So this guy tells me health care 'uncertainty' is killing the economy

[LuckyTheDog]

This guy responded to a Facebook post of mine by whining that the "economy has been crippled" by the "unknown" uncertain future of 20% of the economy. He thinks Obama should just forget the whole health care reform thing so that Wall Street can swoop in and save the economy. If Obama backed down, this guy claimed, Wall Street would invest and create new jobs -- something it apparently is just itching to do, if only it could get some clarity about health care. This was my response:

The economy was crippled by the health care debate? Again, I think your rhetoric is out of sync with reality. The economy was in quicksand and sinking fast when Obama took the reins of the federal government. And the cause of the crisis was directly related to the adoption of “free market reforms” going back to Reagan.

Lowering the top marginal tax rate under Reagan made much worse the short-term-thinking, bonus-driven culture in the top ranks of corporations and Wall Street. Why invest for the long term when the tax code encourages you to extract as much cash as you can as quickly as you can? Add to that the dismantling of Depression-era banking laws and other forms of financial and business deregulation, and we were set up for the kind of collapse we saw in 2008.

Yes, some of this happened under Clinton. That just shows that even Democrats are susceptible to the bad conservative ideas.

Some people want to blame Wall Street. But that’s like blaming the lion for eating the antelope. Wall Street is predatory. It’s the nature of the beast. You can’t expect them to change and you don’t really want them to change very much.

As in nature, that predatory nature can be very useful in weeding out the sick and weak enterprises from the herd and strengthening the rest by allowing the best “genes” (read: ideas) to survive. But when the predators gain too many advantages (think: men with guns, replacing lions), then the whole balance gets thrown off and the system falls apart.

Conservatism is kind of like that. It celebrates the predatory, eat-or-be-eaten aspect of capitalism -- without realizing that, if all the antelopes get killed off, that ends up being bad for the hunters as well.

[Gman2]

1. He is right. There is much uncertainty in business right now. And investment, or hiring is scary

[LuckyTheDog]

3. C'mon, the health care debate is not the cause

That is NOT why the economy is on its knees.

[Gman2]

4. No, but business likes stability. And we aint got none.

[LuckyTheDog]

5. And again... the health care debate ain't the cause

And giving up on health care reform would not be the solution.

[Gman2]

7. Nope, but I wish things were more mellow. So do businesses.

They aint, and doing the governing during those times, is thankless work. As rethugs always plan.

[gmoney]

8. Business and Wall Streeters are proving themselves to be chickenshit

"Oh, I can't hire someone because Obama MIGHT possibly raise taxes 3 percent or make me give them health coverage four years from now..."

How is that SO frightening to these co-called captains of industry, masters of the universe?

If it happens, and it's really bad, FIRE people like you ALWAYS do whenever there's the least little set-back in the quest for ever increasing profits. Or close a factory. Or just suck it up for once the way your grandfather probably did building the business he grew from nothing, then handed to your father, who was slightly less of a dumbass than YOU are.

"Ooh, if cap and trade passes, my oil stocks may only grow at 18% a year instead of 22% a year! Panic, panic, sell, sell, sell! Hide under the covers and stockpile weapons and canned goods!"

Wall Street's demands for not only profits, but endless GROWTH in profits, has caused American companies to gut themselves, ship everything offshore, and create a populace that can no longer afford to buy their products or services.

If Wall Street or Main Street had any sort of spine, or could operate with some common sense and decency, we wouldn't be in this mess.

[HughBeaumont]

9. Silly Rabbit. "Suck it Up!" is only for the unwashed heathens who don't get to sleep on silk.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/HughBeaumont/60

Only the wealthy get to lead their lives with nary a land mine or roadblock to get in their way. The rest of us? "Work HARDER, and . . . HARDER after that!" It's all a scam and the door is closed.

[Gman2]

10. Sure it's rigged, and we will all die paupers, but dignity is still worth fighting for.

[Sherman A1]

2. GREAT!!!

An excellent response......:toast:

[doc03]

6. I agree to that somewhat, I think the way the debate

has been drug out has had a negative effect on jobs. But the reason it has taken so long is the Republican opposition to it not Democrats. I think some of the blame could be put on Obama for letting Congress f--- up the process before getting out front and fighting for it.