Tough question for everybody, re: health care

[bluestateguy]

Do you think that the Democrats just like having health care to use as an organizing issue and a persistent campaign issue to rally the faithful, rather than actually getting anything done that would improve people's lives?

I would compare it to Republicans who love to use abortion as an issue to rally the faithful, but actually making abortion illegal seems to be a non-priority for the bulk of Republican officeholders.

[abelenkpe]

1. no

I think they really want to pass reform.

[still_one]

They want reform, and there are republicans and Democrats who want to make abortion illegal

[Hello_Kitty]

2. They've made far more inroads on abortion than we have with HC.

Waiting periods, parental notification laws, conscience clauses, "partial birth abortion" bans, etc. Anti-choice protesters being able to harass and intimidate women and clinic staff to the point where abortion is virtually unavailable in much of the U.S.

[supernova]

3. They view it as just another policy brick

Sure, I think they seriously want to pass "reform."

But I don't think they realize that to us, it's not just another wonky policy debate about which to form abstractions and sound high and mighty.

I don't think they realize the depth to which we see it as a deadly serious life and death issue that matters in the same way universal sufferage matters.

[Jamastiene]

4. I think some Democrats (liberals, God bless 'em) truly do want to pass REAL reform.

This would be the universal health care/public option/single payer crowd.


I think some Democrats (Conservative Dems/Dixiecrats/Fucking Assholes/Republican Moles/Spoilers) truly do want to join the Republicans (and do) in blocking reform altogether. No Reform/Kill The Poor would be this category's motto.

I think some Democrats (Blue Dog Moderates) just want to use it to rally the faithful voters and make it a corporate giveaway and keep the MANDATES. Health Insurance Company Bailouts by MANDATED bills to the middle class and poor would be this category's motto.


The Democratic Party needs to learn to be liberal and dammit stick to it. Just send the damn Blue Dogs and Conservadems over to the Republican Party where they belong. Then true liberals with backbone can come back to the Democratic Party and at least we'll get what we vote for.

I'm so fucking sick of all the spineless bullshit and excuses why our own party keeps moving more and more right wing. The Republican are already about to fall completely off the damn political scale (teabaggers) and Democrats in Congress are grabbing their ankles as hard as they possibly can so they can follow they off the damn scale. The rest of us are on the other side of the tug of war wondering :wtf: We gotta fight half of our own damn "team" along with the entire Republican Party.

No wonder this country is so goddamn fucked up.

It's about time we pick real progressives for every primary in this country and give them the votes instead of feeling forced to vote for the same old same old DLC golden child.

How I am going to decide who is worth voting for again and who needs to be kicked to the curb:
In the words of Janet Jackson, "What have you done for me, lately?" If they aren't doing their damn jobs, they are FIRED!

[timeforpeace]

5. Probably, if the lack of discussion of the end of HCR (per Nancy's statement) is any indication.

It's all SCOTUS, all the time now.

[treestar]

6. No, I think they tried to get it

If you compare abortion, having it be illegal is far away for the Republicans. Yet they don't give up and turn on their elected leaders.

If we were as rabid as Republicans, we still would not have all we want. But we seem to give up easily.

[laughingliberal]

8. I would be surprised to see the anti-choice crowd support a candidate who ran on anti-choice

and then turned around and gave billions of dollars to Planned Parenthood paid for with a tax on middle class workers for a loophole riddled agreement from Planned Parenthood to decrease rates of abortion. That is the equivalent of what we got with the Senate bill.-a reform effort which was supposed to give more people access to health care and stop the abuses of the industry turned into millions of mandated customers for said industry with some weak, loophole riddled restriction on their behavior, cost control measures aimed at forcing customers to access less care, paid for in part with a tax on the benefits of middle class workers, designed to save the very industry that was responsible for the problem to begin with.

Any Republican lawmaker trying to ram through the scenario I painted above with Planned Parenthood would find themselves on the curb before the ink was dry on the legislation.

edited typo

[T Wolf]

7. Absolutely. "Our" Reps and Sens are, for the most part, kindler, gentler (at times)) corporate

shills just like the GOPers.