Racists for Obama '08

[Scriptor Ignotus]

OK, so I've seen a few posts mention that Obama can't be elected because there are too many racists and/or Islamophobes in this country.

Let's assume your concerns are valid.

Exactly how many racists would vote for any of the other Democratic candidates?

Exactly how many racists would vote for Hillary instead of Obama?

The answer, my friends, is few to none. If someone is small-minded enough to not vote for a well spoken (articulate?), inspirational candidate (you can debate his experience and qualifications, but his ability to inspire millions has already been proven) then it is HIGHLY, HIGHLY doubtful they would EVER vote for any other Democrat for President. I'm sure there are thousands of racist/Islamophobic Democrats out there too, but let's be honest, the majority of these bigots are going to be Republicans or maybe Independents.

Sadly, I know for a fact millions of Americans will not vote for Obama ONLY because he is a black man. Millions more will not vote for him because he is a perceived Muslim or perceived Muslim sympathizer.

My response to this segment of our society? Fuck 'em. Fuck their racism. Fuck their Islamophobia. Fuck their 19th century mindsets. We don't need your votes. We don't want your votes.

If you don't support Obama because he's not qualified, or not experienced enough in foreign policy, or for whatever other reason, that's completely understandable. We can debate these things and in truth they are valid concerns that I have for him too (and I'm obviously a big supporter of his). But when I weigh his pros vs. his cons and compare him to the other candidates he comes up on top every time.

Let's look back briefly at what Rove did in 2000 and 2004. He saw a segment of the population that would NEVER support his candidate and he said the same thing: Fuck 'em. This time, instead of spurning moderates and liberals, we can spurn racists and bigots. Seems like a much better deal this time around...

[Democrats_win]

1. America would be as lucky to have Obama as they are now unlucky to have */chainy.

Some of the people who voted for */chainy hate America and have delivered this country and our soldiers to be sacrificed for the gods of greed and corruption.

[murielm99]

2. Exactly how many?

That thirty percent who do not budge from supporting * no matter what he does.

That is, IF they vote. I have noticed that a large number of vocal idiots are not registered, and never get near a polling place.

Good post.

:thumbsup:

[bryant69]

3. Totally agree

I am largely supporting Edwards, but we have to get past attacking our own candidates for being unelectable. That just plays into our enemies hands.

Bryant
Check it out --> htpt://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

4. What I find ironically amusing...

is that what they're basically saying is that Obama shouldn't run because he's black.

[qwlauren35]

14. Not me...

It's because he's black AND inexperienced.

Now, you can call me cynical if you want to, but there will be tons of people who will point to his inexperience so that they don't have to admit to racism.

I'm sorry, but I have NO DOUBT that all the racists would come out of the closet to vote against Obama if he won the primary.

On the other hand, I think he's EXCELLENT vice-presidential material.

If you look at what the Republicans have done lately, whenever they nominate one of us (black) to an office, that person is SOOOOOOOOOO overqualified that you'd really have to out yourself by objecting to them. Heck, that's how "we" USED to move people up the ladder, before Affirmative Action. Develop yourself until you are virtually overqualified, and even the racists will admit that you have something they need.

We still live in a time when whenever one of us rises to the top, the spotlight shines, almost daily, and we have to be squeaky clean. Clinton didn't squeak, but a black man could NOT have gotten away with getting blown by an intern. PULEASE!!!!!!!!! Especially not a white one.

It wasn't that long ago that a black man was tied to a truck and dragged until he died. It wasn't that long ago that a star athlete, around 19 years old, was CONVICTED of rape because he was black, slept with his 17 year old white girlfriend, and daddy didn't approve.

We still live in an age of racial profiling, where police shoot first if we "look" dangerous. Oprah admits that she gets treated like dog-meat if someone doesn't recognize her. So does Michael Jordan.

The racists in America have NOT died out yet. White people 10 years older than me (50's and up) who LIKED "the way things were" still vote.

I don't want to lose this election. I can't throw my hat in with anyone that I see as having any significant disadvantages that would actually BRING OUT people who don't typically vote, who just want to make sure he does NOT get elected.

Not even Hillary ran as a junior senator. It's just too soon. Obama doesn't squeak yet.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

20. So you don't like him cause he's black.

At least partially because he's black.

I'm not bying the "inexperienced" bit either.

[Colobo]

61. You got it.

[BlooInBloo]

33. What a bizarre transparent willful misinterpretation. Kudos!

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

40. It ain't a misinterpretation.

It's cutting through the crap.

[Colobo]

5. Great post!

[BonnieJW]

6. At this point,

Bugs Bunny would win if he declared himself a Dem. No repub will win the next election.

[Nia Zuri]

7. It would mobilize the racists to vote AGAINST him

[auburngrad82]

13. My hope is it mobilizes African Americans to vote FOR him.

When blacks vote, Dems win. Jimmy Carter and Clinton both won because of the black vote.

[Kelly Rupert]

16. Blacks aren't showing particularly high levels of support for Obama.

Unfortunately for Obama, it seems that black voters are by and large not racist, and are rather looking beyond skin color. He's doing well enough with blacks, but he's hardly 'energizing the African-American community' or anything like that.

[Nia Zuri]

18. A lot of blacks are leery becasue deep down, we know he can't win.

[auburngrad82]

21. I don't believe that.

If there has ever been an African American candidate who could win it's Obama. People need to realize that there is no such thing as a perfect candidate. There is always going to be something you don't agree with. Kucinich is too far left, Clinton is too far right, Edwards voted for the war, and on and on. The fact is all of our candidates are head and shoulders above any Republican candidate right now.

The person who gets the most votes wins. Barack Obama is a candidate who can win because he appeals to both blacks and to whites. I think Edwards is the same way. And personally, I think any ticket with Obama on it, whether it be Clinton/Obama, Edwards/Obama, Obama/Edwards, or whatever, will be a winning ticket.

We need to quit looking at things as "he/she can't win" and start looking at what we can do to help him/her win. I don't care who's on the ticket in November 2008, I will vote for them because they represent the Democratic Party. I probably won't agree with the 100% but they will represent 300 million Americans, not just me. And I'd rather a Democrat be elected than any Republican.

To paraphrase a very popular Right Wing bumper sticker "I'd rather ride with Ted Kennedy than vote Republican."

[porque no]

44. From you post I gather that you are African American.

Will you vote for him if it comes to it?

[Nia Zuri]

58. Absolutely!!!

[qwlauren35]

17. Nope. Not entirely accurate.

We voted in droves in the Gore/Bush election. If you look at the data, we have a higher voter percentage than the national average, and 90% of us have traditionally voted Democrat.

There's not much more we can do by swelling our numbers. Really. Especially after Florida's chads.

I would add that there will be MANY in the African-American community who will reject Obama for being "Cosby-esque". He didn't come up from nothing, he's not "self-made", and for some, he's just not "black enough".

I'm not saying that these people will vote AGAINST him. But some of them will definitely stay home.

[Scriptor Ignotus]

24. I think Hillary will mobilize that sector

just as much as Barack.

no evidence to back that up, just conversations I've had with the staunch conversatives/borderline racists I know.

[Le Taz Hot]

8. Funny, I've been called a racist

by people in the Obama camp because I don't support him. Apparently, I'm also a misogynist for not supporting Hillary Clinton. :eyes:

I understand and agree with what you're saying, however. Why are we pandering to: racists, misogynists, THE RIGHT (in the guise of the "center), and other underbelly segments of our society?

[skipos]

9. Obama may be my 1st choice but

I can admit that his race will make his candidacy a challenge. I know plenty of racists and bigots who voted for Kerry.

No one is saying that we should run a candidate who will appeal to the KKK. What people are saying is that racism is alive and well in America, and it isn't only coming from Bush supporters. There is no reason to live in denial of that.

You don't win elections by only appealing to intelligent, informed voters. In my experience, only 25% of the voting population is intelligent and informed.

[tavalon]

27. Thank you

Pointing out the obvious seems to get one labeled a racist.

[Hippo_Tron]

38. One of my favorite political quotes...

Is when a woman told Adlai Stevenson that all of the thinking people in America were behind him and he replied, "Yes ma'am, but we need a majority."

[shadowknows69]

10. I don't think it's a factor in him getting elected

but i do think it's a factor in his survivability. every white supremecist in the US will come out of the wood work and some of the ones with guns will try to kill him.

[Kelly Rupert]

12. Assassinations are rather difficult.

Both Bush and Cheney are alive and well (and I am not for a second suggesting that anyone should attempt to assassinate either), despite being hated by a large section of America and the majority of the world's population.

[Kelly Rupert]

11. The problem is that racism is not binary.

People aren't either "racist" or "not racist," or "bigoted" or "not bigoted." People's psyches are fairly complex, and his race is likely to subconsciously sway a few average people away from him. However, the number of people likely to be swayed away (or towards him) because of his race are absolutely negligible compared to those swayed by his actual pros and cons--that is, his relative inexperience and his Kennedyesque charisma.

Of course, even still, that neglects a very real issue--those racists to whom we say "fuck 'em." The thing about divisive politics, well, is that it fires up base constituencies while turning off the moderates. And, unfortunately, the conservative base constituency is both larger and more ruthless than the liberal base constituency; were it not, Bush would have gone down in flames both electoral cycles. We won in '06 in large part because we had an energized base and the Republicans had a demoralized, apathetic base. I don't think '08 will be nearly as easy as DU seems to think it will be.

[Scriptor Ignotus]

22. that's a good point you're making

or good points I should say.

But when I say "Fuck 'em" I don't mean go after them, or demonize them or whatever. Obama isn't going to run that sort of a campaign anyway. In fact the opposite. When I say "Fuck 'Em" I really mean, ignore them. Marginalize them. Make them embarrased that they are judging this man because of his skin pigment or his father's Kenyan name.

[IronLionZion]

47. it's not like being a little bit pregnant, we're all a little bit racist

the enlightened ones realize our subconscious bias and deal with it.

[SheilaT]

15. Keep in mind that

we still don't have popular election of the President. If we did, well, let's not re-hash old wounds.

But all any candidate needs to become President is 270 Electoral College votes. I think it would only take about 12 of the most populous states to get to that total. Probably the astonishing thing is that more presidents haven't been elected with fewer popular votes than the "loser", who lost in the EC part, which is the only part that counts. And I'm not even taking into account the fraud of the last two elections.

[BuyingThyme]

19. What if Obama decides that Blacks should not be allowed to be married?

And what if he cites religion as the basis for his decision?

Would he still get the Black vote?

[Scriptor Ignotus]

23. I wasn't speaking to him and the "black vote"

so I'm not sure what point you're trying to make..

sorry if i'm missing the obvious but I'm not seeing where your train of thought is going here...

[BuyingThyme]

56. Well he thinks he can get more votes by keeping homosexuals from marrying,

so maybe he can tip the scales if he keeps black people from marrying.

[Der Blaue Engel]

25. My feeling on this is that if he can win the nomination, he can win the presidency

I'm a firm believer in voting for the candidate of your choice in the primaries and letting the chips fall where they may. Not electable? Then he won't get enough votes to be the nominee and you don't have to worry about it.

Vote your conscience in the primary. Vote your party (for the sake of the country, Democracy, and the planet) in the general.

[noiretextatique]

26. i'm black, and i do not believe obama is electable

at least not in america, nor will he get the nomination. we live in a country where it's still perfectly fine to disenfranchise black voters without serious consequence. i don't see it happening...at all.

[tavalon]

28. While I agree with you

I think he is electable enough that he wouldn't be a detriment as the VP candidate and that Americans would get used to him in that role such that 8 years from now, he could be elected easily. This is what I want to see. Hillary isn't acceptable to the American people in any capacity except First Lady or Senator and she's already done that gig.

[noiretextatique]

30. vp...absolutely, not president

and perhaps if he was vp, a presidential bid after that would be more possible.

[Scriptor Ignotus]

29. and that is why you failed

(a la Yoda, Empire Strikes Back)

I'm white so I'm a little torn into how deeply I can respond to your post. I'll keep it fairly superficial:

I find your mindset troubling, at the same time I find it logical and understandable. Let me just say that I find it highly doubtful any black person has achieved any kind of meaningful success in America with that kind of frame of mind.

[noiretextatique]

31. well, that's something you have absolutely no knowledge of, do you?

how's this for "meaningful success"
BA
MBA
Accountant
Published poet
etc
etc
etc

perhaps it is "troubling" to you, but i see america i lot differently than you do, and i guarantee you that my "mindset" is shared by many black people who have acheived "meaningful success." my mindset is based in the unpleasant reality of things...and it is the key to my "meaningful success."

how about your "meaningful success?"

i could say a lot more to you too, but i won't. your post was rude and offensive though, and if you try that again, i won't be as restrained.
.

[Scriptor Ignotus]

32. yes I am an idiot

I read what you wrote, and then re-read what I wrote and you're right about my "meaningful success" line. When I typed that phrase I was thinking along the lines of "breaking barriers (first black president, first black baseball player, etc) not along the lines of personal accomplishments. I did not articulate my thoughts well at all, and I sincerely apologize for how I put that. Should have been totally rewritten to read: ("nobody (black or otherwise) has broken barriers thinking that it couldn't have been done"). A simple thought, but one I didn't get out correctly. I'm embarrassed I missed the mark so widely.

This is why it's so difficult to discuss race on the internet, because we're not face to face and you can't look me in the eye and tell where my heart is. Over the internet I can't correct a clumsily worded sentence and you can't read my body language and see that I have a point to make but am failing to phrase it properly. In real life I think you would have cringed the minute "meaningful success" came out of my mouth, I would have realized that that wasn't what I was trying to say, retracted, and would have rephrased myself in a matter of seconds. On the internet that clarfication is slow coming and something stupid stays posted, uncorrected, for far too long.

Race is such a sensitive issue, that I think most people decline to discuss it at all. At the same time I think most misunderstandings about race and even religion can be corrected through an open dialog. I really hope that my post will not turn you off from engaging in this discussion.

I would remove the stupid from my post if I could, but the editing ability has expired.

[bling bling]

35. I understood what you meant.

Keep the hope. Obama is a black man in this country too and he believes in himself and that's all I need to hear because I believe in him too. I trust he wouldn't subject himself and his family to the grueling campaign if he didn't feel he had a chance.

Obama CAN be the President of this country. If we can just get the Democrats to elect him in the primary he WILL be the President of this country. We have a better shot of getting him elected in the primary by staying focused on why he's the best man for the job.

[noiretextatique]

53. neither jackson or sharpton or chisolm had a chance of winning

but they ran anyway. i don't think everyone runs for office to win, necessarily, and i think obama is fighting an uphill battle for several reasons, race being merely one of them.
i hope we nominate a strong candidate who has broad appeal to the largest possible segment of the voting public. if that is obama...fine. i will say this, if any black man can be elected president in america, obama is the type of person who could be the first.

[bling bling]

55. The Democrats are going to be a big part of his uphill battle.

Here's my thoughts in a general sense.

From the bottom of my heart I feel Obama can win this country if he can win in with the Democrats. But he needs his supporters, I think, more than the others need theirs. His supporters need to help him by convincing people to let go of their fears of his unelectability.

The only thing I know for sure is that he won't make it if people don't support him. The people who think he's the best candidate hold the power to get him elected. My fear is that the very people who could make it happen for him will get deflated by worrying too much about people who WON'T support him. Or, that the people who would want to jump on board if the train was happy and positive will instead get roadblocked by those who say he can't win, so they choose instead to go with the most electable candidate.

To me it's kind of like when Alan Greenspan uttered the word "recession" and the next day the stock market went down. The more we focus on how race will prevent Obama from winning the more likely that will be true. DU is a challenge for me because I see the race argument being used here against Obama nearly every day in one thread or another. I wish I could figure out how to get more people here to be the change they want to see in the rest of the country.

[noiretextatique]

60. my main concern has been eased

since i did some research on white voters voting for black candidiates. i think obama has a shot, but i am still not convinced he is the best cnadidate. one thing for sure...anyone is better than bush.

[qwlauren35]

43. Nope, not true at all.

I think most of us know what the limits are.

You seem to be ignoring a lot of data, and going with your heart. We have a hard enough time keeping ONE BLACK SENATOR and never seem to have more than one at a time.

But somehow, you think we might have a black president.

In a world where money talks, we have figured out how to get ahead. But in the world of politics, we reach our highest offices by APPOINTMENT, NOT BY ELECTION. Look at Ron Brown, Jocelyn Elders, Colin Powell and Condoleeza Rice. By appointment, they have held some of the most powerful positions in the land. But not by election.

African-Americans have a very difficult time getting elected to legislative offices in the US; getting the executive spot, this time around, just isn't going to happen.

Yes, absolutely, it takes gonads to get anywhere in the US. And it takes enormous ego to run for president. And lots of us have the required gonads and ego. But it takes a lot more than that to WIN an election. Ask Kerry, Dukakis, Dole, etc. Ask Gore...

[FrenchieCat]

37. Obama is not "electable" if enough believe what you believe......

which is a self realizing formula.

I'm sure many said that a JFK wouldn't be President (and those folks probably voted for Nixon) because he was Catholic!

Many said that Black people would never be able to do a lot of things.....and so for a long time, it was the accepted way....not to allow them to do it.

I think this rationale is horseshit....I say that as one Black person speaking to another!

Guess this makes Edwards the winner by default! Guess he's electable cause he's a White Boy from the South. How good for him! :eyes:

[noiretextatique]

50. belief is fine, but numbers and dollars win prevail in the end

and i don't think i'm being pessimissitic by siumply pointing out that reality.

[porque no]

46. Would you vote for him?

Just curious to find out if we lose your vote by running Obama. I'm a white man, I will vote for Obama in the primary and beyond, for what it's worth.

Who you gonna vote for, the Morman? that is rich. black people are going to sit this one out because they don't "think" he can win? Oh gawddamn that is rich.

[noiretextatique]

51. i might vote for him

i am not particularly thrilled by obama...believe it or not. but, per usual, i will vote for the best candidate in the primary, and the least objectionable one in the final election.
thankfully, i don't live in florida where my name might be purged from the rolls. and...i am not rich.
is this the democratic version of the rw whine about blacks "mindlessly" voting democratic? if i happen to think hillary or edwards are better candidates, would i still be black, in your opinion?

[IronLionZion]

49. That's the wrong attitude to have my friend

impossible things happen all the time. Who expected Keith Ellison to win when he's muslim and Minnesota is,.. well,... midwestern? Even in Ellison's urban district, the people are mostly white and protestant.

The very white state of Massachusetts elected Deval Patrick governor. The southern state of Virginia elected America's first black governor, Doug Wilder, and that state has a long history with racism.

There was a time when you and I would find it unthinkable to be served at a lunch counter or go to school with the whiteys. Fortunately that's not the case now.

We miss all the shots we don't take and thinking something is impossible makes it impossible. If we think it might be possible, then it just might happen if we work for it.

The saddest thing of all is that even here on DU, we have to state our race when we make a point in this discussion. That means race matters. The credibility of a DU post ought not to be race-related.

[noiretextatique]

52. um yeah...race matters

however, i've come across some research that makes me a little more optimistic about his chance of winning.

[BlooInBloo]

34. Aaah.... the "good whites" caucus speaks! Only republicans are racist - lol!

Yah - just like only good people are christian.

[Scriptor Ignotus]

39. where did I say that only republicans are racist?

I think I was clear that racism is representated all across the political spectrum -- in my experience more so on the right.

Also, nowhere in my OP do I imply that the people who won't vote for Obama (only because he's black) are solely white people.

[BlooInBloo]

41. It's an obvious consequence of the OP - even without saying the words.

[FrenchieCat]

36. Unfortunately,

I have seen many posts even here at DU in where posters state that other Dems running are the only "electable" ones...which I am starting to realize is "Code" for a racist ideal as to what it takes to become President of the United States. Guess those folks have never seen episodes of the television show, 24. :shrug:

[jsamuel]

42. I am for Edwards, but I think that is a BS reason not to vote for someone.

I think it is BS to not vote for them because "others won't" especially in primaries.

[porque no]

45. You gotta look at this logically and by the numbers,

Right leaning Repubics will never vote for Obama, he's a democrat. A great portion of Repubics will never vote for Obama, he's a Democrat. Racists will never vote for Obama, that's a given.

So who is it that we are losing by running an african American for President? Democrats who are so racist that they would vote for Space Ship Romney over Obama? How many is that again.

I agree with the OP, we don't need them, and from what I've seen and heard, Obama doesn't bring out the bigotry like many others, he kinda transcends it, at least with some.

Obama all the way, baby!

[cooolandrew]

48. He has the backing to beat Hillary and that's a big factor. If you're exceptional race doesn't...

... matter. eg. Mohammed Ali who happened also to be muslim, which to highlight Barack isn't of that faith.

[ProgressiveAmPatriot]

54. Progressives Need to Reject and Reframe the question, Is America Ready for a (blank) president?

I recently wrote an article about this on my blog titled http://progressiveamericanpatriot.blogspot.com/2007/04/shifting-debate-over-conservative.html">Shifting the Debate over Conservative Bigotry and the Civil War in Iraq which addressed this issue.

Here is an excerpt that applies particularly to the cases of Clinton and Obama:

Pundits across the political spectrum have ground the idea that “America isn’t ready for woman president” into the minds of liberals and conservatives alike. We are told as well that “America isn’t ready for black president.” If the media decides to move Richardson into first tier of Democratic candidates for president, they will soon convince us that “America isn’t ready for a Hispanic or Latino president.” As this line is repeated ad nauseum, many accept its conclusion because the premise of the question was never rejected. Why do we accept these euphemisms? The question is not whether America is ready. The question is whether America is too sexist to elect a woman or too racist to elect a black man. Put in these terms, conservatives seeking to dismiss the diverse Democratic field will be forced to either drop the hatchet or come out and blatantly say they think America is extremely racist and sexist.

Either way, we can talk about Democratic issues while they get to decide whether they are going to call the American electorate sexist or racist or just drop it. Sexism is either a major problem or it isn’t. Racism is either a major problem or it isn’t. If they are going to say are candidates aren’t viable because of their sex or race, we are going to demand that they address sexism and racism. Why isn’t their a female or a black Republican candidate for president? Does the Republican Party have a problem with sexism? Does the Republican Party have a problem with racism?

[bling bling]

57. Fantastic. Really. Thank you for sharing this.

I think you're absolutely 100% correct about the framing. I sincerely hope you will inject this into other posts in the future because it needs to be repeated over and over again, I think, in order for this to sink in. I hope you will not mind if I link to it or expand on this in some form as well.

[Geek_Girl]

59. Racist may vote for Edwards before Guliani

Especially in the south