Obama Has Learned Nothing From the BP Blowout

[Donnachaidh]

http://www.truthout.org/dave-lindorff-obama-has-learned-nothing-bp-blowout59577

President Obama claims to have learned a lesson from the disastrous blowout of British Petroleum drilling rig in the Gulf of Mexico: a “cozy relationship” between the agency that regulates oil drilling, the Minerals Management Service, and the oil industry, he charges, allowed companies to drill in vulnerable offshore areas without properly assessing the risks to the ocean and its ecology.

He’s only just figuring this out?

Hell, we already had an example of the problem of “cozy relations” between regulators and industry. The bank crisis that produced the current recession was the financial equivalent of a much bigger oil-well blowout than the Deepwater Horizon rig. It was a catastrophic blowout of the entire global financial system--and it was precipitated by an identical “cozy relationship” between US bank regulators and the banking industry that they were supposed to be regulating. That financial blowout has left almost one in five US workers without jobs now for two years, with no end in sight. And like the giant hidden plumes of oil spreading out in deep layers of the Gulf and heading for the Gulf Stream, it also spread to Europe and beyond, hobbling economies around the world.

But that’s only the beginning. If a “cozy relationship” between regulators and the industries they are supposed to be regulating is a bad thing when it comes to the oil industry, is this because the oil industry is particularly evil and corrupt or is it the principle of the thing? Of course not. As corrupt as the oil industry is, no one could say that industry is unique in its efforts to skirt rules, buy legislators, manipulate prices or poison the public.

So why is the president only talking about this one “cozy relationship”?

What about the drug industry and the Food and Drug Administration?

What about the airline industry and the Federal Aviation Administration?

What about the media and telecom industries and the Federal Communications Commission?

What about agribusiness and the Agriculture Department?

What about the National Transportation Safety Administration and Environmental Protection Industry and the auto industry?

What about the chemical industry (and the oil companies!) and the EPA?

What about the medical-industrial complex and the Department of Health and Human Services or the FDA or the Medicare administration?

What about the nuclear industry and the Nuclear Regulatory Commission?

What about military contractors and the Department of Defense? (sic)

The list of federal regulators that have “cozy relationships” with the industries they are supposed to be riding herd on goes on and on.


More at the link ---

[amborin]

1. k&R So, Obama selected Salazar for Int Dept not knowing S's cozy rel'p w/ Big Oil?

give me a break

:eyes:




eta: rec'd to zero; par for the course

[bvar22]

33. And Vilsack...cozy with Monsanto.

The DLC New Team

(Screen Capped from the DLC Website)


”I am a New Democrat!”---Barack Obama
http://www.dlc.org/ndol_ci.cfm?contentid=254931&kaid=85&subid=900184

Brand Obama, "Hope & Change", was a successful Corporate Marketing Scam....nothing more.

"By their works, you will know them."

[amborin]

44. a scam from the get-go, starting w/ early grooming, imho

[kimmerspixelated]

2. Perhaps if we sign every petition we can, he will listen.

How many have signed the one that is to the left in the ads? I just did!

[readmoreoften]

15. Why would he? He knows that everyone will fall in line and vote for him as the "lesser evil."

All he really needs to do is stay in bed with those funding his presidency and pay a little lip service to the public.

[amborin]

21. where the tea party types come in so handy.. so many fall for the distraction & false dichotomy

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MindandSoul]

4. Just a question. .. Why are there so much Anti-Obama propaganda in this forum???

It is sounding more and more like Fox News blog!

[Donnachaidh]

7. propaganda? Did you READ the article?

Yeah, it is becoming like Fox -- Too many posters who don't bother to READ... :eyes:

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MindandSoul]

12. This is "Democraticunderground. . . ," Right???

Why is it that anyone who disagree with your attacks on Obama is automatically ridiculed and belittled???

It doesn't really work too well with me. . .but I'm sure you are succeeding in pushing quite a few Democratic supporters of President Obama away from this forum. . .Is that your intention???

[Webster Green]

16. What attacks?

No criticism of the president is allowed? :wtf:

[Missy Vixen]

19. No, it's not. Didn't you get the memo?

Don't forget to write that check or hit PayPal one more time, too.

Criticism is tantamount to turning in your Democratic Party card as well.

[MindandSoul]

25. It seems that many of you need to have some additional training in

reading comprehension!

I wasn't talking about "attacks against Obama," I do agree that it is necessary for all of us to keep a critical mind, no matter what party or politician we support.
I was talking about the onslaw of demeaning and childish attacks that were addressed against ME, because I do not entirely agree with such a strong attack against Obama in the context of the Oil spill!

By attacking ME (and others like me) for NOT agreeing with you . . .you are acting no better and no smarter than many tea baggers. . .

Once again. . .Obama never pretended to be the Messiah, or to have a magic wound that would cure all the evils of Government within 2 years, not even 4 years. . .

Do you think he would be able to just throw out every regulatory agencies and hire new one. . .within 2 years. . .and address EVERY problems AND resolve them within that time??

So. . .just keep on pointing out ONLY the negative. . .let's see where it will get us in November 2010 AND November 2012!

I'm sure you'll be a lot happier with Palin?. . ..

[Webster Green]

27. Bullshit!

You are the one who started with words like "propaganda" and "attacks". What did you expect to hear in response to that sort of flamebait?

[MindandSoul]

28. As I said. . .I was referring to attack against individula posters. . .in this case

myself!

And it seems to be increasingly more difficult to differentiate between the real democrates and real supporters of Obama and the "plants" that constantly spew "negativity" about the current administration.

If you have the right to express your views. . .why shouldn't I???

By the way, it seems that the same people who seems to be "so disapointed in our President" are also those who use the type of language that is most prevalent on sites such as "infowars!"

Just saying. . .! And it is MY opinion. . .nothing more, nothing less!

[Solomon]

32. Don't worry. You're doing really well with your points.

which I wholeheartedly agree with. It comes through. If you disagree with anybody else's criticsim around here, you will immediately get a personal attack against you. You are forever a fanboy that doesn't have a brain. That's what they think. And what's so ridiculous about the negativity, is that almost all of us want the same things. The only difference is that some people realize that everydamn thing can't all be done at the same time, things have to be set up, positioning has to be done, and others demand it immediately. Everybody is aligned with a particular issue, and each particular issue, is more important than the other. Each one will say there's no excuse for not dealing with the issue I care most about. When you add it all up, to satisfy everyone, they would all need to be taken care of at once. Something that simply can't be done, unless you're talking about the kind of "change" where heads literally, not figuratively, but literally, roll.

There's a big difference between constructive criticism, and negativity.

[MindandSoul]

34. Thank you for understanding and clarifying my words! I must say that sometime languages fails me

(it might have something to do with my not being a native english speaker. . .my original language is French, and I only learned English (in England. . .which also makes a difference!) after the age of 22!

Still, I believe it not only takes an articulate person to discuss these complex issues. . .it also takes SOME good will from the other debating side!. . .which is obviously lacking in this thread!

[Solomon]

37. Wow. I'm impressed. You're doing really well if english

is not your native language. Better than most Americans. LOL

[MindandSoul]

40. Thank you. . .I must admit that I have had quite a few years to "practice" my new language. . .

and that the University of California in Santa Cruz and San Jose State University were a big help! LOL

[Go2Peace]

74. This site is FULL of propaganda, not the kind you mention. That indeed

is part of the problem.

I have been saying this for a while on the forums. It is the the heavy handed talking point groups that have everyone here with their backs up. Because they have been constantly fighting and "calling out" any DEMOCRAT who expressed anything counter to their mission. Having a minority of very prolific posters in GD: P for a year trying to stifle and control everyone has placed everyone on edge.

The fact is the MAJORITY here is quite progressive. But it is easy to miss that when a relatively few spend all day posting and attempting to make it look otherwise.

Watch who posts when? If you watch GD: P, you will see people that are on here almost 24 hours a day, every day, and they are the ones who started this whole fight on DU.

So others felt manipulate and have started to post their own views back and their is an editorial war going on. Surprise!

I have said it many times, if the Admins would change the rec feature and give it less prominence it would stop rewarding that situation and tone things down, at least a bit (if it is not too late).

[MindandSoul]

88. Good information and good suggestion!

Since I am retired, I usually check in a couple of times a day, morning and night. . .
I also spend time on an other (smaller) forum where I am a moderator.

And, everywhere, it is the squeeky wheel that gets the oil!

[Go2Peace]

102. Thanks. I think most of us here are close in many ways

I am sure there would still be arguments and fights, but I do think a good portion of it is unintentionally encouraged by the rec system format. As a techie I hope they will use the power of programming to fix make it serve all members.

There are a number of ways to do this. They could also have "discussion" vs "news" forums. News forums eligible for greatest with a limit on how many OPs or OPs per hour could be submitted.

Or they could change the algorithm a bit so it does not reward coordinated posting and recing. I know they have been experimenting with ideas. I just hope they make a change soon. I know everyone talks about it always being so contentious here, but it has been much worse in the last year and a half (mods are helping or it would be worse). I have seen a lot of people leave and I think a lot of people we really want here are giving up and going elsewhere.

[amborin]

105. +1000

24/7


part of message disipline

[dionysus]

38. great post. now sit back and watch them squeal in indignation.

:rofl:

[Bluebear]

46. 'I'm sure you'll be a lot happier with Palin?' - What a tired old saw.

[QC]

49. They don't have a word for "cliché" in French, or so I have heard. n/t

[Bluebear]

51. Mon dieu!

:rofl:

[MindandSoul]

55. Actually, it should be: Mon Dieu! LOL!

[Bluebear]

56. Merci, merci!

Je comprends plus que je le parle :)

[MindandSoul]

59. C'est deja tres bien! It is not often that I encounter an American

who can not only understand French, but also WRITE French!

Congratulation!

[MindandSoul]

54. That is really funny. . ."cliche" is actually a French word!

You silly goose!!!

[Hannah Bell]

81. I think you missed the joke. you silly goose.

[MindandSoul]

87. Yep! You're right. . .not quick on the uptake today!!! LOL

[bobbolink]

52. "I'm sure you'll be a lot happier with Palin?. . .."

If that is the best you can do, no wonder you are getting "negative" responses.

This is soooo tired. Some originality is required.

[Go2Peace]

71. Actually, he *did* CLAIM he was going to be a major change agent

Yes, he spoke in general "centrist" terms about some policy matters, but so do almost *all* candidates, because they know if they give away their hand on progressive policy plans that it will energise the money'd elite against their campaign and give the media something specific to twist. They *always* do this.

But at the same time he was making far more serious sounding CLAIMS to real fundamental change. That was the message that got him elected. So it is bullshit to act like everyone should have "known" which of the messages were the "real one". The "political" message that all politicians give, or the very fundamentally different CLAIMS that Obama made in his speeches.

Nobody could have possibly expected that he would fill his cabinet to brimming with industry representatives and traditional players, because that was something he never told anyone and his speeches were extremely counter to that. And his CLAIMS were that he would be a champion for changing the status quo. He made those CLAIMS and should expect to be judged by them. Because that is why a lot of people voted for him over others in the contest.

[MindandSoul]

89. You are right. . . . mostly. He also said that change would not be easy

and would not be quick. . .he did say it may take more than a year, maybe even more than 4 years. .

I believe that I am detecting change. . .that I have already seen change. And, yes, he is pragmatic, so he is more toward the center. . .but just as we are complaining that he is not "left" enough, the "right" is accusing him of being the most liberal president every. . .I think we'll only have a real answer in a couple of years, maybe even AFTER he has left office and (unfortunately) someone who is REALLY to the right takes over!

[joe black]

95. Look at his first string.

That should give you a clue that he is no way going towards liberal policies or even what most americans want like single payer health care.

[MindandSoul]

101. Well, I respecfully disagree!

- The changes to the credit cards excess. . .it a move in the right direction
- The health care reform. . .although far from perfect. . .is a step in the right direction and we are already seeing some changes in the way big health care business reacts. . .(i.e., BlueCross/BlueShield gave up the idea of increasing premiums by 39% in California, and other insurances have agreed to stop or tone down the "pre-existing exclusions or rejection" before the law actually oblige them to do so). And it establish a basis for more changes through amendments. . .
- The law about "equal pay for equal work" certainly is a move in the right direction for women.
- The friendlier, less arrogant dealing with international politics. . .without giving up being firm is a great move in the way America is perceived world wide.
- The new "tough love" approach toward Israel. . . giving up "unconditional support," and demanding respect and show of good will from Israel toward Palestinians.
- The change in "job creation." I'm sure you are familiar with the "bikini graph!"

It may not appear like much . . .until you consider where we came from and how long President Obama has been in office!

[uponit7771]

92. ...and he said he'd do it in LESS THAN TWO YEARS?!??!

[joe black]

94. Thank you.

[inna]

80. "I'm sure you'll be a lot happier with Palin?. . .." - Dude, that's just low.

big :thumbsdown:

[uponit7771]

91. +111 The expectations are set high so he can't meet them and then fail

[sabrina 1]

104. Why don't you point out the positive things he's done, instead

of calling DUers 'Fox News' or accusing them of wanting Palin in the WH. Read your own posts and maybe you'll understand why you get the reaction you get.

Obama is a politician, that's all. He's no one's friend or family member. We all had high hopes for his presidency, especially based on the positions he took on:

Mandated Insurance.
Torture
Restoring the Rule of Law
Offshore drilling
Education
DADT


No one here that I know of, thought he was a miracle worker or even very progressive. We simply chose him after hearing what he had to say on the issues.

I could understand if it was a question of time. But it is NOT. HE made the decision to go against everything he said in the campaign about Offshore drilling. Now, we cannot even attack the right on this issue, because they tell us, rightfully 'Well, your guy is the one who lifted the ban'.

Imagine if he had NOT done that, how much more politically beneficial if nothing else, it would have been for him now.

But worse, he was WRONG when he claimed that 'new technology made rigs safer today'. And someone is wrong, it seems to you, it depends on the letter after their name whether or not we should point that out.

Sorry, that's not how things work in a democracy.

[William Z. Foster]

18. false premise there

Dissent and criticism is not hurting the administration.

Lincoln, FDR and LBJ got far, far more criticism than Obama has. People then didn't whine about that and demand that everyone be loyal and say nothing critical. It is not an "attack" on a politician to express criticism or dissent. The president is not a personal friend of anyone's, not a family member, not a show business celebrity.

The opening blows in these exchanges always come from the partisan loyalists, not the critics. You are not being "automatically ridiculed and belittled." People respond after THEY are attacked for daring to express any dissent or criticism.

[MindandSoul]

47. I guess "where you stand on an issue depends on . . .where you stand!"

I am certainly NOT an over-sensitive person. . .I have had plenty of experience receiving LOTS of criticisms as a super moderator in another forum. . .I actually enjoy a good debate and find complete agreement (or one mind set) in a forum to be a sure way to kill any potential exchange and thus any potential learning/sharing that can occur.

But it always amazes me that people resort to childish attacks that often include crude language instead of presenting an intelligent argument!
And the same people who choose to engage in such immature attacks are often the same who take great pleasure in making fun of the teabaggers for their spelling mistakes and their 7th (at most) grade reading and writing skills!. . .Projection, maybe???

To me, these kinds of "shooting from the hip" attacks are more indicative of a mediocre level of critical thinking and ability to articulate ideas than to express a real point of view. . .

And that is fine. . .but it certainly cuts off communication!

[William Z. Foster]

75. that is funny

You just smeared so many good DUers. From an earlier post, you made it clear that the people you are referring to and objecting to are the critics of the party and the adminstration. They are attacking people such as yourself, you say.

Then you say about them, now that you have established just who it is you are referring to:

"...people resort to childish attacks..."

"...people who choose to engage in such immature attacks..."

"...their spelling mistakes and their 7th (at most) grade reading and writing skills!..."

"...crude language instead of presenting an intelligent argument!"

"...these kinds of "shooting from the hip" attacks..."

"...a mediocre level of critical thinking and ability to articulate ideas than to express a real point of view..."

Um....you are doing exactly what you are (falsely) accusing many, many others of doing.

Projection, maybe???

[MindandSoul]

86. You tell me. . . you seem to be a pro at projection!

[Go2Peace]

73. Yes, this is just normal DEMOCRATIC process

and people give this place a lot of power that it does not have. Nothing about this normal dialog and push and pull in a Party is in any way threatening, and in fact is necessary to a healthy democracy.

[nashville_brook]

20. Obama actually needs US, the people, to drive these issues, b/c it gives him political cover

from the oligarchs that he needs to nudge out of the self-regulation business. it's not "anti-obama propaganda" -- it's what a healthy body politic does to support the issues that matter. this isn't a monarchy -- we don't bow down to our elected leaders -- we keep their feet to the fire thru PARTICIPATION.

[joe black]

96. Christ!

He's the POTUS not the gardener.

[Donnachaidh]

22. attacks? I posted an ARTICLE

Do something about that comprehension problem - :eyes:

[MindandSoul]

29. Once again. . .I wasn't referring to "attacks" in that article or towards Obama. . .

I totally accept the fact that we all need to keep a critical mind (although a fair one!),

But I was referring to attacks against individual posters. . .in this case . . .Myself!

[Donnachaidh]

35. again with the comprehension problem

YOU were the one calling the article *propaganda* and calling the posting of an article as an *attack*. Nice touch, trying to play the victim, when in fact the opposite occurred. Does nothing but point out, again, comprehension problems you had to begin with.

[MindandSoul]

39. The attack was not made by the article. . .it was made by several posters

towards ME because I dared to question the wording of . . .not the article. . .but the introduction made by the person who posted the article. . .

However you choose to interpret my words is up to you. . .but your interpretation doesn't make me wrong, and doesn't make you right. . .it just makes us disagree!

And I have no problem with that. . .as long as it is done respectfully!

[William Z. Foster]

76. you attacked

Here, and on other threads.

You aren't being attacked.

[bobbolink]

50. Listen up, MindAndSoul! Teddy Roosevelt has something to say to you.....

"The President is merely the most important among a large number of public servants. He should be supported or opposed exactly to the degree which is warranted by his good conduct or bad conduct, his efficiency or inefficiency in rendering loyal, able, and disinterested service to the Nation as a whole. Therefore it is absolutely necessary that there should be full liberty to tell the truth about his acts, and this means that it is exactly necessary to blame him when he does wrong as to praise him when he does right. Any other attitude in an American citizen is both base and servile. To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public. Nothing but the truth should be spoken about him or any one else. But it is even more important to tell the truth, pleasant or unpleasant, about him than about any one else."

"Roosevelt in the Kansas City Star", 149
May 7, 1918

[MindandSoul]

53. And I completely agree with Roosevelt! I do believe it is important

to keep our critical ability even (and maybe especially) if we support ANYONE, and it is even more important when that person is an elected official.

But there is a HUGE difference with using constructive criticism and explaining one's concerns in a way that really articulates the problem, or to use immature and belittleling comments that do not discreminate between the "real" issues and the "made up" issues.

If I wanted to read constant, mostly unfounded and crude comments about President Obama. . .I would leave this site and faithfully tune in to Limbaugh, Hannity, Coulter, and. . .Palin!

I expect more from Democrats. . .I believe most Democrats are more willing to research what the media spins than most Republicans. . .
Maybe it was just wishfull thinking???!!!!

[bobbolink]

58. I expected more of Democrats, too... like concern for poor folk, instead of the O administration

now apparently cutting off disabiility, just like Raygun did.
All during the campaign, when I said Obama never said ANYTHING about homelessness and poverty, all I got was "He grew up poor, of course he will help poor people." Yeah, Right! And, here we are... not one word from him or his administration, but apparently now cutting disability, so folks like me can die a slow death. Really nice, Dems!

So, now you can attack back, and I really don't give a shit. You are soooooo worried that your poor golden boy will get a harsh word or two, yet where are you when those of us on the bottom are suffering and dying?

[MindandSoul]

62. I do not attack. . .And I am sorry that you are in a difficult position.

You may not believe this, but I do understand your situation much better than you may think.

When I graduated from college,and instead of joining the "rat race" for a big salary, I decided to get a Master in Social Work and became a lowly social worker. I have worked with several populations as a case manager. . .including homeless people, developmentally disabled people, people with AIDS, and people with mental disabilities.

I do know about the difficulties of trying to live on disability benefits and of navigating the system. . .I assisted many of my clients in doing so.

What I can tell you is that NO ONE President can resolve the problem of homelessness and of poverty. At least this one is slowly turning the ship in the right direction. . .and I don't blame you if you are disapointed that Obama hasn't been able to "change the world" in less than 18 months. . .but I suggest that you keep your hope alive. . .it may be the best thing you got going for you. . .to believe that things can get better and to work in that direction.

[bobbolink]

64. I never had any hope from him, but any hope I *ever* had has died.

[MindandSoul]

65. I'm sorry life is so hard for you. . . If you want to talk in private,

I'll be happy to answer you through a private message.

Anyway, I will be sending you positive energy.

[William Z. Foster]

77. so condescending and arrogant

Just because you think that "this one is slowly turning the ship in the right direction" - you say that as though it were a fact, indisputable, the final word - that gives you no just cause for telling another person to "keep your hope alive" in lieu of making the comments they have been making. That is a sneaky way to tell a person what they should do, how they should feel, and what they should and should not say.

"It may be the best thing you got going for you. . .to believe that things can get better and to work in that direction." How dare you couch accepting your political opinion - spoken by you as though it were fact - as "the best thing" someone else has going for them?" Can you truly not see how arrogant and condescending that is?

Think about the message there -

"Don't criticize the president, because he is turning the ship around. You are just in personal despair - which is not good for you. What is good for you is to share MY political opinion. I say all of this as a degreed experienced professional who works with people just like you. I am real special because although with my degrees and smarts I could have gone for the big bucks, I instead decided to help people like you. Please kiss my ass now and STFU. No more criticizing the politicians I like or disagreeing with my opinions."

In another post you claimed that others were attacking you and using crude language, which I do not think is true. The miracle to me is that people are NOT doing that when you post stuff like this.

[MindandSoul]

85. Sounds like you have a very narrow way of interpreting words. . .

Actually, I wasn't referring ONLY, or even MOSTLY to President Obama's record or vision when I was talking to this specific person about "keeping his/her hope alive". . .

I was referring to his/her life (and anyone else, for that matter) in general. . .

When someone looses all hope. . .that's is too often where life ends. . .either for oneself, or for others. . .
If one has "nothing more to lose" one can be driven to doing desperate things and/or to fall into a big black hole of despair and/or to strike out at the world (Where do you think so many suicide attacks come from???. . .What do you think happened to the pilot of that small plane that crashed into the IRS offices? . . .Where do you think murder/suicides come from?)

I am by no means implying that I believe that anyone on this forum is capable to go to those extremes. . .but giving up all hope is a damning step, even if for that one person alone.

So. . .I may sound condescending to you. . .you may interpret my post as uniquely political . . .but that would be wrong!
But. . .it's up to you, I don't mind either way!
I don't know you, I don't know the poster I was directly talking to, except through the few words in his/her post. . .and YOU don't know me!

[dionysus]

99. don't worry, it's not you. it's just the "you're attacking me!!11" card that get played ad nauseum.

[dionysus]

98. yes, obama wants you, personally to die. because he hasn't given you a house.

jesus h christ.

[bobbolink]

61. You want to know what attacks are? Try posting here as a poor and homeless person!

Try going to your state Dem office and talking to them about being homeless.

THEN you will know what its really like to be attacked.

Does THAT matter to you?

[MindandSoul]

63. As I said before. . .I am a social worker. . .does that tell you that I don't know

anything about feeling disempowered, about fighting the system, about poverty, and disabilities, and despair???

I know social workers often have a bad name. . .but one thing is for sure. . .we are right there in the street, and in the shelters, and in the social security offices, and in the hospitals, and in the hospices, and. . .in the gutter with the most disenfranchised among us!

And believe me. . .for 6 years of university studies. . . we do NOT make much money!

[dionysus]

100. attacks? in case you haven't noticed, time and time again, you have lashed out at posters here who

have expressed compassion and empathy towards your situation.

the other day you went after a poster because she had taken food to the homeless people she encounters. you accused her of perpetuating homelessness through her actions.

and you feel as if YOU are being attacked?

you are carrying around an awfully big chip on your shoulder.

[uponit7771]

93. Critism is good being OVERLY Critical is what I'm seeing. Obama never claimed perfection but the...

...expectation on EVERY issue from people not willing to push congress to the left

[flyarm]

78. Have you ever read the Constitution? Do you know that first line..WE THE PEOPLE?

THAT MEANS ME..THAT MEANS YOU.. that means each and everyone of us..WE the People ..comes before We the democrats! Get that straight in your mind, will ya!!

We have a responsibility above and beyond party!

If you care not to take that responibility seriously..that is fine..but do not for one city second, think that others will join you!..that is what republicans do..not liberals and not progressives..and not any real dem I know!

I will hold any of my employees in government responsible for any and all deeds they do in my employ..and pssssss..they are all my employees!

[progressoid]

82. UNDERGROUND.

A lot of us ain't your run of the mill Democrats. We're UNDERGROUND. See?

Also, if the President (or any other Democrat) does stupid stuff, we're going to call them on it. No free pass just because you have a "D" behind your name.

[IndianaGreen]

8. It was Obama who announced more offshore drilling, not Bill O'Reilly

He also said that there is such a thing as Clean Coal (there isn't) and that nuclear energy is safe (TMI anyone?).

[Name removed]

14. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[readmoreoften]

17. By "propaganda" do you mean accurate information that indicts Obama?

Because that's what these posts are.

[ecstatic]

24. The article writer professes to know Obama's thoughts & what he has learned

which immediately let's me know it's more anti-Obama bullshit. If you haters have something to say, try using facts only. Not assumptions about what you think he knows.

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[roguevalley]

66. actually, you apparently never lived through an oil spill. I have.

you need to stop being such a slave to your point of view and listen to others. Obama can and is often wrong. unless you can see that you are just a leftie version of the other guys.

[Number23]

67. Question of the DECADE

Why are there so much Anti-Obama propaganda in this forum???

[Cha]

69. Excellent question! Consider the

source.

[Cha]

68. Because they get off on it..any stupid thing that

comes down the pike and they're on it. Like these hacks know anything about the President but the everything anti-Obama fills their coffers.

[spoony]

70. Really? Fox News condemns government corruption by corporations?

Hmm, something about your criticism rings hollow.

[Ignis]

72. Here's a link that should answer your concern:

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=false+dilemma&l=1

[Romulox]

83. Says the poster who thinks we just need to give the Drug War another chance...

:puke:

[uponit7771]

90. AMEN!!!!! My fuckin goodness, these people don't stop!!!

[sabrina 1]

103. Fox tells the truth about issues now?

Has anyone here said that Obama is not an American Citizen?

Has anyone here said that he hangs around with terrorists?

Or have they done the exact opposite of Fox and criticized a Democrat when the criticism was deserved?

Your comparison is not only untruthful, it is offensive.

Fox would NEVER criticize Bush which is why they have no credibility.

If Obama does what he promised, rather than flip-flopping on every major issue, people here would be applauding him.

But it is the duty of citizens to criticize politicians when they are doing wrong.

Just weeks before this oil spill, Obama betrayed a promise he made about Offshore Drilling and then implied that those who opposed it were uninformed. He claimed that the information we based our objections on, was 'old'. He further claimed that new technology made oil rigs 'safe' today. Many doubted that and said so. They were attacked for doing so.

So save your talking points. There is nothing here that remotely resembles Fox News who would not know the truth if it hit them in the face.

You just called DUers liars. Then you complain that people 'attacked' you. :eyes:

[IndianaGreen]

5. Obama's offshore drill plan is still on the table?

Obama also said that there is such a thing as Clean Oil and safe nuclear energy.

[greencharlie]

6. how bout the cozy relationship with BANKS!!!! nt

[ShortnFiery]

9. Yeah, the US of A under Goldman Sachs, et. al. : Banksters R Us.

:silly:

[ProSense]

11. "If the president were honest and not just a charlatan..."

Lindorff is an idiot.

[dionysus]

43. so are his little cadre of fail-pushers. their bitterness is nectar to my soul.

[katandmoon]

13. K&R

[G_j]

23. doesn't make it easier when BP made you their top recipient of campaign $$

just sayin..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=8287725&mesg_id=8287725

[nashville_brook]

30. i once heard the mayor of San Fran say that politics is the art of taking money from

corporate interests and then screwing them over (words to that effect). my "hope" is that Obama also holds that philosophy.

[branders seine]

26. I think you have Obama confused with someone else.

"cozy relationships" are all that matter in DC.


Wait. Is this a trick question?

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

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[Rex]

36. The great thing about the Realtime world is we can see if he is learning

as we go along and so far I'd give it an almost 50-50 scorecard rating with Obama currently trying to pull in the lead with the possible firing of Katz.

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

48. Deleted message

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[Raine]

42. Anymore all that hope that I placed in Obama

has turned into hopelessness. :-(

[bobbolink]

60. I never bought that empty "hope" stuff, but I didn't know I would feel THIS hopeless!

:nuke:

[lonestarnot]

57. K and fucking R!

But I've already kicked him once or twice, so now I'm going to wait and see what examples he comes up with and it better be very soon.

[cliffordu]

79. He is SUCH a FUCKING FAILURE as a President and a MAN and an African American

I wish he would just CHANGE!~!!!!!!

:sarcasm:

Just in case.

[dionysus]

84. you won't be laughing so hard when he gets primaried!1!1 oh wait, you will be laughing.

and i will be too.

:rofl:

[cliffordu]

97. Whoop! there it is!!!!!

:rofl: