Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Articles from 1997 and 2000 on how DLC and Democrats co-opted GOP policies, got corporate donations.

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 10:48 AM
Original message
Articles from 1997 and 2000 on how DLC and Democrats co-opted GOP policies, got corporate donations.
Edited on Fri May-14-10 10:51 AM by madfloridian
What's more they no longer had to depend on the traditional constituents in the party such as unions and minorities. They did not have to stand for issues that those constituencies demanded. It was convenient.

In 1997 there was an article in Mother Jones magazine called Democrats at the Crossroads

It's a fascinating article. I think that the stances of today's party leaders on women's rights, gay rights, education, and the privatization of Social Security and Medicare indicate that the DLC has won this round.

As Clinton's second term begins, both New Democrats and populists are maneuvering furiously to influence the White House and shape future party strategies. The DLC is using its close personal ties to Clinton, Gore, Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin, and other White House staffers to push proposals for "reinventing government," such as privatizing Social Security and Medicare, and reforming education.

New Democrats are delighted by the commanding Clinton-Gore victory in November -- but at the same time they can hardly hide their glee that the AFL-CIO's campaign fell short of putting the Democrats back in charge of the House of Representatives. They fear and dislike "big labor," of course. But another factor may also be at work. The DLC has always cared most about presidential politics, while its congressional ties have been primarily to Southern Democrats -- and these are a fast-disappearing breed. Many Southern DLC politicians are now former members of Congress, defeated or replaced by Republicans. Not incidentally, perhaps, DLC leaders are suddenly talking about "bipartisan" solutions, above and beyond mere "party politics."


We heard the word "bipartisan" the moment the elections were over in 2006 and 2008. It was not a coincidence.

Privatization to the forefront even in 1997:

DLC President Al From is urging Clinton to undertake a "fundamental restructuring of our biggest systems for delivering public benefits -- Medicare, Social Security, and public education, for openers." Similarly, Will Marshall of the Progressive Policy Institute (PPI), the DLC's think tank, argues for moving Medicare and Medicaid "into the new marketplace."


Sound familiar? Under Arne Duncan the schools are being subjected to hostile takeovers by private management companies.

Further Obama packed the new debt commission with those who are eager to turn Social Security over to Wall Street.

After the defeat of the Conrad-Gregg commission, groups defending Social Security had little time to rejoice before Obama resuscitated the plan, creating the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform by executive order. While the Commission's proposals will not be limited to an up or down vote in Congress, it's otherwise exactly as Conrad-Gregg envisioned, and Pelosi and Reid have promised to put them to a vote before the end of the current session of Congress.

Obama's deficit commission is actually much older than Conrad-Gregg. Its history as a vehicle for reforming Social Security goes back to 1981, when it was given life under President Ronald Reagan as the Greenspan Commission (guess who chaired it).


A statement from the DLC's Al From makes clear how proud they were of taking the GOP positions.

The predominant analysis in the media echoes the New Democrat view that Clinton won by pre-empting the right on such issues as crime, welfare reform, and a balanced budget. "Every time Dole tried to get cracking on an issue," Al From pointed out at a post-election DLC press conference, "he couldn't do it because the president had, in a sense, beat him there."

Beating the Republican in being Republican.


And the present movement to "reform" education started years ago. The charter school movement today was pushed by the DLC years ago. Al From even wrote about it in 2000.

The Democratic Leadership Council (DLC) is now calling for reforms including school choice and merit pay for teachers.....America is a tale of two public school systems: one that works reasonably well, although it could certainly be better, and one that is by almost any standard a disaster," says From.

.."From argues that the public school system too often serves the interests of teachers and administrators at the expense of the students themselves. It is a "monopolistic" system that "offers a 'one-size-fits-hardly-anyone' model that strangles excellence and innovation" he says.

Characterizing charter schools as "oases of innovation," From writes, "The time has come to bring life to the rest of the desert-by introducing the same forces of choice and competition to every public school in America."


With the appointment of Arne Duncan as Secretary of Education, the DLC think tank won their fight against public education.

In the year 2000 John Nichols wrote an article for the Progressive.

Behind the DLC Takeover - Democratic Leadership Council

At the national convention of a major political party, an ideologically rigid sectarian clique secures the ultimate triumph. It inserts two of its own as nominees for the Presidency and the Vice Presidency. Heavily financed by the most powerful corporations in the world, the group's leaders gather in a private club fifty-four floors above the convention hall, apart from the delegates of the party they had infiltrated. There, they carefully monitor the convention's acceptance of a platform the organization had drafted almost in its entirety. Then, with the ticket secured and with the policy course of the party set, they introduce a team of 100 shock troops to deploy across the country to lock up the party's grassroots.


We knew something was going on back in 2000. We just did not know what. The very lack of the kind of fight our party should have put up for Al Gore told us something, but we did not then understand.

Paul Wellstone was quoted in the Nichol's article when he said:

"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans," he said. "I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."


Someone else reiterated his statement in 2004 and openly was critical of this group. His name was Howard Dean. The DLC made a public statement that he was not the man to be president. They held a press conference to announce it.

"We are increasingly confident that President Bush can be beaten next year, but Dean is not the man to do it," Reed and From wrote.

The 'D' in DLC Doesn't Stand for Dean (David Von Drehle, May 15, 2003, Washington Post)

More than 50 centrist Democrats, including Virginia Gov. Mark R. Warner, met here yesterday to plot strategy for the "New Democrat" movement. To help get the ball rolling they read a memo by Al From and Bruce Reed, the chairman and president of the Democratic Leadership Council. The memo dismissed Dean as an elitist liberal from the "McGovern-Mondale wing" of the party -- "the wing that lost 49 states in two elections, and transformed Democrats from a strong national party into a much weaker regional one."

"It is a shame that the DLC is trying to divide the party along these lines," said Dean spokesman Joe Trippi. "Governor Dean's record as a centrist on health care and balancing the budget speaks for itself."

As founder of the DLC, From has been pushing the Democratic Party to the right for nearly 20 years. He was in tall cotton, philosophically speaking, when an early leader of the DLC, Bill Clinton, was elected president in 1992. As Clinton's domestic policy guru, Reed pushed New Democrat ideas -- such as welfare reform -- that were often unpopular with party liberals.

"We are increasingly confident that President Bush can be beaten next year, but Dean is not the man to do it," Reed and From wrote. "Most Democrats aren't elitists who think they know better than everyone else."


Their agenda is being continued. I fear that it won't be long until education, Social Security, and Medicare are turned over to the same corporations who harmed this country financially under the Bush administration.

When party leaders take on the agenda of the other party on purpose, and the people of the party allow it to happen...there is no good to come from that.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 10:56 AM
Response to Original message
1. Mentioning gay rights, then quoting Paul Wellstone, who voted for DOMA. Obama is not the DLC
Edited on Fri May-14-10 11:01 AM by ProSense
Unlike the Clinton Administration and the DLC, who were pro-deregulation, President Obama is pro-regulation.


On edit: the claims that the President will overturn Social Security and Medicare are completely bogus.

The health care reform law strengthened Medicare


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Never mind.
I don't know what to say about such nitpicking.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. "until education, Social Security, and Medicare are turned over to the same corporations "
The claim that the President is planning to turn Medicare and Social Security over to corporations is completely baseless.

The health care reform law strengthened Medicare


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
joeybee12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #3
10. BS...that is all...n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #10
16. Yes, the claim that the administration will privatize Social Security is BS. Period. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #16
27. Bookmarking. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 04:29 AM
Response to Reply #16
36. but not the claim that it will cut benefits, eh?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 04:29 AM
Response to Reply #3
35. Your post is completely fact-less.
You might think that President Obama and his team would be taking a decisive stance in favor of maintaining a wildly popular, progressive program that was one of his Democratic predecessors’ greatest policy achievement. You might think that a Democratic administration – one that, with the Affordable Care Act, just passed one of the most sweeping social reforms in decades – would be fighting tooth and nail to preserve Social Security against ideologues like Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI), who has proposed a budget that would privatize Social Security and make massive cuts to Medicare. But you’d be wrong.

As the news site AlterNet reports, President Obama has stacked his new 18-member committee charged with dealing with the deficit, the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform, with a number of figures who have staked their careers on undermining Social Security. And what’s more, the ways in which it favors proponents of cuts to the program go well beyond the people serving on it. While 10 of the Commission members will be Democrats, 14 votes total will be needed to support any recommendations, meaning that both parties will have guaranteed veto power. Moreover, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) and House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) have already pledged to vote on the panel’s recommendations – but not until after the midterm elections, when lawmakers will be under considerably less pressure to vote against entitlement cuts.

Who’s in this rogue’s gallery?
• Co-chair Erskine Bowles, the White House’s Chief of Staff under President Clinton; during that period, he was described as "Corporate America’s Friend in the White House.”
• Co-chair Alan Simpson, former Republican Senator, who has a history of attempting to justify backdoor cuts to Social Security by making dubious claims that the annual cost of living adjustment (COLA) is exaggerated
• Alice Rivlin, former Vice Chair of the Federal Reserve. In 2004, Rivlin coauthored a Brookings Institution study advocating, among other proposals, an "increase in the retirement age under Social Security" and "more accurate inflation adjustments to Social Security benefits." Rivlin is also a former board member of the Public Agenda Foundation, an organization largely devoted to destroying Social Security under the guise of “entitlement reform,” and which has called on lower-income Americans to “sacrifice.”

Two more of Obama’s six appointees, David Cote (Obama’s other Republican pick) and Ann Fudge, also have extensive Wall Street and corporate ties that make it highly unlikely that they’ll vote to preserve social programs. Cote is even a member of the Business Roundtable, an anti-Social Security organization. Only one of Obama’s six appointees, SEIU head Andy Stern, is opposed to benefit cuts. It’s a safe bet that the remaining twelve members of the commission will follow a similar ideological pattern, and considering the supermajority requirement and the existing bipartisan support for cutting Social Security, it’s not likely that Stern will win the argument.


http://www.ourfuture.org/blog-entry/2010041302/obamas-deficit-commission-no-friend-social-security
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 06:55 AM
Response to Reply #35
39. Anyone who doesn't see the writing on the wall, needs glasses.
And, they'd better take the rose-tinted ones off.

Just a couple of days ago, Obama was pressuring the President of Spain to institute "austerity measures", including pay and pension cuts.

He now has his commission in place. We know the players, and we know what their policy recommendations will be. Cut and privatize Social Security. Cuts to Medicare and Medicaid. They've all got a paper trail, ten miles long. And it will all be decided by a lame duck Congress after the election. We can thank Republican obstructionism for one thing. Even though they've supported this shit for years, their knee-jerk reaction was to kill the fast-tracking of this commissions recommendations.

Can we please elect some REAL Democrats?


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #1
9. Then let him begin with education...right now, right this minute.
He is allowing his Sec. of Ed to treat teachers badly and cause a lot of anger and bitterness among them.

Let him start with education right now before it is too late.

Otherwise words mean absolutely nothing.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #1
19. Why let facts get in the way of a fun Obama-bashing story?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 04:23 AM
Response to Reply #1
34. Your post is completely bogus.
Obama has the same Clinton retreads among his advisors.

Obama's Deficit Commission is stocked with anti-SS people, notably its chair. The Commission is participating in Pete Peterson's anti-SS propaganda show in June.

"Everything is on the table".

Need a clue?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #1
47. HCR cut Medicare
Only in an Orwellian world would Obama's HCR be considered health care reform, more like a transfer of wealth from the working class to the same insurance and drug companies that screw them.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Individualist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
4. This is a must read! K&R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:37 AM
Response to Original message
5. It's like a little contest, isn't it.
This had 6 recs just about a minute ago, but before it got greatest went down to 4.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
6. Splintered the party in 2000 because of this behavior
Edited on Fri May-14-10 11:45 AM by depakid
Heck of job on their part.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Their attacks on public education have angered me so much.
As I find out more about how it was planned for years, it really makes me more upset.

I find myself not feeling very trusting right now as I see my party fulfilling Bush's education agenda. It makes me even more concerned about Social Security and Medicare which they also want to make part of the "marketplace."

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. I hear you-
Edited on Fri May-14-10 12:18 PM by depakid
I know a more than a few people who still don't trust so called "new Democrats," based on what happened with the Northwest forest plan- and that little double cross was back in the mid 1990's.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nightrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #7
75. glad to hear about the mistrust. Many of us warned last year in the
health "care" debates here on DU about corporatization, and we were ridiculed, called nasty names, and flamed mercilessly.

We were correct about our critiques.

Wouldn't it be nice to hear some apologies for that behavior?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dotymed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #7
76. It has been shown, beyond doubt
that we no longer have a two party system. the only rational alternative is to create a party that IS for the masses. In the meantime, the masses need to organize or be ready for their own austerity program.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sebastian Doyle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
8. The DLC is a Republican infiltration of the Democratic party
Edited on Fri May-14-10 12:08 PM by Sebastian Doyle
its entire purpose from day one has been to dismantle the Democratic party from within, and render it useless.

And its time for some to stop pretending they ever were anything other than that.


It is a cancer that is killing this party. For a while, it seemed like the party was in remission, thanks to the good doctor from Vermont. But it's back, and it's metastasized. Big time. :evilfrown:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Echo In Light Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. "America has one political party with two right wings." Gore Vidal
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. How true.
:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
conscious evolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #8
25. The fascist assholes do it all the time
infiltrate and subvert from within.They keep doing it because it keeps working.This includes DU,imo.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #25
64. +1000000000000
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 06:57 AM
Response to Reply #8
40. They took it over.
And they left the rotting hull of their party to the tea-baggers.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 01:06 PM
Response to Original message
14. How dumb (to the point of suicide) is an organization that, not only allows a fifth column
to openly operate within that organization, but regularly implements to their traitorous plans?
::kick: & R

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 01:08 PM
Response to Original message
15. Thank You, Mad.
Bookmarked for future reference.



The DLC New Team
Pro-LABOR Democrats Need NOT Apply

(Screen Capped from the DLC Website)


”I am a New Democrat!”---Barack Obama
http://www.dlc.org/ndol_ci.cfm?contentid=254931&kaid=85&subid=900184


(I loved seeing this in the OP.)
"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 06:59 AM
Response to Reply #15
41. That team picture needs to be hanging in the Post Office.
We need more Wellstones.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
17. Could be that this is just another aspect of the dog & pony show

Just as there is no big difference between the D's&R's on big issues like the economy and imperialism there is little that really separates the so-called progressives and the DLC/Blue dogs, it's all drama for the edification of the public.

Judge by what is done, not by what is said.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. I think the bipartisanship is done.
I hate that I don't trust anyone in politics anymore.

The ruthless way teachers are being treated has numbed my brain, and I can't get past it to be rational about other things.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. Teachers, the uninsured, sea turtles....

We are all under the bus.

To be honest, it's always been like this, they just maintained the illusion. But the curtain is rent and the man behind it (Capital)is exposed. The privatizing of education, our horrid health care system, the financial debacles in Europe, this oil spill, all can be laid at the feet of Capital's insatiable demand for more profit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. In 2000 I told a Republican uncle we would regret that court decision...
that put Bush in power.

We have.

We have not learned though, and now we tend to try to put into place many of the same policies with minor differences over all.

Yes, we are better than the Republicans, but we still fear them and cave to their demands.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 04:18 PM
Response to Original message
20. k & r
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
amborin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 06:41 PM
Response to Original message
23. knr
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
24. From June of last year...Rahm speaks of the "education revolution"
http://www.schoolsmatter.info/2009/06/more-new-democrats-and-dfer.html

"According to Rahm Emanuel, Democratic policymakers are working on a "quiet revolution" in education reform. If yesterday's DLC gathering and two briefs from DFER are indicators of what's to come, we're in for some big changes. Here is a summary of the hour-plus DLC discussion on education reform and the DFER policy briefs.
DLC Policy Forum on Health and Education Reform:

The DLC gathering began with speeches by Emanuel and DLC President Bruce Reed (education viewpoints explored here). Emanuel, when not pressuring freshmen Democrats from voting against another $100+ billion for the War on Terror, is pushing support for Duncan's brand of education reform. This includes common standards, removing the caps from charter schools, pay for performance, and the incentives built into the "Race to the Top" fund. "We know what's necessary as it relates to quality teachers," says Emanuel. "We know what's necessary as it relates to competition in the public school system, i.e. charters," he continues. "And we know what's necessary to adopt the common standards so you're raising the capacity of our children, our schools, and our teachers." Reed suggested education reform was the "sleeper issue" of the Obama administration, which is dealing with healthcare reform and the ongoing economic crisis. But the Democrats are "just getting warmed up" in education reform and in the next few weeks, President Obama will be making announcements about expanding both community college and early childhood education."

Interesting read. Follow the internal links to very much info on the new "education" revolution.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 10:50 PM
Response to Original message
26. Umm... so like, is this supposed to be a bad thing?
You talk like it is. I thought the object of our game was to elect Democrats. Why do you have a problem with that?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sebastian Doyle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Because they're not Democrats.
Edited on Fri May-14-10 11:06 PM by Sebastian Doyle
If it looks like a pig, talks like a pig, takes money from pigs, and votes like a pig, it ain't a donkey. :kick:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:37 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. I don't know what you call a Democrat
but these people are Democrats, like it or not.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. They hold Republican beliefs.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #32
59. Hey! Put me back on ignore!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #59
63. Finally some good sound advice from you
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #59
68. Okay...gladly.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
olegramps Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #59
70. Why? You are go for a laugh or two.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 04:35 AM
Response to Reply #31
38. yeah, only the policies they enact are republican. rightist republicans at that.
because they're enacting the programs of the anti-new dealers of the 1940s.

who were hard-right wingers.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 04:33 AM
Response to Reply #26
37. right-wing republicans with donkey pins aren't democrats.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #26
43. I don't think if we had only took money from Ben & Jerry's we could have won any elections either
The ones who think we can are Fruit Loops.

Don
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #43
44. Why bother voting when you're just going to get another corporate shill?
These people no longer represent my interests, or my well-being. They also no longer get my support.

I'm not going to buy a ticket to my own execution.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 08:55 AM
Response to Reply #44
45. Why bother voting if your candidates don't have the financing to ever win?
What good is some candidate who perfectly represents your interests if they can't win an election?

Don
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 10:05 AM
Response to Reply #45
61. They might be able to, if the party would fund some progressives.
And maybe offer some support. Instead, the actively circumvent them. Tell donors not to donate to them, and support conservatives. They stick their noses in primaries that they have no business being involved in.

It became an art form under Harold Ford, Rahm Emmanuel, and Chuck Schumer.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #43
54. You got it, Don...the purists at DU continue to amaze me
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Selatius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #26
49. It is a bad thing if you are of the working class and not the wealthy elite who run empires.
How do you like it if I privatized your Social Security and gave control over it to Goldman Sacks or Bank of America or Citigroup?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #49
55. That has nothing to do with anything, especially during the current 4 years
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Selatius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #55
57. The entire thread is over a longer timespan. You talk 4 years. madfloridian talked much longer.
Edited on Sat May-15-10 10:03 AM by Selatius
You talk about electing Democrats. I'm talking about working class interests being represented. What good are these Democrats if they simply pass right wing legislation against the interests of a majority of voters? If you wanted to run Democrats in Rush Limbaugh country, you're better off running populists who are socially conservative and pro-working class. Huey Long was and still is revered as a hero next door in Louisiana by quite a few people, and he had to put up with right wing demagogues like Father Coughlin on the radio.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
olegramps Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #26
50. Because they don't represent the working class. Got it???
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #50
56. No Grandpa, you need to get it.
The object of our game is to elect Democrats. That's especially hard to do in districts where the population leans or is conservative. Tom Delay's old district is a good example. To do it your way would be to endlessly beat our heads against the wall by running and pumping money into a Kucinich-like candidate in this district. No, that's ridiculously stupid. So if we have to run someone that is a bit to the right of Kucinich, then that's what we have to do.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #56
60. "a bit to the right of Kucinich"
yeah everyone is so upset about candidates "a bit right of Kucinich" Yes that's it. unreasonable to expect any liberal policies anymore from any democrat. :eyes: hyperbole much?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #60
66. Your solution to electing Democrats in conservative districts is....??
You didn't say state anything that is a better idea in your response to me (of course, excluding fighting in the streets, etc. (which I don't have a problem with if it comes to that and I'm ready now)). What would you do? No one has any suggestions.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #66
67. Getting the money out of elections is the only solution.
The dynamic is that the party machine places bought and sold corporate democrats in those races before any local candidate could possibly get through the hurdles and barriers to get on the ballot.

Our system is *entirely* bought and sold by corporate interests with a few exceptions.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #67
72. 100% agreed
but for now we have this system and we have to do what we have to do. I grew up in politics with the notion that if you can get a vote from someone for you 50% of the time, that's better than voting against you 100% of the time. OF course now, the SCOTUS says the money is OK. We have a very, very long way to go.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
olegramps Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #56
71. You don't get crap.
That is exactly what is wrong with today's Democratic Party. It is being run by the DLC, which is also know as Republican Lite, and they have failed to confront the Corporations on their anti-worker out-sourcing of jobs. The country isn't conservative the majority have swilled down the Republican propaganda and allowed themselves to be sold down the river. When American workers enjoyed their relatively highest standard of living was when 36% of the workers were unionized. Now the account for only 6% because they elected Democrats that were accountable to the corporate bastards that bought them body and soul.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 06:41 AM
Response to Reply #71
74. Union members voted for Reagan and Bush in the 80's
if you're union, you should know that. Membership wasn't 36% but it was a lot more than 6%. The actual number escapes me this early. When union members quit voting their guns and abortion and other wedge issues, we'll start electing more Democrats. If you're union you should know these things.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kenny blankenship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:07 PM
Response to Original message
29. Hey, if we just do what Republicans do, we'll get corporate money like Republicans get
And rich people will like us. They'll really, really like us!

Jeeze. Why didn't I think of that?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
donheld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-14-10 11:28 PM
Response to Original message
30. Sadly, I have to agree.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Senator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 04:17 AM
Response to Original message
33. K&+R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 07:46 AM
Response to Original message
42. I'd say that this is very scary
except that we've gotten used to it.

How do we reverse this?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #42
53. Most say we need to accept it in order to win or stay in office.
I don't accept that at all.

I find it scary as well.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #53
62. I don't accept it either
Saying that they need to accept it in order to stay in office is a little like 1930s era Germans saying that they needed to persecute Jews in order to .... go with the flow. To the extent that Democrats have to act like Republicans in order to stay in office, there's not much point in electing them.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 08:56 AM
Response to Original message
46. Excellent thread, madfloridian
Fascinating how the DLC felt more at home with the old segregationist wing of the Democratic Party, the one that switched to the GOP.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
48. 2 heads of the same snake.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #48
51. Yes.
It seems that way.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
olegramps Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:31 AM
Response to Original message
52. A major step in correcting the nation's problems is repeal of Tax breaks for the rich.
We have control of the both the Senate and House and the WHITE HOUSE yet they have failed to rescind the immoral tax breaks that the rich have been given. Increase the tax rates up to 70% on income and inheritances over 10 million. Get back what these bastards stole from the working class.

Will this administration along with the corporate bootlickers in Congress do what is necessary to right the ship? HELL NO! Get the hell out of Iraq and Afghanistan. Close our foreign military bases and tell the Japanese to provide for their own security along with the South Koreans who have flooded our markets with products while making it virtually impossible to market our products in the countries.

I was involved in efforts to market products in Japan and they had so damn many hoops to jump through that it took years to obtain all the licenses and permits. By that time they back-engineered the products and making the whole effort fruitless. Tariff products that have been out-sourced by the greedy corporate bastards would be a major step in protecting the workers, but don't hold your breath. We have been sold out by our own representative who have been bought and paid for by the corporations.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 09:55 AM
Response to Original message
58. the language about regulatory agencies going around is "captured by industry"
The same exact dynamic at play here within the Democratic Party.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 11:11 AM
Response to Original message
65. Kick !!!
:evilfrown:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
69. The WSJ op ed by Harold Ford and Eli Broad last year
http://susanohanian.org/outrage_fetch.php?id=614

"Ohanian Comment: AGHHHH!

Here we have it: The Democratic Leadership Council, corporate power, and the Broad Foundation joining hands to destroy public education. Bill Gates must have taken the day off.

Don't dismiss this as right-wing propaganda typical of the Wall Street Journal editorial page. This trio is likely to be spewing their filth in the New York Times and the Washington Post any day soon.

If you doubt that the Democratic Leadership Council had already destroyed every shred of integrity that once rested in the Democratic Party, then be sure to note what Harold Ford, Jr. is doing these days. And remember, no group was a stronger supporter of NCLB than the Democratic Leadership Council. Take a look at this page. Click on a few of the articles--if you have the stomach for it.

And with Lou Gerstner joining the discussion, we come full circle from when he and Bill Clinton stumped for America 2000 for Pres. Bush the Elder. It contained many of the same elements as RTTT but lacked teeth. Pres. Clinton didn't get the national test he wanted but Obama is well on the way to achieving that goal. Without a whimper from our professional organizations. Members of the Executive Council of NCTE say they cooperated on the LEARN (sic) Act so as to keep a "seat at the table."

Now where have we heard this concern for sitting at a table laden with poison food before?

In the ugly piece below, this trio turn the three wise monkeys upside down, shouting pernicious and phony declarations about the beauty of competition. Look at the concern they express about the embarrassing achievement gaps between middle-class children and poor and minority children--at the same time failing to mention the devastating gap in money and the security of food, shelter, and family well-being that money brings, between middle-class children and poor and minority children."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Little Star Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
73. Thank you for this thread. To late to rec but here is a big kick!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 11:53 PM
Response to Reply #73
78. Thanks for that.
:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
teacher gal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 04:01 PM
Response to Original message
77. KIck and wish I could recommend n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed Apr 24th 2024, 09:29 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC