AP: Some Toyota drivers suing in US for a full refund

[Omaha Steve]

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5imJf-xAYjZsiJx5KJN87X2aebzZQD9EFBVCG2

By CURT ANDERSON (AP) – 1 day ago

MIAMI — A group of Toyota owners sued the Japanese automaker Monday, demanding a full refund for their recalled cars and seeking a payout that could exceed several billion dollars.

Dozens of Toyota owners in Arizona and Washington claim the vehicles recalled over incidents of sudden acceleration are so unsafe they should be able to return them immediately. Attorney Steve Berman said many of the owners no longer trust their vehicles.

"When we talked with Toyota owners, they all voiced the same desire — to drive the car back to the lot, hand them the keys and pick up a check," said Berman, who is based in Seattle. "Fortunately, we think the law allows for exactly that solution, and we are asking the courts to make it happen."

The new lawsuits seek class-action status, which if expanded nationwide, could mean a settlement covering about 6 million recalled Toyotas in the U.S.

Dozens of other potential class-action lawsuits have also been filed against Toyota since it began recalling millions of vehicles to fix floor mats the company says can snag on the accelerator in some models and gas pedals that can get stuck in others. Critics and lawsuits contend the real problem is Toyota's electronic throttle control, which the company has denied.

Most of the lawsuits contend the recalls have triggered a significant drop in the value of Toyotas — between 6 percent and 15 percent, according to the Kelley Blue Book used-car manual — and are seeking a cash payment for owners to compensate for that loss. Lawyers involved in those cases have estimated Toyota could have to cough up more than $3 billion, assuming a conservative $500-per-owner payment.

FULL story at link.

[jody]

1. What if a sales contract contained a pre-dispute binding arbitration clause? Can courts hear cases?

[LiberalFighter]

2. Could intentional hiding of defects nullify arbritration?

[jody]

3. Hope a lawyer can answer your question. I oppose pre-dispute binding arbitration in all contracts.

[doc03]

4. I don't support a full refund but I think Toyota should give us a

significant discount for the purchase of a new Toyota. I know when I was shopping for a vehicle I could have bought a Chevy or Ford far cheaper but paid a premium price for what I thought was a superior vehicle and Toyota let me down..

[DainBramaged]

5. Why would you want to get kicked in the face again? Your idea of buying another Toyota is simply

dumb.


Let's review the times Toyota has screwed YOU the consumer.


The engines they made that sludged up between 1995 and 2002, even though the consumer changed the oil on schedule at the Toyota dealers and then Toyota tried to blame the consumer: end result, massive recall and settlement, engines replaced, consumers pissed.

The frames on the trucks that Toyota made from 1995-2003. They originally claimed it was the fault of the 'excessive' salt used in the Rust belt and the Northeast, but when tires started to break away from the frames in Texas and California, they realized they were in trouble: end result, massive recall, trucks being bought back at FOUR TIMES Kelly Blue Book wholesale.

Cars and trucks and SUV's made from 1995 to present, accelerating like there is a bargain at every stop light, except the cars don't stop and people get killed. Toyota tries for years to sweep it under the rug until it overwhelms them: end result, MASSIVE MASSIVE MASSIVE recall, largest in history, and you still want another Toyota?

It is JUST like the settlements of the 90's, the lawyers got gazillions of dollars for sung X manufacturer and the consumer got a coupon to buy more product from the manufacturer that screwed them.


If by now you just can't buy an AMERICAN car, a BETTER QUALITY car made by UNION workers you really need to think about your personal credentials.....


And if you paid a premium for a Toyota, you just really made yourself look foolish.

[Omaha Steve]

13. Premium disappeared in China

Sales went down in Europe too. It seems I saw an article that showed Toyota sales were down, not up last month as reported.


http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-03-17/toyota-s-premium-pricing-power-vanishes-in-china-after-recall.html

March 17, 2010, 7:52 AM EDT

By Makiko Kitamura and Yuki Hagiwara

March 17 (Bloomberg) -- Drivers in China are no longer in a hurry to own Toyota Motor Corp.’s cars.

Neil Hu, a sales manager at a Toyota dealership in Beijing, said he has stopped charging a 5,000 yuan ($732) premium to customers who want to skip the waiting list for RAV4 sport- utility vehicles. He took the initiative after the Japanese carmaker recalled 75,552 of the SUVs in China last month to fix gas pedals that may stick.

“I heard the situation in the U.S. is pretty bad for Toyota,” Hu said. “The recall has impacted us as well.”

Toyota, which grew more slowly than competitors in China in 2009, will likely lose more market share and see a decline in local profit margin this year, analysts say. The carmaker has relied on a reputation for quality and safety to sell high margin, mid- to large-size models even as the world’s biggest auto market shifts to cheaper, smaller cars, encouraged by government incentives.

With Toyota’s brand damaged by global recalls of millions of vehicles, profit margins for its SUVs and Camry and Crown sedans may shrink, said Ashvin Chotai, London-based managing director of Intelligence Automotive Asia Ltd., an industry consultant.

“With this recall saga, Toyota’s premium pricing power in China is gone,” Chotai said. “Toyota’s cars don’t have enough good value for money.”

FULL story at link.

[Historic NY]

6. State Lemon laws may trump a lawsuit...........

they have to have an opportunity to make repairs.

http://www.lemonlawamerica.com/Lemon-Law-Statutes.htm

[leveymg]

7. You had to know this was coming. Product liability lawyers and U.S. car makers exploit the fears

of people who are so profoundly incompetent as drivers and ignorant of the basic mechanics of automobiles that they can't figure out to put their cars in neutral if the gas pedal gets stuck.

Add the usual pompous Congressional hearing, tabloid press coverage, stir, and you get yet another reason for the rest of the world to abandon the U.S. market.

This country . . . what a bunch of suckers.

[DainBramaged]

8. Really, so you take the Republican point of view that the Corporations know what's best for us o_O

and that lawyers are bloodsuckers and all of the people who died (in spite of complaints and coverups gong back to 2004 when State Farm FIRST warned Toyota)were ignorant and incompetent?


How sad for you that your outlook on life is so vile how sad.

[leveymg]

9. No. I see one group of corporations attacking another, and that Toyota is one of the last

companies that actually provides a good product with value to the consumer. If it had not been for Toyota, Datsun and Mazda, we'd all still be rolling around in barges like this one:



The Japanese invasion of the 1970s forced Detroit to do something it still doesn't want to do -- and still doesn't do well -- compete. As a result, the U.S. auto industry is on the verge of extinction. In the back of a lot of minds is this fact, and an aggression born in frustration of many Americans who have seen yet another vestige of their dream disappear.

The fact that so many of us still drive huge monster trucks and SUVs shows we've learned little after decades of gas crises and price gouging by the oil industry. What has Toyota done to deserve this? It gave us the Prius.

[DainBramaged]

10. Your perceptions are not reality based, and comparing the Detroit of today

to that anchor in the picture is the same as comparing the japanese cars of today to the japanese cars of the 60's. And speaking of the Prius, the lump that allows Americans to greenwash their guilt, you can keep it, it's made in japan, not here.


Stay buried in your misconceptions. One day, when made in America is just a sentence in a textbook and the only jobs are sweeping the offices of our Foreign masters, maybe you'll remember our little conversation.

[jakefrep]

11. ".....actually provides a good product with value to the consumer"

LOL. The only thing learned from this recall issue is that Toyota really isn't what they've been cracked up to be.

[PBS Poll-435]

15. State Farm (Bloomington) STILL buys Toyota Camry, Camry Hybrid, Corolla, & Avalon for its Fleet

If they were so concerned......?

:shrug:

[Romulox]

12. Self-delusion is fascinating to observe.

:rofl:

[DainBramaged]

14. all OF THE Toyota FANS ARE DELUSIONAL...THEY THINK THE QUALITY GOES IN WITH THE NAME

When it's the marketing bottom ine that gets the quality.