Does anyone here remember the movie

[tblue37]

The Seduction of Joe Tynan? Alan Alda played an idealistic politician who had to make so many compromises to get into a position of power where he could do some of the good and decent things he wanted to do that by the time he finally had such a position, he was boxed in to such a degree that he could do nothing but serve the corrupt status quo.

Meryl Streep and Julie Harris were also in the movie. Streep played a campaign worker he had an affair with, and Harris played his wife, whom he loved dearly and deeply admired. (Point, of course = the temptations that face even decent politicians.)

The title doesn't refer to his affair with the Streep character, though, but to his getting sucked into the whole political power scheme and not being able to extricate himself from the web of lies and corruption, despite his essential decency and very good intentions.

I have always feared that almost all of even the best pols must ultimately succumb, since there is almost no other route to power in this countrythan through corruption and compromise.

[pberq]

1. What about people like Dennis Kucinich and Russ Feingold?

[tblue37]

5. Yes--they are the exceptions. That's why I said "almost all" and

"virtually impossible." The honest ones are usually not the ones with real power, though. Even Waxman and Conyers, though heads of essential committees investigating high crimes by this administration, have to struggle to get their points into the public consciousness.

The MSM works for real power, and it is pretty efficiaent at keeping the good guys in the second or third tier of the game. Even Howard Dean, as good as they get, even though he is the national chairman of the DNC, has trouble getting publicity and credit for what he has accomplished. Rahm Emmanuel takes credit in the media for all Dean has accomplished and badmouths Dean the whole way, and the MSM goes along with the narrative, which undercuts Dean's power and effectiveness. Basically, guys like Dean, Feingold, Kucinich, Waxman, and Conyers do a lot of good, but the good they do is severely hampered because they are unwilling to compromise their honesty away, so their power is undermined all the time, even by those supposedly "on their side."

[pberq]

8. I agree.

They are severely hampered.

Nevertheless, what they are doing and saying is of greatest importance and does have some impact. I just finished watching "One Bright Shining Moment - the Forgotten Sumer of George McGovern". At the end, they pointed out that, even in defeat, McGovern's message of truth and justice has influenced this country in a positive way.

[Oeditpus Rex]

2. Excellent film

I've seen it three or four times. Kind of the reality version of "Mr. Smith Goes to Washington."

Rip Torn was a hoot. "I got an onion in here that was grown on the shores of hell."

And, of course, the high heels peeking out from beneath his desk. :D

[monmouth]

3. I remember that film, thought it was one of Alda's best..n/t

[bananas]

4. Wasn't he also in "Rosemary's Baby"?

Similar plot line, if you think about it.

[tblue37]

6. That film, btw, is kind of hard to find on VHS or DVD.

I wonder why. Could be no one wants it bruited about?

[1monster]

7. There's an old joke about politicians and honesty. It went something like this...

A young idealistic man decided to run for Congress. During his campaign, he did a lot of pressing the flesh and meeting people.

One day during an event, he met up with an old crotchety person. As he shoke the hand of the older man, the young man said, "I am an honest man, sir, and I want to be your representative. May I count on your vote in the election?"

"No, son, you may not," answsered the older man.

"But why not sir? I am an honest man!"

"Because I want to keep you an honest man," came the reply...

As a joke, it isn't all that funny; but as a social commentary, it pretty much says it all.