Police Dog Stabbed Twice

[paulsby]

store employee stabbed too. they were chasing a shoplifter.

here's the pop quiz. if an officer sees a person stabbing a police k-9, can he shoot the man? iow, is deadly force authorized to protect a DOG? i don't think any k-9 officer would hesitate to do so, but is it constitutionally reasonable, or an unlawful seizure a la tennessee v. garner?

i can't find any case law on this... and i'm a firearm instructor.

(story continues and pic of police dog and partner at link)
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http://www.komonews.com/news/local/81985302.html
PUYALLUP, Wash. -- A police dog that was stabbed while helping capture a shoplifter at a Wal-Mart store is expected to recover.

Puyallup Police Lt. Dave McDonald said the incident began Monday morning when two employees were chasing a suspected shoplifter from the store at 310 31st Avenue SE. Investigators said the man was trying to steal electronics and other items, and even cut a hole in a tarp to pass the stolen items to an accomplice waiting outside. When employees spotted the man in the act, he fled, they said.

One of the employees caught up with the fleeing man, but the shoplifter stabbed the employee twice - in the abdomen and rear end, McDonald said. Police arrived and Daro, a police dog that has been with the department since 2003, chased the attacker through yards and over fences and caught him about four blocks from the store.

McDonald said the man stabbed the dog twice in the leg and neck, but Daro managed to hold the suspected shoplifter until officers arrived. The dog was rushed to an animal hospital and was treated for a severed vein in his leg and a stab wound in his neck. McDonald said the dog is expected to make a full recovery.

[LakeSamish706]

1. if an officer sees a person stabbing a police k-9, can he shoot the man? iow, is deadly force author

A police dog is an equal member of the force (at least in Canada). So yep a police office is justified in using deadly force if his dog is in jeopardy.

[paulsby]

5. that's good to know... in canada

i just can;'t find any case law on it in the US.

fwiw, in THIS case, it wouldn't be an issue since he had already stabbed a PERSON, to wit, the store employee.

i'm just speaking generally.

[LiberalFighter]

10. Check the state law. Many states probably equate it police officer.

[paulsby]

11. i work in WA and tried to find it in the RCW

but haven't yet. otoh, ianal and not an expert in lexis-nexis work

[LiberalFighter]

23. RCW

9A.04.020 a
To forbid and prevent conduct that inflicts or threatens substantial harm to individual or public interests;

In conjunction with Title 16 I would think it could be prosecutable. Although, I don't think Washington does much in the way for k9 units.

[WhiteTara]

27. they did in Ukiah CA a few years ago.

Killed the guy.

[XemaSab]

2. According to Wikipedia

in many jurisdictions, harming a police dog is a felony.

[paulsby]

6. but cops can't automatically use deadly force for felonies

that was what tennessee vs. garner established.

for example, burglary is a felony. you can't shoot a fleeing burglar.

ditto for auto theft.

ditto for forgery.

or prescription fraud


UNLESS there are other factors justifying it, such as threatened deadly force and reasonable belief the subject poses a continued risk if not apprehended

[cliffordu]

3. Yep. I'd shoot the fucker. Isn't the dog considered an officer?

If the perp kills the dog, aren't human targets reasonable to assume??


But that's just me and cannot be trusted to count for anything.

[njlib]

4. Aren't police dogs treated as members of the force?

I remember crying my eyes out watching how they treated a police dog who was killed and recovered from the rubble of the WTC. He was put on a stretcher, covered in the flag, and all the workers stopped and bowed their heads, just like they did for all the human remains that were brought out. They showed the same amount of respect as they would've for an officer or fireman and it still chokes me up.

[paulsby]

8. absolutely. i consider them as such, and i know my fellow officers

who are k-9's most DEFINITELY do.

i am just speaking as a matter of case law. i honestly don't know the answer.

[endless october]

7. it's my opinion that dogs shouldn't be used in this manner.

they have a better function in search and rescue. sending a dog against an armed perp, however, is not acting in the animal's best interest.

[Sebastian Doyle]

9. Someone who stabs a dog probably deserves to be shot anyway

whether or not the dog carries a badge.

[paulsby]

12. that's the 'texas justification'

"yer honor, he deserved killin'!"

:)

[flvegan]

13. Firstly, a police K9 is a cop. If I saw some shit crim stabbing a cop

damn straight I'd open fire.

Secondly, in Florida, we have laws that protect the public against crims that commit violent felonies when viewed in commission of said violent felonies.

After stabbing a person, then stabbing a dog (let us assume we don't know that the dog is an officer) that's felony after felony.

That .45 slug that passed through you? That was mine. Call my lawyer.

[paulsby]

15. right. im not asking IN THIS CASE

because in this case, he already stabbed a person.

i am just asking as a point of LAW (not of morality), if it's justified to use deadly force to protect a police dog.

when i go back to work in a few days , i'll ask one of the k-9 guys.

[flvegan]

20. As a point of law it is. And without opening my WestLaw, has probably been proven.

But then, to me, I'd use force to protect any dog.

And again, my state is very liberal in the interpretation of the ability to do that.

[paulsby]

22. if it was illegal, it would cry out for jury nullification too

which is another factor

[Flaneur]

24. Great. Just stay in Florida. Please.

[flvegan]

25. Why?

Oh, let me guess. A crim is a bit more a crim if the felony is against something you give a shit about, right?

1984 called, they want their mindset back.

[LeftyMom]

26. oOo

:popcorn:

[Stinky The Clown]

14. Dass no dawg, dassa cop.

The dog is a police officer.

As to the constitutional issue you raise, I have no clue. Stinky The Clown law says the shooting would be righteous.

[paulsby]

16. i like stinky law

it has a beat and i can dance to it

[OhioChick]

17. A K-9 is an officer....

So I would assume that his partner can shoot the man.

I remember a few years back on the local news....a K-9 got shot and was taken to the Cleveland Clinic for emergency surgery.

I understand the killing of a K-9 is a felony.

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. Where I used to do it, YES

but that was another country.

Hell, I remember one police dog we took to the trauma center (you read right) who was shot in the field on a Saturday night.

One of our volunteers, a vet, did the surgery at the trauma unit and pooch staid in a human hospital until morning.

He was a sweet dog too... been enough years.

After that he actually played with us, and got really protective of us, apart of his handler.

You try to start an IV and not get bitten by a police dog in pain though... we did put an improvised muzzle on him.

[Edwin Edwards Fan]

19. Brave dog

I hope the dog is alright and awarded for bravery.

[EndersDame]

21. the man stabbed the dog twice in the leg and neck, but Daro managed to hold the suspected shoplifter

Good Dog!! Even after being stabbed he still did his job! If anyone were to hurt my puppy or cats they would be in a world of hurt! Get well soon Daro!

[Vidar]

28. Great dog!