Berlusconi gave Niger Forgeries DIRECTLY to Bush

[kpete]

Berlusconi gave Niger Forgeries DIRECTLY to Bush
by deepsouthdoug
Sat May 05, 2007

That was strongly implied in an interview of Italian journalist/author Carlo Bonini author of Collusion: International Espionage and the War on Terror done by Bill Moyers last night.

Because of the power of ‘the Internets’ I’ve read just about everything I could on the Niger forgery caper, but I can’t recall reading that Berlusconi directly gave the information to Bush. I’m attaching key points of the transcript for those interested.

CARLO BONINI: Prime Minister at the time. Berlusconi had won the general election five months before. He was eager, and he was pushing for strict, direct relationships with President Bush. The intelligence about Niger was a wonderful opportunity in terms of - I mean, politically speaking, it was a wonderful opportunity for SISME to please the government, the Italian government. It was a wonderful opportunity for the Italian government to please the White House. And probably what happened was that no one at SISME would ever thought that the story could go so far.

BILL MOYERS: So your speculation is that this guy (Rocco Martino) was trying to make some money. Some Italian agency, SISME agents, realized that they could make Burlesconi happy if they could give him information that he could bring to Washington and convince President Bush that he was on the President's side.

CARLO BONINI: Absolutely correct. That's basically - I mean, that's not what I believe. That's what facts that we've been reporting.

BILL MOYERS: When Prime Minister Berlusconi came to the White House with the story, do you think he knew the documents had been forged? Do you have any evidence that he knew?

CARLO BONINI: I don't have any evidence. But what I know, what I do know is that, as soon as the story took off, there is no chance, no chance that the government didn't ask the Secret Service for a full account of what was going on.

BILL MOYERS: I remember those pictures of Berlusconi coming to the White House, the coverage of it. He seemed a very happy man, when he was leaving.

CARLO BONINI: Absolutely. I would have died to be up there in a corner listening at that meeting.

BILL MOYERS: He gave the President something the President needed to make a case?

CARLO BONINI: Absolutely. And it was more than a smoking gun. It was a mushroom cloud. I mean, back in October, 2001, and early winter, 2002 - the White House had what he had been looking for for months. The final evidence that Saddam was restarting the nuclear program.

BILL MOYERS: By looking for this yellow cake?

CARLO BONINI: Absolutely.
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/05042007/transcript1.html

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/5/4/83716/24183

[Selatius]

1. I developed a hunch early on that Berlusconi's guys were behind the Niger documents

People argued over whether they were fake, and they were, but very few people asked who forged them and why. The only question is why Berlusconi would do this. What was he getting out of it? Was he hoping the US would throw billions in reconstruction contracts to Berlusconi's friends in the business world? Surely, it's a lot more than simply wanting to please Bush. He was looking for something concrete in exchange for giving Bush those forged documents.

[Canuckistanian]

6. All you wanted to know about Niger and Italian Intelligience....

http://nuralcubicle.blogspot.com/2005/10/berlusconi-behind-fake-yellowcake.html

http://nuralcubicle.blogspot.com/2005/10/yellowcake-dossier-not-work-of-cia.html

http://nuralcubicle.blogspot.com/2005/10/nigergate-great-nuclear-centrifuge.html

[IChing]

8. Berlusconi formed a neofascist coalition of partners for his government

so it was not unexpected, but to personal hand over the documents surprised me.

He has so many trials and charges against him now that are similar to this regime
maybe we can hope to see the same kind of justice here on day.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trials_involving_Silvio_Berlusconi

[formercia]

13. It's the Crusader connection

Birds of a feather.

[phoebe]

17. Presidents new fleet of helicopters - contract rushed through in one day, for a start

http://www.alternet.org/story/36183/?page=2

The choice of AgustaWestland for Marine One surprised most industry observers because U.S.-based Sikorsky Aircraft Corp. was the heavy favorite. Sikorsky patented the first helicopter design in 1939 and built virtually every president's helicopter since 1957. President Eisenhower regularly flew in a Sikorsky to his Gettysburg farm, and the Sikorsky that Nixon boarded when he resigned from the White House is now being restored for permanent display at the Nixon Library.

Not only did Sikorsky lose, but it lost to a foreign firm that has no problems selling its helicopters to the United States' adversaries. (See side bar, "Choppers for Sale, to Everyone")

As with the yellowcake dossier, the key figure in the Marine One contract is Gianni Castellaneta. When the Pentagon put the Marine One contract out for bid, Castellaneta was deputy chair of Finmeccanica and national security advisor to Prime Minister Berlusconi. By the time the contract was awarded, Castellaneta had been appointed Italy's ambassador to the United States.

Castellaneta proudly told U.S. Italia Weekly, "At noon President Bush received me for the official delivery of credentials. He didn't make me wait a single day. An exceptional courtesy."

Castellaneta's role in obtaining the Marine One contract has never been examined before, but according to Affari Italiani, Italy's first online daily, and disarmo.org, an Italian arms control advocacy group, Castellaneta has long managed the most sensitive dossiers in U.S.-Italian bilateral relations.

When Ambassador Castellaneta was asked about his role, the embassy press officer, Luca Ferrari said, "In his capacity as ambassador, representing all of Italy in the United States, the ambassador does not care to speak any more about Finmeccanica."

and more

[seemslikeadream]

2. It's not ringing any bells

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com /

QUESTION: Thank you. Any more explanation of the Berlusconi-President discussion about Italian intelligence on Iraq -- is this to say that Mr. Fitzgerald's finding that the Niger claim had its genesis in Italian intelligence was wrong?
SCOTT McCLELLAN: Mr. Fitzgerald's -- I'll have to look back at what his finding was. I don't recall the specifics of that.

QUESTION: Fitzgerald found that what we had been calling British intelligence, the document -- the forged document --

SCOTT McCLELLAN: Maybe I missed that. I don't think so. I don't think so.

QUESTION: -- alleging an Iraq --

SCOTT McCLELLAN: Okay, I don't think he did.

QUESTION: I'm wrong on this?

SCOTT McCLELLAN: Maybe I'm wrong. But I don't think he --

QUESTION: That's not ringing any bells.

SCOTT McCLELLAN: Yes.

QUESTION: It's not ringing any bells with other people either.

QUESTION: No, it is, it is. And I can't remember if it's Fitzgerald or somebody else, but there's this is the central issue is --

QUESTION: The central issue was --

QUESTION: -- the source of the --

QUESTION: The source of the forged document was Italy, who handed it to --

SCOTT McCLELLAN: No, the -- we actually briefed on the source of the information back in July of 2003, and the source was the National Intelligence Estimate and British Intelligence. That was the basis for the reference in the President's State of the Union address.

QUESTION: Fitzgerald found an Italian tie, and I presume this is what the discussion between the President and Berlusconi was about.

SCOTT McCLELLAN: Yes, they -- like I said they -- Prime Minister Berlusconi brought it up, and as they indicated, that there wasn't any documents that were provided to us on Niger and uranium by --

QUESTION: Wait, no documents or no intelligence?

SCOTT McCLELLAN: I'm sorry?

QUESTION: The press report out of Italy is a transcription -- it's a transcription of the forged documents, not the actual documents themselves. But Berlusconi said yesterday was, no information passed from Italy to the United States.

SCOTT McCLELLAN: Yes, I think he was accurately reflecting what he indicated in the meeting.

QUESTION: So that accurately characterizes the President's position, that the United States never received any intelligence --

SCOTT McCLELLAN: Well, Prime Minister Berlusconi was reflecting that within the meeting, and we've previously said in regards to a question that came up about a meeting here at the White House that no one here has any recollection of Niger and uranium being discussed at that meeting, much less any documents being provided.

[seemslikeadream]

3. Bill Moyers interview with transcript Carlo Bonini

http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/05042007/transcript1.html

Bill Moyers talks with Carlo Bonini


BILL MOYERS: Junk has to be made by somebody. When you set out to find out who made the junk, where did the trail lead?

CARLO BONINI: For sure, the documents were cooked up and put together in Rome. There is no doubt about it. We had a chance to get these documents. We know where these documents came from. And we had a chance to knock at the door of the Niger Embassy in Rome, which is a tiny apartment in the center of the city. And the lady who opened the door was the lady you find in the story we reported. La Señora we call her.

BILL MOYERS: She was working for the Niger Embassy. But she was working...

CARLO BONINI: As a secretary, yeah. But she was a, she was a mole of SISME inside the Embassy.

BILL MOYERS: The Italian intelligence agency.

CARLO BONINI: These documents has the fingerprints of La Señora, and has the fingerprints of a former police officer, a former SISME agent named Rocco Martino.

BILL MOYERS: A rather shadowy, underworld character, right?

CARLO BONINI: Absolutely, in 2001, basically, a freelance agent in the shadow world of spies selling informations, no matter if true or false.

BILL MOYERS: You mean he would make up information and sell it because he -

CARLO BONINI: If necessary. You know, it's - one of those guy that probably, you know - I mean, he's trying to make his life at the end of the month. And so he simply - I mean, at the time, he aspired to be could, we could report at the time, he was just going from Rome to Brussels to Paris to London to, just, you know, trying to figure out how to get some thousand euros from pieces of informations.

BILL MOYERS: But you say in the book he worked with Italian agents, legitimate agents to create this.

CARLO BONINI: That's the case. I mean, he told -

[seemslikeadream]

4. Then the story fell apart

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Yellowcake_forgery


Yellowcake forgery
From SourceWatch
In the push for the 2003 war with Iraq, Bush administration officials, including President George W. Bush himself in his State of the Union 2003 speech, cited evidence that Saddam Hussein had attempted to buy 500 tons of yellowcake uranium from the African nation of Niger.

However, Mohamed ElBaradei of the United Nations International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) looked at the evidence and stated that it was obviously forged and a year earlier the CIA found the evidence to be unreliable. <1><2>

Contents

1 Events
2 La Repubblica Expose
3 SourceWatch Resources
4 External Links
4.1 Related Articles
4.2 Timelines
4.3 Documents
4.4 Articles & Commentary
4.5 Web Series
4.5.1 2003
4.5.2 2004
4.5.3 2005
4.5.4 2007

Events
Seymour M. Hersh wrote in the March 24, 2003, The New Yorker Magazine:

"Then the story fell apart. On March 7th, Mohamed ElBaradei, the director-general of the International Atomic Energy Agency, in Vienna, told the U.N. Security Council that the documents involving the Niger-Iraq uranium sale were fakes. 'The I.A.E.A. has concluded, with the concurrence of outside experts, that these documents . . . are in fact not authentic,' ElBaradei said."
"One senior I.A.E.A. official went further. He told , 'These documents are so bad that I cannot imagine that they came from a serious intelligence agency. It depresses me, given the low quality of the documents, that it was not stopped. At the level it reached, I would have expected more checking.'"
"Congressmen Henry A. Waxman, who approved Bush's war initiative, expessed concern that such a mishap could have occurred. 'It is hard to imagine how this situation could have developed,' he stated in a letter to the President. 'The two most obvious explanations — knowing deception or unfathomable incompetence — both have immediate and serious implications.' Waxman added, 'These facts raise troubling questions. It appears that at the same time you, Secretary Rumsfeld, and State Department officials were citing Iraq's efforts to obtain uranium from Africa as a crucial part of the case against Iraq, U.S. intelligence officials regarded this very same evidence as unreliable. If true, this is deeply disturbing: it would mean that your Administration asked the U.N. Security Council, the Congress, and the American people to rely on information that your own experts knew was not credible.'" <3>

The Bush administration has failed to provide adequate explanation for this situation, and the national media has failed to pursue the matter.
On March 14, 2003, Senator John D. Rockefeller IV asked the FBI to investigate the origin of the documents. Rockefeller expressed concern that the forgeries "may be part of a larger deception campaign aimed at manipulating public opinion and foreign policy regarding Iraq."

"If ... you want one piece to bring you fully up to date on the Niger forgery flap, check out Neil Mackay's "Niger and Iraq: the war's biggest lie?" in the Glasgow Sunday Herald ("One senior western diplomat told the Sunday Herald: 'There were more than 20 anomalies in the Niger documents -- it is staggering any intelligence service could have believed they were genuine for a moment.'"). --TomDispatch.com, July 2003.

La Repubblica Expose
In late October 2005, left of center Italian Newspaper La Repubblica published a three-part series which alleged that the Italian Intelligence Service SISMI played a large role in obtaining the the forged Niger Documents and distributing them to Western Governments. Rocco Martino, formerly a dishonest policeman as well as a former SISMI double agent, is identified as the documents source, and he pitched them to SISMI, who in turn handed them over to the CIA station head in Rome. The documents were reportedly identified by the Italian embassy's intelligence personnel as probable forgeries and were refused. The La Repubblica expose then claims that SISMI Director Nicolò Pollari, at the behest of Italian Prime Minister, Silvio Berlusconi, did an end run around the CIA and delivered the documents by hand in Washington D.C. to White House National Security Council (NSC) staff.

If this expose is true, it has stark implications for many people in the Bush Administration as they vocally blamed the CIA for the false claims of Iraq's acquisition of Niger Uranium, and George J. Tenet accepted the blame. Chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee Pat Roberts would also be cast in a dark hue, as either an accomplice or unknowing dupe, since he vehemently attacked the Agency at the same time.

See: Walter Pincus and Dana Milbank, "Bush, Rice Blame CIA for Iraq Error: Tenet Accepts Responsibility for Clearing Statement on Nuclear Aims in Jan. Speech", Washington Post, July 12, 2003.
A good translation of the La Repubblica series was done by a blogger, "Nur al-Cubicle", and has been mirrored at Shadow-Media dot org:

Carlo Bonini and Giuseppe d'Avanzo, "Berlusconi Behind Fake Yellowcake Dossier", La Repubblica, October 23, 2005.
Part One - Nur al-Cubicle
Part One - Shadow Media
Carlo Bonini and Giuseppe d'Avanzo, Yellowcake Dossier Not the Work of the CIA", La Repubblica, October 25, 2005.
Part Two - Nur al-Cubicle
Part Two - Shadow Media
Carlo Bonini and Giuseppe d'Avanzo, "Nigergate: The Great Nuclear Centrifuge Scam", La Repubblica, October 26, 2005.
Part Three - Nur al-Cubicle
Part Three - Shadow Media
SourceWatch Resources
arms control
Bush administration lies that led to war
Bush's 16 words
Commission on the Intelligence Capabilities of the United States Regarding Weapons of Mass Destruction
Commission on the Intelligence Capabilities of the United States Regarding Weapons of Mass Destruction: Final Report
cooked intelligence
Intelligence Community
Joseph C. Wilson IV
Karl Rove: Outing Valerie Plame
Rathergate: Sumner M. Redstone, George W. Bush & CBS
Senate Select Committee on Intelligence
The Cheney-Rumsfeld Cabal Deception
Treasongate: Beyond Karl Rove
Valerie Plame
weapons of mass deception
weapons of mass destruction investigation
External Links
Related Articles
"Yellowcake Forgery" in the Wikipedia.
"Yellowcake forgery" (with redirect to "Niger uranium" in the dKosopedia.
Timelines
Paul Kerr, "Iraq-Niger Uranium Chronology" (Late 2001-March 2003), Arms Control Association, undated.
TPM Niger Uranium Timeline, Talking Points Memo, Updated November 6, 2005.
Documents
Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, Report on the U.S. Intelligence Community's Prewar Intelligence Assessments on Iraq, July 7, 2004 (521-page pdf).
Return to an Address of the Honourable the House of Commons dated 14th July 2004 for the Review of Intelligence on Weapons of Mass Destruction. Report of a Committee of Privy Counsellors. Chairman: The Rt Hon The Lord Butler of Brockwell KG GCB CVO July 14, 2004.
"The Commission on the Intelligence Capabilities of the United States Regarding Weapons of Mass Destruction," Report to the President of the United States, March 31, 2005.
Articles & Commentary
Web Series
Jack Shafer, "Follow That Story: The Nuclear Whodunit," Slate:
Part 1: "Who bamboozled the United States?", March 14, 2003.
Part 2: "Who forged the documents that bamboozled the U.S.?", March 17, 2003.
Part 3: "CIA analysts do a CYA, telling the press, Don't blame the phony nuke docs on us!", March 23, 2003.
Part 4: "Who forged the uranium documents that bamboozled the U.S.? A chronology," July 14, 2003.
2003
Seymour M. Hersh, "Who Lied to Whom? Why did the Administration endorse a forgery about Iraq's nuclear program?", The New Yorker Online, Posted March 24, 2003.
Walter Pincus, "CIA Says It Cabled Key Data to White House. But Officials Say Document Lacked Conclusion on Iraqi Uranium Deal," Washington Post, June 13, 2003.
"CIA says it didn't hide its doubts on Niger uranium buy," Associated Press (USA Today), June 19, 2003.
Joseph C. Wilson IV, "What I Didn't Find in Africa," New York Times, July 6, 2003.
David Rennie, "CIA man denies Niger-Iraq uranium link," Telegraph (UK), July 7, 2003.
Tony Karon, "Bush and Iraq: Follow the Yellow Cake Road," Time, July 9, 2003: "The question is no longer whether the President uttered a falsehood in his indictment of Iraq; it's at what point the Administration learned the claim of uranium purchases from Niger was false."
Walter Pincus and Mike Allen, "CIA Got Uranium Reference Cut in Oct. Why Bush Cited It In Jan. Is Unclear," Washington Post, July 13, 2003; posted on Common Dreams website.
"The Niger connection," The Observer/UK, July 13, 2003.
"Italy denies originating Iraq-Niger uranium claims," Agence France Presse (ClariNet), July 13, 2003.
Robert Novak, "Mission to Niger," Townhall.com, July 14, 2003.
"Niger upset by uranium slur," BBC, July 14, 2003.
Dana Priest and Dana Milbank, "President Defends Allegation On Iraq. Bush Says CIA's Doubts Followed Jan. 28 Address," Washington Post, July 15, 2003.
Carlo Bonini and Giuseppe D’Avanzo, "Here you have the bogus dossier on Saddam’s uranium," La Repubblica (War in Context), July 16, 2003.
"Blair Stands by Niger Uranium Claim," Associated Press (Fox News), July 16, 2003.
"Bush Uranium Lie Is Tip of the Iceberg," FAIR, July 18, 2003.
Mark Follman, "Spooked by the White House," Salon, July 18, 2003: "A CIA veteran says a growing faction of the U.S. intelligence community is furious over the way the administration corrupted the system -- and that the nation's security is at grave risk." Subscription or preview required.
"Italian journalist claims she supplied Iraq-Niger uranium documents to US," Agence France Presse (ClariNews), July 19, 2003.
Bill Gertz, "FBI probing forged papers on Niger uranium," Washington Times, July 19, 2003.
Howard Dean, "President Bush Must Set the Niger-Uranium Story Straight," Common Dreams, July 21, 2003.
John Diamond, "Conflicting reports leave uranium case open," USA Today, July 21, 2003.
Mike Nartker, "Iraq II: Democrats Demand to Know Why Niger and African Uranium Claims Were Made Public," NTI Global Security Newswire, July 24, 2003.
"Cheney Claims Again Iraq Tried To Acquire Uranium From Niger," Democracy Now!, September 16, 2003.
2004
Mark Huband, "Evidence of Niger uranium trade 'years before war'," Financial Times, June 27, 2004.
James Risen, "How Niger Uranium Story Defied Wide Skepticism," New York Times (Free Republic), July 14, 2004.
Matthew Yglesias, "The UK on Niger," yglesias, July 14, 2004.
"New Fight Over Iraq Nuke Claim," CBS News/Associated Press, July 19, 2004.
Mark Huband, "French Probe Led to 'Fake Niger Uranium Papers'," Financial Times (GlobalSecurity), August 2, 2004.
Juan Cole, "Rocco Martino: 'I am the Source of the False Niger/Iraq Uranium Story'," Informed Comment, August 2, 2004.
Eric Margolis, "The lies that led to war," Canoe Network, August 8, 2004.
Joshua Micah Marshall, "FBI could talk to source of forged Niger papers. I did," The Hill, September 23, 2004: "One of the obvious places to start such an investigation would be with Elisabetta Burba, the Italian journalist who got copies of the documents and later turned them over to the American Embassy in Rome."
2005
Steven C. Clemons, "John Bolton Pushed Niger-Uranium Fiasco at State -- Then Tried to Hide his Tracks and Staff Lied to Congress," The Washington Note, March 14, 2005.
Meldread, "Follow the Yellowcake Road," Democratic Underground, July 4, 2005. Timeline of events starting in February 2002.
Ian Masters, "Who Forged the Niger Documents?" AlterNet, April 7, 2005.
Ivo Daalder, "Niger and Uranium -- The Evidence," TPM Cafe, July 15, 2005.
"Uranium from Africa and the Senate (SSCI) Report," The Left Coaster: Introduction and Part 1, July 24, 2005; Part 2, Part 3a, and Part 3, July 25, 2005.
Raymond McGovern, "Iraq-Niger: Cheney and the Forgery," After Downing Street, July 25, 2005.
Justin Raimondo, "Niger Uranium Forgery Mystery Solved? The Fitzgerald/Plame investigation goes in a new direction," Antiwar.com, July 19, 2005.
Larry Johnson, "Mambo Italiano and Plame Gate," TPM Cafe, October 10, 2005.
Robert Collier, "Seeds of Leak Scandal Sown in Italian Intelligence Agency," San Francisco Chronicle (Common Dreams), October 30, 2005.
"Italy warned uranium dossier on Iraq was fake," Associated Press (USA Today), November 3, 2005.
Tom Regan, "Italy denies faking Niger documents. Italian secret service names 'occasional spy' as source of forged documents," Christian Science Monitor, November 4, 2005.
John Hooper, "Italy 'warned Saddam intelligence was bogus'," Guardian Unlimited (UK), November 4, 2005.
Jonathan S. Landay, "Italy provided U.S. with faulty uranium intelligence, officials insist," Knight Ridder Newspapers, November 4, 2005.
Elaine Sciolino and Elisabetta Povoledo, "Source of Forged Niger-Iraq Uranium Documents Identified," New York Times, November 4, 2005.
"FBI: Money played main part in forged papers on Niger uranium," Associated Press (Billings Gazette), November 5, 2005.
"Treasongate: The Niger Forgeries v. the CIA Intel Reports - Preliminary Conclusion: An Italian Job," The Left Coaster, November 7, 2005.
"Intel Probe: The Yellowcake Mystery," Newsweek, November 14, 2005 (issue).
Philip Giraldi, "Forging the Case for War. Who was behind the Niger uranium documents?" The American Conservative, November 21, 2005 (issue).
Larisa Alexandrovna, "Senate Intelligence Committee stalling pre-war intelligence report," The Raw Story, December 2, 2005.
Peter Wallsten, Tom Hamburger and Josh Meyer, "FBI Is Taking Another Look at Forged Prewar Intelligence," Los Angeles Times, December 3, 2005.
Justin Raimondo, "'Urban Myth' – or Treason? The Niger uranium forgery cover-up unravels," AntiWar.com, December 5, 2005.
Craig Unger, "The War They Wanted, The Lies They Needed," Vanity Fair, June 6, 2006: "The Bush administration invaded Iraq claiming Saddam Hussein had tried to buy yellowcake uranium in Niger. As much of Washington knew, and the world soon learned, the charge was false. Worse, it appears to have been the cornerstone of a highly successful 'black propaganda' campaign with links to the White House."
2007
Peter Eisner, "How Bogus Letter Became a Case for War. Intelligence Failures Surrounded Inquiry on Iraq-Niger Uranium Claim," Washington Post, April 3, 2007.
Margie Burns, "Washington Post Almost Catches Up With Niger Uranium Story. Three Years Late, Long After the Flawed Senate Intelligence Committee Report, WaPo Finally Fills in a Very Few Blanks on Bush's Infamous '16 Words' Which Led to War," The Brad Blog, April 4, 2007.
Gordon Prather, "Conspiracy, Collusion, War," Antiwar.com, April 14, 2007.
Dan Eggen and Paul Kane, "Hill Subpoenas Approved for Rice, Other Bush Officials. As Democrats Seek Administration Testimony on Various Issues, Ex-Justice Aide Receives Limited Immunity," Washington Post, April 26, 2007.
Gordon Prather, "Enabling Bush's Wars of Aggression," Antiwar.com, April 28, 2007.
Ray McGovern, "Sorry They've Been So Mean To You, George," BuzzFlash, April 30, 2007.
David Edwards, "Ex-CIA analyst: Forged 'yellowcake' memo 'leads right back to' Cheney," The Raw Story, April 30, 2007.
New American Patriot, "Ex-CIA Heavy: 'I've Got the Goods on Cheney'," A Liberal Dose Blogspot, May 1, 2007.
Jonah Goldberg, "Between Tenet's lines," Salt Lake Tribune, May 2, 2007.

[H2O Man]

5. I do not think

that this implies the documents were given directly to Bush.

[burythehatchet]

20. well we do tend to take rather long leaps of faith, don't we.

[Forkboy]

7. From a Mussolini wannabe to a Hitler wannabe.

Charming!

[formercia]

11. The Knights of Malta put Hitler in Power.

The Knights were closely affiliated with Il Duce as well.

The Crusades were a coalition of the willing and not so willing.

[xchrom]

9. a PRETEND mushroom cloud -- and everyone concerned KNEW it was a pretend mushroom cloud.

[formercia]

10. Berlusconi is a Knight of Malta as is Poppy

The usual suspects.

[IChing]

12. As was William Casey, Ronald Reagan and others were honorary members

The usual suspects with the bad penny.

[formercia]

14. Vietnam was a Knights of Malta operation as well

Spellman's War.

as was the War in Central America and the 'Dirty Wars' in Latin America.

Frank Carlucci, head of Carlyle is a KOM as well.

[grasswire]

18. what relationship does KOM have to P2?

Isn't Berlusconi P2?

[formercia]

19. The P2 Lodge was a false-flag operation by the KOM

It was made to appear as a Masonic Lodge but was in total control of the Knights of Malta from the beginning.


Here's some references frome Namebase.org Some very familiar people involved...

http://www.namebase.org/main3/Malta-Knights.html

[UTUSN]

15. K&R n/t

[Me.]

16. IIRC There Was A Time When Fitzgerald & McNulty Were Working On Getting

them from the Italian government. If the WH had them wouldn't they have gone there first?

[Zhade]

21. KICK

KICK

[wildbilln864]

22. kick! n/t

[Disturbed]

23. Ms Rice needs to be arrested by the Sgt. of Arms and

brought to the House to testify Under Oath. Will Waxman back down?

[progressoid]

24. That's a pretty big leap in logic to say that he gave them DIRECTLY to Bush.

Bonini is guessing. He even admits so when he says, "I would have died to be up there in a corner listening at that meeting." He doesn't know what happened.

[lala_rawraw]

25. not entirely accurate...

He gave him information. Pollari gave Hadley the documents.

[frogcycle]

26. source?

[peacetalksforall]

27. Two questions: We need to learn what the agreements were that

the U.S. signed with the Coalition of Partners. Obviously, when we went out to them we probably asked for soldiers. However, we also probably gave them a wish list should they not be in a political position to send live bodies (fuel stops for rendition flights, prison grounds, prison guards, espionage, artillery, doctors???). Given the nature of their 'contribution', it is doubtful that Italy thought this up. Italy got the nod, if you apply what we know about the agenda the Pentagon and WH was operating on. I don't think we're getting the behind the story sequence. The Moyers interview was only an interview. No?

Question 2 - where is Micahel Ledeen in these write-ups - does he come up within the articles linked?

[adamuu]

28. as an athiest, I don't believe in Hell. But

this post makes me think i should start.

[pscot]

29. Rashomon

This tale, in it's many iterations, has become so convoluted that it will probably never be sorted out. It's fun for a while, but in the end it just makes your head spin.

[lovuian]

30. My video on Berlusconi

He is Bush's best buddy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mx3p9juDV_A

and he is a IDIOT