Va votes to block enforcement of federal mandates on health insurance

[Statistical]

Virginia's General Assembly became the first in the nation Wednesday to approve legislation that bucks any attempt by President Barack Obama and Congress to implement a national health care overhaul in individual states.

The Republican-ruled House of Delegates, with wide Democratic support, voted 80-17 without debate for the largely symbolic step aimed at the Democratic-backed reforms pushed by Obama and stalled in Congress. The vote sends the measure to Republican Gov. Bob McDonnell who intends to sign it.

...

The bill's sponsor, Del. Robert G. Marshall, R-Prince William, and other supporters advocated the measure as a defiant statement to an overreaching federal government. They say it falls under the Constitution's 10th Amendment that deals with state sovereignty. Marshall said he expects the law to be challenged and ultimately decided by the U.S. Supreme Court.

"There are limited powers the federal government has. Simply because of the supremacy clause, it doesn't mean anything that the Congress does, in fact, must be enforced at all levels of government in the United States," Marshall said in an interview after his bill won passage.

"It gives the state of Virginia the right to intervene on behalf of individuals should they decide not to pay for insurance and they refuse to pay the fine or they refuse to pay the fee or the tax or whatever you call it," he said.

...

More distressing for Virginia Democrats was that 21 of their 39 delegates in the 100-member House sided with the GOP in defying the initiative that is their party's national priority.

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http://www.wavy.com/dpp/news/virginia/va-votes-to-block-health-care-mandate

A little known fact is that IRS relies heavily on states to collect, garnish, and enforce. A state that refuses to enforce federal mandate will make any enforcement very difficult for the IRS.

[Statistical]

1. No mandates. The govt didn't need to mandate me to get a car, flatscreen TV, or life insurance.

I got those things because I believed they provided value for the money.

If insurance offers a value people will purchase it.
If it doesn't then they won't and they shouldn't be forced to purchase a product that doesn't provide value.

[Mari333]

2. [phone]

[katandmoon]

3. I'm against mandates but IMO this is not an apt comparison.

[Statistical]

6. Why?

The TV was tonque in cheek but I purchased both Flood Insurance & Life Insurance without a mandate.

I looked up the numbers and feel they provide security and value for my family.

I am above the 100 year flood plain thus am not mandated to have flood insurance however I am just barely above it so I feel it is worth it.

[tritsofme]

12. We can't just ignore the problem of adverse selection

Flood insurance wouldn't work so well if companies were mandated to write policies to people whose homes are already flooded.

[alc]

8. the mandate isn't to force individuals to purchase a product THEY want.

It's to force people to buy insurance who DON'T see a value in it (mainly young, healthy adults). By adding them to the pool, everyone can get cheaper rates. And those who don't buy in will pay fines that help subsidize those who can't afford it.

The proper way to get money from citizens into a system is through taxes, not by requiring purchase of a corporate product (especially one that many people don't want). Aside from all the other issues with the mandate, this is a REALLY bad precedent.

[Statistical]

14. It doesn't make it cheaper though.

It simply spreads it around.

Adding people to the pool *may* make alc insurance cheaper (depending on your age and other factors) but it hasn't reduced the cost of healthcare. It simply has spread the cost across more pockets.

Add in health insurance companies admin overhead and profit margin and you actually made total Healthcare (i.e amount of $$$ entire country spends on healthcare in all forms) more expensive.

If Healthcare wasn't such a racket more people would choose to purchase insurance.

[girl gone mad]

26. It's unlikely that rates will go down because of the mandate.

Take a look at what has happened over the last few decades in education. As more people were brought in to the system through subsidies, loans and scholarships, tuition soared. Colleges and universities simply took advantage of these new pools of money that had been created. The poor and middle class were constantly squeezed.

The insurance and health industries will follow this same playbook. With more money being diverted toward health coverage, providers will raise costs and premiums and go on a spending spree for new facilities, equipment, etc., none of which is likely to provide patients any more benefit than the Olympic-sized swimming pools and luxury dorm rooms provided college students. But it will keep costs sky-high and make some connected insiders quite wealthy.

[EFerrari]

4. I was wondering when someone would try this. n /t

[kenfrequed]

5. this is a symptom

This is a stupid reaction to a terrible bill that, rather than providing a public option that would free people from the insurance companies, contains a mandate instead. Perhaps people will look at this more closely now.

[kctim]

7. This and many more

were going to come with this mandate, a public option mandate or a single-payer mandate.
Not surprised at all.

[hobbit709]

9. I believe that argument was settled in April, 1865.

[Statistical]

10. Civil war has nothing to do with state enforcement of a federal statute.

CA does this with drug policy for example. CA prohibits state employees from assisting federal agents in medical marijuana prosecutions.

The federal govt can make something illegal (or this case subject to a fine). VA can't stop the federal govt however VA doesn't need to assist them either. If you owe the IRS money and they decide to seize assets do you know how they do it? They request assistance by local Sheriff.

The bill simply prohibits state agents from assisting in enforcement / collection of a law Virginia disagrees with. This doesn't mean you are immune for IRS in VA but rather VA won't assist the federal govt.

Should CA local Police be forced to enforce federal statutes on marijuana?
Should CA (and other states with "sanctuary") state troopers be required to enforce federal illegal immigrant statutes?

The federal govt has the right to pass any law it wants (well any Constitutional law) and the federal govt can enforce those laws. Nothing requires the State to assist federal govt with enforcement. States have the power to not assist the federal govt. It has happened many times in history of the United States and has been upheld as Constitutional.


If in VA the IRS wants to threaten, harass, enforce, or collect on this federal mandate let them do-so without any assistance from great Commonwealth of Virginia.

[Johonny]

27. I think clearly for many people the civil war settled nothing

[Ozymanithrax]

11. The tax fine for failing to purchase insurance will be on the Federal Income Tax...

Not the state.

This is a stupid, pointless exercise.

What they should do is pass a state law that allows a deduction equal to whatever tax fine is paid for failing to purchase health insurance. Take it right of the top of state taxes owed. That will teach.

[Statistical]

13. Not stupid. The IRS relies heavily on State collection and enforcement.

Without State assistance the ability of IRS to collect is made substantially more difficult.

VA is simpy refusing to provide assistance to federal govt for enforcement of this unjust law. It doesn't mean you are immune to IRS rather than VA won't assist them.

[LiberalLoner]

15. This is going to be a big mess I think. Oh I wish medicare for all had passed.

[Statistical]

17. I agree.

Eventually the United States will have a single payer system just as we have "single payer fire & police departments".

Likely I won't live long enough to see it. However in another 50-100 years I could see US finally joining rest of the civilized world.

[spanone]

20. wouldn't have mattered. the party of nothing is just that. they don't want shit to pass.

[progressoid]

16. Well, this is bound to end well.

:eyes:

[mdmc]

18. Protecting our freedoms!

[spanone]

19. good, when hcr passes, the va voters can kick these folks out of office & change the law

[girl gone mad]

21. The people of VA, like the majority of people in the rest of the country..

oppose being mandated to buy defective private health insurance policies.

This is only the first in a long line of legislative acts, protests and court battles to come.

[Statistical]

22. I think I heard on radio that 30 something? other states are considering similar action n/t

[spanone]

24. you speak for the majority of the people in the country? pretty amazing

[Statistical]

25. You honestly think people support mandates on high prices, high profit insurance?

You should run for Congress!

[girl gone mad]

28. Roughly 3/4 oppose individual mandates..

in poll after poll.

[Statistical]

23. Mandates are overwhelmingly unpopular. It is about the only thing voters agree on.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/12/18/poll-health-care-reform-w_n_396990.html

37% support a bill that has mandates but no public option.

[Statistical]

29. Last shameless kick for those coming home. n/t