"Further supply vessels.... to be escorted by the Turkish Navy"....Any confirmation of this?

[Junkdrawer]

A shocked world has responded with outrage. Turkey recalled its ambassador to Israel and warned of unprecedented and incalculable reprisals.

Two Turkish activists were reported to be among those killed in the flotilla. Ankara warned that further supply vessels will be sent to Gaza, escorted by the Turkish Navy, a development with unpredictable consequences.

....

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/turkey-threatens-action-israel-on-alert/116743-2.html?from=tn

Israel and Turkey on a war footing? :shrug:

[WeDidIt]

1. Any attack by Israel on a Turkish vessel is an attack against NATO

This is getting bad, fast.

[RC]

4. Depends on who fires first.

I'm betting Israel.

[truedelphi]

57. Yeah reports seem toindicate that many on board the attacked vessel were

Sleeping.

[Statistical]

49. Depends on where/when/how the attack happens.

NATO is a defensive organization only.

[WeDidIt]

50. Read the charter.

Any attack on a member nation's vessels, soil, or aircraft by a non-member nation is an attack on ALL members of NATO.

And the Mediterranean is specifically named in Article 6.

[Statistical]

53. That doesn't mean NATO WILL respond.

Many soldiers and aircraft of the United States have been attacked in Iraq and it didn't become a NATO conflict.
Turkey has never rendered military assistance or aid for the war in Iraq.

NATO did not get involved in the Falkland War despite a NATO nation being attacked.

While the potential for NATO involvement is there it isn't this "auto war" clause that you seem to think it is.

There have been dozens of conflicts since NATO was formed that didn't result in mobilization of NATO forces.

Lastly your blanket statement "any attack on any NATO ship anywhere" is just hyperbole.

If Turkey were to sail into Israeli territorial waters NATO would not defend that action.
Also if Israel were to return fire after Turkish warships opened fire it is unlikely NATO would defend that action either.

[WeDidIt]

56. Every member nation except the United States has condemned Israel's actions

Some action will be taken, with or without the United States. My hope is that president Obama will choose to be on the right side of history.

Thuggery by any nation must be met with swift resolve and action. Israel has proved time and again it is nothing more than a thug nation, no less so that North Korea or Iran.

[Statistical]

60. Once again action doesn't need to be (and likely wont be) military force.

Your fantasy of a shooting war between NATO and Israel won't happen.

[WeDidIt]

61. Telepathy FAIL

I agree, action doesn't need to be military force, and likely won't be.

But there will be action by NATO.

[LakeSamish706]

2. "Israel and Turkey on a war footing?" Uh, No.. It will be Israel vs NATO at that point! n/t

[aquart]

7. You're hoping NATO will attack Israel?

Oh, what a dream come true for so many. Europe doing Arab dirty work. Because, of course, Arabs are incapable of doing anything? I mean, they had years to attack Israel and yet it's still there. Now NATO can come and wipe them up and rectify their evil error at the UN in 1948 and give the Arabs back the land the Israelis bought and paid for........oh happy days.

Glad you're pleased.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

12. Telepathy FAIL. -nt

[provis99]

42. what is "Ignored" above telling you now?

I assume its some kind of anti-Arab slur right out of the Israeli/Palestinian forums.

[laylah]

52. My ex is Jewish, as are my children.

THAT said, this was an abomination! Jack and I have talked about the "kid glove" treatment of Israel over the years. They DO have the right to exist, they DO have the right to prosper, the DO NOT have the right to do unto others as others have done unto them!

Reprehensible!

[LakeSamish706]

23. Not hoping that anyone attacks anyone else actually, I would dearly love

to have this whole thing go away. Israel needs to stop acting the way they are is a certainty. I fully understand that Hamas is as much to blame for the how Israel feels, but you can't run around boarding other countries ships in International waters.

[EFerrari]

3. I hope this true but fear it's not.

This is exactly the moment to push through.

There was to be a second wave of vessels but that was before the attack.

[Junkdrawer]

31. I'm seeing a lot of blogs now linking to the IBN story, but I can't find another source....

I find this less than likely, but who knows?

[aquart]

5. Turkey intends to get into a shooting war with Israel?

Now that's entertaining. WHY?

[proteus_lives]

6. If it's true, it's because they want to force NATO countries to attack Israel.

Which wouldn't happen.

[Tripmann]

9. If its true, its because they don't want any more of their citizens

being executed in cold blood by the IDF.

[proteus_lives]

11. "executed in cold blood"

Now, it's just lies. Google the numerous videos of the "peaceful activists" attacking Israeli soldiers.

[mike_c]

15. "activists attacking Israeli soldiers" engaged in piracy and kidnapping....

That's called self defense where I come from.

[WeDidIt]

17. The activists had every right to deffend themselves from Israeli illegal acts.

Israel is the aggressor nation here. Israel is the nation that violated international law.

Israel is a terrorist nation.

[aquart]

21. So this was NOT a peaceful aid mission?

Because if peaceful protest was the intent....FAIL.

[WeDidIt]

22. Yes, it was a peaceful aid mission

They defended themselves with fold up chairs and kitchen knives afgter being fired upon before troops dropped onto the ship.

The IDF is a terrorist organization and bombing of all IDF training facilities is now justified.

[inna]

36. "The IDF is a terrorist organization and bombing of all IDF training facilities is now justified."

Fail. Try harder.

[WeDidIt]

37. No fail about it, the IDF is no different at all from Hezbollah. n/t

[inna]

39. "bombing of all IDF training facilities is now justified" - I don't believe for a second that you're

being sincere. It's probably the most "irresponsible" statement I've read in these threads yet.

[WeDidIt]

40. 100% sincere

That's what is done to terrorists and the IDF is a terrorist organization.

[proteus_lives]

43. Yeah. Because Hezbollah would have repeatedly warned them.

:eyes:

[WeDidIt]

48. Hezbollah issues warnings all the time

No different from the IDF.

[JCMach1]

25. Here are a few of who were on-board...

...More than 700 people, most of them from international non-governmental organisations, activists and people of various nationalities, religions and from all walks of life.

About half were Turkish and the rest from 50 countries around the world.

Prominent passengers include some European MPs, and writers and journalists. Among them were the former Greek-Catholic archbishop of Jerusalem, Monsignor Hilarion Capucci, Arab Israeli Islamist leader Sheikh Raed Salah and Abbas Nasser, an Al-Jazeera correspondent who said he was calling from a hiding place aboard one of the ships when his telephone suddenly went dead. He said the captain and two people had been wounded... http://www.thenational.ae/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100531/FOREIGN/705319968/1001

[inna]

38. Has anyone been able to find the list of (reportedly) 19 people killed, and those wounded?

Is it at least known what the nationality of most victims is? (I presume, Turkish, but I'm not sure.)

[Tripmann]

26. I stand by my quote

These people were shot dead during an act of piracy by the IDF. I'd call that pretty cold blooded.

[JCMach1]

35. I agree not only that, this is an act of piracy against the US... one ship is US Flagged

http://www.thenational.ae/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100531/FOREIGN/705319968/1001


The convoy includes the “Mavi Marmara,” a large Turkish-flagged passenger vessel with about 600 people on board, two cargo ships and three other boats.

Two other boats are also Turkish-flagged, while another two are Greek and one more is from the United States.

A seventh ship, the 1,200-tonne “Rachel Corrie,” named after an American who was crushed to death by an Israeli army bulldozer in Gaza in 2003, was en route from Ireland to join the flotilla.

[proteus_lives]

44. No one said you were on the ball.

Repeated warnings.

Using tear gas and non-lethal ammo first.

Not using lethal ammo until a "peaceful activist" wrestles a weapon from a soldier.

Yeah, so cold-blooded.

[aquart]

20. Now that is wildly naive.

[EFerrari]

10. If it's true, it's because Turkey is demanding that international law be upheld. n/t

[WeDidIt]

14. You might want to acquaint yourself with the NATO charter

Israel may have already fucked themselves with NATO with this attack on a civilian vessel because the U.S. invoked article V. of the NATO charter in response to the attacks on civilians in the World Trade Center.

And Turkey shows every intention of invoking all of its rights under Article V of the NATO charter. The U.S. gets no veto on this.

[aquart]

18. Which means they want something else. WHAT?

Who is Turkey sucking up to these days? Does this have to do with the Kurds? (Always the first question to ask with Turkey.)

[WeDidIt]

8. If Israel fires on a Turkish vessel they have fired on NATO

according to the NATO charter.

Turkey has been a member of NATO since 1951. The NATO charter is clear on this.

[aquart]

19. So you're hoping this will start a Europe against Israel war?

With the Arabs doing nothing and reaping the rewards? Good plan there.

[WeDidIt]

24. This was Israel's decision and all the consequences are 100% the fault of Israel.

No sympathy for terrorists.

[proteus_lives]

45. And b/w thinking like that is the reason there's no peace.

Go ahead, hold your breath until NATO attacks Israel.

[LakeSamish706]

28. Here is a list of the member countries of NATO!

http://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive/nato_countries.htm

[Recursion]

13. A) no, war is never "entertaining"

B) the "why" is because that's often what nations do when other nations attack their civilian fleet in international waters

C) in case you haven't noticed, Israel isn't exactly the unquestioned regional superpower it once was

[EFerrari]

16. How can you be "entertained" when some of us are waiting to hear

if our friends have been shot?

Seriously?

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

29. Well, pro-Palestinian protesters have been shot.

For some, such a thing is ALWAYS entertaining. :shrug:

[Tesha]

47. Why do you keep phrasing this as though Turkey would be *STARTING* the war?

It seems to me that the first illegal act wasn't taken by the
Turkish ship but rather by Israelis.

Tesha

[Imajika]

27. Turkey will not go run an Israeli blockade...

It just isn't going to happen.

If Turkey tried that they most assuredly would NOT get help from NATO.

[LakeSamish706]

30. Depends if the blockade is in International waters or not. Turkey is rightfully pissed

big time at Israel, as are most other nations in the world right now. I dare say if Israel were to fire on Turkish war ships, NATO would most certainly have to back Turkey.

[EFerrari]

32. You can't mount a blockade in international waters.

Edit: Or, you can but it's illegal.

[LakeSamish706]

34. That was my point! But Israel thinks that it is ok to do. n/t

[harkadog]

65. Was JFK's Cuban blockade illegal?

It was in international waters the the U.S. confronted civilian Russian ships.

[spanone]

33. every fucking nation in the world should escort them. these are international waters

[Odin2005]

41. I hope they break the blockade! GO TURKS!!!

[proteus_lives]

46. Odin2005: GO WAR AND DEATH!

[Tailormyst]

51. do you put any blame at all for any of this on Israel?

[proteus_lives]

54. I think Israel should have waited until they were out of IW to board the ships.

But those soldiers had every right to defend themselves once the crew members attacked.

And the blame is also on the head of the "peaceful activists". They knew they were breaking a blockade, they knew Israel was serious about this and they refused to sail to Egypt to deliver the supplies. They preferred to make a point.

Well, they must be delighted now, they have a bunch of new martyrs.

[Tailormyst]

55. Wow okay

Your view on humanity and what is right and wrong just differs way to much from mine. Going to turn off the computer and go read a novel for a while. Have a good night.

[proteus_lives]

63. Yeah, I prefer looking at both sides.

Most prefer bigotry and hatred about the I/P situation.

Have a good night.

[Tripmann]

59. So by that logic

The burglar illegally entering your home 'has every right' to shoot you for trying to push him back out the door.

Hang your head

[proteus_lives]

62. Logic fail from you.

No surprise.

[Tripmann]

66. The comparison is apt

Let me simplify it further for you.

The people on board the aid ship had as much right to resist this act of piracy as people on board a ship being boarded by somali pirates. In international waters the IDF became nothing more than thugs with weaponry illegally boarding a boat.

[blublu]

58. BBC

I heard that about an hour ago on the BBC

[TexasObserver]

64. Hopefully, NATO will close ranks against this aggressor nation.