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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 04:33 AM
Original message
Links To Live Stream Of Tony Blair's Hearing At The Iraq Inquiry (On Now)
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 05:32 AM by Turborama
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 04:55 AM
Response to Original message
1. watching it now
:kick:
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 04:57 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. He didn't waste any time linking it to 911, did he?
Thanks for the :kick:
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:16 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. yeah, that was quick wasn't it
the facts on WMDs hadn't changed in 3 years, but the perception changed after 911. :eyes:
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:16 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. BBC International also has live coverage n/t
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:19 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. and blogging live as well
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:25 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. Everything about Blair is plastic
I detest this liar and war criminal
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:19 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Is this the link?
It must be having heavy traffic 'cause it's taking ages to load: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/8486631.stm
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:44 AM
Response to Reply #7
12. Yep - I'm watching on TV
but it's loading quite easily on my laptop.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 04:59 AM
Response to Original message
3. Watching
K & R
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:20 AM
Response to Original message
8. Weaseling, lying little shitbag
He claims "I didn't use the words 'regime change'" in the Fern Britton interview. Here's what he said then:

"If you had known then that there were no WMDs, would you still have gone on?" Blair was asked. He replied: "I would still have thought it right to remove him (Saddam Hussein)".

Significantly, Blair added: "I mean obviously you would have had to use and deploy different arguments about the nature of the threat." He continued: "I can't really think we'd be better with him and his two sons in charge, but it's incredibly difficult. That's why I sympathise with the people who were against it (the war) for perfectly good reasons and are against it now, but for me, in the end I had to take the decision."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/dec/12/tony-blair-iraq-chilcot-inquiry


Look, you scumbag, that's 'regime change'. You let your guard down for an interview that you thought was about religion, and told us what you really thought.
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:25 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. And they let him get away with it
I hope that doesn't set the tone for the whole thing and it turns into a charade, but it looks like it has. He wanted to get that out and dealt with as quickly as possible and they assisted him.

"Weaseling, lying little shitbag", perfect description.
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:27 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. and found it interesting he brought up the ~Clenis
:eyes:
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:45 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. Very, very interesting
I think he's mentioned September 11th more than St Rudy.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:47 AM
Response to Reply #8
15. He really doesn't lie that well
and he's lying non-stop.
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HipChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:50 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. the accent almost makes you want to believe...
:puke:
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:52 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. Not for me
not after 400 years of that same accent.
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HipChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:53 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. forget to add...
:sarcasm:

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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:09 AM
Response to Reply #20
25. LOL
:evilgrin:
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:53 AM
Response to Reply #8
21. The BBC people are caling him on it during the break
but the Inquiry people gave him a pass. :puke:
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:56 AM
Response to Reply #21
23. So are Sky News. They're also showing close ups of his hands shaking
Showing how nervous he is.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #23
97. Wish I had seen that
Damn. Hope he shakes to the grave.
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HipChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:47 AM
Response to Original message
14. K&R watching it now...He had a close relationship with Bush...it earned him the nickname Bush jr..
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:48 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. Poodle
that was the nickname.
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:23 AM
Response to Reply #16
29. Teflon Tony
Was/is another one.

http://www.teflontony.com/

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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:44 AM
Response to Reply #29
41. I forgot that one
:hi:

This fugger can lie.

BLIAR!!
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:52 AM
Response to Original message
19. He keeps going back to 911 as his turning point
Strange that during the build up he hardly ever used 911 as an excuse.

Blair's Iraq view 'changed dramatically' after 9/11

Page last updated at 10:20 GMT, Friday, 29 January 2010

BBC

Britain's attitude towards the risk posed by Saddam Hussein "changed dramatically" after 11 September 2001, Tony Blair has told the Iraq inquiry.

The former PM said that the policy up to that point was one of "containment".

Mr Blair is facing questions in public for the first time about taking the UK to war against Iraq.

Sir John Chilcot began the six hour question session by saying Mr Blair could be recalled to give further evidence if necessary.

More: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/8485694.stm

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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:53 AM
Response to Original message
22. k/r
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:08 AM
Response to Reply #22
24. Good review of the morning's proceedings
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 06:11 AM by malaise
on BBC International's web site
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/8486631.stm

Lots of demonstrator's outside the Inquiry.

Bravo

lots of signs with BLIAR -hahahahaha
Blair + Bush = Saddam
War Criminals

Blair lied thousands died.

add
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:11 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. I'm watching
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:19 AM
Response to Original message
27. He didn't answer the question...he hid behind the military after claiming he wasn't hiding behind
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 06:20 AM by Solly Mack
the military


No different than saying, well the generals on the ground told me all is good...when the generals on the ground aren't the ones making the decision to invade...Blair(Bush) was..

Even generals take orders
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:22 AM
Response to Reply #27
28. The (if only I knew then) what we know now bullshit excuse
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 06:23 AM by Solly Mack
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:25 AM
Response to Reply #28
30. Iran, Iran, Iran....don't judge me on Iraq because of Iran, Iran, Iran
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:29 AM
Response to Reply #30
31. Yeah, what the fuck? Good question about Iran aimed right back at him just then
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 06:29 AM by Turborama
"If Iran was such a problem why didn't you invade Iran instead of Iraq?"
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:30 AM
Response to Reply #31
33. Iraq was just the easiest country to bully
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:29 AM
Response to Reply #30
32.  Iraq was an example to everyone else to give up WMD (per Blair)
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:31 AM
Response to Reply #32
34. A war of convenience, in other words. n/t
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:31 AM
Response to Reply #34
35. Yep
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:33 AM
Response to Original message
36. If you have cable it is on live on BBC World News on Cable TV..high numbers 100+ on Cable. eom
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:35 AM
Response to Original message
37. excellent thread Turborama ..thank you..will come back here after watching Blair testify. eom
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:36 AM
Response to Original message
38. Gee, I only mentioned it once so it's not my fault that other people ran with it
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 06:38 AM by Solly Mack
(on incorrect information Blair put out in an official statement)

The "dossier" was making a case against Saddam

http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/spl/hi/middle_east/02/uk_dossier_on_iraq/html/full_dossier.stm

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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:38 AM
Response to Original message
39. Just for reference, what Balir said to Parliament on Sept 2002:
I am aware, of course, that people will have to take elements of this on the good faith of our intelligence services, but this is what they are telling me, the British Prime Minister, and my senior colleagues. The intelligence picture that they paint is one accumulated over the last four years. It is extensive, detailed and authoritative. It concludes that Iraq has chemical and biological weapons, that Saddam has continued to produce them, that he has existing and active military plans for the use of chemical and biological weapons, which could be activated within 45 minutes, including against his own Shia population, and that he is actively trying to acquire nuclear weapons capability.

On chemical weapons, the dossier shows that Iraq continues to produce chemical agents for chemical weapons; has rebuilt previously destroyed production plants across Iraq; has bought dual-use chemical facilities; has retained the key personnel formerly engaged in the chemical weapons programme; and has a serious ongoing research programme into weapons production, all of it well funded.

In respect of biological weapons, again, production of biological agents has continued; facilities formerly used for biological weapons have been rebuilt; equipment has been purchased for such a programme; and again, Saddam has retained the personnel who worked on it prior to 1991. In particular, the UN inspection regime discovered that Iraq was trying to acquire mobile biological weapons facilities, which of course are easier to conceal. Present intelligence confirms that it has now got such facilities. The biological agents that we believe Iraq can produce include anthrax, botulinum, toxin, aflatoxin and ricin—all eventually result in excruciatingly painful death.

As for nuclear weapons, Saddam's previous nuclear weapons programme was shut down by the inspectors, following disclosure by defectors of the full, but hidden, nature of it. That programme was based on gas centrifuge uranium enrichment. The known remaining stocks of uranium are now held under supervision by the International Atomic Energy Agency.

But we now know the following: since the departure of the inspectors in 1998, Saddam has bought or attempted to buy specialised vacuum pumps of the design needed for the gas centrifuge cascade to enrich uranium; an entire magnet production line of the specification for use in the motors and top bearings of gas centrifuges; dual-use products, such as anhydrous hydrogen fluoride and fluoride gas, which can be used both in petrochemicals but also in gas centrifuge cascades; a filament winding machine, which can be used to manufacture carbon fibre gas centrifuge rotors; and he has attempted, covertly, to acquire 60,000 or more specialised aluminium tubes, which are subject to strict controls owing to their potential use in the construction of gas centrifuges.

In addition, we know that Saddam has been trying to buy significant quantities of uranium from Africa, although we do not know whether he has been successful. Again, key personnel who used to work on the nuclear weapons programme are back in harness. Iraq may claim that that is for a civil nuclear power programme, but I would point out that it has no nuclear power plants.
...
There will be some who will dismiss all this. Intelligence is not always right. For some of the material, there might be innocent explanations. There will be others who say rightly that, for example, on present going, it could be several years before Saddam acquires a usable nuclear weapon—though if he were able to purchase fissile matériel illegally, it would be only a year or two. But let me put it at its simplest: on this 11-year history; with this man Saddam; with this accumulated, detailed intelligence available; with what we know and what we can reasonably speculate, would the world be wise to leave the present situation undisturbed—to say that, despite 14 separate UN demands on the issue, all of which Saddam is in breach of, we should do nothing, and to conclude that we should trust, not to the good faith of the UN weapons inspectors, but to the good faith of the current Iraqi regime? I do not believe that that would be a responsible course to follow.

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200102/cmhansrd/vo020924/debtext/20924-01.htm
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:45 AM
Response to Reply #39
43. And, to take that apart:
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 07:05 AM by muriel_volestrangler
"The intelligence picture that they paint is one accumulated over the last four years. It is extensive, detailed and authoritative."

A lie. It was patchy, based on dubious personal intelligence, and full of guesses and assumptions.

"It concludes that Iraq has chemical and biological weapons"
It suspected he still had wepaons

"that Saddam has continued to produce them"
a lie - there was never evidence of continued production

"that he has existing and active military plans for the use of chemical and biological weapons"
well, the plans from 1990 were still in existence

"which could be activated within 45 minutes"
a rumour literally picked up by a cab-driver overhearing a conversation

"including against his own Shia population"
ie implying the 45 minutes also applies to use outside his country - which the intelligence did not think was true

"and that he is actively trying to acquire nuclear weapons capability."
a lie.

"On chemical weapons, the dossier shows that Iraq continues to produce chemical agents for chemical weapons"
a lie

"has rebuilt previously destroyed production plants across Iraq"
a lie

"has bought dual-use chemical facilities"
no, they were for the genuinely stated use

"has retained the key personnel formerly engaged in the chemical weapons programme"
well, yes; Iraq was a centralised state, and it didn't expel scientists. It continued to employ them; but not on WMD programs

" and has a serious ongoing research programme into weapons production, all of it well funded."
a lie

Oh fuck, there are too many lies in there to list them all.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:57 AM
Response to Reply #43
49. The one truth I have gathered this morning is that
BLIAR lacked judgement then and lacks judgement today.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:43 AM
Response to Original message
40. Snort...I would remove government from it (now)...but I'd still publish it
Uh, when the PM publishes a position paper, government is involved
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:45 AM
Response to Reply #40
42. Blair (Bush) I wasn't the only one who thought Saddam had WMD
Blair is giving the exact same excuses Bush/Cheney have used

Can't blame me...everyone thought it

Nevermind that everyone didn't

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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:45 AM
Response to Reply #40
44. We know he BLIAR but what troubles me most
is his view that Saddam would have done more harm to his people as if the invasion and occupation did not kill a million people and dislocate the lives of millions more. I mean WTF???????
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:51 AM
Response to Reply #44
46. Well, gee, malaise..don't you know Blair had the good of the people in mind?
He and Bush had the bestest of intentions and just wanted to help people.
Killing & torturing your family to bring democracy to your orphaned nieces and nephews is a good thing.

The hue of the hand oppressing you makes a difference doncha know?
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:53 AM
Response to Reply #46
47. My bad
I should have remembered the meme. :hi:
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:56 AM
Response to Reply #47
48. Blair needs that smile smacked off his face
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:46 AM
Response to Original message
45. Yeah..that's the ticket...Blair was just too trusting
LMAO
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 06:59 AM
Response to Original message
50. Oh, we are all aware of you choosing your words quite carefully
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:02 AM
Response to Original message
51. Parliament can be mean (tricky) to me but you make a fair point
Well, golly, Blair, thanks for your approval of my question.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:04 AM
Response to Original message
52. Chicken head bob moment
Blair...not me
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:06 AM
Response to Original message
53. Oooh...the UN process prevents the closure (you want)
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #53
54. The lying fugger
laughed off the French and Russian refusal to sign on to their illegal war.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:09 AM
Response to Reply #54
55. Yeah he is
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:13 AM
Response to Reply #55
57. Interesting that he only mentioned France and Russia
because several other countries did not go along with the invasion.

In 2003, the governments of the U.S., Britain, and Spain proposed another resolution on Iraq, which they called the "eighteenth resolution" and others called the "second resolution." This proposed resolution was subsequently withdrawn when it became clear that several permanent members of the Council would cast no votes on any new resolution, thereby vetoing it. <1> Had that occurred, it would have become even more difficult for those wishing to invade Iraq to argue that the Council had authorized the subsequent invasion. Regardless of the threatened or likely vetoes, it seems that the coalition at no time was assured any more than four affirmative votes in the Council—the U.S., Britain, Spain, and Bulgaria—well short of the requirement for nine affirmative votes.<2>

On September 16, 2004 Secretary-General of the United Nations Kofi Annan, speaking on the invasion, said, "I have indicated it was not in conformity with the UN Charter. From our point of view, from the charter point of view, it was illegal."<1>
-----------------
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Security_Council_and_the_Iraq_War
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:15 AM
Response to Reply #57
58. No accident he mentioned only the two
playing on bigotry and fear
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 08:19 AM
Response to Reply #53
76. That's because Blix, inconveniently for Blair, said the inspections were going well
and, to show Blair was lying (again), Blix had not yet asked for interviews outside Iraq by the time of his March 7th report:

The second reflection is that, with relevant witnesses available, it becomes even more important to be able to conduct interviews in modes and locations which allow us to be confident that the testimony given is given without outside influence.

While the Iraqi side seems to have encouraged interviewees not to request the presence of Iraqi officials, local minders or the taping of the interviews, conditions ensuring the absence of undue influences are difficult to attain inside Iraq. Interviews outside the country might provide such assurance. It is our intention to request such interviews shortly.

http://edition.cnn.com/2003/US/03/07/sprj.irq.un.transcript.blix/


So Blair's contention that such interviews would never be allowed is a total guess by him. His claim that Blix could never have concluded whether all WMD had gone is, again, a complete guess. Blix is optimistic in his report that inspections were working. France, Russia and other SC members wanted to give the UN inspectors the time they wanted; Bush and Blair didn't. So they gave up trying to get a 2nd UN resolution, told the inspectors to get out or be bombed along with Saddam, and then invaded.
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #76
106. Thanks for the research, Muriel
I clearly remember that Blix was optimistic about the progress and your analysis proves (again) that they're letting him slither out of this.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #76
128. Yep! Thanks for adding that!!!
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:11 AM
Response to Original message
56. We had to resolve this by removing Saddam (but I never said regime change)
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:16 AM
Response to Reply #56
60. If there was any justice on this planet
he'd be in chains in the Hague or in an unmarked grave somewhere outside of a prison gate.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:18 AM
Response to Reply #60
61. That's a big if (sadly)
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:33 AM
Response to Reply #61
66. Protest pics
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:37 AM
Response to Reply #66
70. Great pictures!
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:39 AM
Response to Reply #70
71. More
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:51 AM
Response to Reply #71
74. You should post various pictures in its own thread...more coverage that way
:)
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:57 AM
Response to Reply #74
75. Done
Good idea - thanks
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:16 AM
Response to Original message
59. Blair is giving me a Bush headache
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:25 AM
Response to Reply #59
63. The LIAR wants to be asked the 2010 questions
Man this is unfuggingbelievable.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:28 AM
Response to Reply #63
65. I laughed hard when he said that. FEAR! Dammit! Feel the fear!!!
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:20 AM
Response to Original message
62. I wanted a 2nd resolution, Bush didn't ..so I'm better than Bush....so stop picking on me
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:27 AM
Response to Original message
64. LMAO. don't ask the March 2003 question..ask the 2010 question
Saddam and his sons would be invading now! Blowing us all up now!

Don't you see!?!?! We stopped something now (that we had no way of knowing would take place) by committing crimes then.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #64
67. And the price of oil would have been
...wait it actually passed that a while back. :rofl:
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:35 AM
Response to Original message
68. Blair's defense...the end justifies the means...(2010 question!)
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 07:43 AM by Solly Mack
even if the end (in question) is a narrative of his own making (and Bush's)

He acted in "good faith"

He really believed he was right (He does concede - magnanimously, of course - that people telling him that he was wrong had every right to say he was wrong...but they were misguided in their thinking)

911 changed everything


Iran would be attacking everyone right now if Saddam had not been removed.


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Duende azul Donating Member (608 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:36 AM
Response to Original message
69. Time is pressing? Interrogate that asshole until you get to the substance.
6 hours is not enough.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:43 AM
Response to Reply #69
73. Lunch break

Galloway among the protesters.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 07:40 AM
Response to Original message
72. Silver lining: It hasn't been one of those "I don't recall" hearings
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 08:34 AM
Response to Reply #72
77. I get the feeling Blair is calling the US for more talking points
Blair's testimony thus far has a decidedly Bush administration feel to it. Same excuses, same rationalizations and justifications...same complaints against those who think he's not just wrong, but criminally so.

Nothing new about that since over the years Blair's excuses have adapted themselves to Bush's excuses.

Still, hard to watch if only because America has failed itself miserably by not doing the very least it could do and get the Bush/Cheney administration before a very public camera for questions about their crimes.

America is still pretending...
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #77
78. Yep, he sure sounds quite Rovian in his defense
I wonder if someone's going to create a word cloud for his testimony. If so, September will most likely be the most prominent word.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #78
79. I believe he now has Rudy beat.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:05 AM
Response to Original message
80. They wouldn't give Bush his war so I could demonstrate my special kind of relationship with America
and then he wagged his tail and whimpered
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:10 AM
Response to Original message
81. The French didn't want to be a part of the 2010 solution!
The French didn't ask the 2010 question!

The French didn't care if Saddam ran off with Cherie!

The French killed Diana!
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:12 AM
Response to Original message
82. I didn't want to get Bush angry at me. I needed a job later.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #82
83. Don't think of me as a poodle..think of me as loyal and obedient
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:14 AM
Response to Original message
84. Saddam was profoundly wicked...wars of lies and torture..not so much
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:15 AM
Response to Original message
85. Am I the only nutcase still watching?
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #85
93. No I'm still here
but I was on the road between home and work for a while
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:59 AM
Response to Reply #93
94. Excuses. Excuses. :P
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #94
95. LOL
:evilgrin:
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Duende azul Donating Member (608 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:06 AM
Response to Reply #85
99. No. And thanks to you, malaise, turbo and all those who keep this going!
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #99
100. So you admit to being a nutcase? :P
Me too :)
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Duende azul Donating Member (608 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #100
120. Yes. Watching this is evidence enough, isn't it?
:toast:
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #120
121. ...
and to you :toast:
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #85
103. I'm watching but disappointed that they didn't hammer him about the illegality
I might be being overly optimistic but I'm hoping this is a warm up for the next time they call him in.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:27 AM
Response to Reply #103
105. We can hope. Thank you for starting the thread!!! The links were a great help!!!
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #105
107. You're most welcome, I'm glad you found them useful. Thanks for all your input!
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:17 AM
Response to Original message
86. So..the UK military was keen, willing and able..but Bush understood it was too difficult for the UK
Alrighty then
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:18 AM
Response to Original message
87. I can wrap up what we've absorbed from this..Blair is a liar
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:23 AM
Response to Original message
88.  You really want to go on Blair's understanding of anything?
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:45 AM
Response to Original message
89. "legal difficulties were a 'new dimension' in a difficult situation"
said legal difficulties being - the legality of invading Iraq.

the difficult situation was Blair's need to please Bush
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:46 AM
Response to Original message
90. will the united states ever ask mr bu$h* WHY he invaded iraq?
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #90
91. I doubt it but I have a question for BLIAR
Did he and does he believe that Iraq was some colony of Britain and the US and that the President of Iraq was some truant school boy they had the right to discipline.

BLIAR is an arrogant war criminal
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 09:54 AM
Response to Original message
92. Mentioning the impact American Lawyers had on Goldsmith in changing his views
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #92
115. Excellent articles, thanks for the heads up! n/t
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #115
123. You're welcome!
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:02 AM
Response to Original message
96. Get your waders on...Blair is seriously slinging shit now
I care about the military!
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
98. The invaders avoided a humanitarian crisis in Iraq?
Do the Iraqis know this?
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #98
102. I don't know whether to laugh or cry
This is undiluted bull shit and it stinks.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #102
104. I'm laughing to avoid other emotions
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 10:26 AM by Solly Mack
The last 10 years haunt my dreams and my waking moments.

I still can't reconcile not prosecuting war criminals with the hype America still pushes about itself.

I tried talking to a professional and telling me to try and do other things doesn't cut it. I do all kinds of things already...volunteering, etc. Doesn't stop the feelings. Doesn't stop the thoughts. Ignoring it won't change anything because far too many people ignore it already and that haunts me as well.

I was told to get perspective...but from my perspective America is allowing war criminals to go free and pretending otherwise isn't a new perspective, it's denial.

Being told life goes on is about the dumbest thing said to me about it all...of course life goes on(DUH)...but how does that change a single war crime committed? How does that change the lack of prosecutions?

Sorry...I really am in a bad way over it all.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #104
113. Well the sad truth is that life does go on but
you must ensure that you maintain your health so that we can continue to push for these war criminals to be brought to book.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:12 AM
Response to Original message
101. Blair says if the military wasn't properly prepared for invasion it was their own fault
If they didn't have all the necessary equipment for a desert invasion it wasn't his fault

Rumsfeld thanks you Blair.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
108. "situation in Iraq very different from what we expected"
No one could anticipate....

Of course, when you're expecting flowers....
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
109. ut oh...watch out world...Blair is portraying Iraq as the learning curve for invasions of the future
with Muslim populations
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #109
111. Yes indeed
The evil fugg continues to push more crusades
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 10:59 AM
Response to Original message
110. That Iran would take advantage of any Iraq invasion is "hindsight"?
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 11:05 AM by Solly Mack
Seriously? "hindsight"?

Because no one could ever know that ahead of time?

Blair actually said he thought "Iran would be amenable" to the west invading Iraq because Iraq and Iran went to war against each other..so Iran would support the invasion instead of using it to their advantage


Blair said the issue(s) of WMD and regime change cojoined....magically... on their own
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:16 AM
Response to Original message
112. Bringing up the number of troops needed for an invasion ..500K number
Blair is saying that number was a matter of troops needed after an invasion

and that they now know...now...not before...that after an invasion you will be nation building, so you need the troops

Because troops just aren't needed to secure supply lines or set up checkpoints or set up med stations or set up communication etc. during the invasion and immediately after it has started

Course, this argument allows for the bullshit argument that the only thing wrong about invading Iraq was how it was executed and not the invasion itself. It makes it easier to dismiss all the lies and trumped up evidence and just focus attention on a matter of execution instead of cause (lies and trumped up evidence)
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
114. Mary, mother of Fred, someone slap Blair
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
116. Asking the POS about Abu Ghraib
Blair...he was shocked and angry...because it was wrong...and the "damage it would do"

because the terrorists & Al Jazeera..media were misrepresenting "us" (UK/US)in our motives

The MOST important thing about Abu Ghraib was it did damage to our cause (per Blair)

Blair goes with the few bad apples lie
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Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #116
117. Bringing Al Jazeera into it, biiiig mistake!
In case you missed it, I posted something about Bush's war against Al Jazeera, http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6848728">here.

I bet they won't take the comment he just made about them lying down.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #117
118. LIke Rumsfeld, Blair blames the pictures (evidence) for the crime
Edited on Fri Jan-29-10 11:39 AM by Solly Mack
taking place in the pictures...

Amazing defense...it wasn't me that was in the wrong, it was the evidence showing me committ a crime that was wrong
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
119. Just end this and prosecute Blair. It's truly the only decent thing to do
We got some in America that need prosecuting too.
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
122. "The Cabinet weren't interested in becoming part of the legal debate"
said legal debate being...was the invasion legal
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
124. Last few questions....almost over...
went in as liberators (snort) and attacked as occupiers (well, gee, I wonder why?)

the question asked: Do you think the Iraq people think it worthwhile?



Blair...too early to say if the Iraq democracy will take root (which isn't answering the question)

Electricity is better now than under Saddam....yes, Blair cited that as an example of Iraqis thinking it worthwhile.

Now reforming the question as do we think it was it worth it in terms of the Iraqis
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
125. Thank you,Turborama ! Thank you everyone!!!
You guys made this bearable!!!
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #125
127. Thank you too
You were great company :hi:
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Dangerman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
126. When the inquiry finds out the truth, are we should move forward?
We didn't look forward after WWII when we tried the Nazis for wars of aggression.

I don't think we should do the same with Blair and Bush.

If the inquiry finds out the truth, we should seek justice against Blair and then Bush. We cannot let war criminals like them live their rest of their lives as free men and in denial of wrongdoings. We must convict Blair and Bush and send those bastards in prison!

Crimes against humanity should not be limited to what the West called "Bad Guys".
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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-29-10 05:55 PM
Response to Original message
129. Shallow slithering liar- he may not even know the difference between truth and lies...
He has been a disaster.

A traitor to his party, his country, and most of all, to the entire world.
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