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Can Presidents take the lead on civil rights legislation?

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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 10:42 PM
Original message
Can Presidents take the lead on civil rights legislation?
Well, gosh darn, contrary to what I read here all day long, it looks like they can.

"The bill was introduced by President John F. Kennedy in his civil rights speech of June 11, 1963, in which he asked for legislation "giving all Americans the right to be served in facilities which are open to the public—hotels, restaurants, theaters, retail stores, and similar establishments," as well as "greater protection for the right to vote."

He then sent a bill to Congress on June 19. Emulating the Civil Rights Act of 1875, Kennedy's civil rights bill included provisions to ban discrimination in public accommodations, and to enable the U.S. Attorney General to join in lawsuits against state governments which operated segregated school systems, among other provisions.


"...The bill was reported out of the Judiciary Committee in November 1963, and referred to the Rules Committee, whose chairman, Howard W. Smith, a Democrat and avid segregationist from Virginia, indicated his intention to keep the bill bottled up indefinitely. It was at this point that President Kennedy was assassinated. The new president, Lyndon Johnson, utilized his experience in legislative politics and the bully pulpit he wielded as president in support of the bill. In his first address to Congress on November 27, 1963, Johnson told the legislators, "No memorial oration or eulogy could more eloquently honor President Kennedy's memory than the earliest possible passage of the civil rights bill for which he fought so long..."

"...The record of the roll call vote kept by the House Clerk on final passage of the bill.On the return from the winter recess, however, matters took a significant turn. The pressure of the civil rights movement, the March on Washington, and the President's public advocacy of the Act had made a difference of opinion in Representatives' home districts, and soon it became apparent that the petition would acquire the necessary signatures. To prevent the humiliation of the success of the petition, Chairman Smith allowed the bill to pass through the Rules Committee. The bill was brought to a vote in the House on February 10, 1964, and passed by a vote of 290 to 130, and sent to the Senate..."

"...Johnson, who wanted the bill passed as soon as possible, ensured that the bill would be quickly considered by the Senate. Normally, the bill would have been referred to the Senate Judiciary Committee, chaired by Senator James O. Eastland, Democrat from Mississippi. Under Eastland's care, it seemed impossible that the bill would reach the Senate floor. Senate Majority Leader Mike Mansfield took a novel approach to prevent the bill from being relegated to Judiciary Committee limbo. Having initially waived a second reading of the bill, which would have led to it being immediately referred to Judiciary, Mansfield gave the bill a second reading on February 26, 1964, and then proposed, in the absence of precedent for instances when a second reading did not immediately follow the first, that the bill bypass the Judiciary Committee and immediately be sent to the Senate floor for debate. Although this parliamentary move led to a filibuster, the senators eventually let it pass, preferring to concentrate their resistance on passage of the bill itself..."

"...The conference bill was passed by both houses of Congress, and was signed into law by President Johnson on July 2, 1964. Legend has it that as he put down his pen Johnson told an aide, referring to the Democratic Party, "We have lost the South for a generation."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964

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katandmoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 10:45 PM
Response to Original message
1. K&R. It's very obvious Obama's "fierce advocacy" was never meant to be exercised once he got elected
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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 10:46 PM
Response to Original message
2. Presidents can submit any legislation they want nt
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
3. Wilson and Women's Suffrage
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Ozymanithrax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
4. Accurate or not, Johnson was wrong. The south remains lost.
and will not be coming back anytime soon.
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Mimosa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. No. The South is NOT 'lost'
Ozy , you said

"Well, gosh darn, contrary to what I read here all day long, it looks like they can.

"The bill was introduced by President John F. Kennedy in his civil rights speech of June 11, 1963, in which he asked for legislation "giving all Americans the right to be served in facilities which are open to the public—hotels, restaurants, theaters, retail stores, and similar establishments," as well as "greater protection for the right to vote."

I was an aware little kid in ATL GA during the late 50s. I remember the arguments in every home over civil rights for blacks. What 'level' to grant them, or did they need more than what they had already. There was a big struggle you may not know about (judging from your post) and the progressives DID WIN. Despite the assassinations of JFK, RFK and MLK. Have you heard of them?

Have you visited the South lately? Blacks and whites relieve themselves in the same bathrooms. They are eating in the same restaurants, even working in the same offices! And for over 30 years they have occasionally even married each other. And they walk around on sidewalks holding hands. Sometimes they even have mulatto babies they're not ashamed of. You really ought to come and visit 'down here.' Shocking! ;)
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Ozymanithrax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #8
22. And they still vote predominatly racist Republican.
Used to be racist Democrats.
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Mimosa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. I'm suspecting those computer machines
Ozy, in many Southern states there's a tradition of corrupted elections. I'm serious here.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 10:48 PM
Response to Original message
5. Wilson too.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9006590#9010812

He didn't want to and had to be embarrassed into it, but he did it.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Yep
Presidents have played indispensable roles in every human rights expansion throughout our history.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. They even introduced bills!
Heady days indeed, the wild bygones of our ancestors!
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. How did they do that?
I read here on GD-P almost every day that Presidents can't do that. It's unconstitutional.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. It must have been some trick lost
to the fog of time. No one knows how Stonehenge was erected either. These secrets pass into the haze of ensuing decades. Perhaps the scrolls will be discovered again some day.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. Yes, someone in that forum told me, in all seriousness, that for the president to lobby congress
would violate the separation of powers doctrine.

Seriously.

(Ironically, this same poster loves to brag about what an elite college she attended. Looks like that was a lot of money wasted.)
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-26-10 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #13
29. evidently one without a good poli sci dept
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. dupe
Edited on Wed Aug-25-10 11:13 PM by Starry Messenger
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 10:58 PM
Response to Original message
7. LBJ's fondest hope in life was not making right wing bigots love him.
People who are not afraid of their enemies can get a lot done.
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LooseWilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #7
16. That wasn't very sensible of LBJ- if he would've just kept his distance from civil rights...
he might just've had a second term. (What kind of politician gets stuff done that won't get him/her re-elected?... That's just crazy talk.)
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Kringle Donating Member (411 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #7
18. are you old enough to remember him as president?
everybody I knew despised him
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. I was a child then. The point is that he did not mind making enemies
in the service of getting things done.

Vietnam destroyed him, something dropped into his lap by the much prettier JFK, but there is no denying that he was not mortally afraid of conflict.
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Kringle Donating Member (411 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. politics, and making enemies... go hand in hand .nt
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. Very true. Being in power inevitably means having enemies.
This whole "I just know I can make them love me!" thing, which Clinton also had a bad case of, is a fool's game.
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Kringle Donating Member (411 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-26-10 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. Clinton is the best 'tactical politician', the world has ever seen
the reason the last 6 years of his presidency
looked like a rugby game, is that
he had millions of enemy but
only one of him
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Radical Activist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-26-10 12:17 AM
Response to Reply #7
27. I guess you haven't read the Carro book
or any other biography. He was the leader of the bigoted southern Senate caucus. They did love him. That's partly why he was the one who finally got a major civil rights bill through the Senate filibuster.
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Prism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:16 PM
Response to Original message
14. Yep. President Obama could make civil rights his grand cause if he wanted
So far, he chooses not to.

I certainly never thought I would see that from our first African-American president over forty years after the great Civil Rights victories of our age, yet here we are.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:17 PM
Response to Original message
15. Shhhh!...You'll ruin the Bliss.
"Strong and successful presidents (meaning those who get what they want - whether that happens to be good for the country or not) do not accept "the best deal on the table". They take out their carpentry tools and the build the goddam piece of furniture themselves. Strong and successful presidents do not get dictated to by the political environment. They reshape the environment into one that is conducive to their political aspirations."

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/07/17




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Prism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-26-10 12:17 AM
Response to Reply #15
28. LOL, the Bliss . . .
I love V.
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Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:20 PM
Response to Original message
17. Leaders lead. Its what they do.
Not all who reach the top are actually leaders, sad to say.
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amborin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-25-10 11:39 PM
Response to Original message
19. if they support an issue, and have leadership capability, yes.
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Radical Activist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-26-10 12:14 AM
Response to Original message
26. Yes, but JFK and LBJ are poor examples.
Edited on Thu Aug-26-10 12:15 AM by Radical Activist
They responded to pressure from a social movement. JFK in particular was too cautious. LBJ deserves more credit, but he was very shrewd about waiting to act until there was a critical mass of support.

Truman and Grant were more daring on civil rights but Congress and much of the public weren't ready yet.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-26-10 08:30 AM
Response to Original message
30. GASP!!! no -- that can't be!
i'm so -- what's the word --

amazed --

that leaders will actually lead.
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