Why do the terrorists hate us?

[saltpoint]

Dubya says it's because we love freedom.

But why do YOU think the terrorists hate us?

Choose one of the first 9 below or OTHER in slot 10.


Question:

THE TERRORISTS HATE US BECAUSE:

[NightWatcher]

1. How about because we bomb them and support the evil leaders who torture them

[DesertRat]

2. exactly. n/t

[saltpoint]

5. Very likely the PNAC crew hasn't considered it from that angle,

but dammit, I'm right with ya.

[EFerrari]

3. Other: they can only rob us one election at a time. n/t

[saltpoint]

36. Yeah, but we're gonna kick their sorry butts in 2008.

Ken Blackwell thought he was going to be the next Diebold-blessed Governor of Ohio.

Things didn't go so well for him, despite those deep ties to Diebold.

I think there are going to be a lot of Republicans defeated in 2008, including Pete Domenici if he even bothers to run, and maybe Elizabeth Dole, who always struck me as someon who might work for the Chamber of Commerce of Syrup City, Mississippi.

[EFerrari]

41. I've learned it isn't only Diebold or ES&S but did you see that

the same IT guy that set up the email system in the GOP Justice Dept scandal also set up Blackwell's site for 2004? No flies on the BFEE.

We will kick sorry butt AGAIN in 2008 and as in 2006, we need to keep building the watchdog infrastructure to make sure they don't steal it again. We were loaded for bear in 2006. But, the Federal election is easier to steal.

We have to keep our helmets on and we will. I'm tired of electing Democrats that don't get seated and so is my little dog. :)

[MadBadger]

4. Partially Our Government's support of Israel.

[saltpoint]

8. I insist on a distinction between the government of a nation and its people.

Just as I would hope someone from "old Europe" would distinguish between you and me and Bush, for example.

I understand your point, but really have to argue against the broad-brush interpretation of an entire country or culture.

Nothing personal.

[MadBadger]

9. fixed it

[saltpoint]

11. Thank you, hnmnf -- I seriously meant no personal affront to you, but

very valued personal friends of mine who are Jewish are certainly not representative of the hardline political ideology of some of their government officials, in the same way you and I certainly are not willing to let someone like Don Rumsfield or Richard Perle speak for us.

Thank you.

[MadBadger]

13. No, I agree with you. When I said Us, i was speaking about our policy

though I realize it wasnt clear. I am Jewish and I do support Israel, but to an extent. I believe that there are two sides of the issue unlike many of my Jewish friends including my parents who only see on side.

[saltpoint]

20. I think we're cool. I imagine all of us have encountered the one-side-only

contingent.

I think I'm hearing you and understanding what you mean and where you're coming from.

In the long view I would love it if our next president -- no matter who it is -- would encourage a more global and inclusive spirit. I'd expect it of our Democratic candidates, but we need it no matter what. Bush has alienated way too many nations -- nations who used to be our friends.

[Lerkfish]

6. because we're nakedly aggressive hegemonists hell-bent on world domination and

the complete destruction of anyone who does not offer us fealty.

In other words, we're the world's tyrant. What's not to hate?

[saltpoint]

31. I am hungry to hear the voices of the anonymous Muslim villager in

an anonymous part of an Islamic nation who can communicate a universal, inclusive vision.

I don't want Mohammed Atta in a Deerfield Beach, Florida motel, peering at himself in the mirror before he goes to a strip club up A1A.

And more importantly, I don't want my media telling me that Atta is the Muslim and that the anonymous "universal" Muslim is the Muslim I need to know.

Least of all do I want my president to try and frighten me, my family, and my friends about "the terrorists following us home."

The Republican Party is not the whole world but it operates often as if the whole world were its own patio backyard. The 2008 elections will be difficult for the GP to steal -- Kenneth Blackwell might have tried it in Ohio in 06 and got his ass stuck in the glue -- and the confluence of events conspires against the red team.

A more thoughtful man or woman in the Oval Office will not be able to untaunt our allies or restore rapidly the damage Bush has done, but a turn int he right direction toward that universal, inclusive vision will be vividly noticed. And genuinely necessary.

[mudesi]

7. OTHER: Unconditional support of Israel and belligerent foreign policy (nm)

[saltpoint]

12. Do you think it might be a case of the Bush administration -- since we've

suffered 6 years of it already with another 2 or so to go -- a case of Dubya and his PNAC pals declaring that there was an axis of evil?

I mean, consider the language as warlike, but consider the gesture, too. To me, it was a classic case of demonizing the "enemy" to justify aggression against that enemy.

Our foreign policy needs rehauled from many years before Dubya, but it's Dubya who did the demonizing in this case and almost 4,000 of our daughters and sons are dead because of it.

My poll here attempted to undermine Dubya's demonization. "The terrorists hate us!" he says.

[Xipe Totec]

10. Because we're over there

instead of over here.

[TahitiNut]

14. Other: We're a "safe haven" for the Global Military Industrial Complex

... it's like "Son of Godzilla." :shrug:

[saltpoint]

23. Hi, TahitiNut. I'm trying to keep it light here tonight, actually.

Evidently I waded into a kind of harsher landscape than I bargained for.

My target was George Bush and his propensity to demonize "the enemy," thus attempting to dehumanize them, thus justify pre-emptive military assault.

And I was trying to extract his "because we love freedom" propaganda as evidence that he was off-base and contemptuous.

It's clear I didn't do a very good job of it.

[TahitiNut]

26. Oh. You didn't think "Son of Godzilla" was funny?

Gotta work on that. :evilgrin:

[saltpoint]

27. LOL! You're great -- don't worry -- I was just taking

responsibility for my own blurred target.

[Jacobin]

15. Support of Israel and treament of Palestinians

And our support of repressive Arab regimes.

This is the stuff that DU 101 is made of.

the other choices on this quiz are BushBot talking points

[saltpoint]

18. Jacobin, you have missed the spirit of the poll. If I love Elie Wiesel's writing

I am not an oppressor, nor a tool for an oppressive culture. If I oppose militarism, I oppose it in any uniform, and must temper my opposition rheteoric when my own president is launching pre-emptive assaults on sovereign nations.

Philip Roth is one of my champions. Surely you have read him and understand the motivation for my genuine and abiding respect for his work, for his sensibility, for his range and depth.

My government could have had Al Gore or John Kerry, both of whom were intellectual men, thoughtful men. Instead and at the moment that office is held by a much lesser thinker, a man who couldn't count his own nuts even if he knew where to look for them, and who is the very embodiment of xenophobia.

Our foreign policy is certainly skewhunky. I don't quarrel with the point. But you missed the focal attack of my poll.

I read your posts on DU with respect and expect to continue to. But you're way off on this one tonight.

[slowry]

16. Legitimate reasons,

some not-so-legitimate ones, and some whacked-out-fanatical-nut-tastic ones. It's not one thing.

It's certainly not solely our "freedoms", but that is undeniably a factor. They don't appreciate freedom of speech, religion, appearance, sexuality, etc. Other than that, I'm pretty sure they don't enjoy watching men, women, and children being killed and oppressed for oil, as others have pointed out. Support of nations they hate (again, some legitimate concerns, some fucking hella illegitimate racist ones too...).

Many layers. It's like a big cake, but don't eat it.

What?

[OffWithTheirHeads]

17. Because we want to impeach them

and hold them accountable for fucking with our constitution and bill of rights.

[MadBadger]

19. Are you responding to the right question?

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MadBadger]

28. Steering the conversation to the right? The question was about why the terrorists hate us

And the answer was about impeachment. The answer just didnt match the question.

[slowry]

21. Hell ya. Was gonna make that point but I'm lazy. n/t

[Maru Kitteh]

22. Our tomatoes lay with our cucumbers.

And you forgot George W. Bush.

[saltpoint]

25. Jim Dobson gets upset when the cucumbers lay with the cucumbers and

the tomatoes lay with the tomatoes.

I don't do a lot of vegetable metaphors, so you'll have to pardon my inexperience with the lexicon.

[Behind the Aegis]

29. I was going to write something real....

...but since you are trying to keep it "light...": the real reason: Coke vs. Pepsi! We all know Bush is a "coke" person! :evilgrin:

[saltpoint]

32. Do you suppose that's why his speeches are always so incoherent?

Or is it just lack of preparation or brain power?

Maybe a sadistic speech writer?

SOMETHING'S up.

I'm having a Diet Pepsi with Lime as we speak!

[Behind the Aegis]

34. I never watch his speeches...

....it is like hearing nails on a chalkboard, so I am going to say the reason his speeches are incoherent are lack of brain power! The speech-writers may be geniuses, but one is only as good as one's dummy, so, I feel bad for them. I am guessing his speeches have all the big words spelled FOH-NETIC'LEE. But that's just me! :)

[saltpoint]

35. Good post, Behind the Aegis. Yes. "FOH-NETIC'LEE. And the speech

writers are likely paid extra if they remember to leave off the 'g's on verbs.

Cuz Dubya don't like them g's on his verbs.

[baldguy]

30. Because we murder their children.

[saltpoint]

33. You and I do not, though. No one else posting in this thread murders

anyone's children.

I think we need to put the blame on the "shock-n-awe" militarism of the Bsh administration. The war was "pre-emptive," which to me is immoral.

Saddam was monstrous, surely, but not specifically a strategic threat to U.S. soil or citizenry. To U.S. interest, yes. There was the oil.

The protestors whose signs ask things like How much blood for how many barrels of oil -- etc. seem to me to have it about right. That seems to be the essence of Bush's foreign policy. Bush et al wants the oil; Bush et al will kill to get it.

[Xithras]

37. Heh, they disagree with you.

The prevailing philosophy throughout the middle east and parroted on Arab media is that the citizenry is as culpable as the government. He who does not act to STOP oppression is actively aiding it. It's that philosophy that morally empowers those who want to kill civilians.

[saltpoint]

40. Well I would expect the PNAC folks to disagree with me, certainly.

I would expect Brit Hume to disagree. And all his little friends at FOX News.

But I am never going to concede representation to Bush et al as my advocates or ambassadors in the Middle East -- or anyplace else.

They don't speak for the people there either. The Saudi Royal family is not Saudi Arabia.

[treestar]

38. Because we are constantly interfering in their countries

Rather than just paying a fair price for their country's oil.

[BlooInBloo]

39. Jackass foreign policy + support of Israel.

[candice]

42. We invaded Iraq, occupied the country, and have caused the death of

around a hundred thousand Iraqis. Then there is the question of Israel, which took over another country, both legally and not, and whose position we always take since we have a symbiotic relationship with the House of Saud dictatorship.

[leftofthedial]

43. because the fascist-capitalists who have seized power in our country

are infinitely hate-able assholes

[saltpoint]

44. Ladies and Gentlemen, regarding this post, this original post.

My intent was to place blame on Bush in a broad sense by narrowing the problem to his use of ridiculous propaganda such as "the terrorists hate us because we love freedom."

He uses the same kind of propaganda when he says if we leave Iraq now, "the terrorists will follow us home."

That was the zone I was aiming for, and I thought my poll would prompt responses targeted that direction.

Plainly I was wrong, and plainly I didn't do a good job at all on this poll.

For those of you who have tried to answer the post, I apologize for doing such a poor job on its theme and strategy. It veered off early on because I didn't make it very clear to begin with.

My apologies.

Over and out.

[camero]

45. Other: Our boots (bases) are on thier land

And they have been for awhile. All to allow ExxonMobilAmeriCorp to exploit thier resources.

Need I say more?