I remember when I worked at Target we told each other at least we couldn't be outsourced

[TwixVoy]

I remember when I worked at Target we told each other at least we couldn't be outsourced. Most of the team members were part time making near minimum wage with no benefits or the limited benefits option.

Now Wal-mart has found a way. How damn greedy can these corporations get? You already employ part time people at the lowest wages the law will allow. Now they bring in a 3rd party company to employ the people in your stores? WTF?

Retail being outsourced... never thought I'd see the day.

FYI Target is also slowly getting rid of it's specialized and department management positions.... people are being demoted down to regular team member. Which means the meager pay raises they got for those promotions (which took years and generally got them $1-3 in raises) are being taken away, and they also lose the full time benefits they had in those positions. Yet they are still being expected to do the same work. From what I have been told by my former co-workers this goes in to effect sometime next month.

[KittyWampus]

1. please explain the "third party company to employ people in your stores"

You mean Target and Walmart workers will technically be working for some hiring agency?

[TwixVoy]

4. Just Wal-mart at this point

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35046668/ns/business-retail

[KittyWampus]

6. They hired a company to provide the product sampling in Sam's Club. So those jobs will still exist

just not being done by Sam's Club/Wal-mart employees.

I don't know what company will provide the labor for these positions. Do they pay even less than Wal-Mart?

Obviosuly, they decided to get some workers off the balance sheet. It may make sense in terms of benefits Walmart won't be liable for. And hiring the outside company tp provide that service might be deductible or something.

But I view this like when stores hire a custodial company to come in and do clean up.

I'm not arguing in favor of anything. Just trying to understand.

NEW YORK - Wal-Mart Stores Inc. said Sunday it is cutting about 11,200 jobs at its Sam's Club warehouse division as it outsources in-store product sampling to marketing company Shopper Events in an effort to win more customers and boost lagging sales.

[musette_sf]

28. "Shopper Events" has ONE client. ONE.

Guess who?

Hint: Shopper Events is in Rogers, AR. Less than 8 miles from Bentonville.

[glinda]

2. I don't think Target would do any of this if not for pressure from Walfart.

[TwixVoy]

3. Don't be so sure about that

All retailers follow the same business plan.

As far as I know though Target has no plan to outsource employees like this. Yet anyway.

[glinda]

11. I live in MN. and am pretty familiar with how they have been pressured by Walfart.

[TwixVoy]

12. Yes that pales in comparison

to my experience as a middle manager with them for years.

Trust me - upper management only cares about one thing at Target - the dollar. Every stunt that Wal-mart pulls we pull. We lock employees in at night. We give them 5 cent annual raises. We have anti-union training. We did everything Wal-mart did.... and it wasn't "pressure" it was choice. Until the recession hit the stores were pulling in boat loads of cash. Wal-mart was not a major threat.

[glinda]

24. Every business must care about dollars. I noticed Target made changes after Walfart pummeled them.

[louis-t]

5. "In-store product sampling".

Whatever that is. The people they will use for this service will not be technically employed by Wally World. Contractors. The dreaded C-word.

Contractors are self-employed and are responsible for 100% of their income tax. They get a 1099 at tax time.

[KittyWampus]

7. You go down aisles of Sam's Club and there are people handing out little taste-samples.

[louis-t]

13. Yeah, took me a minute to figger that out.

I have never been to a Wal-Mart (or Sam's). And never will.

[TwixVoy]

8. Not just that department

Apparently they also are replacing some of the employees that handle memberships.

Don't know much about Sams but my guess would be the employees who demonstrate product. (like free samples, etc) At Target we had no such position.

[barb162]

9. Minimum wage to outsourced minimum wage...where's the savings?

[TwixVoy]

10. I'd imagine they are getting all the savings one normally gets by using contractors

You have significantly less liability for anything that happens to the employees. They get hurt on the job? Independent contractor not your problem.

They want any kind of benefits? Independent contractor not your problem.

They get screwed out of overtime pay? Not your problem.

Want to terminate them because you feel like it? Not a problem.

Worried about unions? That's the company that employs them problem.

Plus you have less tax liability.

Lots of savings here.

[louis-t]

14. See my post above for the answer.

[dixiegrrrrl]

15. Product sampling has long been done by market research or product companies.

Way back in the 70's and again later in the 90's I worked for market research firms.
One of the jobs always open to free lance people was food sampling in stores.
It is not a new thing.
It sounds like a new way for Wal-Mart, tho, if they used their min. wage employees to do it.

[madmom]

16. GM has been doing this for years. Instead of having a general labor

department that did janitorial work they outsourced to another company. Instead of their workers running their in-house cafeteria they outsourced it to another company. They even outsourced lower management jobs to another company. Years ago ALL these jobs were done by GM employees, not so now.

[eilen]

18. Yeah, IBM was doing this in the 1990's.

They outsourced all their clerical/secretarial, and many factory workers. They had a deal with ManPower. People worked for up to 9 months, then had to stop for at least a month before they could restart or IBM would have to hire them and give benefits.

[FarCenter]

19. This is a good analogy -- lots of companies hire other companies, like ARAMark, to run cafeterias

The people working in Company X's cafeteria are not contractors to Company X. They are either employees or contractors to Company Y, which has a contract to run Company X's cafeteria.

Janatorial services, motor pools, security guard services, etc, are typically contracted to other companies that specialize in doing those types of operations. It is almost always cheaper than setting up your own departments and hiring employees to staff them internally.

[tammywammy]

26. That's how it is where I work

The janitorial staff, cafeteria and security guards are not employees of where I work, it's another company.

[EmeraldCityGrl]

17. At this point if Walmart, target el al.

implanted their employees with computer chips it would not surprise me.

It would also not surprise me if the employees actually allowed it. At some

point you have to take a stand. Predatory businesses will NEVER self-regulate

in favor of the worker, the workers MUST organize and demand a workers

bill of rights. One advantage workers have is, the retail corps rely on American

consumerism to survive. Use it. Consumers as well need to take a stand and stop

supporting these monsters. I know, it's the only store within fifty miles, or I

can't afford to pass up the deals. We keep lowering the bar and look where we find

ourselves.

[Kceres]

20. What is it with Target? I was just there today and there was almost NO inventory.

I also overheard a couple of sales associates talking about how they were getting their hours cut back due to low sales numbers. This was the first time I'd been to Target since before the holidays and I can't believe how barren the store looked.

[TwixVoy]

22. I of course can't be sure now

but back in christmas 2008 and 2007 the logistics process became SERIOUSLY screwed up.

The company was not prepared for such a major shift in peoples buying habits.

During christmas 2008 we literally had the stock room so full it was nearly impossible to even get to most places one needed to go. Reason? The company kept buying product and shipping it to the stores even though the stores were beyond maxed out because no one was buying the product they were sending us. Most of the stores had to clearance it all out at 75-90% off BEFORE CHRISTMAS just to get rid of it.

In previous years the distribution centers could just send truck after truck to us non-stop and everything was fine. That doesn't work anymore.

So after christmas 2008 the plan was to buy extremely small amounts of product and send small amounts of product to the stores to prevent such a cluster fu** from happening again. I'm sure that's still the plan.

[Terra Alta]

21. there really is no job security in retail

I currently work for Wal-mart(going on 5 years now), and have seen people get fired for just about anything and everything. They are especially getting rid of people who have been there a long time and those who are full-time. It's a shame, really.

[left of center]

23. All this outsourcing allows more rich middlemen to

get a cut from whatever costs they save their client, leaving less for labor. These middlemen will put more pressure on labor to be "more efficient" so they can maintain their outsourcing business.

It is just more trickle up economics. It's going to get worse before it gets better!

[lib2DaBone]

25. The last two jobs I could find were both "Employee Leasing" deals...

..it's the latest rage of the the Wall-street Venture Capital firms, three-piece suit crowd.

For Instance.. Kohl berg-Kravitz-Roberts buys an entire hotel chain.

They have no intention of going into the hotel business. What they want to do.. is cherry pick the profitable sections of the business, spin off whatever portions they can for a profit.. and take a HUGE tax loss on the remainder of the revenue stream. They have no intention of painting the buildings, fixing the hotels, improving service or growing the business.

If you go to work for them (Or any of the other top 20 Investment Capital Firms like Carlysle Group) you sign a statement saying that you are an "employee at will". No benefits, no overtime, no fair pay.. nothing! Either that or you don't take the job, Jack.. it's just that simple. You have to remember.. these corporations are empowered and backed by the full force of the Federal Government. Our tax dollars at work.

Working in America today.. there are no benefits... no health insurance.., no dignity, no future ...nothing. That's why Health Insurance Reform is such a joke.

Now, not only can the big money controllers get you to work for slave wages, thanks to our CONgress and Senate.. you will be REQUIRED to buy benefits from Big Insurance or be fined.

Corporate pigs at the trough.. profit is never... "enough".

[FarCenter]

27. Most employees are "employees at will"

It doesn't necessarily mean no benefits, etc.

It means that you can quit whenever you want for no reason, and they can terminate you at any time for no reason.