Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

32 years ago today. Last US military flight out of Vietnam.

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 09:18 PM
Original message
32 years ago today. Last US military flight out of Vietnam.
Edited on Mon Apr-30-07 09:29 PM by Tom Joad
April 30th, 1975

The U.S. presence ended in Vietnam as U.S. Marines and Air Force helicopters, flying from carriers off-shore, begin a massive airlift, Operation Frequent Wind. In all, 682 flights went out-- 360 at night. 5,000 people were evacuated by helicopter from the military compound near Saigon's Tan Son Nhut airport; about 2500 from the U.S. Embassy (1000 Americans total, the rest Vietnamese).
That morning, two U.S. Marines, Darwin Judge and Charles McMahon Jr., Marine security guards, were killed in a rocket attack at the airport. They were the last Americans to die in the Vietnam War. At dawn, the last Marines of the force guarding the U.S. embassy lifted off.
The war in Vietnam ended as the government in Saigon announced its unconditional surrender to the North Vietnamese. Vietnam was reunited after 21 years of U.S. domination and 100 years of French colonial rule.



___________________________________
Thus ended our criminal war policy in Vietnam.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 09:32 PM
Response to Original message
1. "Even Now, We Lie To Ourselves About Vietnam" -- Robert Jensen, November 25, 2000
Edited on Mon Apr-30-07 09:33 PM by scarletwoman
Jensen teaches journalism at the University of Texas at Austin. He can be reached at rjensen@uts.cc.utexas.edu.



On his way to Hanoi last week, when asked if he thought the United States owed the people of Vietnam an apology, 25 years after the end of the war, Clinton said, simply, "No, I don't."

Some have offered a personalized explanation: As a man who avoided the draft during that war, Clinton has to stand tough today. But another possibility deserves consideration: To apologize for crimes against the people of Vietnam would be to admit that the stories we tell ourselves about our conduct in the world -- then and now -- are a lie.

To apologize would be to acknowledge that while we claimed to be defending democracy, we were derailing democracy. While we claimed to be defending South Vietnam, we were attacking the people of South Vietnam.

To apologize now would be to admit that the rationalizations for post-World War II U.S. foreign policy have been, and are still today, rhetorical cover for the power politics of an empire.

The standard story in the United States about that war is that in our quest to guarantee peace and freedom for Vietnam, we misunderstood its history, politics and culture, leading to mistakes that doomed our effort. Some argue we should have gotten out sooner than we did; others suggest we should have fought harder. But the common ground in mainstream opinion is that our motives were noble.

But we never fought in Vietnam for democracy. After World War II, the United States supported and financed France's attempt to retake its former colony. After the Vietnamese defeated the French in 1954, the Geneva Conference called for free elections in 1956, which the United States and its South Vietnamese client regime blocked. In his memoirs, President Eisenhower explained why: In free elections, the communists would have won by an overwhelming margin. The United States is all for elections, so long as they turn out the way we want.

The central goal of U.S. policy-makers in Vietnam had nothing to do with freedom for the Vietnamese people, but instead was to make sure that an independent socialist course of development did not succeed. (my emphasis) U.S. leaders invoked Cold War rhetoric about the threat of the communist monolith but really feared that a "virus" of independent development might infect the rest of Asia, perhaps even becoming a model for all the Third World.

To prevent the spread of the virus, we dropped 6.5 million tons of bombs and 400,000 tons of napalm on the people of Southeast Asia. Saturation bombing of civilian areas, counterterrorism programs and political assassination, routine killings of civilians and 11.2 million gallons of Agent Orange to destroy crops and ground cover -- all were part of the U.S. terror war in Vietnam, as well as Laos and Cambodia.

This interpretation is taken as obvious in much of the world, yet it is virtually unspeakable in polite and respectable circles in this country, which says much about the moral quality of polite and respectable people here.

(much more at link)


sw

on edit: vote to recommend
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
elocs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. I grew up with the war from the time it was in Viet Nam until it was Vietnam.
From the time I was first really aware of what was going on in the world it was in the headlines every day. Every day. It was the thing that caused me to lose my innocence when those and what you believe to be good do evil. Unfortunately, with the state of the world today and what happens everyday, I don't think the young people of today have much innocence left.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. I graduated from high school in 1967, my friends were being drafted.
But I was already plenty cynical from the time I was 14, when JFK was assassinated.

sw
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NorCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
2. The part that caught my eye...
"Vietnam was reunited after 21 years of U.S. domination and 100 years of French colonial rule."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
4. i remember watching that on tv
they also broadcast film of the Vietnamese army entering saigon. it all seems like a dream now...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Monkeyman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. You Didn't want to live that dream it still is in my nightmares
Now They didn't learn its happening again
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 10:10 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. I look forward to the last US military plane leaving Iraq.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Monkeyman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. You and me both and it better be soon
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. i never thought that it would happen in our lifetime
and worse i never thought that anyone in our generation would make that mistake. they never had to really put their convictions the line when it came to vietnam. maybe if they had there would`t be a war
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
juno jones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 10:23 PM
Response to Original message
9. So weird
I was thinking about that today when I read about the explosions in the green zone. Just a flash of those films of helicopters being dragged down by the people holdling onto the "feet", crawling like ants to the top of the buildings trying to get out. "Are we there yet?" I wondered.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mark414 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-30-07 11:56 PM
Response to Original message
11. i recall a DUer giving a firsthand account of that day
but i can't remember who...hopefully they'll poke their head in here
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-01-07 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Lots of Vietnam vets on DU -- I'll give this a kick and see if anyone else shows up. (nt)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mark414 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-01-07 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. indeed there are (and another kick)
but this particular DUer in question was there, at the embassy (with those famous photos) on that last day and was one of the lucky ones airlifted out...

i'm gonna have to search the archives and try to find his story...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue Apr 16th 2024, 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC