Apple admits using child labour

[babsbunny]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/apple/7330986/Apple-admits-using-child-labour.html

By Malcolm Moore in Shanghai
Published: 12:21PM GMT 27 Feb 2010


Apple has admitted that child labour was used at the factories that build its computers, iPods and mobile phones.

[Ozymanithrax]

1. Fortunatly, I don't own an Apple comuter, iPod, or mobile phone.

I wonder how people who are apple users will view their choice to encourage child labor.

[parasim]

6. I am an "Apple User" and I have this to say...

I am glad that Apple is the ONLY tech company to even do audits of the companies they work with and have made the statement that if these companies don't fix the problems that they have uncovered in their own investigations, they will not work with them.

Quit falling the for the sensational headlines and dig more into the story. Apple is taking action AGAINST these kinds of activities.

[gateley]

25. +1. Just another reason why I'm glad I'm an "Apple User" too. nt

[FreeState]

74. +1

[mopinko]

7. i view it as

other companies are doing it, too. do you have an electronics that are not made in places that use child labor? singling out apple is ridiculous.

[grace0418]

15. I view it as a positive thing that Apple is doing something about it. Most big companies

would turn a blind eye. Most probably *are* turning a blind eye.

[Touchdown]

70. Keep buying into the lie.

It may fit one day.

BTW: It's a computer company, not a girlfriend who dumped you.

[tekisui]

2. For shame. I don't think 15 year olds working,

if done with parental consent and not in harmful conditions, is a big deal. I worked at 15, with a worker's permit.

But, the 60 hour plus work week and not paying China's minimum is bad. And, if any of the 15 year olds were in this boat, even worse.

[Omaha Steve]

56. They are not putting together finished products

They make the boards with toxic materials around them. Without proper protection, it is a deadly job. Like the young Chinese girls that make Mardi Gras beads. Cancer is a given.

[midnight]

3. Really Apple?

[boppers]

24. Apple audits for green tech, fair wages, safer processes, and publicly owns up.

Ever see Dell or Gateway do such a thing? Can you imagine what the results are likely to be?

[Robb]

4. I don't understand this story, actually.

It's not particularly clear how the information came to light. Did Apple release this information after an internal study?

[druidity33]

10. yes, it was an internal audit.

Apple posted the results on their website. I think it should be applauded that they check up on their suppliers and contractors. Apparently some folk on DU will do anything to dis Apple.

:shrug:

here's a better link:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-10461082-37.html?tag=newsEditorsPicksArea.0

from the article:

"Apple last year found a number of workplace violations, including use of underage workers, among its suppliers, even as those companies are coming more in line with Apple's standards.

In 2009, according to its 2010 Progress Report (PDF), Apple's audits of suppliers turned up 17 core violations, those that it considers to be the most serious practices or situations that run counter to the central principles of the company's Supplier Code of Conduct.

Of those core violations, three involved the hiring of underage workers; three involved the use of noncertified vendors for the disposal of hazardous waste; three involved the presentation of falsified records during the audit; and eight involved excessive recruitment fees.

The supplier code of conduct and the site audits are intended to protect workers' rights and to improve factory conditions."

[MUAD_DIB]

12. Yes. Apple investigated itself.

In its report, Apple revealed the sweatshop conditions inside the factories it uses. Apple admitted that at least 55 of the 102 factories that produce its goods were ignoring Apple's rule that staff cannot work more than 60 hours a week.

The technology company's own guidelines are already in breach of China's widely-ignored labour law, which sets out a maximum 49-hour week for workers.

Apple also said that one of its factories had repeatedly falsified its records in order to conceal the fact that it was using child labour and working its staff endlessly.

"When we investigated, we uncovered records and conducted worker interviews that revealed excessive working hours and seven days of continuous work," Apple said, adding that it had terminated all contracts with the factory.

[Jakes Progress]

48. The story is straight forward; the headline is misleading. nt

[anonymous171]

5. And their products are still prohibitively expensive! nt

[Tesha]

9. Luckily, no one forces you to buy them. (NT)

[anonymous171]

11. Of course. I prefer non-proprietary parts anyways. nt

[boppers]

23. What's proprietary inside a Mac?

The PCI bus? The Intel CPU's? The industry standard graphics cards? Pray tell, what are you focused on?

Are you perhaps confusing a talking point from 10 years ago with current technology?

[boppers]

22. There are cheaper alternatives.

Forced labor and child labor products always tend to be cheaper, this is apple making their products *more* expensive by removing it from their supply chains.

Of course, some of us factor in many more things into our purchases besides cost.

[TommyO]

51. Really?

I paid $2200 for my Mac Pro, have been using it for over a year, and fully expect to be using it four years from now. A comparably equipped Dell workstation running Windows Vista was priced higher.

[femrap]

8. Apple must please

its greedy shareholders with larger and larger profit margins. Just makes me sick.

All the companies do it. I rarely purchase anything made in China.

[MUAD_DIB]

13. Read the story before jumping to conclusions.

Apple initiated the report.

--snip--

In its report, Apple revealed the sweatshop conditions inside the factories it uses. Apple admitted that at least 55 of the 102 factories that produce its goods were ignoring Apple's rule that staff cannot work more than 60 hours a week.

The technology company's own guidelines are already in breach of China's widely-ignored labour law, which sets out a maximum 49-hour week for workers.

Apple also said that one of its factories had repeatedly falsified its records in order to conceal the fact that it was using child labour and working its staff endlessly.

"When we investigated, we uncovered records and conducted worker interviews that revealed excessive working hours and seven days of continuous work," Apple said, adding that it had terminated all contracts with the factory.

[Dreamer Tatum]

14. BFD. You don't think Apple beats on their suppliers to manage costs?

They do.

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MUAD_DIB]

32. BFD? Did you not read the article in order to whine about Apple?

Like I wrote before. Read the article instead of jumping to conclusions.

[alfredo]

38. The way it works, They sign a contract with the supplier.

It is up to the supplier to manage their own costs. If you are a contractor, you live or die by your bids. If you screw up, you can't renegotiate your price in the middle of the contract period. You suck it up and hope you don't bite the big one before the contract needs to be renegotiated.

[Dreamer Tatum]

59. So Apple doesn't have SLAs in their contracts that forbid child labor? If they do...

...it took them this long to find out about it?

I know Apple makes shiny toys that lefties drool over, but really, fuck them. They're a money-grubbing corporation.

And before anyone gives me shit about their progressive HR stances, I have two words for you: American Express.
Look into it.

[alfredo]

62. Yes they do, and the audits are part of the agreement.

We don't know what sanctions they put against the contractors, or how much jeopardy the supplier is in come renewal time. By not treating their workers according to the contract, they are in violation and could be terminated.

We should be encouraging companies to push better conditions for workers. If American companies allow abusing the workers then they are doing our country harm. Apple has its problems, but at least they are trying to do right. Look at the environmental changes they made since Al Gore has been on the BOD.

BTW, did you actually read the article. If you just read the headline you will be mislead. The headline is deceitful and shows bias. Bad journalism.

[femrap]

19. Earlier this decade

their laptops were made in Taiwan. I wonder if there is a laptop NOT made in China?

[MUAD_DIB]

20. The article is not about location but Apple's pointing out that some of

its vendors are guilty of worplace violations.


If your point is that Apple does not make its products here in the USA then bravo.

[femrap]

57. Yes, my point is

about location. China is well-known for its totalitarian rule, horrid human rights, and cruel treatment of workers.

Long ago I gave up on having products manufactured in the US. Globalism took over. But I try to buy products from countries that have a semblance of Democracy such as Taiwan and India.

The management of Apple knows damn well how China operates and yet they move their manufacturing base there. They used to be in Ireland but I guess the Irish cost too much as well.

Greed rules. People die.

[MUAD_DIB]

66. While I agree with you your last line can be applied to the USA as well

but is easier(?) to detect.

[femrap]

68. And that is where it was

directed!

Are you a mole?

[parasim]

16. I applaud Apple in this and even Slashdot promoted Apple's actions...

-snip

The most recent audit of Apple's partners revealed 17 violations of ASCC. The violations include hiring workers who were as young as 15 years of age, incorrectly disposing of hazardous waste, and falsifying records. In Apple's recently released Supplier Responsibility 2010 Progress Report (PDF), they condemned the violations and threatened to terminate their business with facilities that did not change their ways."

-snip

(my emphasis)



http://apple.slashdot.org/story/10/02/28/1249219/Apple-Enforces-Supplier-Code-of-Conduct-After-Child-Labor-Discovery

[MUAD_DIB]

18. Some people just read the first line

and scream that Apple is guilty.

Apple is the one who pointed out the violations.

[JCMach1]

29. This is the standard statement all companies make when they get caught at this

Just go back through old NIKE PR statements and you will see much the same.

[TCJ70]

39. Apple didn't get caught...

...Apple caught their own suppliers. I think that's the difference.

[bridgit]

21. Wow! If they didn't have that 'child labor price break' iPods might be $4-5,000...

And that would be really bad for bid'ness, I can only imagine what shrimp would cost without it at Traitor Joe's http://bluelivingideas.com/topics/fishing/seafood-slavery-americans-eat-thai-shrimp-caught-forced-labor

[Kablooie]

50. Apple initiated and paid for the investigation itself and dropped all companies with violations.

[bridgit]

54. That can be a form of johnny-come-lately neo-plausible deni-ability too...

Only 65 per cent of the factories were paying their staff the correct wages and benefits (that's the staff not just the kids), and Apple found 24 factories where workers had not even been paid China's minimum wage of around 800 yuan (Pounds76) a month.

Meanwhile, only 61 per cent of Apple's suppliers were following regulations to prevent injuries in the workplace and a mere 57 per cent had the correct environmental permits to operate.

Apple said it had required the factories to "perform immediate inspections of their wastewater discharge systems" and hire an independent environmental consultant to prevent future violations.

However, Apple has not stopped using the factories.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/apple/7330986/Apple-admits-using-child-labour.html

Certainly if you have no problem with the labor issues they such as Trader Joe's got tagged with as they are all doing it all of them including Apple - the cool the uncool, the hip the un-hip, the conservative the so-called progressive, the people that own Apples and the people that do not - that's why they took their jobs to China cause Americans want to be paid too much, look...

I know a couple guys that operate photo lithographic reduction process' in China and became multi millionaires as did their Chinese counterparts. They are there for the cheap labor and they will tell you so over T-Day turkey with a smirk that they pay 'top people' .85Ct's/hr to assist in the production of the puter chips not un-like the ones in these very puters, and buy $1,200 illegally bootlegged system ops software CDs for 50 bucks on the streets of Mexico City. That's how its done, that's part of how the rich get richer

But its a little strange to think the Apple did not understand the work environment in China going in, eh - it was only 25 kids in all of China so statistically they are still on the sunny side it would seem

Apple initiating this report is a way for them to distance themselves from the larger picture of a very ill labor environment in China and elsewhere. But it should not be misunderstood; that Apple went in there in the first place looking for cheap labor and they got that and more

First of all, and Apple could have asked nearly anyone, but, you know, off we go - "Apple found 24 factories where workers had not even been paid China's minimum wage of around 800 yuan (Pounds76) a month" and that converts to 115.528 USD per month. Not a half day or day or week but per month

There may come a day, but I know of no DUer that will work for those wages and so off the jobs went. There should be no more wondering why as there seems little mention how long those practices were allowed to exist before someone at Apple asked a question at all; nor any daylight upon specious profits reaped thereby in the interim between a handshake in China over tea and Apple's report

[Jakes Progress]

26. Apple auditing themselves and being transparent

and then getting skewered with stupid headlines like this just shows that it doesn't seem to pay to try to do the right thing.

[JCMach1]

28. After they have done the WRONG thing... that's called

SPIN!

[Elwood P Dowd]

31. Microsoft and dozens of other US companies use the same factories & same workers.

Where is their spin? Why haven't they looked into this? I think you're full of it on this one. Just another Al Gore, Steve Jobs, Apple hater.

[JCMach1]

41. Not a hater... your contention is 'Apple is different' mine is that

Apple is (in many ways) just as bad as many of the companies you would pile on for their problems.

Big corporations these days= big time exploitation.

You can call me out when you find a union label on your iPhone. Then, we'll talk.

[Touchdown]

71. If you use an iPhone, you are using a union network.

[MUAD_DIB]

33. Their suppliers did the wrong thing and Apple

was big enough to own up to it...uncover it. Spin is the attempt to convert controversy into acceptable and vice versa.

Apple didn't do that.


Thanks for your SPIN.

[JCMach1]

40. Here is something from Mr. Knight, CEO of NIKE

..."Independent monitoring is a critical element of an overall system of improving labor practices," Mr. Knight said. "Nike's goal is to reach a point where labor practices can be tested and verified in much the same manner that financial audits determine a company's compliance with generally accepted accounting principles."... http://www.corpwatch.org/article.php?id=12965

This was from NIKE's 1998 playbook.

[Jakes Progress]

44. Read anything since 1998?

Nike has located multiple problems of exploitation and violations of labor standards in the production of their products. Yet you cite Apple as spinning when they do the same thing that you are lauding Nike for.

Apple's investigation isn't the only thing transparent here. So is your bias.

[Jakes Progress]

42. What part of the story is hard for you to understand?

Apple did the audit. Apple released the data. No one else was asking. No one else was checking up.

Your concentration on headlines as information and preconceived attitudes is the exactly what I'm talking about. Have you read anything about Dell's audit of their manufacturing? Have you seen any headlines about HP or Sony?

By your standards the best thing a company can do is just never ask any questions of their suppliers, never even think about it, let alone actually spend company money to check these things out.

[JCMach1]

43. Maybe they should audit this...

...Inside Longhua, workers labor a 15-hour day building iPods, for which they usually earn about $50 per month. When they're not on the assembly lines, they live in secluded dormitories that each house 100 people and prohibit visitors from the outside world. The workers are allowed "a few possessions" and a "bucket to wash their clothes."

"We have to work too hard and I am always tired. It's like being in the army," Zang Lan, one of the workers at Longhua, told the Mail. "They make us stand still for hours. If we move we are punished by being made to stand still for longer. The boys are made to do pushups."

According to the report, the iPod nano is made in a five-story factory called "E3" that is secured by armed police officers. The super-slim digital music player is said to include over 400 parts which arrive from component manufacturers all over the world.

Another factory in Suzhou, Shanghai, manufacturers iPod shuffles and is completely surrounded by barbed wire. At this facility, 50,000 workers are housed outside the plant and earn about $99 per month. However, they must pay out of pocket for their accommodations and food, "which takes up half their salaries."... http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/06/06/12/ipod_city_inside_apples_ipod_factories.html

Oh wait, they candy-coated it:

...Back in June, The Mail on Sunday claimed that workers in Longhua live in dormitories of 100 people, and visitors are not permitted. The Mail also claimed that these people work a 15-hour day and earn £27 per month (this is now believed to be around £38 per month). The article also said that the compound was secured by police patrol.

Apple launched an investigation and responded to these claims on 17 August. The company reported that it found no evidence of enforced labour, and that the factory did not use children as workers.

Some find Apple's report flawed. Janek Kuczkiewicz, director of human and trade union rights at the International Confederation of Free Trade Unions (ICFTU) said, "We are not impressed either by the report or by the findings of Apple." Kuczkiewicz criticised the small scale of Apple's investigation. He says Apple interviewed just 100 of an estimated 30,000 iPod workers.

Tellingly, Apple provided no information on the conditions under which the interviews with Longhua workers were held and the company's report has not been independently verified. Whether you believe Apple's statement would seem to depend largely on how much you trust a giant multinational corporation to report honestly on its cheap overseas labour practices.... http://crave.cnet.co.uk/digitalmusic/0,39029432,49282987,00.htm

[Jakes Progress]

45. Why do you keep arguing against yourself?

Read your own cite. It mentions "just one of thousands of companies" doing this. As a result, Apple institutes procedures to stop the abuse. You attack them for being up front about it. How many of the thousands of companies that you cite in your link have you written to protest? Can you even name one?

You are not being as honest or up front as Apple. You are spinning your side by selective quotes. Do you by any chance work for Dell or HP? Do you know about their record in this matter? Or are headlines the extent of your "research"?

[JCMach1]

46. You didn't read my points above... Corporate exploitation is the problem

Apple is just part of that... don't kid yourself otherwise.

[Jakes Progress]

47. You didn't read anything in my post.

I said Apple should be commended for doing more than your "thousands of companies" about ending such exploitation.

I know you only read headlines, but the story here is about Apple setting up procedures to end exploitation. You seem incapable of understanding what is written, let alone what is happening.

You didn't answer my questions. If you think that there is no difference between the actions of Apple and Dell, you are the one who is kidding yourself.

[JCMach1]

49. They are still doing it! That's the point... But hey they have got the deniability

it was JUST the CONTRACTORS afterall.

Apple would NEVER condone such activity. :sarcasm:

[Jakes Progress]

64. Get yourself an ipod and listen to some music.

You have a real problem understanding how the world works. You would punish any company that tries to make things better.

Attitudes and behaviors like yours are why companies get away with the crap they do. Instead of being any part of a cure, your behavior just contributes to the problem.

[rucky]

55. Still, I'd rather know than wonder about the products on the market.

And right now, companies have little incentive to come forward with information like this. So maybe a little golf clap will encourage other companies to step up and stop this practice of enslavement.

:shrug:

[JCMach1]

27. For all those Apple owners

[TommyO]

53. You never fail to jump on an anti-Apple thread

What other manufacturers are working to stop these labor abuses? Dell? Don't fucking make me laugh.

[Jakes Progress]

65. Oh, but he claims to not be biased.

Maybe he works for Dell.

[Touchdown]

73. Go easy. His girlfriend was stolen from him by an Apple programmer.

he was more muscular, better smelling, knew how to cook, could sing, and had a bigger dick.

No need to crush the man anymore.

[grahamhgreen]

30. Knowingly?

What am I saying - we all know our Chinese/SE Asia goods use child labor - thats why we need to pull out of our "free trade" (really slave trade) agreements, bring back tariffs and trade barriers and manufacturing. Protectionism protects us.

[alfredo]

34. The headline is the story the Telegraph is trying to push.

The Telegraph is a right wing rag.

[Elwood P Dowd]

35. You are right Alfredo. The Telegraph is a piece of shit right wing rag, and the DU Apple haters

have now embraced it.

[alfredo]

36. They are a scandal sheet.

[TCJ70]

37. Kudos, Apple...

...for checking up on your suppliers and trying to hold them accountable.

What a terrible headline.

[upi402]

52. Hats off the whoever got the story out

Then there's this;
"...62 workers at a factory that manufactures products for Apple and Nokia had been poisoned by n-hexane, a toxic chemical that can cause muscular degeneration and blur eyesight"

Murder on the installment plan.

[Codeine]

58. Apple got the story out. nt

[Downtown Hound]

60. Gee, and I USED to defend them too

I left the Mac over two years ago when I went to IT school. I use Linux now. Very grateful I do. Apple brands itself as the computer for smart, intellectual, creative artists types that want a better world. And here they are using child slaves.

I guess there really is no such thing as a good corporation.

[FreeState]

75. You didn't read the article did you? N/T

[Downtown Hound]

76. Yeah I did, and I'm not impressed

In case you're not aware, these kinds of charges have been kicking around against Apple for awhile now, as far back as 2004-05. And Apple is just now looking into it and doing something about it? Sorry, I'm not impressed. And anybody that is is a sucker in my book.

[Romulox]

61. This thread shows that people can justify almost ANYTHING if they like the product enough

I'm the owner of half a dozen various Apple products, so I'm pointing no fingers...

[MUAD_DIB]

63. Or justify anything if they hate it too.

[DainBramaged]

67. Did this one eariler Sunday(at least it proves Apple does audit their suppliers)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7813980

[Touchdown]

69. Mis-representing article. Apple exposed the child labor.

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/10/02/27/apple_taken_to_task_for_reporting_partners_child_labor_violations.html
Report used against Apple

Writing for the Telegraph UK, Malcolm Moore characterized the report's findings to make it sound like Apple had been caught violating the law and had been forced to admit that it was "using child labour in China," when in fact the opposite was actually the case.

In reality, Apple stepped in to police a situation it had no legal responsibility to address. "We required a review of all employment records for the year as well as a complete analysis of the hiring process to clarify how underage people had been able to gain employment ," Apple stated in the report.

At one facility, Apple discovered that management had actually been falsifying records to make it appear to be compliant with the company's standards.

"When we investigated," the report notes, "we uncovered records and conducted worker interviews that revealed excessive working hours and seven days of continuous work." Apple subsequently terminated all of its contracts with the factory.

[Sultana]

72. Will still Apple products