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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 03:08 PM
Original message
FL church defends hate sign against gays. AU says IRS should investigate..
Edited on Fri Mar-26-10 03:15 PM by madfloridian
about whether this church is practicing politics by getting involved in a mayoral race.

There is no excuse for such ugliness. It is tragic that a church would put such a sign in their yard.

Americans United for Separation of Church and State has requested the IRS determine if this crosses the line between church and state.

IRS Should Investigate Florida Church For Opposing Mayoral Candidate, Says Americans United

Americans United for Separation of Church and State today asked the Internal Revenue Service to investigate a church in Gainesville, Fla., that posted a sign opposing a mayoral candidate. Dove World Outreach Center erected a sign on its property reading, “No Homo Mayor.” The reference is to Craig Lowe, a mayoral candidate who is gay. Contacted about the matter by the Gainesville Sun, a top church official admitted that the church had erected the sign.

“We don’t feel as though the city should be represented by a homosexual,” said Terry Jones, senior pastor at Dove World Outreach Center.

The Rev. Barry W. Lynn, Americans United executive director, called the church’s actions a blatant example of illegal politicking by a tax-exempt group.

“This is an open-and-shut case,” Lynn said. “The church freely admits that it intended to intervene in the election in violation of federal tax law. I urge the IRS to act promptly.”


I agree with AU. This is outrageous.

Looks like the county was already called in by an anonymous tip, but the inspector said it was all ok as long as they were just a church.

County investigates Dove World Outreach Center

County officials investigated the Dove World Outreach Center after receiving an anonymous complaint the church was violating tax-exemption laws.

The anonymous tip sent to the Alachua Country Property Appraiser claimed the church wasn’t paying taxes on part of the building leased to TS & Company, a furniture business run by Dove World Outreach Center preachers Terry and Sylvia Jones.

Sheila Crapo, a property appraiser administrative analyst, said she investigated the church on Thursday, and the furniture business was leasing 1,700 square feet of the 9,000-square-foot church.

Crapo said the building could remain tax-exempt as long as its predominate use was for religious purposes.


Maybe Ms Crapo is unaware of the hate signs?

This is the same church that had a sign saying Islam is of the Devil. The Gainesville, Florida community fought back against that sign...it was good to see them do that last year.

Florida church posts sign saying Islam is of the Devil. Refuses to take it down. Community protests

Video at the link from the ABC affiliate.

Residents carried their own signs Wednesday evening calling for "peace not hate" in response to a northwest Gainesville church that recently posted a sign with an anti-Islamic message.

At least 80 people gathered on both sides of Northwest 37th Street in front of the Dove World Outreach Center for a prayer vigil organized after the church recently erected a sign proclaiming "Islam is of the devil."

Participants held up their signs and listened to words from Eve MacMaster, pastor of the Emmanuel Mennonite Church, and Saeed R. Kahn, president of the Muslim Association of North Central Florida. The group maintained its vigil for at least an hour as members at the church gathered for a 7 p.m. service.

After learning about the church's red-lettered sign, MacMaster used e-mail to let others in the community know about the vigil.

"We're here to stand in solidarity with our Muslim neighbors," MacMaster said. The purpose of the vigil, she said, was express the goodwill of most citizens and religious people toward Muslims and to "pray for the cleansing of the community."


Maybe it's time for that community to come together again in defense of another group which is hated by Dove World Outreach

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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 03:10 PM
Response to Original message
1. "No homo mayor!" - what a lovely, Christ-like sentiment
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. "No older homo?"
:shrug:
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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. +1
Seems more like a Moral Orel episode.
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Wizard777 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 05:34 AM
Response to Reply #1
12. That's a holdover from the Torah. Churches also have freedom of expression.
Homosexuality is indeed a violation or their religious tenants. They have a right to speak out against it. But the sign goes too far by one word "Mayor." That's where they enter the political arena. They are free to speak out against homosexuality in general. But they are not free to specifically speak out against a homosexual mayoral candidate. That's political.
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pundaint Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. Churches have a choice between freedom of political expression and freedom
from taxes. I'm all for their free speech, and I'm all for taxing them like any other business.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 04:05 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. It went too far by two words, thank you. "Homo"?? Who the fuck says that anymore
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Toasterlad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #12
22. Did You Intentionally Leave "Imperial" Off the Front Of Your Name?
Just wondering.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 03:16 PM
Response to Original message
4. Lovely sentiments from that church.
Too bad there is no Jesus to judge them in the end. Sometimes I almost wish I could believe there was.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. I was raised Southern Baptist...but sometimes now I also wonder
as you do. I never thought I would say that, but it does seem that way sometimes.
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 03:29 PM
Response to Original message
5. Jesus , protect us from your fanclub
how fucking Christian of them
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MattBaggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. This is why I thank God every day for making me an atheist.
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Initech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
8. Who would Jesus hate?
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 04:41 PM
Response to Original message
9. Such is the world I live in. Nt
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-26-10 06:29 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. And it should not be that way.
Jesus surely would have wept about that sign.
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polmaven Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 07:55 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. Yes, Jesus would have wept..
Jesus probably would have outright wailed at that sign....Thank you for posting this. I hope Rev. Lynn is successful.
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saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 02:47 AM
Response to Original message
11. Homophobia is alive and well and totally more acceptable than racism or religious prejudice!
Edited on Sat Mar-27-10 02:47 AM by saracat
:sarcasm:Had the "church" had signs up reflecting any other bigoted sentiment, they would be called out for it. Homophobic statements? Not so much:mad:
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Urban Prairie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 08:07 AM
Response to Original message
14. "Dove World Outreach"?
More like Preach Religious & Homophobic Bigotry.
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moonbatmax Donating Member (290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. I was just thinking when I read that name...
Every single word of it is a lie.

Every. Single. Word.

Dove? Symbol of peace? At least I thought...

World? Well... I dunno about this one.

Outreach? Like what, reach out and SMACK someone?

PFEH!!
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Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 08:16 AM
Response to Original message
15. Slam Dunk
If it had just been an anti-gay sign, they could get away with it (i.e., Fred Phelps) but as soon as they referenced the mayor and the mayoral election, they crossed the line. Churches may advocate for causes, but not for candiates or campaigns.
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 04:10 PM
Response to Original message
19. Can't you just feel the Christian love...nt
Sid
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Commie Pinko Dirtbag Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 04:14 PM
Response to Original message
20. I wonder, what is there to "investigate"?
The possibility that aliens from planet Zurg put up the sign and brainwashed the otherwise tolerant church officials with their Mind Rays?
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Divine Discontent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 04:18 PM
Response to Original message
21. they're sick and twisting Torah (Jewish church custom) bible verses for their hate
they are the affront to GOD - how about NO MEDDLING "CHURCHES"!?? I like that slogan better.
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951-Riverside Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
23. The IRS should not be used as a tool to control what is said in Churches
It goes against our basic principals. With that said, no church should have tax exempt status.
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skepticscott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-28-10 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #23
26. The IRS is not used as a tool to suppress free speech
Churches are under no obligation to accept tax-exempt status, but if they do, they accept certain conditions, among them that they will not engage in partisan politicking. Those conditions are NOT imposed on them without their consent, and they have no constitutional right to tax-exempt status. It is a privilege. Any church is perfect free to forego the tax exemption and get involved in politics all they want, but they seem to want it both ways.
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951-Riverside Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-28-10 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #26
29. Churches should not have the option of tax-exempt status AT ALL.
Both church and government abuse this "status" way too often. If anything businesses or individuals dedicated to research, science and education should have the status without strings attached at least they help people.
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skepticscott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-28-10 03:46 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. well, I don't disagree with you
I don't like that churches are exempt from not only income tax, but also on property tax on what are often huge parcels of land. To the extent that they do charitable work, I can see it, but much of what they do is no such thing, and much of the money people give to them (and get to deduct on THEIR taxes) also goes to non-charitable causes. But I don't see the government abusing that status at all. It isn't like the IRS comes in and shuts things down at the first report of an incident like this. They always issue a warning and a notification of why the reported activity is a violation and what will happen if it continues. It is only the most egregious repeat violators, who basically thumb their noses at the rules regarding politicking, that have their tax-exempt status yanked. And no one ever has their free speech rights yanked because of this sort of thing.
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cstanleytech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-28-10 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #23
32. Actually its a pretty good tool to use to keep
the separation between church and state intact and frankly I dont know about you but I rather not have any church running the government.
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Toasterlad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
24. How Amusing That Two Posters On This Thread Felt Compelled To Put the Blame On the Torah
As if the old testament isn't part of the christian bible.

Funny how the christians are so quick to denounce those of their religion who stand up for the tenets of their faith. Say what you want about the radical crazy fundamentalists; at least they're not hypocrites (well, not about denouncing gays, anyway).
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Rage Inc. Donating Member (429 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-27-10 11:55 PM
Response to Original message
25. Ah, the First Amendment!
Even though scoundrels misuse it, I never want it to leave us!
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saltpoint Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-28-10 09:38 AM
Response to Original message
27. It might be instructive to ask the good pastor why Jesus was
unmarried at age 32.

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Brickbat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-28-10 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
28. I love AU -- they're a great organization. Props to them on this.
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Nikki Stone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-28-10 03:50 PM
Response to Original message
31. In her defense, if your name is "Crapo" you've probably heard a lot of hate speech
Edited on Sun Mar-28-10 03:50 PM by Nikki Stone1
and learned to ignore it or crumble.
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