I wonder how many of us would become total assholes if we were uber wealthy

[Duer 157099]

I would like to think not, but the evidence that when people join the upper tiers of society, they change, their opinions and values and priorities just seem to change, like the waxing and waning of the moon, the ebb and flow of the tide, just a fact of nature.

It's the exception when this doesn't happen.

If it's a given of nature, do we just finally accept it somehow?

[JuniperLea]

1. I don't think so...

I've known several self-made millionaires and billionaires that are as down to earth as they were when they put themselves through college working at Baskin Robbins. They didn't swap political parties either... still Dems.

[rurallib]

3. yet OTOH I have worked with some factory workers

whose stock took off and they became true assholes when they realized what they had.
I have a friend who always tells me a Repug is just a Dem with a dollar in his pocket.

[Salviati]

5. Nah, they were assholes before, they just didn't have enough $ to tell everyone to fuck off.

[zappaman]

2. It seems a lot of folks here

don't need money to be total assholes...
I think assholes are assholes regardless of money and good people are good people regardless of money.

[MrSlayer]

4. I'd be too busy enjoying myself to become an asshole.

I believe in overtipping as it is. If I had real money I'd be making someone's day every day.

[JuniperLea]

11. Whenever I have a few bucks...

I share by tipping well. I would love to be able to freak people out with uber large tips!

My property taxes went down (along with the value) and the state sent me a check... I was very, very, overly generous for weeks... it felt damn good.

[renate]

6. a acquaintance of my husband's who became super rich...

... said that money just makes you more of what you were already.

So latent asswipes probably become blatant asswipes, and generous people are able to become even more generous. And people who were not secure about themselves probably try to buy a sense of importance, and people who were secure probably don't need to and can stay down to earth.

[ShortnFiery]

7. IMO, wishful thinking. Look at how many working class people have destroyed their lives

after winning the LOTTO?

Money makes others "take notice of you in a flattering way."

I fear far too many of us, including myself, could easily be taken in by this flattery to the point we'd start to believe the beautiful bullshit people tell us about ourselves. :blush:

If you have your health and enough to survive and provide for your immediate family - then, IMO, that's as good as winning the lottery.

Anyway, that's my rationalization and I'm going with it! :silly:

[pipi_k]

27. Hah...I don't believe very much of the flattery people give me now

If I had lots of money, I'd figure they were only sucking up to me and believe even less.


Anyway, the older I get, the more I realize that good health is more precious than money.

[EFerrari]

14. I think that's probably true. We've had some pretty dramatic

reversals here and that's what seemed to happen in both directions.

[jaysunb]

25. Hubby is 100% correct

:thumbsup:

[MIprogressive1]

8. I would buy an island and live there with an unlimited supply of beer and pizza :)

[Fuzz]

9. I'm an asshole now!

;)

[William Z. Foster]

10. other way around

Being wealthy does not always make people total assholes, but being total assholes does make people wealthy. That is the problem. Anti-social, predatory and exploitative behavior is lavishly rewarded. Those dedicated to contributing to the common good are punished.

This is a generalization of course, and not an ironclad rule. But it has as much or more validity than any other generalization of its kind.

Even those right here who are attacking the left and the working class, and apologizing for the wealthy and for Wall Street and for the existing social hierarchy and conventions and arrangements, tend to be personally well off, and also are the most aggressive and anti-social posters, as well. I don't think success makes people assholes, I do think being an asshole, though, helps people become successful. The only real rebuttal to that I ever hear is this - "only losers would say that!" Heh. Right.

We routinely admire the (financially) successful no matter what sort of assholes they are, and no matter how talented or dedicated a person may be, they are liable to be seen as and treated as a "loser" if they are not financially successful. In fact, when a person is aggressive and bullies others, we assume they must be wealthy (only they can get away with that; you or I get the cops called on us.)

This is true everywhere we look, at all levels of society, it permeates everything and corrupts all of our social interactions and relationships. We are so accustomed to it, so unable to imagine anything else, that we don't even "see" it. Yet it is relatively new and very localized.

[RandomThoughts]

24. Ok, then lets fix it.

Lets call all the cops down to help those people being hurt. That would solve it wouldn't it?

Since people you describe that get ahead by worse means fits the description of hurting people.

You could even call that a form of justice.

[Duer 157099]

26. I think you're right

I will never be uber wealthy because I release money very easily, giving it away or whatever.

You're right, it's totally the other way around, it's just assholes who tend to accumulate wealth because they know how to be assholes.

That so sucks.

[William Z. Foster]

28. dominate or be dominated

Since the rise of capitalism in England, fairly recently, and then the replacement of Britain by the US as the main imperialist power, an orgy of destruction has been unleashed. In our lifetimes we are seeing the climax, as all traditional culture is disappearing, sustainable cooperative communities in every corner of the earth are under assault, and as the earth and the people of the earth are pushed to the brink. We are uniquely placed, since we are in a position to do the most to stop this, being the intellectuals in the heart of the beast. Of course, we are also surrounded by the most aggressive and motivated protectors of the system on the planet, as well, and they control the political process and discussion. That battle - the key battle for the survival of the human race - the battle of words and ideas at the heart of the empire, plays out right here every day.

In order to stop the destruction, we must be willing to look at and challenge the social arrangements and conventions right here, the assumptions and the mentality that are pervasive in our own everyday lives. That is the thing that people are most resistant to, and that is what all of the fighting here is about. Those with the training, motivation, time and resources to engage in the political discussions here are mostly from the upper 10% income bracket, mostly white, and they share certain ideas about organization, social status and leadership. It is the WASP ethic and mentality - the mind of the colonialist, imperialist and exploiter - the boss, the owner, the landlord, and the manager. We look to people with those traits as leaders, and to those activities - colonialism and imperialism and exploitation - as models to emulate in everything we do. We need to de-colonize our minds.

In every social interaction everyday with everyone you encounter a certain calculation goes on. People's relative clout is assessed by our perception of their access to resources, their financial status, as that tells us who will dominate whom. Dominating others is what it is all about - not greed. It is social. All of us "know" this on some level - we say it is a "dog-eat-dog" world, we say that "money makes the world go around," we say that "the rich get richer and the poor get richer." We are able to see all of the evil effects of this, but we are resistant to synthesizing our observations into a coherent and powerful picture and to then acting on that. We can see the "problems" - the destruction of the environment, racism, sexism, homophobia, bigotry, war and torture, homelessness and poverty, and we seek to attack those problems in isolation from each other rather than look at the root cause.

We absolutely must look at our own successful people and our notions about success - the winners in this horror show, and who gets there and how - we must look at WASP male hetero privilege and status, which means the methods and approaches modeled after the behavior of that dominant group, we must look at the history of capitalism and imperialism, we must look at our own roles in promoting and sustaining the social standards and conventions since we have internalized the mentality of the dominant ones, the exploiters, if we are to be serious about stopping the juggernaut that is chewing the earth and its peoples to shreds.

That discussion is not happening, and all of the discussions that are happening are for the purpose of preventing any such discussion. That means that we are engaged here in the work of propping up the oppressors, apologizing for the overlords and the social systems that ensure their power, strengthening the dominant group and promoting their way of thinking and acting.

[RandomThoughts]

12. You can be thought to be an asshole without being an asshole.

Just like many assholes that many people think are mostly good, are actually assholes, especially in the view of another asshole.

Much of the view of assholeness is not about action or thought, but for many people it is just seeing if they agree with the same stuff.

I think it is a pretty strong word, and like to think of some people I disagree with as just having a different opinion, then I can listen to it and try to learn from it.

On a side note, if anyone thinks I am an asshole at times, and I hope people don't, but really don't know, since I see things pretty different at times.

all I can say is.

:loveya: :grouphug:

what else is there to do, best to not get upset.

[flamingdem]

35. There are assholes and there are creeps nt

[Stevenmarc]

13. I'll be able to afford people to be an asshole for me.

[EFerrari]

15. LOL

:rofl:

[RandomThoughts]

16. I personally do not consider that an workable equation.

If you knowingly let or have people be an asshole for you, then you would be the same way, just in secret.

You actually make the point about secrecy in that comment, by a person using someone else, then hiding that action that they agree or even facilitate, then they are double at fault, once for being that way, and once for hiding it.

[EFerrari]

19. If you were rich, you could pay someone to know for you, too.

[RandomThoughts]

20. Willful ignorance is not an excuse either. n/t

[Stevenmarc]

29. LOL, You might want to share your concerns with my hired sphincter

[flamingdem]

34. lol! nt

[EFerrari]

17. In honor of, the I-95 Song.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3i6OrOZwtmA&feature=related

[VOX]

18. No way. If I hit the jackpot, I'd create a foundation for **LIBERAL** causes, PACS and candidates...

You know how the RW howls constantly about George Soros -- well, George would be my role model! :bounce:

[renko]

33. Yep, but I'd aim for the Liberal Roger Ailes or Mellon-Scaiffe. n/t

[Codeine]

21. I'm already an asshole.

I'd just be an asshole who bought union-made American cars more often, left even larger tips, was able to afford Fender American instead of Fender Mexican, and who was able to spend more time with friends.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

22. Wealth does not always mean assholery.

I have known some extremely kind, generous (and liberal) rich people, as well as some selfish, assholish rich people. I think it has more to do with the way you were brought up and what your personal values are than how much money you have. Many very wealthy people believe they have an obligation to use their wealth for the benefit of others -- noblesse oblige, if you like -- and it's a family or social tradition in those circles to donate generously to charity. Obviously, though, many others are selfish, greedy bastards -- but they would probably be that way even if they weren't rich.

I'd like to think that if I became very rich I would not become at least any more of an asshole than I already am.

[Canuckistanian]

23. They say that wealth doesn't change a person.

It unmasks them.

I've seen it happen to a few acquaintances, family members and business friends.

Their moral values change radically AFTER they've made it financially.

[Stinky The Clown]

30. I'm an unwealthy asshole now. Why stop a good thing because the "un" changes?

[Rincewind]

31. I would

like the opportunity to find out how I would react if I became really wealthy.

[seabeyond]

32. i know a number of moderately rich. they are good people.

uber rich? i have met a few. they have been pretty full of themselves and has been expected to be treated in an uber rich manner. not too impressed.

[flamingdem]

36. If I was uberrich I think I'd just stay home enjoying pleasures and fomenting

revolution from the jacuzzi. I would not risk going out because what if I got in a car accident or was shot by a peasant. No way.

I'd probably get really fat with this scenario however.

[Lorien]

37. I made a nice six figure income in the past

which isn't "uber wealthy", but it was far more than I needed. I gave away a lot of money back then to various charities-both local and international, bought my friends computers or car repairs when things broke down, bought another friend a whole work wardrobe when she started a new job, and another one plane tickets to visit family over the holidays. I ended up giving far more away than I invested. Then I started having health problems. My insurance wouldn't pay for needed surgeries, what investments I had tanked, my employers stopped using contractors and now my fortunes have dwindled to nil. About a half dozen or so of the friends I once helped stuck with me. Others left once I had nothing more to give. I've seen money change people for the worst firsthand, but I'm glad to say that I think I became more generous as my wealth grew. If you can't do something GOOD with the excess then what's the point in having it?

[Taitertots]

38. You have to be an asshole to get uber wealthy n/t

[SDuderstadt]

39. Man, I'd love to be uberwealthy...

and, although I know it sounds like a cliche, I would immediately find a financial advisor and instruct them to invest it in such a way that it generates the greatest possible return ethically and morally, for the express purpose of helping the most people possible, while living confortably but not lavishly.

Imagine the good you could do and the lives you could change for the better with the ability to help financially. I've always been a fan of the underdog and no amount of money in the world will EVER change that. Never.

[MkapX]

40. Not all of them

Not all millionaries are snobs...in fact Bill Gates has actually been pretty progressive in some of his views. His father even wrote a book called "Why America Should Tax Accumulated Fortunes". Likewise Jamie Johnson son of Johnson and Johnson chairman made a documentry called "The one Percent" about american greed