Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

This is why we need to find a better method for funding schools

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 11:51 AM
Original message
This is why we need to find a better method for funding schools
"School officials across New Jersey said on Wednesday that they would most likely have to lay off hundreds of teachers, increase class sizes, eliminate sports teams and Advanced Placement classes, cut kindergarten hours and take other radical steps to reduce spending after 58 percent of districts’ budgets were rejected by voters on Tuesday, the most in at least 35 years."

<http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/22/education/22schools.html?ref=nyregion>

Voters, whipped into a rabid froth by their conservative governor, rejected increased funding for schools all across the state of New Jersey. This is a scenario that is being played out all across the country. Without the continuance of stimulus funds from the Obama administration, schools are being forced to take school financing to the voters. These aren't, for the most part, finance issues that are aimed at increasing teacher pay, or building new football stadiums. These are finance issues that address issues of simply maintaining the status quo, keeping class size small, repairing buildings, retaining art, music, language and other necessary programs.

Yet the voters take a look at their own individual financial problems and, with the help of misleading officials and pundits, decide to vote these financial issues down. Some are simply knee jerk anti-tax people, some have bought into the myth of the "greedy unions", others simply don't like, or see the need for education. But for whatever reason, the vote down these necessary funds.

While teachers and other school staff will suffer, the worst crime about these rejections are that it is our children who are going to pay the heaviest penalty. They won't be exposed to as much art or music, they won't be able to learn a different language, they will be stuffed into overcrowded classrooms where their chance for reaching their full learning potential drops dramatically, they will be denied the benefits of physical education and team sports. We are already saddling our children with a tremendous financial debt, but now we're going to do so without giving them the benefit of a full education.

This is happening across the country, and has been for decades. Most school districts require that any school finance issue has to be passed by a super majority of voters. Thus, while the local school board can whip up enough support to form a majority, it is all too easy for their opponents to find enough votes to reach the magical 41% level. Thus, schools are constantly running short of funds, having to enlarge classrooms, having to cut programs and staff. This has been the sad reality since I started school in the sixties, and it has only gotten worse as time has gone on.

This method of funding our schools has simply got to change. I realize that we pride ourselves on being a democracy, but on the issue of school funding we have taken democracy too far. Is there any other profession, any other area of country that relies directly on the whim of the voter to obtain funding? No, there isn't, so why do we continue this practice when it comes to what we refer to as one of our most important jobs, education?

If we truly want our children to have a great education, if we truly want to invest in the future of this country, then we have got to stop this practice of leaving education funding up to the whim of voter. A good first step would be dropping the requirement for a supermajority in voting for education funding. Better yet, set strict funding formulas according to an education spending policy that actually provides enough funds for the present and future growth.

If we don't, we are consigning our children to a future that is much less than promising.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Robb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 11:53 AM
Response to Original message
1. I agree.
Education should receive the same funding leeway as defense: "It costs what it costs, because it's vital."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
2. Wait for the sticker shock when the first SAT scores come in a few years
hereafter. Teachers make a difference. Students don't learn by themselves.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kerrytravelers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. They'll just blame the teachers.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:01 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. It's already happening
I went back to college to pick up a teaching degree, and the lack of basic knowledge among my fellow, younger students is appalling. It's only going to get worse as the effects of this magnify in the upcoming years.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. It's worse than you state.
20 years ago, I was a law student after getting a Masters in Elementary Education.

The professor tried to cite "The best laid plans of mice and men . . . " to Hemingway.
The chorus of male law students behind me bellowed a correction of Steinbeck.
I felt compelled to set the record straight by calling out "It was Robert Burns, you Yahoos!"

This was just one example out of many that demonstrated that the law students would only memorize the decision of each case but had no practical experience in liberal arts. It was obvious that they didn't do much reading. The majority could repeat, but could not think.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Fumesucker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
3. The part that will upset the most Americans?
Cutting team sports..

That will become a major issue, the rest of it not so much.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
elfin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Sports donors will pop up like weeds
to keep those programs going.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jennicut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. Yes. People won't pay attention to the rest. No middle school and freshman sports teams
Edited on Thu Apr-22-10 11:59 AM by Jennicut
are possible per one of the superintendents there. That would be the only thing to make parents really upset.

NJ, like CT, has some of the highest property taxes in the country. But cutting education won't solve that. It will make it worse in the long run.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. Ours were cut a few years ago
We still have a few JV and Varsity at the high school, but everything at the middle school and freshman level is all volunteer and fully parent-funded. A good school board will cut those programs and keep the teachers. The only reason the other sports programs were kept is because ticket prices and athletic fees do generate enough to fund them.

What kills me is that I don't think we have a librarian, at all. We might have saved ONE in the last budget, but I'm not sure. And I actually talked to well-respected community members, mothers, who said we don't need a librarian.

And Oregon has an equalized funding system too.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jennicut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. We might loose 2000 teachers this year in CT. We are not the hardest hit state
but we still face cuts. Luckily, a new high school was just built a few years ago in the town I live in, Terryville. It was built before the economy collapsed. It was really needed, as the elementary school my daughters would be going to a school built in 1900 if it was not built and all the schools were moved up. The school was in rough shape, it needed to close down.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OHdem10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:00 PM
Response to Original message
7. I have lived in several states over a lifetime. In each state education
funding was and is done through property taxes. I have
reached a conclusion that this process sets the stage
for failure. The more prosperous a community, town or
neighborhood the better the schools. Am I correct or
am I overlooking something and not seeing the picture
correctly.

Could they lower all property taxes and set up and "education
tax" in to which everyone paid.?? Just a thought??
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. You're not missing something....
Edited on Thu Apr-22-10 12:06 PM by Jeff In Milwaukee
And Ohio is one of the worst offenders. One can find neighborhoods immediately adjacent to each other where one district is awash in cash and the other is nearly bankrupt.

And since property tasxes are the one tax that gets an up-or-down vote, pissed off taxpayers will more often than not vote down a property tax increase just because their pissed off. And then the district has to cut services and come back in the next election cycle. And then lay off some teachers and come back in the next election cycle. Just the cost of two or three attempts at getting a levy passed is grossly wasteful and inefficient.

Operating Expenses should be paid by the state. Capital Expenses should be paid through property taxes.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. Nope, you're spot on,
But even in the most prosperous of school districts, funding for education rarely keeps up with the needs.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Many states have equalized funding
They take in the property tax to the state and then the state pays it out on a per student formmula, with some extra for rural schools I think. People have been sueing states for twenty years over this, I don't understand how any state continues to have locally funded education only. It's been declared unConstitutional, over and over again.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
stray cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
8. are we all willing to pay for it?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. I am, I know many other people who are, the question is are you willing to pay for it?
Education is not cheap, yet this country has been trying to do education on the cheap for over forty years. If we are serious about having a well educated public in order to have a brighter future for our country, then we need to invest in education. Putting more money into education, which means raising teachers salaries to attract the best and the brightest to the profession, which means funding for adequate, modern, spacious facilities for all, which means offering a wide range of programs for all, all of this will singlehandedly do more to insure student success than any of the plans we're using or considering now, including NCLB, RTTT, privatization, etc.

So the question we've each got to ask ourselves is are we willing to pay for it? I am, how about you?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
16. Then they use the inevitable failures as proof of government anything as bad.
How can schools do their job without the necessary funding. We pay school taxes and think of it as an investment in our kids future. I'd rather pay for education than some of the stuff we pay for (wars).
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
keith the dem Donating Member (587 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 01:03 PM
Response to Original message
18. Christie's plan is to destroy public schools!
Yesterday you saw a revolt against school boards...people are too goddamn stupid to know that the reason school boards had to raise taxes was because that fat lard ass gave those boards a major screwing with only weeks to totally revamp their budgets.

I amazed how easy it was, with the full compliance of the whore media, to shift the blame to teachers and school boards. Now the burden is on local governments who also will get blamed.

At the same time, Christie has given major raises to his staff.

Make no mistake, this is about privatizing schools. Fatso's rich buddies, who are keeping a nice tax cut, can't make profits off those public "socialist" schools.

The asinine popular myth is that these rich bastards will create jobs with their tax cuts....Nobody is gonna create jobs when people can't afford to buy anything. Working teachers buy stuff, laid off teachers don't.

also going down in those votes was almost all school construction projects. All those construction workers, architects and engineers also buy stuff...if they have work.

Almost on a daily basis, we hear about Christie's cut to education, no more library funding...no more public TV funding.

A main reasons that taxes are high in NJ is because of the structural problem of having too many districts and municipalities. His Lardness does nothing to correct that he just shifts the problem down the line. (undoubtedly so he doesn't miss lunch)

The other reason is that we only get half of what we send to the fed's. The Porkster is making this even worse by cutting funding for things like transportation that causes the loss of federal matching funding.

Christie is without a doubt the most despicable person I have ever seen hold public office.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. And this pattern is being repeated across the country,
While this administration continues to not just cheer it on, but actually aid and abet the crime. Public schools are one of the last great public pots of money that can be raided, and we're now seeing them get destroyed so the corporately connected can make millions while consigning our children to a bleak future. But hey, it is being done under the auspices of a Dem, so all's well:eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Turbineguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 04:51 PM
Response to Original message
20. Schools should be financed the same way
prisons are. Because if we chose not to build the first, we are forced to build the second.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-10 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. Nice line there, I'll have to use it sometime,
Thanks!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Apr 19th 2024, 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC