our questions. I may have one or two after I have read your information. Thanks again.

[aquart]

28. How old is the Gosse's Bluff crater?

[duanehamacher]

29. The age of Gosse's Bluff crater is...

142.5 ± 0.8 million years

[canetoad]

33. Is this the crater?

Read about your discovery in The Age and immediately tried to plot it's location. Thank you for posting here, always great to see Aussies.

On Edit: I just checked the co-ordinates you posted and I am way out. Another example of bad reporting - the article I read clearly said 150km South West of Alice Springs.

[duanehamacher]

34. Well...

...not many of the journalists got the story right. In some cases, it's completely off. Oh well.

BTW - although I live and work in Oz, I'm actually American... Mizzou alumni (B.S. Physics 2004) ;)

[druidity33]

19. K&R

Surprised and delighted to see the author/discoverer here on DU. Welcome Duane!

Really interesting stuff.

What other discoveries have been made using folklore and other tradition i wonder. Or more importantly, what hasn't been discovered that could be?

[TexasObserver]

20. Recommend

[malaise]

22. Great post

Happy New Year :hi: