Teabaggers LOSE BIG in Arizona!!! wooohoooooo!! Dems have a chance in NOV!!

[jillan]

We had a vote on a 1 cent sales tax increase per dollar tonite to help save the schools, police, fire dept....and the teabaggers were having fits about it! Hate radio kept telling their listeners to vote NO.
It's a landslide YES vote!

Follow me on this - this was Brewer's Proposal, yes Papers Please Brewer, the teabagger thinks she is the BEST Guv that Az has ever had, and they voted against her tonite.

This is good! This is hugh!!!!1!!!!111!!


I am so looking forward to November :)

[FrenchieCat]

1. Seems like "Fired up Ready to go" is not to be the Teabagger mantra......

[jillan]

4. You wanna see "fired up ready to go"? Watch the Dems in Arizona this November.

[CLANG]

54. More like "ready to fire".

[Dappleganger]

2. Congrats!

It's good to know there's some sensible people left.

[Bobbieo]

7. Yuma sure got its panties in a wad over this! Go, Raul, Go!!!!

[ThatsMyBarack]

70. Or rather....

Patties in a Wade!!11!!!!! ;)

[gateley]

3. The good guys in AZ had their say! VERY exciting! nt

[xxqqqzme]

5. What - she didn't take norquist's

taxpayer protection pledge? I'm shocked!

[Catshrink]

20. The chickenshit Legislature wouldn't do it

but passed it along to the voters - this is all because of Norquist. But he's pissed and will make the fact that the Leg. allowed it to go to the voters an issue.

[blondeatlast]

47. Yeah, I felt I had to vote "yes" but I made sure people I knew knew that this

was because of our chickenshit leggies shirking their responsibilities.

[BrklynLiberal]

6. So, it turns out that the anti-teabaggers are the silent majority here..

[FrenchieCat]

9. They always have been......

But the media kept hoping to grow the movement,
and it appears that the strategy isn't working out so well!

[BrklynLiberal]

11. :-)

[bobburgster]

46. Something tells me...

the media won't be reporting it with the same angle.

[CLANG]

82. More like the vocal minority if you ask me.

[depakid]

8. Interesting, since a sales tax is regressive- and hits the lowest incomes hardest

(and it includes undocumented immigrants).

[lonestarnot]

12. Every child is worth a fucking penney! WTF

:wtf:

[jillan]

15. It also helps them. A major portion of this is going to public schools.

They were talking about a major firing of teachers, leading to overcrowded classrooms where their children would not be receiving the attention they deserve.

And it's only for 3 years.

[depakid]

23. It does indeed- though it's important to point out that they're also paying for it

in more ways than one.

[PSzymeczek]

85. They were going to close

one elementary school here. They still might. What they need to do is shut down the freakin' charter schools and take back the tax money that goes to them for the public schools.

[Tansy_Gold]

86. AMEN -- Imagine Charter Schools are a funnel to the wealthy

They need to GO GO GO GO GO.



Tansy Gold

[marybourg]

24. It was a bittersweet issue; a tax increase (using a regressive tax )

put forward by the party whose 13 tax cuts in 9 years (or was it 9 in 13 years?) and giveaways to faith-based groups and cronies contributed mightily to this shortfall. Now that they have the Gov's mansion, THEY want a tax increase. If Janet had still been Gov, they would have excoriated her if she had suggested a tax increase. I hate it that they got what they wanted, but I guess it's the lesser of two evils.

[Mosby]

73. taxes in AZ have been lowered 16 times in 18 years nt

edit to include link:


Arizona lawmakers' resistance to tax hikes is well-established. The state has cut its overall tax take in 16 of the past 18 years.

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2010/04/07/20100407arizona-proposed-sales-tax.html

[county worker]

33. The lowest incomes get the benefit of social programs the tax pays for.

They also spend less.

[depakid]

34. Econ 101 -declining marginal utility...

[county worker]

35. Taking me back many moons. Had econ 101 in the 70's

The more they consume of services the less they are served or something? or the more they spend the less it benefits them or something?

[depakid]

37. The tax is far more expense in terms of their buying power than it is for a wealthy person

Example: a $20.00 tip to single mother waitress buys lunch for her kids for a week, whereas it means far less to single guy who drops $100 on a dinner.

Services (like education) also have collateral benefits to the wealthy in terms of a better employment base and less crime on the streets, etc.

[county worker]

39. So what do you think if the waitress doesn't have good schools to send her kids to or

not enough police to come to her aid. The rich guy can do without the tax increase just fine. His life is not as good with the tax because he doesn't need the services.

[depakid]

40. Rational fiscal policy (particularly during an economic downturn)

is to levy taxes according to the ability to pay. Otherwise, you're taking discretionary income (and its multiplier effects) out of the overall economy- making everybody that much poorer.

[county worker]

42. You really think they could pass a tax "according to the ability to pay"?

Pragmatism would say take what you can get.

[depakid]

43. A lot has to do with how it's presented

Would they support rational and responsible fiscal policy if they were shown the benefits- with a bit of populist appeal to hitting up the fat cats?

Maybe.

[LanternWaste]

53. Econ 102 - Cost/Benefit Analysis

Econ 102 - Cost/Benefit Analysis

[lonestarnot]

10. Sheet! I forgot all about that!

:bounce: :woohoo: Whooooodamnwho!

[blondeatlast]

13. I live in a heavily Republican area--and have yet to meet a soul that opposed the tax.

Even some Republicans came to the realization that THEY GET THIS MONEY BACK IN SERVICES.

[jillan]

22. I was listening to KFYI this afternoon in the car - you should've heard them.

The guy was whining about how he just spent thousands of dollars getting his car fixed and if 100 passes it would cost even more.
And all I could think was stfu - the children of Arizona are more important than his car. And then he went into a big rant telling his listeners to vote no. No more taxes.

All the TEA types want is something for nothing.

[aquart]

14. I don't understand exactly what you voted on. Or what won.

I don't know what was whose proposal or why it was opposed or voted for. I know you all think the issue is clear, but it isn't here in NYC.

[jillan]

16. Here

Proposition 100 proposes a 1% increase (one-cent per dollar) in the Arizona state sales tax. Two-thirds of the revenues generated would fund k-12 education and the other one-third would fund health and human services and public safety. The sales tax would automatically repeal on May 31, 2013.

[Michigan-Arizona]

44. According to this section of the bill it may not automatically repeal

Will it really repeal automatically?

Yes, it will repeal on May 31, 2013. It would take a two-thirds vote of the legislature or another voter proposition to keep the tax increase in place.

[blondeatlast]

19. One cent sales tax increase for three years, to make up for our dumbfuck guv's decision

to forego Federal funds and to fund her dumbshit lawsuit against the Feds regarding healthcare. I've got a kid in public school--I had to vote yes, even though our guv and her leggies shirked their responsibility.

She couldn't get the legislators (her own party) to agree to a budget, so it was submitted to the voters. The voters passed the increase--but I'm pissed that the leggies got off scot free on this.

[Catshrink]

17. WooHoo!

Now my paycut will only be 3%!

Thank you Arizona.

[ThoughtCriminal]

18. Media was expecting a close vote

There didn't seem to be much polling on this, but the last I saw was that support had "fallen from 60% to 51%".

With 43% polls reporting, "Yes" votes on Prop 100 are ahead about 64% to 36%.

Latest:
http://www.azsos.gov/results/2010/special/BM100.htm

Yeah, the Tea-Bag crowd is going to be really unhappy - especially if the landslide holds up.

[blondeatlast]

21. Even some big L Libertarians I know supported this--they knew that the money

would kind of come back in the form of services.

[LarryNM]

25. Wonder if the "liberal" MSM will Ignore This like

they did on the Oregon Tax Increase earlier in the year? Doesn't fit their script. Doesn't fix the huge structural problems that will require an increase in taxes on the highest "earners" or taxing capital gains as regular income, but it Is a step in the right direction and a defeat for the anti-humane Norquist Mindset.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ohheckyeah]

27. And that has what to do with the OP?

If you want to talk about immigration maybe you could start a thread.

[MIprogressive1]

28. Im new here and cant yet

[MIprogressive1]

29. Sorry for my previous post!

Im drunk and have a friend over who is a fucking repuke and he got on here when i wasnt looking!

[ohheckyeah]

31. I'd have to be more than drunk to have a

repuke friend.

[CLANG]

83. Can't leave a puke alone with your computer, dude

That alone gets you a pizza.

[ohheckyeah]

30. Okay. There are a number of threads on

immigration that you can join in on.

[county worker]

36. They are people who need food shelter and clothing not available in Mexico because of lack of work

or income. Their families are starving and many live in shacks and filth with out clean water. If you don't understand basic human decency I can't teach it to you.

[ThoughtCriminal]

32. 72% polls reporting - Still winning 64 to 36!

But if you look at comment posts at the newspaper sites, it seems like every tea-bagger in the state is online whining about it.

[harkadog]

38. I think the results are not favorable to our candidates.

1) We have a no name running against McCain in November 2) Brewer backed this proposal and the voters agreed with her by a large margin 3) Brewer signed the immigration law and every poll has shown the great majority of voters in AZ as elsewhere back it. Democratic candidates for the most part have been largely quiet about both these issues.

[jillan]

41. No no no - I have to disagree with you on so many levels.

Rodney Glassman is beating JD in the polls (last I heard). The R's are split between McCain and JD. 2 of McCain's staffers just quit his campaign. Hopefully Glassman will step up his campaign, and I have word that he will be soon.

Brewer backed this proposal - as did Terry Goddard. The Teabag types that love Brewer voted against this. I don't think that's good for her.

Terry Goddard has been very outspoken about 1070.

I take it you live in AZ? If so, you may want to sign up to be on Glassman's and Goddard's email list. And if you want to volunteer, I can put you in touch with someone that would love to have some help.

[harkadog]

49. I try and be a realist.

I am on Goddard's and Glassman's email lists but thank you. JD will not beat McCain. Glassman may be a nice guy but he will not beat McCain. Janet Napolitano could have beat him but she was taken from the state for no good reason. There are plenty of people that could have done Homeland Security.

[ThoughtCriminal]

45. A few of things look brighter

The same polling company (Rasmussen) that reported a large majority of Arizonans support SB 1070, also was showing only 53% support for Prop 100. They were way off in the latter because Rasmussen HEAVILY over-samples Republicans. It also seemed to be something of a push poll, asking several questions about concerns about crime and economic costs of illegal aliens before asking if the respondent supported the anti illegal alien immigration bill. Very likely, SB 1070 is supported by a majority of Arizona voters, but not nearly as strongly or as extensively as its supporters claim.

http://www.blogforarizona.com/blog/2010/04/dont-believe-it-rasmussen-has-become-an-outlier-poll.html

Gov Brewer won a victory here, and although she is a Republican and far right wing by any measure, it was a HUGE slam against the hard line GOP legislators. Pandering to anti-tax tea-baggers may not be the winning formula they thought it was.

[harkadog]

51. You are forgetting one thing.

This was a special election. Turnout in a special election is always low and skewed to the people who have an interest in the subject matter of the election. The polling may have been completely accurate but that doesn't mean the people polled voted in the special election in the same proportions that would happen in a regular November election. I know it is conventional wisdom on DU to say Rasmussen over samples Republicans but I have never seen any evidence of that -- just assertions. If they were consistently wrong about their results they would go out of business because that is how they get paid -- for accurate results. If they were oversampling someone do you think only people on DU would know about that?

[lonestarnot]

58. Not forgetting shit she. You would like for things to be otherwise, doesn't make them so. First

thing leatherface cut was Child Protective Service, and laid off well everyfucking body. Yeah she certainly gives a crap about kids. Your attempts at bully marginalization are not going to work out to well here. :nopity:

[harkadog]

59. I was replying to a rational poster.

You don't fit that category.

[lonestarnot]

89. You were shitting in your hat. Pitiful you have to defend your governor here.

[harkadog]

97. You should substitute a "u" for the last "o" in your username

It would be more accurate.

[lonestarnot]

100. Yeah freepers like to call me that. You should substitute hairball for dog in yours.

:puke:

[lonestarnot]

48. Brewer only backed the bill for cover. She has cut so many childrens' programs that

she had to cover appearances. hmmmmf nice try.

[harkadog]

50. Nice try at pretending you know something about it.

Anyone who lives in AZ knows Brewer had to drag the legislature kicking and screaming to put the measure on the ballot. She originally wanted it passed as a law but when they refused to do that she got them to put it on a special ballot. You have no idea what you are talking about. Go embarrass yourself somewhere else.

[Name removed]

56. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

60. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[saracat]

68. Actually, Brewer initiated this idea and she bucked her own party to do so.

I have to agree that this doesn't necessarily mean great things for the Dems in Az in Nov. For instance my district is actually socially liberal and yet consistently votes for the most outrageous wingnuts. They 100% support education yet they elect wingnuts who vote against all education bills.It makes no sense.

[RobertPlant]

52. what I think will happen

McCain got 76% of the vote in 2004. Its unrealistic to try to spend money trying to unseat him when there are a lot of other seats to take. At this point you hope to reduce his margin of victory by 10-15 points and ready it for a democratic takeover in 2016 when McCain will be 80.

I could see Goddard beating Brewer. Napolitano got 62% of the vote last time so I don't see how Georgina Wallace will be that hard to beat.

As for the house seats I see all the districts staying the same. I do think the democrats may have a wild card chance in district 3 with Shadegg retiring though.

[LLStarks]

55. Regardless of the circumstances, we should never be proud of tax increases.

Arizona's government needs to be more responsible.

[lonestarnot]

57. Voters saving their children from government.

[ecstatic]

61. Despite how the media is spinning things, I think the tea party is really energizing our side

More people voted dem in the KENTUCKY primaries yesterday. That's HUGH.

[NJmaverick]

62. K & R!

[City Lights]

63. Great news, jillan!

:toast: :woohoo: :bounce:

[Mosby]

64. The referendum was a shell game and the repukes won

The real story with the sales tax referendum is that the gutless republican legislature in AZ did not want to raise income or property tax for re-election reasons so they passed the buck to the public though a sales tax referendum and then used scare tactics to get it passed. Our local media didn't have a clue.

I'm a little surprised that dems etc. are happy that AZ is moving towards regressive taxation.

[jillan]

65. You know what? I don't mind paying taxes, especially when it goes for education, healthcare, police

fire, new roads...things like that.

I do have a hard time when my tax dollars go to waste - to fraud and abuse - and that is a huge problem.


Countries like Denmark pay huge amounts of taxes, but in return their citizens get so much.

And I am saying this as someone who sells on ebay to make ends meet - not exactly someone that won't feel the tax increase.

[Mosby]

67. I don't mind paying a little more also

Property and income taxes in AZ are pretty low compared to many other states. Speaking of wasteful spending, the Phx PD spend almost 1/2 BILLION per year now, according to a recent expose in the AZ Republic the amount is ridiculous compared to other similarly sized cities. Many phx cops roll around in 50K+ chevy tahoes, they have 8 helicopters and just bought their first airplane, it's utterly out of control but most of their budget is secret so there is almost no oversight. There is absolutely no reason why they need expensive SUVs when Malibu's or whatever would work just fine. The city of Avondale (maybe 36K pop) just bought a $500,000 urban assault vehicle. And yet the public (and media) really believed that cops were going to lose there jobs if the sales tax increase didn't pass.

[HuckleB]

91. It's a regressive tax, however.

Most Arizonans got screwed, but didn't have a way to make things right and keep services up to par.

Further, Arizona's sprawl leads to everyone living with additional living expenses that might as well be taxes, via auto payments, gasoline costs and wear and tear costs, not to mention time wasted in commute.

[drmeow]

66. I agree with you

This is the first time I was truly undecided about how I was going to vote on an issue until 10 minutes before I went to the polls. I ended up holding my nose and voting for it ... but I'm pissed that needs jobs and services were held hostage to a regressive tax increase. You could probably just raise the property and income taxes of (people living in Paradise Valley by 1% to raise the same amount of money (OK - a little exaggeration but ...). If it wasn't for SB 1070 (and the resulting boycotts), I might have voted no.

I'll bet a .5% income tax increase would have been passed by the voters if the same tactics had been used.

[Mosby]

71. Property and income taxes are low in AZ

but in order to raise them the republican controlled legislature would have to do it and we all know that's not going to happen, in fact they have been busy lowering taxes for more than 15 years. It's basically the Steve Forbes flat tax plan but implemented slowly.

[drmeow]

75. Is that because

on the legislature has the authority to increase them or because they wouldn't pass if put before the voters? If a 1% state wide sales tax can pass, I would think that a small income tax increase would pass, too but maybe not. It still wouldn't be what I want (which would be a true progressive tax structure) but even a small across the board income tax increase is less regressive than a small sales tax increase.

Incidentally, I heard a rumor that if 100 passed, the legislature was going to pass more business tax cuts - I hate them.

[HuckleB]

92. Sales taxes are high.

Property taxes are actually middle of the road, ranked 18th lowest out of the 50 states. Income taxes are 12th lowest. Sales taxes were 9th highest, but they might be number one now.

[TK421]

69. One cent per dollar? Does anyone else find that to be a piffling amount?

what the ever-loving FUCK were those people in an uproar about?

SALES TAX!!!

[aikoaiko]

72. Its an interesting frame --

We use the same 1 penny tax here in my county in GA for special projects. Its a good thing.

One cent per dollar is 1% of a dollar. We already pay 5 cents per dollar for state sales tax or 5%.

Increasing it by one cent is a 20% increase in sales tax.

1 penny per dollar increase versus 20% increase in sale tax. Its all the same but one is definitely easier to accept.

[TK421]

74. I can understand that thinking, but in the end it certainly won't bankrupt any of us

are you near Marietta by any chance? I have a friend there, that's why I ask

[aikoaiko]

78. No, I live in Southeast GA on the coast. In the Garden of Good and Evil.

And you're right, the 1% sales tax won't bankrupt anyone.

It works here because all the money is dedicated to local projects before people vote on it. Plus we get a decent amount of tourists coming through our county that it taps into out of state money and not just county residents.

[TK421]

79. And that is how the money should be spent...good for you and your county

I like your state,BTW..when I drove back home to PA from Florida back in 2001 I stopped in Georgia plenty of times. Nice, warm people..good places to eat...and it changed my opinion of the South I must say. I used to be a South basher ( I lived in Florida, and had countless miserable experiences there I only attributed to being below the Mason-Dixon line ) I like Georgia...I really do

And North Carolina, too

[Mosby]

76. What's the sales tax in your city?

The sales tax in Phx is now 9.3%, El Mirage is highest with a rate now of 10.3%

[TK421]

77. Need to look it up...I'm right outside Philly and it doesn't seem overwhelming

I need to look it up

from what I'm looking at, it is 6%

edited to add: http://www.selectgreaterphiladelphia.com/data/incent_tax_taxes.cfm

[TK421]

99. I posted the reply, but now I see it probably could be worse

I guess I'm not thinking about what it could be across the country, so I apologize for that

[anachro1]

80. No Brown Voters Welcomed

Will we see these signs in AZ come November?

[existentialist]

81. OK, so it had to be passed, and the people of Arizona did

it when their legislature and governor would not,

And OK, the sentiments of Arizona voters as indicated by the vote are very counter to teabag and Republican policies.

This is good as far as it goes.

There is still one problem, namely that a sales tax is a regressive tax that falls hardest upon those who can least afford it.

[HisTomness]

84. I see this very differently than the OP

This was a tax increase pushed by the unelected Republican governor of the State.

It was needed for two reasons:
1. The mostly Republican legislature tripled the budget in the last few years.
2. The controversial "Papers Please" bill does not include funding for its enforcement.

Proposition 100 had wide-ranging support and an extreme advantage in funding for promoting it.

The way I saw it, the Republican legislature and (unelected) Republican governor went on a foolhardy spending and legislation spree, and then came knocking on my door asking me to pay for it. They told me it is needed for education (the children) and health services (the sick and elderly)...and also for law enforcement. The same law enforcement that needs money to enforce this new immigration law. Since tax revenues are essentially fungible, the upshot is that I'm being asked to fund that asinine bill by agreeing to a regressive tax, and it is incumbent on me to feel guilty about not doing my part for children, the elderly, and the infirmed.

Ultimately I'm being asked to enable the irresponsible Republican lawmakers that got us into this mess in the first place. I'm a dyed-blue Democrat and have no problem with paying my taxes to support the services we all enjoy, so maybe had it been the Dems that had come calling I would've been more receptive. But instead it was that group of buffoons, so I voted NO knowing full well the bulk of this state would pass it anyway like so many other bad ideas that have come to pass here in the desert.

[HuckleB]

95. I know more than a few teachers who spread the word to vote yes for this...

... however they would not think about voting for a Dem in November.

[rasputin1952]

87. Most of us have a jar or two filled with pennies...

more than enough to cover this 1% tax w/o even blinking an eye.

Spend a dollar, the rate added a penny, (to already existing taxes), spent $10, you're out a dime, spend $100, you're out a buck, spend a thousand, you're out an additional $10...etc.

This money goes essentially to kids, most people spend about $50-$100 bucks on various excursions to a store. Why is a penny an issue?

The economy is actually bolstered by this 1 cent addition. teachers get paid, spend the money, items for the school are bought, many of them locally, increased business, what is the matter with people?

Perhaps some should go back to school...it's a damned penny per dollar! Dump out the jars and drawers...go on a friggin spree!!!!!!!!!!

[Tansy_Gold]

90. Much of it will also be spent by tourists

And I say that as one of the people supporting a boycott of my state over SB 1070. The truth is that boycott or no boycott, the winter visitor will still come, the Asian and European tourists will still come, and they are the ones who do have money and can afford to spend it here. Tourism is a huge part of Arizona's economy, and an increase in the sales tax collected from the tourists is a good part of the motivation.

The poor will do without something or other because they need to scrape up the extra $100 a year or whatever it amounts to, the rich will find ways around it, and us working stiffs and the tourists will provide the funds.

What's being forgotten, however, is that money is fungible. The extra 1% will go to education and public safety, but it will also indirectly go to all the other things, including immigration raids. THOSE items were being funded while education and children's health insurance were being cut. Money is NOT being moved out of those programs to fund all-day kindergarten or keep class sizes from doubling. Now we'll have money for public education and health programs through the new tax, but we'll also have 1070 enforcement and all the other shit funded from other revenues.



TG

[HuckleB]

94. The tourists might not get such great service this year, at least according to this piece.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=es3hq0XM-cw

[rasputin1952]

96. I lived in AZ, Kingman, Mohave County for about 7 years...

I know that AZ's are basically good people, and like everywhere else, the "fringe" gets far too much press and the everything gets overblown.

I honestly believe tat 1070 will be declared unconstitutional, it's a question of when.

i also think your governor is toast, and those in the lege that voted for this will be gone.

I was down there during the "Hayworth Years", (not in his District though, thank God), After a bit, his constituents realized he was a buffoon, and ousted him. 1070 is worse than the Hayworth "legacy", by far, and when this gets to the USSC, it will be ripped apart.

As for the 1% tax, it's not just AZ, when taxes are mentioned, some people go ballistic, no matter what the rate may be, or for what it goes to. Take away the gas tax and it would be seen as some king of "victory", for about 2 weeks, until the streets and roads never got repaired, and potholes to rival the Grand Canyon began to crop up. Then there would be a great clamor to fix the things, as well as the streetlights and a host of other things. Of course, w/o an educated workforce, because of that penny per dollar that might not have gone through for education, there would be no one in the future to actually know how to fix the things anyway...;)

[Mosby]

101. The poor still move like everyone else

and when you move your going to pay the maricopa county stadium tax of 3%. So just to recap if you need to move in phx using a do it yourself moving company like u-haul or penske your going to pay a 12.3% tax on the rental. Getting closer to steve forbes 15% little by little.

[Tansy_Gold]

102. The poor don't use U-Haul or Penske. They have friends

I'm not arguing that this won't hurt the poor, because it will. But because they have limited amounts to spend, their "tax increase" is limited, too. Again, I'm not saying this justifies anything; I'm merely clarifying.

12.3% tax on a single expenditure that not everyone will make in a given year hardly equates to Forbes' 15%.

As far as I know, food is still exempt from state sales tax, if not cities'. Apache Junction, for example, charges a city sales tax on groceries. Is anyone screaming about that? If you shop at Fry's or Safeway or Food City in AJ, you pay tax on your groceries; if you shop at Basha's in Gold Canyon, you don't.

Retail sales in Arizona, however, are greatly impacted by the winter visitors and other tourists, most of whom do have substantial disposable income. A lot of them also aren't registered voters in Arizona, and the election was held after a lot of them are back in Minnesota or Wisconsin or Idaho or Oregon. Most of them are retirees who don't have kids in school, so they aren't going to directly benefit from what they're paying. They tend not to stay in high crime areas, so they're not going to need a disproportionate amount of law enforcement services. (They do probably tend to get involved in a disproportionately high number of traffic accidents, however. . . . . . . )

I personally would have preferred raising taxes on higher levels of unearned income, on rental or vacation property, on corporate profits and business property, but that's not gonna happen. The sales tax is not a good substitute by any means, but it has justifications.



Tansy Gold

[Lorien]

88. Let's hope that we get some strong Dem challengers against DINOs and DLCers too

It's time to sweep both houses clean of pro-corporate fascism, anti-environment, anti-worker, anti Americans. Vote Winograd!

[HuckleB]

93. My facebook based anecdotal evidence is not so clear.

I went to high school in AZ, so I am "friends" with a lot of current residents, all middle aged, and apparently regular voters. Most of them supported this measure, but continue to post GOPer BS otherwise.

I know it's meaningless, but...

[fascisthunter]

98. what does this tell you right wingers

yes, Americans aren't anti-tax even though you have saturated the air waves and tv with your lies.