BREAKING: Health Care Reform negotiations WERE televised. Hours and hours of them.

[cherokeeprogressive]

Therefore, we've reached the quota for "transparency". The negotiations will now move behind closed doors.

Congressperson Pelosi has made the statement that this bill has been the most transparent legislation ever created. It is her opinion as well that we've reached the "Transparency Quota", and that the public need not be concerned with further information until President Obama puts pen to paper.

"Trust us."

BOHICA, people. In an unprecedented and little reported move, a rider has been attached to an obscure transportation bill currently being voted on that will appropriate $50 billion dollars in order to supply each member of the American voting public with their own small tube of Anal Eze so as to make the insertion less noticeable.

The "Transparency Quota" has been reached. There is nothing more to see here. Now, please move along (Oh, and here's your tube).

:sarcasm:

[nightrain]

1. knr. sad and painful.

[JuniperLea]

2. We know what is in both bills...

And we know they can't deviate from what's already there. Nothing new will be presented. What's the point? The final will be a combination of what we already know.

I'm sure they don't want to be bombarded with phone calls, emails, and faxes while they hammer things together. There's really no point because we can't add or detract from what's there.

[bigtree]

3. it's worse than that

Reasonable and practical provisions in the House bill will be sacrificed in deference to the Senate version, just to ensure final passage in that functionally undemocratic body.

[Captain Hilts]

6. As President Snowe would want it. nt

[JuniperLea]

23. According to what crystal ball?

I'm really weary of all the predictions... seriously. I prefer actual facts to predictions.

[bigtree]

26. when we get the facts, the bottom-line on the final bill

. . . it will be too late to effectively advocate for the provisions we favor or object to. Of course, it would serve the interests of those who will support of whatever they eventually pass to have those with concerns remaining ignorant and mum until then.

[JuniperLea]

29. We've already done that...

And what they have to work with isn't going to change. If we were to do as you propose, we would have no bill passed this year. There simply isn't time.

[HughMoran]

32. ...and we all agreed this would happen

Why is repeating the obvious a good argument?

Oh, that's right, because it pisses people off and promotes the negative atmosphere here.

Keep up the good work ;)

[bigtree]

36. wtf?

You spend most of your time here these days sniping at and degrading critics of this administration's policy - and you accuse that post of mine as 'promoting a negative atmosphere? You really don't like politics or political discussion, do you? I think you believe posting here is some kind of campaign. I don't see it that way. I'm here to discuss issues, and occasionally vent. I really don't know what more (or less) you expect from a discussion board. Maybe there's somewhere else on the net you can find where everyone agrees with you. Sort of a HughMoran.com.

[HughMoran]

38. ...and?

You attack me instead of acknowledging that everybody agreed that the House provisions would not make it into the final bill.

So, I think it's obvious who's stating a political fact and who's here to stir the pot.

[Name removed]

39. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

5. What's the point in having transparency?

It's astounding that you even feel the need to ask the rhetorical question, but I shouldn't be surprised anymore.

[cherokeeprogressive]

8. What's the POINT?

I, for one, do NOT want "the most important legislation since WWII" finalized behind closed doors by people who seem to hold corporate interests equally as high as those of American Citizens.

Hey, but that's just me. As a child, I used to get in trouble for taking things apart in order to see how they worked.

[JuniperLea]

22. What do you expect transparency to do in this case?

When everything they have to work with has been decided, and no new items will be inserted?

[FrenchieCat]

Aye!

To believe that elected Democrats should be dumb enough to allow Cable Company owned C-Span and the GOP to bait and manipulate us once again is sheer lunacy. For those who hop on that train....I've got a bridge to sell them.....

Transparancy for the sake of entertaining the media and the opposition to healthcare reform is kind of like encouraging town hall meetings for the sake of discussion on an important national matter; Those were "shown" all over the media for days on end. Guess they were supposed to be helpful to the "democratic" way, but did they advance the issue of health care? I believe that they hurt the case, and now, here we go again!

Guess some folks never learn, and aren't interested in understand that politics is the art of the possible, not the art of stalling till its dead.

[saracat]

21. Jeez, you never stop, no matter how absurd. We have a right to know what is happening behind those

And now you are attacking C-SPAN? For what ? Running proceedings with no commentary? The same media you looove to castigate was intrumental in getting this President elected with the barrels of print and videotape dedicated to fawning and praising him. And yet, because many are disappointed in the President's current positions, some insist on painting everything as a media conspiracy. ALL news insn't FOX NEWS.We do have left wing commentary as well, such as Olberman, Maddow, and others. What is really bothering you is that they are stepping out of line and criticizing where they feel it is warrented.

We were manipulated and it wasn't just by the media. The Campaign and the WH engages in its own manipulation as well.What do you think any administration has a press office for? Every WH only wants you to hear what they "Want" you to hear and this WH is not any different.

[JuniperLea]

24. I'm sorry... but that was the last personal attack I ever want to see from you...

You have good ideas, and some sound judgement on many issues, but your personal attacks are disgusting. So long.

[saracat]

31. I am merely refuting what the poster is saying. I didn't call her offensive names

or attack her. I merely disagree.If pointing out a position is absurd is apersonal attack, there isn't any romm for differing opinions.

[GMA]

34. Like the op says,

nothing to see here, just move along. Are you first in line?

[laughingliberal]

37. Perhaps but I find a lot of people still don't know what's there

For instance, I'm finding a lot of people who don't know that the bill will still allow rescissions. There is some talk, also, that the House might push to have some parts of their bill replace some parts of the Senate bill. Would be nice if we were allowed to see what our government is doing. If they don't like phone calls, emails, faxes, etc...they might need to see what they can do about that pesky right to seek redress from our government.

[JuniperLea]

40. The ignorant are at fault for their ignorance in this instance...

There are links all over DU showing both bills. There are even links to sites that line both up side by side and discuss the differences.

I'm having a hard time mustering sympathy for the uninformed... especially the vociferously inclined uninformed.

[laughingliberal]

42. I have yet to see any of the web sites that go into great detail and not one has mentioned the

loophole allowing rescissions to continue. I found that in the bill. It is a long bill and I'm just not inclined to fault average people who aren't able to make it through the 2000 pages. There are a lot of people whose lives don't allow a lot of time for research. I'm not going to fault them cause they're busy working a couple of jobs and trying to raise their kids. They might be able to catch a little on C-span if it was there but not everyone's life allows for the kind of research I've done to hunt down the poison pills in the bill.

[Captain Hilts]

4. Secret meetings in the WH with PhRMA, now, this. Ugh. nt

[LLStarks]

7. You make me sick. This a major government proceeding. There is no quota for transparency. nt

[Fumesucker]

12. That's right, no transparency needed at all..

Don't you trust your government to do what's best for you?

What are you, some kind of teabagger or something?

Yes, it's :sarcasm:..

[avaistheone1]

13. Just another sign our democracy is broken.

[cherokeeprogressive]

15. Yeah, well grab a bucket and have a seat because there are many more like me who are tired of

hearing that there have been "hours and hours" of televised negotiations and that should be enough.

What's your pleasure? Dramamine or Bonine? I gots both.

[dflprincess]

16. Ummm reread the OP

I believe the poster was just summing up Pelosi's attitude, not his own. Pelosi is the one who should be making you sick, not the poster.

[Captain Hilts]

17. This isn't the Joint Chiefs discussing our policies in Afghanistan. It's healthcare. nt

[JuniperLea]

25. I'm sorry... but that was the last personal attack I ever want to see from you...

You have valid points on occassion... but it's not worth seeing your personal attacks. So long.

[Parker CA]

9. Unless every single hour and minute is televised, it surely doesn't count.

;-)

[G_j]

10. she really said that?

Transparency Quota?

it's obvious we've already reached our democracy quota...

[cherokeeprogressive]

11. She said that the process of HCR has been the most transparent of any legislation in HISTORY.

She never mentioned the words "transparency quota". I made the inference.

[G_j]

14. yes

same thing, you just put it more honestly.

[sandnsea]

41. She didn't much of any of that

Q: Madam Speaker, it came to light today that C-SPAN wrote a letter, Mr. Lamb wrote to you guys to have this process be transparent in regards to the conference committee. Right now it’s being done with a ping-pong. Any response on that? Mr. Boehner announced the favor of this to be out in public. President Obama was in favor of that on the campaign trail…

Speaker Pelosi. Really? There are a number of things that he swore on the campaign trail. But I have referred that letter to the Assistant to the Speaker. Mr. Van Hollen, would you like to respond?

Assistant to the Speaker Chris Van Hollen. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Let me just point out first that the health care debate in this piece of legislation has been subjected to an unprecedented degree of public scrutiny and input. The original bill was put on the Internet for the public to inspect. You then had a summer where you had thousands of hearings around the country and town meetings and both town hall meetings where people were showing up as well as telephone town hall meetings. You had a whole series of hearings. In fact, I think it is important to note that there were over 100 hearings held by the chairmen of the three committees who are here with us today - heard from 181 witnesses, 83 hours of markup, the list goes on.

So we will continue to have that kind of open process as we go through this next phase. There will obviously be discussions between Members of the House and Senate, but we will continue to keep the American people informed as we have in the earlier stages.

Q: Will you allow the C-SPAN cameras in?

Assistant to the Speaker Van Hollen. We don’t even know yet whether there is going to be a conference, as the Speaker said.

Speaker Pelosi. It’s not excluded.

Assistant to the Speaker Van Hollen. It’s not clear whether that is going to happen.

Q: Madam Speaker, one of your colleagues today called bypassing conference committee - he told me that it’s an assault to democracy. So how are you going to convince some of your Members that…

Speaker Pelosi. Well, I don’t know who you are talking about, but what I will say that there has never been a more open process for any legislation and anyone who serves here has experienced. As Mr. Van Hollen said, and as you know, tens of thousands of people participated in our town meetings, over 100 witnesses in our bipartisan hearings that were held, and the list goes on. I’m not going to repeat what he has said.

http://obama-mamas.com/blog/?p=902

[G_j]

45. thanks

I'm not sure exactly what she is saying..

[sandnsea]

46. Well it's pretty fucking clear

"As Mr. Van Hollen said, and as you know, tens of thousands of people participated in our town meetings, over 100 witnesses in our bipartisan hearings that were held, and the list goes on. I’m not going to repeat what he has said."

What did he say?

"So we will continue to have that kind of open process as we go through this next phase."

What process?

"Let me just point out first that the health care debate in this piece of legislation has been subjected to an unprecedented degree of public scrutiny and input. The original bill was put on the Internet for the public to inspect. You then had a summer where you had thousands of hearings around the country and town meetings and both town hall meetings where people were showing up as well as telephone town hall meetings. You had a whole series of hearings. In fact, I think it is important to note that there were over 100 hearings held by the chairmen of the three committees who are here with us today - heard from 181 witnesses, 83 hours of markup, the list goes on."

Most of the people on this board haven't even watched what was televised. It's just another concocted outrage.

[LLStarks]

18. How is this getting rec'd? Closed-door sessions of Congress are shameful. We need a public record.nt

[LiberalAndProud]

19. I think you missed the sarcasm in the OP.

Sometimes the tag is implied.

[cherokeeprogressive]

20. LOL. I went back and put the tag in. Shoulda figured... n/t

[salguine]

27. What the fuck is BOHICA? I have such acronym fatigue I could fucking scream.

[cherokeeprogressive]

28. I'm sorry. Bend Over, Here It Comes Again. n/t

[Name removed]

33. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[salguine]

48. Okay. Sorry if that was a pit peevish. Like I said...extreme acronym fatigue...

[leftstreet]

35. Kinda sounded like a new drug. 'Ask your Doctor if BOHICA is right for you'

:rofl:

[laughingliberal]

43. Lol!

Now, that's funny. I don't care who ya are. :rofl:

[salguine]

47. Actually I was wondering whether to take the wife there for our next vacation.

[flyarm]

30. k & r !!

[Greyhound]

44. We Won!

Oh, err...

wait a minute...