I'm sorry but on its face, taking a republican position and passing it over thier no votes

[hootinholler]

Seems like it's a little suboptimal in the strategy department.

Essentially that is what the Dems have been doing. If we have to pass stuff over no votes anyway, can we please apply core democratic values in what we pass?

-Hoot

[Lost4words]

1. There is no political party that represents me, none not even close anymore.

[Echo In Light]

42. Green

http://www.gp.org/index.php

[QC]

2. Well, according to one especially active poster this morning, your puzzlement

results from your not having attended Harvard and thus being unable to comprehend complex reasoning.

As I am likewise not a Harvard graduate, the decision seems pretty fucked up to me, too.

[hootinholler]

4. Well please fill me in

I could use some entertainment this morning.

Similarly, I've been grooving on the up and down rec count, lol.

-Hoot

[spoony]

8. Apparently some colleges have great Pragmatism programs

I hear the final required class, How to Sleep at Night After Selling Out Everything You Once Believed In, really separates the posers from the hardcore.

[QC]

10. I hear that the best such program is at Cooper Union,

where they have many books that are over a 100 years old.

Is that true?

[Moochy]

26. Thats the genius of Neo-* political philosophies

Once enough people have died, you can bring back the regressive policies of the last century and call them post-partisan, new, pragmatic and centrist.

I hear Cooper Union has an online degree in GroupThink control.

[joeybee12]

12. Yeah, and apparently every one else who graduated from Harvard and has a different

view must have been in the wrong classes there. Pope=Infallible=Obama.

[bvar22]

23. That was an exemplary display of "Class Elitism".

I went to that school's site and searched for "tuition".
The response was, "If you have to ask...."

I now understand the devotee-like support for a Democratic Party Leadership that has assured the RICH Ownership Class that they will never know a day of discomfort, while telling the Working Class that we WILL be forced to compete with 3rd World Slave Labor for our jobs.

I worked my way through a Working Class State University in the late 60's, and considered myself fortunate to have been able to do so.

Unable to understand complex issues?
LOL.
There is NOTHING complex about "triangulation" and taking $MONEY$ for legislation beneficial to the donors.

[QC]

25. I'm just shocked to learn that such an elite school doesn't teach English.

I thought that was a pretty basic subject.

[safeinOhio]

3. The President is a genius.

He is so far smarter than me. I questioned lots of stuff, but in the end he has made his doubters look foolish.
First President to get a major national health care bill passed. About to sign a historic arms agreement. Pulling troops out of Iraq. Has the opposing party in shambles. Saved the country from a depression. Regained the respect of the world for America.
We only look one or two moves ahead. The President is 10 or 20 moves ahead of us.
As for passing republican positions over their no votes, genius. Tell me how the Republicans are going to run against this man, let alone win?

[hootinholler]

5. Bullshit.

It leaves too much on the table. What was the CBO score of HR676? I remember a few times that was supposed to happen.

Truman summed it up best, I'll paraphrase, given the choice between a real republican and a pretend republican, the voter always picks the real one. Now is a time to negotiate through strength and do what is best for the nation rather than whats best for wall street.

-Hoot

[uponit7771]

15. letting the perfect or good be the enemy of adequate is ..............leaving a lot on the table

[hootinholler]

22. All I'm saying is that we need to start with all our options on the table.

Make the opposition figure out how to remove any given piece of it.

Are you seriously claiming this is the best we could have done?

-Hoot

[zipplewrath]

6. Name 2

He is so far smarter than me. I questioned lots of stuff, but in the end he has made his doubters look foolish.

Name 2, from the left that is.

First President to get a major national health care bill passed.

A major REPUBLICAN health INSURANCE bill passed (which was sorta the point of the OP). Single payer/public option/universal health CARE is still waiting. Did get the mandates in there and blocked negotiation on drug prices however, ya know the things he ran AGAINST.

About to sign a historic arms agreement.

Which is huge, don't get me wrong. It's kinda sad it got lost in the GOP health insurance reform. However, that's a relatively nonpartisan kinda accomplishment.

Pulling troops out of Iraq.

On the time table established by the SOFA written by Bush.

Has the opposing party in shambles.

Scott Brown on line 2.

Saved the country from a depression.

Through TARP funds (passed under Bush), and a bank bailout that he described as a "root canal". There were no "20 moves ahead" here. Heck the banks were 10 moves ahead of him, which is why he couldn't stop their big bonus plans.

Regained the respect of the world for America.

Yup. Well, apparently except for Israel.

We only look one or two moves ahead.

Got a mouse in your pocket? Speak for yourself.

The President is 10 or 20 moves ahead of us.

Ibid.

As for passing republican positions over their no votes, genius. Tell me how the Republicans are going to run against this man, let alone win?

Scott Brown is still waiting on line 2 for ya.

[safeinOhio]

13. Line 2

MA democratic party ran Browns opponent, and they did get a pro-choice Republican that voted for the jobs bill. Also note another recent poll that shows his and Democratic candidates are pulling ahead in Ohio.
The big picture is that Obama has lots of accomplishments for only one year in office. Which Republican do you see beating him?

[zipplewrath]

19. Him?

No one. The left won't get a credible challenger and the GOP doesn't have much to challenge him with. To the original posters point, that isn't exactly an overwhelming testament to the strategy of passing GOP bills. It's a great way for the incumbent to "play defense", but it isn't much of a testament to achieving traditional democratic goals.

[dflprincess]

40. They don't have to beat him

he's joined them - if not in name, by actions.

[spoony]

9. "Tell me how the Republicans are going to run against this man, let alone win?"

It's true, how can any Republican argue for their party agenda, when Obama so consistently cuts them off to claim it as his own. Of course, maybe the GOP can play that game too and tell Dem voters they'll embrace the old, discarded liberal agenda. They'll be lying, but at least we'll know it ahead of time.

[joeybee12]

14. amazing...you win the blind obedience award for this month!

Congratulations!!! :toast:

[safeinOhio]

17. damn, I was going for the

non-ideologue award.

[tavalon]

16. So that's what this is about?

Winning?

[QC]

21. Yes. n/t

[tavalon]

30. That's just wrong

But I know I'm speaking to the choir here.

[bvar22]

24. If you don't care about policy, direction, ...

or the Real World effects of passing Republican legislation, then your post makes perfect sense.

OTOH, if you vote "Democratic" because you believe in "Democratic" values, then passing Republican Legislation is a deep betrayal.


"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans."---Paul Wellstone

[leftstreet]

29. Oh brother

[awoke_in_2003]

36. There are 2 reasons...

why she is my favorite Food Network host :) Too bad my wife always runs me out of the room when Giada is on

[TheKentuckian]

32. Tell me how the people win if he continuously adopts horrid Republiscum policy?

It doesn't matter if he wins if the price is working folks lose.

[EFerrari]

35. How can you have a "union yes" avatar and tell me that this president

who went on national television and said a schoolful of teachers should be fired for not turning a school around -- when the state said the opposite -- is simply beyond me.

The Republicans will have no problem at all if this president doesn't remember who sent him to Washington in the first place. You don't have to be a genius to see that he's dinged just about every single membership of his coalition. A genius would ask his chief of staff to stop insulting his base.

I've love to see genius from this president. Now.

[freddie mertz]

41. Is this intended as a joke? nt.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

7. how about taking a republican position then

twisting some of the interior work, adding regulations, rules and requirements that limits damage and such that also makes it more in tune with democratic values?

That seems like a sensible approach to me if one is almost required to take such a position to gain a few vital votes.

[havocmom]

18. Why bother? If you won't get any bipartisan support for ANYTHING?

Why dilute progress and change for people who have no intention to even consider any legislation?

[safeinOhio]

31. It is not the bipartisan support that is stopping

the liberal agenda. It is the blue dogs.
Now if by appearing moderate and flexible the President gets a real majority in congress and wins a second term, all would be possible. To have lost because of 10 or 20 blue dogs would burn the bridge behind him. Being unable to pass anything would not help Dems in any election. Now he has them right where he wants them.

[havocmom]

37. LOL

When the Prez pushes legislation the GOP used to run on, the problem is at a higher pay grade than blue dogs on the Hill

[frylock]

27. which vital votes?

teabaggers? congressional repubs didn't cast a vote for this crap bill.

[havocmom]

11. Best post of the year!

[Moochy]

20. Its GENIUS if you are a follower of @LeoStrauss

Yes We Can Stay The Course!

[HughMoran]

28. That's one small-minded perspective

...that can only be supported with a pre-conditioned mind. I leave mine open for input...

[tkmorris]

33. And yet you offer no rebuttal

Beneath you I suppose.

[hootinholler]

38. It's taken me a year to arrive at this position

The old fashioned way, empirically.

So exactly how am I small minded and pre-conditioned?

-Hoot

[HughMoran]

39. It's taken me 30 years to refine my position on politics

I don't find myself easily swayed by a single position or vote.

[Edweird]

34. K&R