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Iceland Jails Top Bankers - Why Can't New York AG Do the Same?

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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-13-10 10:11 AM
Original message
Iceland Jails Top Bankers - Why Can't New York AG Do the Same?
Bankers jailed, sued as Iceland seeks culprits for crisis
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4379020#4379696

Such a reasonable country, rising up to its own self-defense. It's nice to think about the happy news in Iceland - I know it's all a daydream - in combination with this:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/13/business/13street.html?hp
Prosecutors Ask if 8 Banks Duped Rating Agencies
By LOUISE STORY
Published: May 12, 2010
The New York attorney general has started an investigation of eight banks to determine whether they provided misleading information to rating agencies in order to inflate the grades of certain mortgage securities, according to two people with knowledge of the investigation.


--

The ratings agency scams go to the heart of the Wall Street housing bubble frauds. This is where the excuses and evasions end. Supposedly independent third-party auditors received billions of dollars from the issuers of junk securities to rate them AAA, without which investors would have never been duped into buying said junk.

To take one example, Moody's issued hundreds of AAAs on mortgage securities (like the famous Abacus fund put together by John Paulson and pimped by Goldman Sachs) that only months later were downgraded to junk. The difference is, they had already been sold to the suckers while still AAA. The "correction" came after the suckers were already screwed, and merely adds insult to injury.

The ratings agencies who posed as independent auditors of values committed frauds just as bad or worse than those perpetrated by Arthur Anderson on behalf of Enron.

Arthur Anderson was seized in the course of the criminal investigation of Enron. There was no need to be polite to them.

Of course, Wall Street saw to it at the end of the 20th century (thanks to Obama advisers Larry Summers and Robert Rubin alongside Phil Gramm and Greenspan) that Congress would make legal all the frauds it then perpetrated in the 21st century. However, the variety of fraud and conspiracy laws on the books gives a prosecutor a lot of leeway. Cuomo may not need to be limited to financial statutes. When businesses misrepresent their products to gain sales, they may make themselves liable under other existing fraud statutes.

I wonder about the applicability of the RICO criminal statutes. These are like turbo for prosecutors. They were invented specifically to get at gangsters who knew how to conceal their operational decision-making structures - just like the banksters knew to disperse apparent responsibility among many different parties, each in a different compartment, each able to claim they're "just doing their job." But again, the weak link in the bankster schemes is at the ratings agencies. This is where their fraud is most obviously exposed.

A lot of mobsters went down on a lot less evidence of conspiracy to defraud than is currently available for the banksters and the ratings agencies. This is not really about the law but about public and political attitudes and the will to act.

When the banksters are seen as having committed greater crimes with far, far greater damages to the public than anything the mafia ever did, then we may see some motion from the politicians. We may actually be close to that moment. I think it will come with the next crash - though unfortunately there is the risk that the next crash will instead bring a right-wing reaction in Tea Party style.

Of course, we've already seen Wall Street's true line of defense: fuck with us and we blow up the world. Drain your economy to guarantee our operations, or we blow up the world. It's hilarious that this country still runs on Terror War propaganda. Can you imagine a greater capitulation to terrorists than the government's series of surrenders to the bankster threats since 2008?

Hey, good news everyone:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/12/business/12bank.html?hp
4 Big Banks Score Perfect 61-Day Run
By ERIC DASH
Published: May 11, 2010

It is the Wall Street equivalent of a perfect game of baseball — 27 up, 27 down, the final score measured in millions of dollars a day.

Despite the running unease in world markets, four giants of American finance managed to make money from trading every single day during the first three months of the year.

Their remarkable 61-day streak is one for the record books. Perfect trading quarters on Wall Street are about as rare as perfect games in Major League Baseball. On Sunday, Dallas Braden of the Oakland Athletics pitched what was only the 19th perfect game in baseball history.

But Bank of America, Citigroup, Goldman Sachs and JPMorgan Chase & Company produced the equivalent of four perfect games during the first quarter. Each one finished the period without losing money for even one day.

Their showing, disclosed in quarterly financial filings, underscored the outsize — and controversial — role that trading has assumed at major financial institutions. It also drives home the widening lead that a handful of big banks are enjoying over lesser rivals on post-bailout Wall Street.

SNIP


That's why we fight! MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!
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Scuba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-13-10 10:23 AM
Response to Original message
1. Indict AIG, Goldman Sachs, etc... Sieze their assets. That's that the law calls for doing ,
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zazen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-13-10 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. seize their assets for a special Teacher Retention and Recruitment Fund
Put every highly-qualified laid off teacher back to work and create more positions to get classrooms down to manageable size. Let every governor, LEA and SEA, their school boards and the public at large know that's what you plan to do with the assets so they're already mentally spending the money.

We could use a green jobs fund too, but the comparison of laid of award-winning elementary school teachers (positions well known and previously filled) to these greedy monsters might add some momentum to seizing their stolen monies.
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-13-10 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. how about setting up a fund to help EVERYONE who has been hurt by this crime?
I'm sure there are many people who have been out of work LONGER than teachers. I guess they don't count?

Let's start this off right by NOT setting up deals for special interest groups right away. that just smacks of the same sort of elitist bullshit that will piss off everybody else.

Let's help the folks who have been suffering the LONGEST. No cut-ins on the line.
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-13-10 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Think bigger: national banks + local credit unions
Edited on Thu May-13-10 01:56 PM by JackRiddler
Seize the banks as criminal organizations and liquidate Wall Street altogether. Meet the insured deposits - print money if necessary. Cancel any debts to public entities (since Wall Street had a big role in causing these). Screw the shareholders. Pay only foreign bondholders. But encourage this stance internationally.

This is a necessity: confront the tyranny of the bankers and their compound interest slavery.

Everything will of course crash miserably, since the system is not set up for such an action. The whole point is to start a new system, in which the means of creating capital and money are no longer in the hands of profit-motivated private entities but of democratically controlled public institutions.

THEN:

Every state founds and appoints/elects people to run a set of banks (e.g., three separate state-owned banks for consumer-homeowners-state employees, small businesses, and larger development projects in tandem with corporations). The states elect a national coordinating board for a central bank. Its explicit purpose is national development of green energy and a transport/infrastructure transformation. No longer do we fly the empty flag of 'growth' but of ecologically sound economics in the human interest.

Meanwhile, credit unions and community currencies are encouraged. We the people take control of our own capital. We the people decide how it is invested. We the people learn from our own mistakes (which will be made, you can be certain).

---

Unfortunately in our political climate the categories necessary to conceive such ideas are either elusive or impossible to discuss without attack. Make no mistake, the banks will crash again for the same big-picture reasons they crashed before (eternal growth is both imperative and impossible; as it growth reaches limits capital turns to cannibalistic strategies that generate worse and worse crashes).

But what will follow is probably the man on horseback, or some modern form of totalitarian control: the corporations on horseback. Because all discourse in this country has been degraded by 40 years of a continuous neoliberal class war including a massive dumb-down through media, and a non-stop theocratic-reactionary assault on reason itself.

I mean, people's hearts and guts are owned and branded by corporations and they think "the government" is already "socialist" so they demand more corporate control! We are so screwed.
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Scuba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-13-10 07:48 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Nailed it.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #4
22. Excellent post.
Too bad there is no possibility, at least not yet, of doing any of what you recommend.

People cannot be educated when the media is as controlled as ours is.

As for the ratings companies, I could swear I read that some of them were coerced into those AAA ratings.

I hope the 'investigations' are not just for show. Especially those being conducted by the Special Investigator for TARP.

Maybe Iceland will start the ball rolling in other countries around the world.

Michael Moore asked in his movie 'Capitalis A Love Story' "Where is the money"? It's a simple question, but it didn't disappear. What happened to it? Shouldn't we be trying to find out now that there is no doubt of the fraud that was committed?
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-13-10 03:00 PM
Response to Original message
5. kick!
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-13-10 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. kick?
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-13-10 08:10 PM
Response to Original message
8. K&R
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 01:55 AM
Response to Original message
9. kick
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The Damned Donating Member (284 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 03:18 AM
Response to Original message
10. K & FUCKING R!
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dmosh42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 04:34 AM
Response to Original message
11. Where's Holder, Obama"s AG?
They should abolish that position. (AG) Completely useless!
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 04:46 AM
Response to Original message
12. Now.. When some serious LAW AND ORDER is required. .
Where are the absolutists in Congress who tout their "tough on crime" cred?
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fishbulb703 Donating Member (492 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 05:18 AM
Response to Original message
13. Its not terror and threats to the government, the government is in bed. Its threats to us. via media
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 09:46 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Yes & No. Think back to September 2008...
The people clearly were not scared of the bankster threats and in a moment of clarity wanted to see them into their collective financial grave. And in a change, enough of the government was more afraid of the people than the banksters, to the point where the TARP plunder bill at first failed. It was the political leadership that then used a carrot and stick strategy on Congressional hold-outs, including threats that the world would end there would be martial law etc. etc. Anyway, it's a combination, surely. Sometimes politicians don't conform, and they get screwed. I'm sure the lesson of Spitzer's demise got through to a lot of them.
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Iggo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 09:55 AM
Response to Original message
15. Because they'd have to jail their accomplices and enablers. (n/t)
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. What, they can't have a falling out? It would be a wondrous sight...
I think the system is utterly corrupt but motivations and vision still vary among individuals. Spitzer for example was a man of the system nevertheless with a set of core political beliefs (New Deal oblesse oblige) and willingness to go after more egregious corruption. Cuomo perhaps the same. There is also the genuine risk of a domino effect - one banker rightly nailed to a charge may be willing to nail the next, and so on.

It requires some serious pitchfork action, I suppose. Election anger at incumbents ain't enough.
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 08:16 PM
Response to Original message
17. evening kick
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Selatius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
18. Too many politicians are being financed by corporate leaders and bankers.
The only way they would do it is if fear of the working class outweighs the fear of corporate overlords.
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Yes, and unfortunately...
Edited on Sat May-15-10 12:21 PM by JackRiddler
in this country the most fearful segments of the working class seem to be those who respond to the dogwhistles of nationalism, racism and fundamentalist religion. Not to mention the know-nothing libertarian economic faith that glorifies greed and a lack of compassion, and creates the myth of the "free market."

Which is another way of saying the sad truth about the left in a nation where the majority of the people really are center-left: We suck!
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 01:31 PM
Response to Original message
20. Hm, it's interesting that Bill Clinton stepped in to disagree with my thesis, because...
it shows that the banksters really are detecting some rise in the temperature, and must be seriously considering that they have, in fact, exposed themselves to criminal prosecutions.

Here's what the Glass-Steagal Repealer, George Bush Senior's best friend and the future father-in-law to a Goldman Sachs trader had to say:

Bill Clinton: "Lower the rhetoric. Goldman Sachs did nothing illegal."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x8336273

Motherfucker.
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wildbilln864 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 01:34 PM
Response to Original message
21. k& friggin R! nt
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
23. Sunday kick
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-18-10 11:03 AM
Response to Original message
24. tuesday kick
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-20-10 06:00 PM
Response to Original message
25. thursday kick
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