Obama is exceeding my expectations & keeping a majority of his campaign promises (ObamaPromiseMeter)

[uponit7771]

...while throwing a relatively few away or under the bus.

OBAMA PROMISE METER (aka facts)

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/



I'll fight more to push him and our congress more to the left (or towards common sense)

There's....................hope for him

[stray cat]

1. Not me - but I am sure happier with him in office than the current alternatives!

[havocmom]

2. relatively few under the bus?

Only the backbone of the base and a whole lotta people who are the ones to hit the pavement and work campaigns.

Not a great chess move IMO

[uponit7771]

4. It's good your thinking is in the minority, democrats like Obama

[no limit]

7. Yay! Team! Can I get a (D)?!

[uponit7771]

10. No, but you can get some facts- (link)

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/

[havocmom]

45. Only time will tell, I reckon. But with a chief of staff calling liberals names

and policies GOP has already campaigned on, we are a tad nervous about change that isn't. It will be a difficult thing to defend in 2012 if we don't start seeing substantial diverging from conservative positions on things like

Patriot Act

DADT

Wiretaps without warrants

Sane oil policy that does not put fragile ecosystems in peril along a coast that gets hit often by hurricanes.

REAL support of public education and the professionals who work with low pay and impossible cultural expectations to meet in the effort to undo the damage the whole society does to education and children.

REAL support of working class efforts to join in union efforts to stop the downward spiral of the middle class which IS the backbone of the economy

A Sec of Treasury who is not so obviously a puppet of the corporations who got fat while destroying so much of the economy.

GITMO still in operation as a prison beyond the reach of US Judicial oversight.

Would go on with the list, but I have to go to my barely over minimum wage part time job. Perhaps one of the many unemployed DUers here today could add to the list....

We worked for real change. Not change as a PR construct and catch phrase. We expect something besides agenda the GOP has already run on.

[tyne]

3. Me too

[Cant trust em]

5. I think he's done a good job while in office.

While his time hasn't been perfect, I think it's important to put things into perspective.

[no limit]

6. Your definition of relatively few is very odd

Threw away the public option after campaigning for it.

Added mandates after campaigning against them

Said he would close Gitmo in the first year, now it looks like it wont be closed in the first term

Said he would repeal DADT, doesn't seem willing to use his power as president to do this, instead he'll leave it to congress to hopefully pass a law

I could go on but don't feel like typing, I think you get the point. Maybe you can list what campaign promises he has kept when it comes to major issues?

[uponit7771]

8. ObamaPromiseMeter, I have facts you have what you think (link)

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/

[no limit]

12. I have what I think? are you saying I lied? If you are gonna call someone a liar point out specifics

I told you, major issues. What major battles have we had in the last year? Healthcare was one. And he totally broke his promises in the key areas. Including on the public option and on mandates.

[uponit7771]

15. No, I believe you're being honest...I do think you're wrong relative to the facts

[no limit]

17. So Obama didn't campaign on the public option? He wasn't opposed to a mandate?

[uponit7771]

20. You implied that Obama was NOT keeping a majority of his campaign promises, ObamaPromise meter shows

...empirically that your position is false.

[no limit]

26. I did say on major issues. I'm sorry you ignored that part.

One the promises kept very few are major issues. On the promises broken many are major issues. So no, my position is not false. Not only that many of the issues on the promises kept page can be debated. And you link seems to ignore atleast one major promise broken about mandates, so I'm sorry if I have a hard time believing that link is totally accurate when it doesn't include such a major flip.

[uponit7771]

29. Obama has kept his promises on the "Major Issues" I cared about, you're not going to define them for

...me and again....the facts speak louder than both of us

[no limit]

37. The facts are wrong. I proved one thing the site is lying on, why should I believe everything else?

[uponit7771]

46. Quote of the day, "....the facts are wrong..."....come on dude....lets me rational. Isn't it a RW...

...talking point to pic out a singular or few inaccuracies and then minimize or discount all the other facts?

You know, like they're trying to do with Global Warming?

[no limit]

48. I just gave you a clear example of them excluding a major promise broken

you do not dispute this. So why should I believe that they didn't exclude other vital things or pad the promises kept list?

[uponit7771]

53. ..and I admitted that the are a relative few inaccuracies and I don't expect perfection. Overall ...

...that does not negate the overwhelming empirical evidence that Obama has kept a majority of his promises.

[no limit]

58. yes it does. Even if I accept at face value that he kept 105 promises

and I accept at face value that he stalled on another 85 I can not accept that he broke only 17. That number is probably much bigger. So no, it's not a majority, atleast you don't have reliable proof that it is the majority.

And we are not talking about small issues such as increasing funding national parks. We are talking about major issues that will have an affect on the majority of americans. Many lower wage middle class single adults will not be able to afford these mandates.

Another issue not listed as a broken promise is the closing of Gitmo within 1st year. So that's 2 I found just in a brief time. The list is not credible.

[Cant trust em]

9. Be prepared to fight a lot of unwinnable fights on this thread. nt

[uponit7771]

11. Obama promise meter = big ammo, lot of facts behind it

[Cant trust em]

27. It doesn't seem to be convincing a lot of people. nt

[uponit7771]

36. They're trying to argue against the facts by minimizing the promises kept, that's their only

...retort otherwise there are very few people, IMHO, that are looking at what Obama has done and saying they can't support him any further.

[Cant trust em]

39. Like I said...

expect to fight a lot of unwinnable fights.

Good on you though for even bothering to engage. I've left those people behind a long time ago.

[uponit7771]

50. Quote of the day, "....the facts are wrong..."....I see what you mean, I think there are a few that

...can be turned.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

13. One of the promises he made (and kept) was deal breaker for me.

The escalation of the lost war in Afghanistan seriously impaired my hold nosing abilities to the point that I couldn't vote for him.

[uponit7771]

16. Why did you vote for him in the first place? Did you think he would lie about that promise? TIA

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

60. I didn't vote for him because I thought he would keep that promise.

I won't vote for him because he kept that promise.

[jtuck004]

14. "Jackson himself enjoyed widespread support that ranged across all

classes and sections of the country...without Jackson being clearly pro- or antilabor, pro- or antibusiness, pro- or antilower, middle, or upper class...it has been demonstrated that he was a strikebreaker"

"It was the new politics of ambiguity - speaking for the lower and middle classes to get their support...To give people a choice between two different parties and allow them, in a period of rebellion, to choose the slightly more democratic one was ingenious mode of control...The Jacksonian idea was to achieve stability and control by winning "the middling interest, and especially...the substantial yeomanry of the country" by "prudent, judicious, well-considered reform." That is, reform that would not yield too much."


From "A People's History of the United States"

Thank you Mr. Zinn

[SargeUNN]

18. I am ok with Obama but I KNEW he wasn't a Liberal all along

Yeah like many of us, I am disappointed in several decisions he has made, but I knew he was going to do some things I wasn't in favor of. The MSM and right wing tried to sell him as a big time liberal but just looking at his record and listening to his words, it was obviously he was a centralist. Why are we surprised he isn't acting like a liberal when he isn't and never was. He has moved some things to the left a little and he has disappointed us in others, but just imagine if we had some right wing moron in his place.

[uponit7771]

22. I think he used a lot of common sense and there ARE some things from the right (some) that makes...

...sense.

I paid attention too, Obama isn't LBJ but he's got a lot done and I'd proudly fight for him

[zipplewrath]

19. All promises are created equal?

A sight like this makes little distinction between the importance. And to some degree ignores HOW the promise was "kept". Covering all children by making their parents buy a policy that violates a promise he made to fight mandates is a convoluted "promise kept". I understand there's a certain amount of goal post moving on both sides, but the site makes little, if any effort, to sort this kind of thing out.

[uponit7771]

21. Matters who the promises are important to, the health care and energy one was important to me

[tonysam]

23. He's an absolute disaster on education, and THAT will be far more important

to the future of this country than some tweaking of the health care system or energy.

[uponit7771]

24. He's done more good than bad on education and on a majority of his issues IMHO. ObamaPromiseMeter

...empirically shows that he's kept the vast majority of his campaign promises

[enlightenment]

38. Keeping many little promises while breaking

big promises.

Yes, that would keep his standing in the green if you're only looking at the average, which is what you're doing.

Others are looking at specifics and don't see the same level of promise keeping.

It's all in how you parse it.

I could look at the average of US wages over the past 20 years and say "wow! People are getting richer every year!"

Would I be right? Yes, if you only look at the average. If you look at the details, the picture is radically different.

Whatever floats your boat, I guess.

[uponit7771]

44. They're little to YOU not me, you can TRY to minimize the facts but the facts speak for themselves

[Romulox]

25. Why is there a story about the NAFTA lie on that site, but NAFTA isn't listed in "broken promises"?

Site needs an internal fact checker. :hi:

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2008/mar/04/barack-obama/obama-misled-about-nafta-discussions/

[no limit]

28. The individual mandate also isn't listed under broken promises.

[Romulox]

32. The site seems to weasel out of it by calling it a "flip flop" rather than a lie...

:shrug:

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/jul/20/barack-obama/obama-flip-flops-requiring-people-buy-health-care/

[uponit7771]

31. Still doesn't change the "majority" label I stated in title

[Romulox]

34. On the contrary--it calls the entire tally into question. nt

[uponit7771]

40. Right, just like global warming gets called into question for a few analysis mistakes. Again, facts

...tilt toward supporting Obama vs nit picking on the factual data which has been factored into the analysis...I'll take facts

[no limit]

35. So if Fox is proven to have lied to you do you believe everything else they say?

It's a credibility problem. And I'm not gonna go through all issues to try and prove them wrong, I have better things to do. I did prove one major thing they decided not to include.

[uponit7771]

42. No, I look at a wholistic picture when it comes to organziations and people and act accordingly...

...I'm not going to call my son a bad person because he tried to hide the dog trainer from me.

[no limit]

Again, it's a credibility issues. I'm sorry you don't understand that

they lied on that list or they are arrogant to the facts. Either way that makes it unreliable as a source. If I was able to point out one falsehood after just a minute on their site I can point out many more if I spent more time on it, unforutantely I have a job and other responsibilities that prevent me from wasting my time.

[uponit7771]

54. You've been wrong a couple of times in your life, that doesn't make you a non credible source...

...and people can be balance critically without lauding vices or attributes

[MadHound]

30. That's nice, but the fact of the matter is that just because he kept these promises

Doesn't mean that they are good policy. What, you support the ongoing war in Afghanistan just because he promised to expand it?

[uponit7771]

33. I don't support the ongoing war, I do support normalizing the area the best we can and getting out a

....and that is being done in the midst of this "war".

Obama is doing what he said he'd do for the most part, I can support that

[MadHound]

41. Really,

How can you call the ongoing slaughter of innocents "normalizing?" The fact of the matter is that, as imperial occupiers, we cannot normalize the situation there because we are the agents of chaos, the ones who are preventing it from becoming normal, much the same situation we were in with Vietnam, Iraq and our other wars of empire.

So, on the domestic front, do you support Obama's ongoing onslaught of public education, all because he's keeping his promise?

And what about the promises he's broken, like, oh, say, the public option.

[LeftyMom]

43. April Fools threads go in the Lounge.

[havocmom]

47. Oh snap! The rest of us totally missed that possibility

:applause:

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

49. hahahahahahahahaha!

:thumbsup:

[uponit7771]

51. So do people who ignore the facts

[LeftyMom]

56. Oh dear, you're serious?

Really?

C'mon.

[ShortnFiery]

52. ...

Nicely played. :evilgrin:

[Individualist]

57. +1

:thumbsup:

[pnorman]

55. Thanks! I was looking for that site!

n/t

[andym]

59. Good link. Informative. nt.

[uponit7771]

61. Some here are nit picking at a couple of inaccuracies but for the most part their arguments sound

...far reaching